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Dragon Ball Super |OT9| Genki-Drama

R

Rutger

Banned
Chaotic-Strike said:
That describes most of the characters in this arc not named Goku honestly.

Its probably one of the biggest faults of this arc with how the story has been framed with characters disappearing on multiple episodes only to come back later. No one has really done anything "exceptional" other than eliminate a couple of mooks for each episode.

I would at least hope we could move past "it's just for money excuse" though considering the arc is one big excuse in itself to give the supporting cast something to do. The one thing Freeza has going for him is his personality in comparison to certain other members on the team I could mention.
Click to expand...

Sure, but at least the rest of the characters don't feel as forced into the arc as Frieza does.

The best thing about Frieza to me was how satisfying his defeat was, and him being brought back again and again destroys that.

It doesn't help that his interactions with other characters have been done in the most generic "villain playing along with the good guys" way. He's just been boring since the tournament started.
 
T

The Silver

Member
Frieza has been highly entertaining to me every time he's on screen, I was one of the few who was always happy about Frieza coming back for this.
 
B

Blackleg-sanji1

Banned
LotusHD said:
No, it's always been pretty easy...
Click to expand...
Nobody knows what they would’ve done with buu as nobody knows what they would’ve done with Frieza as said it’s easy now

Everybody expects Frieza to do some shady shit the fact right now that he’s not as of now if the most refreshing part the frost shit was wasted potential but At least it wasn’t predictable
 
NeonZ

NeonZ

Member
Blackleg-sanji1 said:
Nobody knows what they would've done with buu as nobody knows what they would've done with Frieza as said it's easy now
Click to expand...

Aside from having Freeza betray the team and then get killed off like a nobody, repeating Revival F for no reason, it's really easy to see how Freeza could be more interesting than Buu, who doesn't really have any dynamic with any character in the tournament, just a fun powerset.
 
SolVanderlyn

SolVanderlyn

Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
A Pretty Panda said:
It's probably better than whatever they would have come up with for Buu
Click to expand...
I could have done with Slim Buu instead of Krillin. Loads more potential there.

My issue is less with Freeza being there and more with who he replaced to get there.
 
S

Skeeter49

Member
Frieza healing Goku and then telling him about Ultra Instinct is the best development he's had since Z.

Same for working with Gohan even if that was poorly executed. They should have kept the mafuba jar in play for one more episode, with that being the reason why Frieza tricked Frost, to get the jar. Vegeta owing Frieza one would have been so much better, and could have came into play for episode 112.

I am worried about Frieza in next weeks episode. Attacking Vegeta would be really bad for his character so I hope it doesn't happen.
 
L

LotusHD

Banned
Blackleg-sanji1 said:
Nobody knows what they would've done with buu as nobody knows what they would've done with Frieza as said it's easy now
Click to expand...

Still think it was always easy... :p

A straightforward dim-witted creature (Sorry Buu) vs. a self-serving recent antagonist that holds an obvious grudge against the Saiyans and Beerus, who has to not only find a way to come out of this tournament alive permanently, but also ensure that he doesn't get killed/erased immediately afterwards. Neither do we even know what his wish would be, which could either be simple or grandiose.

Not to say that they can't do anything with Buu, but the main fun with him is his powerset, and seeing how the contestants in this tournament would handle that. But seeing as how Buu is way outdated power-wise, he has his work cut out for him. You can't even say he'd be a true berserker type character either like say Kale or Kid Buu.
 
C

Chaotic-Strike

Banned
Rutger said:
Sure, but at least the rest of the characters don't feel as forced into the arc as Frieza does.

The best thing about Frieza to me was how satisfying his defeat was, and him being brought back again and again destroys that.

It doesn't help that his interactions with other characters have been done in the most generic "villain playing along with the good guys" way. He's just been boring since the tournament started.
Click to expand...

Forced is in the eye of the beholder and they did plenty to actual justify his inclusion of this tournament for me. Besides Dragon Ball has never felt that coherent or natural considering the events of the Buu saga or even in the previous arc, so even if I did agree with you what's one more saga on the pile. At this point, almost anything can be justified in Dragon Ball if the writers work hard enough at it.

Freeza's original defeat was already ruined anyway when he was killed by Trunks and then again in ROF. It's just now they've finally found something to do with him after completely botching him in ROF.
 
