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Doctor, Doctor MAFIA | It's not Lupus

S

Sorian

Banned
Ty4on said:
Squidyj wise I don't think you're a bad vote.

I'm curious though of your reaction to FEP. Why didn't you consider voting for him?
Click to expand...

That's fine, Splinter doesn't think I'm a bad vote either and he at least have some shaky reasoning. squidy started his tunnel on me pretty much immediately into the game and has given pretty much no reasoning.

As for FEP, I'm just not scum reading him, at least not as much as others. From the "says weird shit category" I'm finding nin scummier than FEP.
 
F

flatearthpandas

Member
Sorian said:
What a weird way to phrase that.
Click to expand...

Trying to keep it neutral I guess.

I think my explanation should be acceptable. The scum angle is weird. It can't be a scum mistake since it would reveal too large of a team. If it was deliberate, framed as a mistake, it would mean exposing myself to wifom two random people. For what benefit? I don't think scum would want to purposefully expose themselves right now.

Anyway, what might scum know right now that could influence their actions tonight? If any of the targets are scum, they could know who the weak doctor isn't. Leaving 3-4 people scum would definitely want to let alive in hopes they off themselves at night. It is possible they know for sure who the jailor is. Without going into detail there, we might actually be able to vote tomorrow with pretty good assurance of grabbing scum.

Ty4on, any way to simulate n2 with scum taking deliberate actions to avoid weak and/or target jailor while town acts randomly again?
 
T

Ty4on

Member
flatearthpandas said:
Ty4on, any way to simulate n2 with scum taking deliberate actions to avoid weak and/or target jailor while town acts randomly again?
Click to expand...
I'm not near my computer, but I don't know how I'd simulate that? How does scum avoid random targeting?

So far the only deliberate action is lynch target (apart from the first one).
 
C

cabot

Member
VOTE TALLY:

sorian (1)
squidyj 266
*splinter 269 (338)

crimsonfist (1)
sorian 299

nin1000 (1)
burbeting 300

flatearthpandas (1)
*splinter 338

burbeting (1)
flatearthpandas 347


DAY 2 ENDS:
pin_1470517200.png
 
C

CrimsonFist

Member
FEP's mistake doesn't make sense as a scum slip, and I wouldn't expect scum to make a slip that obvious anyway.

I think the thing I'm kind of uneasy about though is Nin's excuse for avoiding taking action in future. It's built on really shaky logic, and even if he was right about being the vig, withholding a shot wouldn't necessarily be the optimum play. Also interesting that he assumes scum was jailed rather than the target saved, which statistically is the more likely possibility.

Ty4on said:
One jailor related thing is with two people on Burb it's more likely one of them was a jailor.
On a related note. Who was the NK target that was protected? Neither me, Burb, Sorian nor Nin seem like very likely NK targets. *Splinter seems like the most likely being town read so much. That could make a jailing of the killing scum more likely.
Click to expand...

It's not uncommon for scum to go for more under the radar players on night 1 though, especially in Gafia, although considering the unique setup, that might not be the case here.

Vote: Nin1000
 
S

*Splinter

Member
UNVOTE

That theory doesn't require a 3 man scum team, but... Bleh. I don't think there's a great track record for voting on "slips" anyway.
 
S

Sorian

Banned
In regards to who the NK was supposed to be, I think it's safe to assume they tried to either kill a townread player or someone who was on track in scum hunting. Splinter seemed like the person most town read but no one was on him so that points to the jailer blocking, as far as who was on track, who knows. They certainly weren't PR hunting though, nurse was dead and no one did (does?) know what their ability is for sure anyway.
 
S

*Splinter

Member
Hmm

Sorian and squidy
Sorian and Burbeting
Sorian and FEP

I guess there's a common theme to my suspicions.

VOTE: Sorian
 
S

*Splinter

Member
And FTR I'm wildly unconvinced by the theory against nin

Him playing so nice could be him begging not to be lynched, but OTOH there are other potential (outside of game) reasons for that.

Voting nin for questionable logic though is bleh.
 
S

Sorian

Banned
*Splinter said:
Hmm

Sorian and squidy
Sorian and Burbeting
Sorian and FEP

I guess there's a common theme to my suspicions.

VOTE: Sorian
Click to expand...

How do you not have Crimson on any of those lists? Even with some weak reading like my usual MO of hounding down my scum partners all the time for the bus credit.
 
