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Doctor Who Series 10 |OT| He's Back, and It's About Time

Boem

Member

Hah, and during that pre-series 10 university speech Moffat said he was done remaking old properties: Doctor Who, Sherlock, Jekyll and Tintin just happened because he was given the opportunity and they were his big childhood obsessions. At the time he definitely said he'd like the new thing to be an original idea rather than something like this, although he did clarify it's much easier to get a greenlight if it's a familiar idea.

Looking forward to it though, should be fun. Dracula sounds like pretty much the biggest Gatiss-type thing ever.

Edit: although they do add that they both have unannounced solo project inbetween. Curious what that could be.
 

Feffe

Member
In retrospect its pretty amazing how well it fits considered it's cobbled together from spare set parts the BBC happened to have lying around
Are you sure? I think they rebuild it from scratch for An Adventure in Space and Time, then re-used it for Day of the Doctor and Hell Bent
 

Kinglypuff

Neo Member
I'm really excited for next episode. This season hasn't done much for me (apart from Extremis which was great) and left me pretty disappointed because I really loved series 8 and 9. But everything seems to indicate that this finale will be some top-form Moffat, and Missy's consistently been one of the best part of Capaldi's era so I can't wait to see another episode focused on her.
 
Why? Did you not know who John Hurt was?
He's one of those guys that appears in every other movie you watch, but it's hardly surprising that people wouldn't recognize by name.

I remember that in these very threads, when that episode aired, people thought the Doctor's name was John Hurt.
 

Goldrush

Member
He's one of those guys that appears in every other movie you watch, but it's hardly surprising that people wouldn't recognize by name.

I remember that in these very threads, when that episode aired, people thought the Doctor's name was John Hurt.

Honestly, John Hurt is a brilliant and ironic name for the Doctor.
 

Pagusas

Elden Member
Why? Did you not know who John Hurt was?

I know who John Hurt is, but I dont care about name power when it comes to doctor who or any other show. It was out of charecter for the show to introduce someone like that (with an actors name on the screen). It was like "LOOK AT WHO THIS IS!!! OMG DO YOU SEE!!!! WE GOT JOHN HURT!!!!


To which I was like "ok....? I care why? Why is this person important?"


I would have had the same reaction with Hugh Lori or Sean Conery. Like "cool.... why is their name on screen like that?"
 
I know who John Hurt is, but I dont care about name power when it comes to doctor who or any other show

To which I was like "ok....? I care why? Why is this person important?"

Why would you ask that question if you realized who he was?

That doesn't make any sense. If you didn't know he was John Hurt, I could see being confused. But if you knew that was John Hurt, and then you saw the name "John Hurt" come up on the screen, I guess I don't get the disconnect here:

"Huh? I dont get it". It landed with a giant thud and confusion
 
I know who John Hurt is, but I dont care about name power when it comes to doctor who or any other show. It was out of charecter for the show to introduce someone like that (with an actors name on the screen). It was like "LOOK AT WHO THIS IS!!! OMG DO YOU SEE!!!! WE GOT JOHN HURT!!!!


To which I was like "ok....? I care why? Why is this person important?"


I would have had the same reaction with Hugh Lori or Sean Conery. Like "cool.... why is their name on screen like that?"
In this case, a big part of the significance came from how there was an additional unnumbered Doctor we didn't know about. People still argue over how Doctor Who stories should be organized because of this.
 

Blader

Member
I know who John Hurt is, but I dont care about name power when it comes to doctor who or any other show. It was out of charecter for the show to introduce someone like that (with an actors name on the screen). It was like "LOOK AT WHO THIS IS!!! OMG DO YOU SEE!!!! WE GOT JOHN HURT!!!!


To which I was like "ok....? I care why? Why is this person important?"


I would have had the same reaction with Hugh Lori or Sean Conery. Like "cool.... why is their name on screen like that?"

Because he's the Doctor.
 

Feffe

Member
The ending of Name of the Doctor was quite funny because... well... the script goes out of his way to make clear John Hurt was a previous incarnation of the Time Lord called "The Doctor" but he was not "The Doctor". Then he's on-screen introduced as The Doctor.

11: "I said he was me, I never said he was the Doctor."
War: "...in the name of peace and sanity."
11: "But not in the name of the Doctor!"

INTRODUCING
JOHN HURT
AS
THE DOCTOR
 
The ending of Name of the Doctor was quite funny because... well... the script goes out of his way to make clear John Hurt was a previous incarnation of the Time Lord called "The Doctor" but he was not "The Doctor". Then he's on-screen introduced as The Doctor.

