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Dragon Age II |OT| The Revenge of Shit Mountain

A

antonz

Member
HadesGigas said:
At least that's a glitch (if you listen closely, two voice clips of him saying "except for *name*" play at once), the rest of the nonsense is intentional!
Click to expand...
Good to know. Couldnt be bothered to replay through the melee character I made after the mage playthrough.
 
M

MechaX

Member
ShockingAlberto said:
I don't understand why
Bethany
leaves in the ending, as well.

You'd think they'd stay with Hawke!
Click to expand...

How do they even handle that in the end game anyway?

Especially if you let Bethany live but let her join the Circle instead of the Grey Wardens. I mean, if you side with the Templars, does she go apeshit? If not, does she even flinch when she hears that Orsino was supporting a mage version of Victor Frankenstein? (Hell, for that matter does Cart-... Carver bitch out when hearing the same?)

Rahxephon91 said:
That's exactly what happen to me. I never did his quest to recruit him, but he poped up there and before that I had automatically received his companion quest. It was pretty strange.
Click to expand...

Wait, are you fucking kidding me? That actually must have been pretty hilarious to see this archer guy come out of nowhere and whine about how much justice needed to be served in that scene.
 
H

HadesGigas

Member
ShockingAlberto said:
I don't understand why
Bethany
leaves in the ending, as well.

You'd think they'd stay with Hawke!
Click to expand...

Yeah that bugged me. I just killed like 1000 people to rescue you, don't you wanna hang out?
 
R

Rahxephon91

Banned
Fimbulvetr said:
Wait. Even if you don't recruit him he shows up anyway and acts like you've been bros the entire time?
Click to expand...
That's exactly what happen to me. I never did his quest to recruit him, but he poped up there and before that I had automatically received his companion quest. It was pretty strange.
 
Y

Y2Kev

TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
Fimbulvetr said:
Wait. Even if you don't recruit him he shows up anyway and acts like you've been bros the entire time?
Click to expand...
That is hilarious. The scripting of the event sequences is an unmitigated disaster.

I have two major problems with the end:
1. The Anders resolution is wholly unfulfilling and ridiculous.
2.
Meredith's portrayal
became so black and white. The game spends the whole adventure telling me the difficulties between the mages and templars are complex and gray. The actual mechanics of the game portray things to be pretty one sided (we never see a Circle, we see little actual mage abuse...but we see PLENTY of naughty mages and Kirkwall is OVERFLOWING with blood mages). Why is
Meredith
portrayed as bluntly evil? I was siding with the mages at that point and I still thought she had a pretty good argument.

And, finally (so I guess this is number 3), what they did with
Orsino
was kind of insulting. Like, I knew that Bioware was trying to write it so that they wouldn't actually have to generate unique content/endings. But I absolutely roll over the first wave of attacking templars and then
he has a freak out moment and becomes a fucking zombie? He was using blood magic too!
Every single mage in this game uses blood magic.

It's not black and white or gray, it's shit colored.
 
L

Lostconfused

Member
About Orsino
if you haven't noticed. He is the one that sent books and wrote letters to the insane serial killer that offed Hawke's mother
 
K

kinoki

Illness is the doctor to whom we pay most heed; to kindness, to knowledge, we make promise only; pain we obey.
I'm thinking that somewhere in the development people from the future (and/or Adjustment Bureau) came back in time after having the future destroyed by the constant delivery of good, involving BioWare games. We can still see the remnants of the great game but lots of content was deleted to save the human race. We couldn't handle a better, move involving Dragon Age.
 
M

MechaX

Member
Y2Kev said:
And, finally (so I guess this is number 3), what they did with
Orsino
was kind of insulting. Like, I knew that Bioware was trying to write it so that they wouldn't actually have to generate unique content/endings. But I absolutely roll over the first wave of attacking templars and then
he has a freak out moment and becomes a fucking zombie? He was using blood magic too!
Every single mage in this game uses blood magic.
Click to expand...

It's just so surreal on how ridiculous that scene was. I mean, BioWare has no problems shoving bandits by the dozens to kill Hawke when just attempting to walk home in Lowtown. You fight a whopping 6 templars (and with my mage's absolutely cheap "slow everyone down to a crawl" gravity spell, it probably took less than 30 seconds). I was thinking "Oh. Well, if they're going to half-ass the assault this much, we might as well hold here and think of a way to-" but then
Orsino
butts in and screams "NOOO WE CAN'T WIIIINNN" *slit wrist becomes abomination*

It was really at that moment out of 40 hours of giving them the benefit of the doubt where I became totally convinced BioWare was just fucking with me.