S

squidyj

Member
Sorian said:
Why is it a good way for town to lose? You haven't actually answered that question. Are you trying to push a policy lynch, do you think I did something (that would have had to have happened very early day 1), what? And where does your belief come from and why even point to Burb specifically and not Ty4on?

Is this night vale again?
Click to expand...

Sorian said:
"Logic"

Ok, so give me specifics on what you just said, either he was blocked or he was non-killing. So basically, he is anything. "Oh, but then we can take into account that Ty or FEP is the paranoid!" Except we aren't solving that riddle anytime soon. Lynching Burb just for info makes no sense because his lunch does not give us any info. If he flips doc the maybe he was a regular doctor because nothing happened or maybe he was a killing doc and was jailed or maybe he was a regular doc and was jailed. K, great logic there. If he flips scum, then maybe a jailor got him, or maybe he targeted someone else that got healed, or maybe he was out in the woods taking a shit last night as bears tend to do and was doing nothing anyway.

So no, get off your high horse, I followed through on the logic, it's just without full flips, we aren't solving this and anyone trying is purposely wasting time. That's not even taking into account that this is Gafia and I'm willing to bet my career that a town member probably lied too to muck things up.
Click to expand...

What's weird to me here is this throwing away of the context of the original question you asked me in favour of finding a way to more vigorously attack my conclusions, in your response it no longer seems to matter to you that you asked why Burb over Ty, you will use any argument that could be applied to either to attempt to discredit my position.
 
T

Ty4on

Member
squidyj said:
What's weird to me here is this throwing away of the context of the original question you asked me in favour of finding a way to more vigorously attack my conclusions, in your response it no longer seems to matter to you that you asked why Burb over Ty, you will use any argument that could be applied to either to attempt to discredit my position.
Click to expand...
Why do you think scum was jailed?
 
S

Sorian

Banned
squidyj said:
What's weird to me here is this throwing away of the context of the original question you asked me in favour of finding a way to more vigorously attack my conclusions, in your response it no longer seems to matter to you that you asked why Burb over Ty, you will use any argument that could be applied to either to attempt to discredit my position.
Click to expand...

Because you answered the why Burb over Ty question, your conclusion is weak and as I showed there, you aren't gaining as much as you seemed to think you would but you still ignored the first question and continue to. I'm not asking you to keep justifying you choice with new information, I'm asking you to justify it with your original logic. All this seems to me is you wanted to suspect me so you put the horse before the cart and have been looking for reasoning since then.
 
F

flatearthpandas

Member
CrimsonFist said:
Also interesting that he assumes scum was jailed rather than the target saved, which statistically is the more likely possibility.
Click to expand...
Yeah. To be fair, it is really easy to get wrapped up in potential scenarios and run with weird assumptions. It's fun to think about but seems pretty fruitless at this stage.

Ty, Burb, Sorian, and Nin were all potentially blocked scum or saved No reason for scum to withhold a kill. Unlikely that both CPR and Quack didn't act so there were likely at least two actual saves. We have four roles capable of saving in any capacity. Squid can't be the quack.

I do think if scum was blocked, there's decent chance they know that's what happened. I don't think we can really assume there was a scum jail with our info unless I'm missing something.

Given four people who could potentially have been jailed scum all the same and me already feeling weird about one of them, going to keep the vote on burb for now.
 
S

squidyj

Member
Sorian said:
Except one of the 3 protections is even more likely so if that's your only reason then you aren't making sense.
Click to expand...

\yeah between weak doctor, quack, cpr, and scum kill you really think we got ZERO kills on the back of a single protection?
 
S

Sorian

Banned
squidyj said:
yeah between weak doctor, quack, cpr, and scum kill you really think we got ZERO kills on the back of a single protection?
Click to expand...

You're specifically talking about the scum kill, I also never said a single protection. There were 4 individual protections along with two people who didn't act. Did scum get jailed? Maybe. But that is a ridiculous conclusion to jump to and believe above all else with these odds.
 
S

*Splinter

Member
Who do you think was jailed, squid?

Sorian?

Sorian is a very likely target for night actions - it was a safe guess that you at least would target him. Why would he choose to carry out the NK when there is a higher chance of him being jailed than his teammate?
 
S

squidyj

Member
*Splinter said:
Who do you think was jailed, squid?

Sorian?

Sorian is a very likely target for night actions - it was a safe guess that you at least would target him. Why would he choose to carry out the NK when there is a higher chance of him being jailed than his teammate?
Click to expand...

burb or nin seem more likely to have been jailed.
 
S

*Splinter

Member
Oh, deadline approaches.