11: "I said he was me, I never said he was the Doctor."
War: "...in the name of peace and sanity."
11: "But not in the name of the Doctor!"

INTRODUCING
JOHN HURT
AS
THE DOCTOR

I agree. This always sort of bugged me. By the end of the 50th he's redeemed for making the decision to destroy Gallifrey by, well, not destroying Gallifrey so wouldn't that make him as deserving of the title as any other version of the Doctor? Going forward he should be counted. Of course, from a marketing perspective it would be a total mess when you have spent years with numbers corresponding to certain actors. Try explaining that 9 is now 10, 10 is 11 etc.

So it's best to do what they did and just stick with War Doctor.
 

Feffe

Member
I agree. This always sort of bugged me. By the end of the 50th he's redeemed for making the decision to destroy Gallifrey by, well, not destroying Gallifrey so wouldn't that make him as deserving of the title as any other version of the Doctor? Going forward he should be counted. Of course, from a marketing perspective it would be a total mess when you have spent years with numbers corresponding to certain actors. Try explaining that 9 is now 10, 10 is 11 etc.

So it's best to do what they did and just stick with War Doctor.
Well, he's been The Doctor only for a few hours (minutes?) at the end of his life. We know that during the Time War he's done quite a few un-doctorish things such as leading an army.

A similar case is the Ninth Doctor, who's been The Doctor for most of his life except the final moments when he broke the promise deciding to be "coward, any day" (in his words to the Emperor of the Dalek). But for most of his life he's been The Doctor, so he counts, while the "War Doctor" doesn't.
 
Yeah, nobody saw that shit coming at all.

The pop in the room as the eyebrows hit the screen was fucking MASSIVE.

My whole theatre exploded with noise, myself included.

The ending of Name of the Doctor was quite funny because... well... the script goes out of his way to make clear John Hurt was a previous incarnation of the Time Lord called "The Doctor" but he was not "The Doctor". Then he's on-screen introduced as The Doctor.

11: "I said he was me, I never said he was the Doctor."
War: "...in the name of peace and sanity."
11: "But not in the name of the Doctor!"

INTRODUCING
JOHN HURT
AS
THE DOCTOR

Their problem was always that they never introduced a real alternative name for him in the narrative. Even in the Big Finish series, you can recognize them having trouble trying to refer to his character without calling him The Doctor. Eventually they just say fuck it, have everyone call him the Doctor anyway, and depict him being grouchy about it.

If he had actually taken a definitive alternative name during the war, it would have been easier to differentiate him from the rest. Without a good label, he's still just, you know..the Doctor, but don't say it to his face I guess. Then that leads to people bringing up the old number debate again and again because they got nothing better to call him.

I understand that the moral of the story was that he really still was the Doctor the whole time just doing his best in hard times and being ashamed of it, but for the purpose of narrative clarity a temporary new title during that time period would have been helpful to smooth things over. It would have been good housekeeping.

I actually hoped that Big Finish would correct that but they understandably followed Moffat's example and left everyone awkwardly stammering around him until they couldn't avoid calling him the Doctor anymore.
 

Pagusas

Elden Member
Why would you ask that question if you realized who he was?

That doesn't make any sense. If you didn't know he was John Hurt, I could see being confused. But if you knew that was John Hurt, and then you saw the name "John Hurt" come up on the screen, I guess I don't get the disconnect here:

Let me re-explain.

In the narrative of what was going on the character himself is significant. But at that very moment in the story telling all the show did was say "this isnt the doctor" followed by putting John Hurts name on screen.

That was it. Can you not see how someone who doesnt read the forums much before watching was just scratching their head like "wtf, yes thats the actor John Hurt, great, anddd??". You didnt see David Tennant get a big "David Tennant" right under him when he first appeared. You didnt see Matt Smith or anyone else get it. Just John Hurt. Why did the show feel the need at that moment to tell me the actors name? Especially when its going out of its way to tell me this person IS NOT the doctor, he's something else. What is he? Well according to the onscreen clues, he's John Hurt...
 

A-V-B

Member
Let me re-explain.

In the narrative of what was going on the character himself is significant. But at that very moment in the story telling all the show did was say "this isnt the doctor" followed by putting John Hurts name on screen.