Lostconfused said:
About Orsino
if you haven't noticed. He is the one that sent books and wrote letters to the insane serial killer that offed Hawke's mother
Click to expand...

From a writing standpoint, that alone is a big issue.
"Meredith, stop prosecuting mages for being blood mages (notwithstanding how every mage seems to be a blood mage in this city) even though I, First Enchanter, am supporting a horrible blood mage that is trying to make a Frakenstein's Monster and would single-handedly prove your point that blood mages in Kirkwall are evil!"
 
R

Rufus

Member
Dark Stalkers said:
Is Anders still a Warden if you didn't recruit him in Awakening?
Click to expand...
Yes, even if he's died in Awakenings.

Lostconfused said:
About Orsino
if you haven't noticed. He is the one that sent books and wrote letters to the insane serial killer that offed Hawke's mother
Click to expand...
Isn't it amazing that no one reacts to that during the scene? They even hint at it with a note you find in Quentin's den, but when it's finally revealed in a cut-scene (which should mean this is of consequence, instead of all the other times where what you do outside of one doesn't fucking matter one bit, like prancing around in mage uniform in front of templars); nothing happens. Not a single comment or even a pause.
 
Y

Y2Kev

TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
MechaX said:
It's just so surreal on how ridiculous that scene was. I mean, BioWare has no problems shoving bandits by the dozens to kill Hawke when just attempting to walk home in Lowtown. You fight a whopping 6 templars (and with my mage's absolutely cheap "slow everyone down to a crawl" gravity spell, it probably took less than 30 seconds). I was thinking "Oh. Well, if they're going to half-ass the assault this much, we might as well hold here and think of a way to-" but then
Orsino
butts in and screams "NOOO WE CAN'T WIIIINNN" *slit wrist becomes abomination*

It was really at that moment out of 40 hours of giving them the benefit of the doubt where I became totally convinced BioWare was just fucking with me.



From a writing standpoint, that alone is a big issue.
"Meredith, stop prosecuting mages for being blood mages (notwithstanding how every mage seems to be a blood mage in this city) even though I, First Enchanter, am supporting a horrible blood mage that is trying to make a Frakenstein's Monster and would single-handedly prove your point that blood mages in Kirkwall are evil!"
Click to expand...

Well, I guess they would just expect you to realize that he's sort of dishonest. But they just make
Meredith
seem so fucking evil to that point that'd you'd have to be crazy to suspect anything is ACTUALLY awry with the mages. Unless you ARE PLAYING THE GAME AND SEEING THE MAGES GONE WILD
 
M

Mr_Zombie

Member
Dunno if you know this guys, but there's a mod on Dragon Age Nexus that lets you change your party members' armour :D.
You've gotta love modders that fix shitty game design :). Now, if only there were a mod that disables (or at least improves) the wave system...
 
C

Confidence Man

Member
That would have been nice to use. Too bad I can't see myself ever replaying this game. Just the thought of having to run around Kirkwall and it's measly number of locations over and over again doing nothing but fighting waves and waves of mobs for thirty hours gives me a headache.
 
Y

Yurt

il capo silenzioso
I just finished Awakening. I'd have to say, it's a much much better game than this.

And WOW at Anders ? His actions in DA2 makes no sense at all based on his personality in Awakening. Especially with Justice stuck up his ass the whole time. He's so laid back and doesn't wanna be bothered with anything, hell you get +points with him if you leave him out of some key battles.
 
G

Gvaz

Banned
Yurt said:
I just finished Awakening. I'd have to say, it's a much much better game than this.

And WOW at Anders ? His actions in DA2 makes no sense at all based on his personality in Awakening. Especially with Justice stuck up his ass the whole time. He's so laid back and doesn't wanna be bothered with anything, hell you get +points with him if you leave him out of some key battles.
Click to expand...
That's because Anders in Awakening was written by Gaider and Anders in DA2 was written by that infamous woman who was like "I don't like videogames"

For once, I actually liked something Gaider did. Better than her fanfic garbage writing anyways.
 
Mikey Jr.

Mikey Jr.

Member
Got about 10 hours in.

I TRIED to love it like I did DA, but I can't.

Its like 2 different games for me. Its not one thing I hate specifically, I think its just overall.

I think its that I wanted a sequel to Dragon Age, and instead I got some new IP that has the Dragon Age name on it.
 
X

X-Frame

Member
Gvaz said:
That's because Anders in Awakening was written by Gaider and Anders in DA2 was written by that infamous woman who was like "I don't like videogames"

For once, I actually liked something Gaider did. Better than her fanfic garbage writing anyways.
Click to expand...