Too much silliness to ignore from squid.

VOTE: squidy

If he's scum please don't let Sorian off the hook. This play stinks of bus.
 
S

squidyj

Member
*Splinter said:
Oh, deadline approaches.

Too much silliness to ignore from squid.

VOTE: squidy

If he's scum please don't let Sorian off the hook. This play stinks of bus.
Click to expand...

did you ever even want to lynch sorian? you say so at the start of each day, but you always find a way to move to someone else.
 
S

*Splinter

Member
squidyj said:
did you ever even want to lynch sorian? you say so at the start of each day, but you always find a way to move to someone else.
Click to expand...
I'd love to!

Dunno if he's scum though. And the only other person willing to vote him seems far more likely to be scum.
 
T

Ty4on

Member
^^^^^^^^^^^^ I can see Burb/squidyj, but the connection I'm seeing could also be related to them being in a similar targeting situation (only person on someone). They both seem weirdly assuming of the jailing taking place.

squidyj said:
burb or nin seem more likely to have been jailed.
Click to expand...

I can see Burb with two people on him, but why Nin in particular?
 
S

squidyj

Member
*Splinter said:
Hmm

Sorian and squidy
Sorian and Burbeting
Sorian and FEP

I guess there's a common theme to my suspicions.

VOTE: Sorian
Click to expand...

So what you're saying is there are multiple scum teams you think sorian could be on, that I could easily be bussing my scum teammate but it's still a better idea to lynch me over him in contradiction to what you said earlier.
 
S

*Splinter

Member
squidyj said:
So what you're saying is there are multiple scum teams you think sorian could be on, that I could easily be bussing my scum teammate but it's still a better idea to lynch me over him in contradiction to what you said earlier.
Click to expand...
Current theories in order of how much I believe in them:

squidy and a jailed teammate
squidy and Sorian
...
Sorian and Burbeting
...
Sorian and flatearthpandas
 
S

squidyj

Member
*Splinter said:
I don't know what you're doing, but I don't know why else you'd be so hung up on the Jailer possibility.
Click to expand...

that's an absolutely fucking bizarre read to make.
why would I ever tip to that if I knew that a jailer had interrupted my teammate?
If I knew there was a jailer I would keep quiet and we'd kill the jailer the next night
 
S

*Splinter

Member
squidyj said:
that's an absolutely fucking bizarre read to make.
why would I ever tip to that if I knew that a jailer had interrupted my teammate?
If I knew there was a jailer I would keep quiet and we'd kill the jailer the next night
Click to expand...
So you couldn't possibly be scum because if you were scum you'd do X?

Cool
 
S

Sorian

Banned
*Splinter said:
He was busy yesterday.

Today he's been defending people, that's about as conspicuous as you can be, so I disagree with your reasoning on him.
Click to expand...

I'm still unimpressed today, lots of theory and bookkeeping, very weak scum hunting.

Though I will admit that I missed him saying two days ago was a bad day for him, thought you slipped by saying he was busy but I apparently just can't read.

Not really my top vote anymore.

VOTE: squidyj
 
S

Sorian

Banned
Would scum even know that it was a jailer and not a protection? I'm sorry, but as scum, I'd never trust you all to actually report true results, especially after one night phase.
 
S

squidyj

Member
Sorian said:
Would scum even know that it was a jailer and not a protection? I'm sorry, but as scum, I'd never trust you all to actually report true results, especially after one night phase.
Click to expand...

It's true that scum would have our own self-reporting as their only indication of what happened
 
S

*Splinter

Member
Sorian said:
Would scum even know that it was a jailer and not a protection? I'm sorry, but as scum, I'd never trust you all to actually report true results, especially after one night phase.
Click to expand...
I guess if the person who carried out the kill was targeted but not the person they were trying to kill.

I don't have an answer for why squidy would bring it up in thread though. His play doesn't make much sense either way.

Just realised you implied town lying about their targets. Eh, maybe.
 
S

Sorian

Banned
squidyj said:
Vote: Burbeting

lets make it interesting.
Click to expand...

I like this spread more than yesterday's.

*Splinter said:
I guess if the person who carried out the kill was targeted but not the person they were trying to kill.

I don't have an answer for why squidy would bring it up in thread though. His play doesn't make much sense either way.

Just realised you implied town lying about their targets. Eh, maybe.
Click to expand...

Gafia.

I was actually going to lie and say I targeted Ty4on when I didn't but since I showed up so late and saw that Ty was already in a threesome, I held off and just told the truth.
 
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