R

Rutger

Banned
Omega Kirby said:
Frieza adds suspense to the whole arc, cause everyone is constantly thinking what he's up to.
Click to expand...
Not really. Frieza wants power and revenge against Goku. He will continue to play along with U7 since it benefits him(with that whole not being erased thing) and if he ever gets a real opportunity to go against them, he will.

He is a very simple character.

NeonZ said:
Aside from having Freeza betray the team and then get killed off like a nobody, repeating Revival F for no reason, it's really easy to see how Freeza could be more interesting than Buu, who doesn't really have any dynamic with any character in the tournament, just a fun powerset.
Click to expand...

This could have been a great chance to explore the origins of Buu by having something like him in another universe. He's a lot more open ended than Frieza as a character so there's a lot of directions they could go.

Plus he might have brought Mr. Satan to the stands which would be the best.

Chaotic-Strike said:
Forced is in the eye of the beholder and they did plenty to actual justify his inclusion of this tournament for me. Besides Dragon Ball has never felt that coherent or natural considering the events of the Buu saga or even in the previous arc, so even if I did agree with you what's one more saga on the pile. At this point, almost anything can be justified in Dragon Ball if the writers work hard enough at it.

Freeza's original defeat was already ruined anyway when he was killed by Trunks and then again in ROF. It's just now they've finally found something to do with him after completely botching him in ROF.
Click to expand...

I don't think he was justified enough with how poorly the transition from Buu to him was.

And no, Trunks killing him was great, the powerful coward got the pathetic death he deserved.
 
L

LotusHD

Banned
Rutger said:
This could have been a great chance to explore the origins of Buu by having something like him in another universe. He's a lot more open ended than Frieza as a character so there's a lot of directions they could go.

Plus he might have brought Mr. Satan to the stands which would be the best.
Click to expand...

You don't need Buu in this tournament to have another Buu though.

As for Frieza, yes it's simple in that he's up to something, but considering the context, rules, and stakes that prevent him from doing anything explicitly evil, the big question is how exactly will he try to come out on top?
 
A

Azerare

Member
LotusHD said:
You don't need Buu in this tournament to have another Buu though.

As for Frieza, yes it's simple in that he's up to something, but considering the context, rules, and stakes, the big question is how exactly will he try to come out on top?
Click to expand...
Yeah... would have been cool to see a universe 6 buu. But at least we got Dr. Rota
 
B

Blackleg-sanji1

Banned
Keep telling y’all the buu arc hate is real
Goten and trunks haven’t done nothing
Won’t let buu in tournaments
Videl is a house wife
Both fusions are trash now
Ss3 is irrelevant

All from the buu arc
tumblr_m41h4i595a1rul0hko1_400.gif
 
L

LotusHD

Banned
Blackleg-sanji1 said:
Keep telling y'all the buu arc hate is real
Goten and trunks haven't done nothing
Won't let buu in tournaments
Videl is a house wife
Both fusions are trash now
Ss3 is irrelevant

All from the buu arc
tumblr_m41h4i595a1rul0hko1_400.gif
Click to expand...

Gohan could wish for Videl to get her personality back.

Rutger said:
Exploring things related to a character without involving that character is generally a bad idea, haha.
Certainly would be in the case with Buu.
Click to expand...

I mean, it's not like our Buu is about to have a stimulating conversation with this theoretical alternate Buu, hence why I said that. Your argument makes a lot more sense with say, Piccolo and the U6 Namekians. Not that I disagree, but at the same time, meh. That said, it just seems similar to Piccolo's situation where you basically hope it gives Buu a path to get stronger or something, because otherwise I can't say I particularly care about Buu's origins lol

Anyways, Buu should've replaced Tien.
 
O

Omega Kirby

Member
Rutger said:
Not really. Frieza wants power and revenge against Goku. He will continue to play along with U7 since it benefits him(with that whole not being erased thing) and if he ever gets a real opportunity to go against them, he will.

He is a very simple character.
Click to expand...