Doesn't make much sense -- why would they switch writers for a character?
 
W

witness

Member
On my second playthrough as a female Mage that hates other mages, fuck you Anders. I will for sure do a 3rd playthrough as a rogue. First playthrough took me right around 30 hours or so, which is what I finished the first Dragon Age in. Want some more DLC bioware!
 
G

Gvaz

Banned
X-Frame said:
Doesn't make much sense -- why would they switch writers for a character?
Click to expand...
I don't know why, but that's the way it is.

Jennifer Helper wrote him, that's this woman, remember?

http://www.killerbetties.com/killer_women_jennifer_hepler?page=0,3

Playing the games. This is probably a terrible thing to admit, but it has definitely been the single most difficult thing for me. I came into the job out of a love of writing, not a love of playing games. While I enjoy the interactive aspects of gaming, if a game doesn't have a good story, it's very hard for me to get interested in playing it. Similarly, I'm really terrible at so many things which most games use incessantly -- I have awful hand-eye coordination, I don't like tactics, I don't like fighting, I don't like keeping track of inventory, and I can't read a game map to save my life. This makes it very difficult for me to play to the myriad games I really should be keeping up on as our competition.
Click to expand...
 
F

fizzelopeguss

Banned
Patryn said:
Oy. If she hates the medium so much, why is she bothering to write in it? How did she even get started?
Click to expand...


She obviously can't write for shit, the games industry about the only place where she can paid for her deviantart literature.
 
P

Psi

Member
Playing the games. This is probably a terrible thing to admit, but it has definitely been the single most difficult thing for me. I came into the job out of a love of writing, not a love of playing games. While I enjoy the interactive aspects of gaming, if a game doesn't have a good story, it's very hard for me to get interested in playing it. Similarly, I'm really terrible at so many things which most games use incessantly -- I have awful hand-eye coordination, I don't like tactics, I don't like fighting, I don't like keeping track of inventory, and I can't read a game map to save my life. This makes it very difficult for me to play to the myriad games I really should be keeping up on as our competition.
Click to expand...

Sounds like a pretty solid definition of a non-gamer to me.
 
H

hateradio

The Most Dangerous Yes Man
fizzelopeguss said:
She obviously can't write for shit, the games industry about the only place where she can paid for her deviantart literature.
Click to expand...
There was nothing redeemable about emo-Anders, so I guess that's true.

Her thought process.

"Anders is just so deep and emotional because he is devastated and frustrated of being a hunted mage. And so when he
blows up the chantry, leaving those gamers in absolute dismay (I MEAN LIKE, HAVE THEY EVER HAD STUFF THIS COMPLEX!), he gets on his knees and can no longer hold it from his friends that he is incapable of separating himself from Justice and Vengeance
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!TWIST-AAA. And
EVERYTHING GOES TO HELL AND YOU"RE LIKE WOAH BECAUSE IT"S LIKE WOAH AND STUFF!!!! OMG, CAN YOU IMAGINE IT!!!~ TORMENTED ANDERS FTW!
"
 
G

Gvaz

Banned
I get the sarcasm but for people that really think similar to that they should just stop while they're ahead or just write that dribble for fanfiction.net
 
C

CabbageRed

Member
The further away I get from last playing the game, the more Anders gets to me. Is it a Twilight thing? Is it poorly written and nonsensical angst porn that exists solely to let someone tick off a box next to "appeals to reclusive teenage girls."

Patryn said:
Oy. If she hates the medium so much, why is she bothering to write in it? How did she even get started?
Click to expand...

It's a job. The real wonder is that they would hire her and that they would embrace her vision of Anders/Justice. I worry for Bioware.
 
G

Gvaz

Banned
The more I think of DA2 and anders, the angrier and angrier I get that someone let
anders survive.

I wouldn't have had an issue if he didn't do it with people inside.
 
K

kitzkozan

Member
CabbageRed said:
The further away I get from last playing the game, the more Anders gets to me. Is it a Twilight thing? Is it poorly written and nonsensical angst porn that exists solely to let someone tick off a box next to "appeals to reclusive teenage girls."



It's a job. The real wonder is that they would hire her and that they would embrace her vision of Anders/Justice. I worry for Bioware.
Click to expand...

Jennifer Helper is irrelevant.

How about that interview with the doctors where they outright lied and insulted our intelligence by saying: well, we had to choose between both game as to which would provide the best entry point for PS3 users and it's ME2.

Yep, it's definitively not because Microsoft published the first game...
 