That was it. Can you not see how someone who doesnt read the forums much before watching was just scratching their head like "wtf, yes thats the actor John Hurt, great, anddd??". You didnt see David Tennant get a big "David Tennant" right under him when he first appeared. You didnt see Matt Smith or anyone else get it. Just John Hurt. Why did the show feel the need at that moment to tell me the actors name?

Because Doctors are always introduced outside of an episode? But Hurt wasn't? So he's introduced during the episode.
 

Pagusas

Elden Member
Because Doctors are always introduced outside of an episode? But Hurt wasn't? So he's introduced during the episode.

What you just said makes no sense to me. Maybe because I'm watching these all without being apart of the press cycle of doctor who, I've never paid attention to the series until 5 months ago.
 
What you just said makes no sense to me. Maybe because I'm watching these all without being apart of the press cycle of doctor who, I've never paid attention to the series until 5 months ago.

I think it was to clarify exactly who he was playing. The War Doctor was a relative surprise at the time. We had no idea there was a incarnation of the Doctor between 8 and 9. It was assumed that 9 was the Doctor that participated in the Time War (and if things had gone the way they were originally planned, that would have been the way it played out. Long story).

So, who in the hell is showing up at the end of the episode?

"John Hurt"

All right, cool, John Hurt is good in everything, should be inter...

"As

The Doctor"

Wat?!? Which Doctor?!? Wat?!?
 

Blader

Member
What you just said makes no sense to me. Maybe because I'm watching these all without being apart of the press cycle of doctor who, I've never paid attention to the series until 5 months ago.

It's an awkward way to do it, but the name on the screen is just to make clear that John Hurt is playing an incarnation of the Doctor, since the dialogue itself doesn't really make that clear. Nobody knew ahead of time (officially anyway) that John Hurt was going to be in that episode or that he'd be playing the Doctor.
 

Boem

Member
Let me re-explain.

In the narrative of what was going on the character himself is significant. But at that very moment in the story telling all the show did was say "this isnt the doctor" followed by putting John Hurts name on screen.

That was it. Can you not see how someone who doesnt read the forums much before watching was just scratching their head like "wtf, yes thats the actor John Hurt, great, anddd??". You didnt see David Tennant get a big "David Tennant" right under him when he first appeared. You didnt see Matt Smith or anyone else get it. Just John Hurt. Why did the show feel the need at that moment to tell me the actors name? Especially when its going out of its way to tell me this person IS NOT the doctor, he's something else. What is he? Well according to the onscreen clues, he's John Hurt...

No, it's made clear he's an earlier incarnation of the Doctor, not a different character. Just someone who, for some (at the time) unknown reason wasn't deserving of the name 'Doctor', according to himself.

There was a lot going on in that scene: seeing glimpses of all the earlier Doctors, teasing the 50th anniversary (which was BIG at the time - there was simply no way of not being aware of that context when watching it when it aired in the UK given the media hype, and the biggest gossip for months at a time was 'which old Doctors will show up?' - how about one you haven't seen before?), the knowledge that Matt Smith was leaving soon, nobody knowing who the new Doctor was going to be, suddenly realizing there was a 'missing' incarnation of the Doctor in there and that's he's standing right there in front of us, his name and the little conversation instantly reminding viewers of the Time War between the classic and modern show...

I'm sorry it didn't click for you, but I always felt it was a terribly well put together scene, and possibly the best cliffhanger the show ever had outside of Hartnell dying and suddenly turning into a weird rejected member of the hobo Beatles. Honestly one of my favorite moments of the show.

Adding the words 'Introducing JOHN HURT as THE WAR DOCTOR' is simply a stylistic choice to hammer down the gravity of that moment. A big name A-list actor, playing an iconic part (joining a very, very limited list of actors who did so before), right before what was promised to be the biggest party in the show's history, with the media going crazy over it for months at that point).

If your complaint is that it requires a little knowledge of what the show is - well, sure. It's a season finale. Of a show in its 7th season (not counting the classic one). In a big fanwanky leadup to a fanwanky 50th anniversary party. They're allowed to use that stuff - it's like complaining what the big deal is about Force Awakens ending with Mark Hamill. You don't even need that much context really, all you need is a very basic understanding of the idea that multiple actors have played the part (which the episode hammers down by actually explicitly showing all of them multiple times, in a way never done before in the modern show). There was never a better place for going deep into that stuff than right before the big multi Doctor 50th festivities. And it's intentionally a tease for what's going to follow, although definitely not as baffling as you're painting it.
 