His goal is simple but how he plans to achieve this power isn't. And thats what makes him interesting. It's more than just "I'll train for another 4 months"
 
R

Rutger

Banned
LotusHD said:
I mean, it's not like our Buu is about to have a stimulating conversation with this theoretical alternate Buu, hence why I said that. Your argument makes a lot more sense with say, Piccolo and the U6 Namekians. Not that I disagree, but at the same time, meh. That said, it just seems similar to Piccolo's situation where you basically hope it gives Buu a path to get stronger or something, because otherwise I can't say I particularly care about Buu's origins lol

Anyways, Buu should've replaced Tien.
Click to expand...

It's just an idea anyways, point is I feel there's far more interesting directions Buu could have gone in with this arc than the Frieza tries to be evil again direction we have.
 
U

Undead Fantasy

Member
Rutger said:
Sure, but at least the rest of the characters don't feel as forced into the arc as Frieza does.

The best thing about Frieza to me was how satisfying his defeat was, and him being brought back again and again destroys that.

It doesn't help that his interactions with other characters have been done in the most generic "villain playing along with the good guys" way. He's just been boring since the tournament started.
Click to expand...

I couldn't disagree more.

Him giving energy to Goku as a reference to Namek was superb.
 
L

LotusHD

Banned
Rutger said:
It's just an idea anyways, point is I feel there's far more interesting directions Buu can go in than Frieza tries to be evil again.
Click to expand...

Well, to each their own. I feel like Frieza is inherently more interesting to work with. The only thing I can say is that it's still DBS, so stuff like say the Frost betrayal could've had much better execution. And if people end up feeling underwhelmed by what should basically be a slam dunk regarding Frieza's interactions and scheming, then imagine how you'd feel if they were utilizing Buu instead :p
 
B

Blackleg-sanji1

Banned
Kagari said:
You might be on to something here.
Click to expand...
They’ve rendered two warriors who were on par/maybe even greater than vegeta at least)with their fathers when fused useless

Turned buu into more of a joke than fat buu already was

Fusion dance was already made useless in the buu arc itself so that’s whatever but than the earrings follow the same bull

Ss3 the form achieved in the afterlife and achieved thru fusion and training is a joke and can’t wven be used in a power build up showcase

At best we got a Uub mention I mean I guess that cool.
 
NeonZ

NeonZ

Member
LotusHD said:
Anyways, Buu should've replaced Tien.
Click to expand...

I'd actually agree with that in spite of liking Tenshinhan, since the anime staff had no will at all to use him. He didn't get a single character moment and didn't even get to use all his old techniques again or any new ones. I think Buu still ended up with more battle screentime than Tenshinhan in this arc in spite of not being an official team member.

I guess there's still a chance the manga will do something with Tenshinhan, but I don't have high hopes...
 
C

Chaotic-Strike

Banned
Rutger said:
I don't think he was justified enough with how poorly the transition from Buu to him was.

And no, Trunks killing him was great, the powerful coward got the pathetic death he deserved.
Click to expand...
It was fine for me since they actually explained that they needed the strongest fighters from their universe to help. The only mistake they made is taking Buu out of the equation instead of someone who barely contributed at all like Tien.

Trunks killing him ruined everything that was set up in the Namek saga with Goku finally becoming the Legendary SSJ and killing Freeza.

It made the whole previous arc feel pointless and your whole argument would make much more sense if he actually ended there.
 
I

Icyflamez96

Member
LotusHD said:
Gohan could wish for Videl to get her personality back.



I mean, it's not like our Buu is about to have a stimulating conversation with this theoretical alternate Buu, hence why I said that. Your argument makes a lot more sense with say, Piccolo and the U6 Namekians. Not that I disagree, but at the same time, meh. That said, it just seems similar to Piccolo's situation where you basically hope it gives Buu a path to get stronger or something, because otherwise I can't say I particularly care about Buu's origins lol

Anyways, Buu should've replaced Tien.
Click to expand...

a y u p
 
K

Kagari

Crystal Bearer
Blackleg-sanji1 said:
They’ve rendered two warriors who were on par/maybe even greater than vegeta at least)with their fathers when fused useless

Turned buu into more of a joke than fat buu already was

Fusion dance was already made useless in the buu arc itself so that’s whatever but than the earrings follow the same bull

Ss3 the form achieved in the afterlife and achieved thru fusion and training is a joke and can’t wven be used in a power build up showcase

At best we got a Uub mention I mean I guess that cool.
Click to expand...

The only thing I can think of that's been carried over and actually improved rather than nerfed to the ground is Ultimate Gohan...
 