L

luxarific

Nork unification denier
Re Anders:
Anders actions and personality in DA2 really don't bother me that much, particularly if you view him as essentially waging a losing battle to Justice for control of the host body, as it were. I mean, it's why Abominations are called Abominations and why mages are cautioned so strongly about making pacts with demons.
 
Y

Yurt

il capo silenzioso
I like what you're saying. but
do you remember Justice in Awakening, I don't think he'd want to take anyone's body.
 
G

Gvaz

Banned
bigdaddygamebot said:
because it's a job...that pays?
Click to expand...
It's like hiring a ref who doesn't like sports. It's kind of a prerequisite.

Or hiring a computer chip maker who doesn't like computers.

The person's best interests are not in the medium in which they work, which generally leads to poor performance or poor effort on their part.
 
R

Relix

he's Virgin Tight™
Hey, the last quest was actually pretty well done. Many hard battles too. If the whole game was like that and the end of Act 2 it would've been awesome. Anders actions were a bit weird but hey... I kinda felt for the guy =P
 
F

flyover

Member
bigdaddygamebot said:
because it's a job...that pays?
Click to expand...
Yeah. If you're a writer -- particularly a fiction writer -- I can't blame you for actually finding a way to make a decent living at it, even if it's in a medium you're not a huge fan of.

And, actually, I wouldn't even have a problem with her not being a big gaming fan, so long as she can tell a good story and write good characters. I'm sure there are plenty of good game writers who aren't big gamers. Now, as to whether she's one of them...
 
T

tenchir

Member
I stopped in Act 2 when I read about the bugs that affects quests(particularly the Nathaniel one). So I waited for almost a month for the patch to come out only to learn that 1) They didn't fix that quest and 2) They didn't fix the import save issue that lead to that quest.

So I just decide to restart awakening at a point where I just select Nathaniel to be part of my party and beat the game again, then beat Golem and Witch Hunt DLC again. So I can re-import the save into DA2. Next time time they offer preoder bonuses for DA3, I just wont bother to preorder because of the bugs they never fixed with DAO, DAAW, and DA2. I will just wait for the ultimate edition.
 
L

luxarific

Nork unification denier
Yurt said:
I like what you're saying. but
do you remember Justice in Awakening, I don't think he'd want to take anyone's body.
Click to expand...

From what Anders tells Hawke in DA2,
Justice didn't actually take Anders's body willy-nilly - Anders essentially offered him the opportunity to take up residence. I think if Justice or Anders had known the effect such an offer would have on both of them, neither of them would have considered making the pact in the first place. Actually, given the unfortunate results of the Anders-Justice team-up, I'd love to see how well Wynne's own little spirit invasion turned out, except in that case, it sounded as though Wynne was essentially dying, so perhaps she just didn't live long enough for the negative consequences to emerge.

In any case, the way Anders/Justice (and Merrill for that matter) are written in DA2 doesn't really bother me because I don't think they're
independent actors - both of them are being controlled or influenced by their spirit/demon partners, even if they don't think they are.
Orsino's
bizzare "let's try blood magic" twist is far more inexplicable to me than Anders becoming obsessed with the freedom of mages.

But, imo, DA2's writing/characterization are not the most critical problems the game has (DA2 doesn't really seem much worse than ME2 when it comes to this aspect, although DA2 -is- worse than DA:O in this area). DA2's gameplay mechanics and dungeon/battle/environmental design are far more bothersome to me than the game's writing/characterization.
 
F

Fimbulvetr

Member
luxarific said:
From what Anders tells Hawke in DA2,
Justice didn't actually take Anders's body willy-nilly - Anders essentially offered him the opportunity to take up residence. I think if Justice or Anders had known the effect such an offer would have on both of them, neither of them would have considered making the pact in the first place. Actually, given the unfortunate results of the Anders-Justice team-up, I'd love to see how well Wynne's own little spirit invasion turned out, except in that case, it sounded as though Wynne was essentially dying, so perhaps she just didn't live long enough for the negative consequences to emerge.
Click to expand...

There were no negative consequences for Wynne, only for the spirit that decided to help her(once she dies it will die as well).

The reason Justice became Vengeance is because of Anders' personal anger at the Templars. Wynne didn't have any especially negative emotions to corrupt the Spirit within her, so Faith remained Faith.
 
F

Fimbulvetr

Member
ShockingAlberto said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjUgNKnlmzM

Kinda spoilers, obviously, but I couldn't resist turning fraps on for that.
Click to expand...

Hurraaaay.
ZmNW6.gif
 
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