New World Enough and Time trailer. Appears to pour a bit of cold water on the theory that the Monks and the Cybermen are linked. Confirms presence of timey-wimey shenanigans.

looks great. can't wait.

just hope its not a another Dark Water (great- more like this)/Death in Heaven (what the fuck are you doing, Moffat?) situation

of course, it will be exactly that, except instead of Danny dying its Bill turned into a cyberman
 

Bluth54

Member
I like the concept of different ends of the ship running at different speeds due to a black hole but I would think the ship would have to be really, really long for a black hole to have that effect on a ship.

Still it's a great concept and does seem like a very Moffat style concept for an episode.
 
I like the concept of different ends of the ship running at different speeds due to a black hole but I would think the ship would have to be really, really long for a black hole to have that effect on a ship.

Still it's a great concept and does seem like a very Moffat style concept for an episode.
The ship's 400 miles long. Moffat's physics student son ran the calculations.
 

wetflame

Pizza Dog
Yeah, nobody saw that shit coming at all.

The pop in the room as the eyebrows hit the screen was fucking MASSIVE.

Yeah, I just caught up with the thread and wanted to say this moment was huge even watching along at home. I was super pumped. Even watching it back now is great.
 
I like the concept of different ends of the ship running at different speeds due to a black hole but I would think the ship would have to be really, really strong for a black hole to have that effect on a ship.

Still it's a great concept and does seem like a very Moffat style concept for an episode.

Makes sense, actually, but it would also rip the ship apart.
 
The ending of Name of the Doctor was quite funny because... well... the script goes out of his way to make clear John Hurt was a previous incarnation of the Time Lord called "The Doctor" but he was not "The Doctor". Then he's on-screen introduced as The Doctor.

11: "I said he was me, I never said he was the Doctor."
War: "...in the name of peace and sanity."
11: "But not in the name of the Doctor!"

INTRODUCING
JOHN HURT
AS
THE DOCTOR

I really thought he'd be an intensely dark version of The Doctor I.e. The Valeyard, was quite surprised when he was just a nice old dude
 

Slowdive

Banned
There's been a surge of bets for Richard Mylan to be the next Doctor, the same happened with Capaldi just before he was announced.

Edit: He's tweeted denying it. I still think it's Marshall due to how quiet he's been.
 
I could see it. Got that charming yet weird vibe going for him.

Not sure whether casting someone from Moffat's other famous show is strange or not though. Doesn't help that he looks a bit like Moffat too.
 

iMax

Member
Someone stealth-edited Kayvan Novak's Wikipedia page to say it was him, then it got flipped back.

Doubt it's anything but he'd be a cool choice!
 
I'm going to guess that it's going to be someone completely out of left field that no one's ever heard of, never mind having guessed.

A Matt Smith for a new age, if you like.
 

tomtom94

Member
Someone stealth-edited Kayvan Novak's Wikipedia page to say it was him, then it got flipped back.

Doubt it's anything but he'd be a cool choice!

TIL he played Handles in Time of the Doctor.

Richard Mylan's wiki page has been edited as well.

I doubt the BBC want to announce whoever it actually is until after series 10 is over - it'd be jolly rotten for Moffat and Capaldi to have their final thunder stolen.
 

Krooner

Member
There's been a surge of bets for Richard Mylan to be the next Doctor, the same happened with Capaldi just before he was announced.

Edit: He's tweeted denying it. I still think it's Marshall due to how quiet he's been.

Word is Mylan is actually being lined up for Dracula not Who, but the Moffatt connection caused confusion.
 
is the last Moffaty thing left for Moffat to do, to have the current Doctor's last episode and the new doctors first episode be the same episode.
 
Tomorrow is the beginning of the end. I'm not ready. Peter just started, right?

The Clara Show finally ended with series 9. Series 10 feels like the first series that the 12th Doctor was able to get unstuck from the mud and start going somewhere. Makes it feel like he just started to me.

His regeneration is not until Christmas, right? For a second I thought it was happening at the end of the season and started getting suspicious.
 
The Clara Show finally ended with series 9. Series 10 feels like the first series that the 12th Doctor was able to get unstuck from the mud and start going somewhere. Makes it feel like he just started to me.

His regeneration is not until Christmas, right? For a second I thought it was happening at the end of the season and started getting suspicious.

Apart from a few exceptions, I'd have to agree. Wish he was staying around a bit longer.

And yeah, his last episode will be the Christmas special.
 
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