R

Rutger

Banned
LotusHD said:
Well, to each their own. I feel like Frieza is inherently more interesting to work with. The only thing I can say is that it's still DBS, so stuff like say the Frost betrayal could've had much better execution. And if people end up feeling underwhelmed by what should basically be a slam dunk regarding Frieza's interactions and scheming, then imagine how you'd feel if they were utilizing Buu instead :p
Click to expand...

Pretty much!

I don't know if I would be as underwhelmed if Buu was underutilized though, since at least I'm not tired of seeing him at this point.
Undead Fantasy said:
Well, it's one of the worst arcs in Z.
Click to expand...

It has some of the lowest points like giving Goku the win.
But it also has some of the highest points like Mr. Satan's friendship with Buu and completing Vegeta's character arc.
 
S

Skeeter49

Member
Maybe Kyabe will get SSJ3, and reveal that when you use it right it's stronger than SSB and UI.

And then the only 2 Cabba fans in the world wake up from their dream.

Blackleg-sanji1 said:
Is it even improved yet not nerfed but I wouldn't call that improved yet either
Click to expand...
It's a form that can scale up to other forms Goku and co get, based on Gohan's potential and how much he works on perfecting the form.
It's definitely an improvement.
 
C

Chaotic-Strike

Banned
Goku getting the win wasn't the problem in the Buu saga.

It was literally how every character got thrown aside to make it happen and how the arc just drags with all the interesting plot ideas you've been invested in flat up not mattering in the end.
 
B

Blackleg-sanji1

Banned
Chaotic-Strike said:
Goku getting the win wasn't the problem in the Buu saga.

It was literally how every character got thrown aside to make it happen and how the arc just drags with all interesting plot ideas you've been invented in flat up not mattering in the end.
Click to expand...
Yup spot on
Was an insult to multiple characters
Multiple power ups
Multiple sacrifices

And just straight up a waste of an arc
 
K

Kusagari

Member
Frieza has been, by far, the best thing about this arc.

The constant looming feeling that an imminent back stab is coming, the clowning of Frost, the tension with Goku (that has been fantastic from the second Goku initially went to free him for the tournament.)
 
Z

Zubz

Banned
Blackleg-sanji1 said:
Keep telling y’all the buu arc hate is real
Goten and trunks haven’t done nothing
Won’t let buu in tournaments
Videl is a house wife
Both fusions are trash now
Ss3 is irrelevant

All from the buu arc
tumblr_m41h4i595a1rul0hko1_400.gif
Click to expand...

Everything else I'm fine with, but Videl getting done dirty is the one thing worse than doing a Tien dirty. Speaking of whom...

Undead Fantasy said:
Freeza has been a joy the entire arc.

The real shame is Buu being out instead of useless Tenshinhan.
Click to expand...

He's not useless, the writers just hate him. Most scoreboards for the ToP have him in 14th place individually.
 
Astral Dog

Astral Dog

Member
Rutger said:
Not really. Frieza wants power and revenge against Goku. He will continue to play along with U7 since it benefits him(with that whole not being erased thing) and if he ever gets a real opportunity to go against them, he will.

He is a very simple character.

.
Click to expand...
Its not about his motivations, but how he gets there and how fun it is. I don't expect complex characters in Dragon Ball but Frieza is one of the best villains.
 
R

Rutger

Banned
Sub Boss said:
Its not about his motivations, but how he gets there and how fun it is. I don't expect complex characters in Dragon Ball but Frieza is one of the best villains.
Click to expand...

Sure, and how he is getting there hasn't been fun to me.

I think Frieza was great on Namik, had the perfectly pathetic death he deserved vs Trunks and that's it. He's not complex enough to carry multiple arcs as the villain imo and his inclusion feels like Super wants to just live in the glory days of DBZ instead of moving forward.
 
L

LotusHD

Banned
Rutger said:
Sure, and how he is getting there hasn't been fun to me.

I think Frieza was great on Namik, had the perfectly pathetic death he deserved vs Trunks and that's it. He's not complex enough to carry multiple arcs as the villain imo and his inclusion feels like Super wants to just live in the glory days of DBZ instead of moving forward.
Click to expand...

Weird thing to say considering both the plot of this arc and the last, neither has he showcased himself to be the main antagonist, but alright lol
 
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