Support NeoGAF

[Alcibiades]

excerpts from the CED newsletter:

Dual-format next-generation DVD players are being "actively looked at" by 3 CE makers and 4 chip suppliers, with a goal of delivering product as soon as late 2007, Jim Taylor, vp-gen. mgr. of DVD software developer Sonic Solutions' advanced technology group, told Consumer Electronics Daily. Sonic, at work on software for dual- format players, has talked with all those involved, Taylor said.

It might be possible to debut dual-format players before late 2007, but the Blu-ray and HD DVD camps are "way too stubborn to let the battle be lost in the next 6 months," said Taylor. "They're evenly matched and there is no clear winner at this point," he said: "At the same time, there are enough people working on dual format solutions that we'll see those players come out at the end of 2007, for sure 2008."

Taylor declined to name the CE or chip companies readying dual-format devices, but Hitachi, LG and Samsung have floated plans to sell such decks.

...

...

"We have the capability to provide all of the software for and the chipsets are essentially already capable of both formats," he said: "I think consumers will see this as cheap insurance and will flock to dual-format players and everyone else will be dragged along behind that."

A similar situation occurred with DVD recorders, Taylor said: "We saw the same thing happen with -RW and +RW. Today even the staunchest supporters of one format or the other make dual-format drives." Taylor's optimism contrasted with Sigma Designs Vp Ken Lowe's pessimism about dual-format product, which he said will slow rollout of next-generation DVD and up costs. Blu-ray will emerge "victorious" in 4-6 months, Lowe told analysts in a recent earnings conference call. Sigma Designs is supplying media processors for 6 Blu- ray players.

Pick-up head and royalty costs would be higher for dual- format players, but chipset prices would be the same, while software costs aren't "very big" and can be spread "across a lot of units," Taylor said: "Even if you're talking about a $400-$500 player, then it should be a less than 10% surcharge [for royalties] and I think that's cheap insurance for consumers... an extra $50 to know that you didn't make the wrong choice of formats."

The leap to next-generation DVD recorders is expected to be fast, Taylor said. Sonic's RecordNow software is packaged with Pioneer and Fujitsu Blu-ray drives largely for backing up data, he said. Desktop PC OEM suppliers to Hewlett- Packard, Dell and others also are expected to ship models with Blu-ray drives loaded with a version of Sonic's MyDVD software first half 2007. "The PC suppliers, partly because of the support from Intel and Microsoft for HD DVD, are now looking at both formats a lot more than they used to, instead of exclusively being focused on Blu-ray," Taylor said.

...

On other fronts, Sonic has delivered a version of its Cineplayer software to Nintendo for a DVD player-enabled version of its Wii game console (CED Nov 14 p12), Taylor said. The CinePlayer CE DVD Navigator, tailored to work with the Wii user interface, lets Nintendo add slow-motion playback, bookmarks and other options, Taylor said. Media reports have indicated Nintendo intends to offer DVD functionality only in Japan, but Taylor said there are no curbs on using the CinePlayer software. A DVD-enabled Wii is expected to be available 2nd half 2007. "Everything is delivered and finalized from our point of view and Nintendo could roll out this capability at any time in any of their products," Taylor said. "It's really up to Nintendo what their timetable is."

Summary:

-3-4 companies working with Sonic on dual-format players

-Broadcom will make a chipset compatible with both

-Sigma expects Blu-ray to win, but adds they supply the chips to 6 Blu-ray manufactorers

-PC suppliers moving away from Blu-ray only stance and supporting HD DVD as well*

-Wii DVD can be enabled? that part is kinda hazy...


*although it's hard to see where the Blu-ray support here is, since LG, Samsung, Toshiba, HP, Acer, Fujitsu, and Asus have all come out with HD DVD-enabled laptops, whereas the only Blu-ray laptop I'm aware of is the Sony VAIO.

 

[emomoonbase]

Good. It's stupid to think they thought consumers were going to buy only one kind of player or one of each type for different movies.

 

[Zaptruder]

For the sake of not having to buy a HD-DVD capable player in the near future, I hope this doesn't succeed or help HD-DVD gain too much traction. Ah who am I kidding, I just want universal on the BD side as well, I don't care what HD-DVD does then. Better for me as a consumer that way.

The HD-DVD format doesn't offer any technical advantages for me... all it's offering right now is universal's exclusivity. I mean... why do I wanna spend more on a HD media only machine when I'm already planning on getting a perfectly BD capable player in the form of the PS3?

heh... the real people benefitting from hybrid disc machines will be warner and universal (and other HD-DVD patent holders); if those hybrid machines gain wide spread acceptance, that means consumer transperancy for warner and universal, meaning they can release movies freely without having to worry about patent issues... because otherwise, there's no draw to releasing movies on the inferior disc format, meaning no other studios have reason for loyalty to HD-DVD, which in turn means they wouldn't recieve much in the way of patent royalties.

 

[jjasper]

If we are talking $450-$600 I would gladly sell my hd dvd add on and be all over this

 

[Grifter]

Are we ever going to see a tangible difference from BRD compared to HD-DVD?

 

[Alcibiades]

Are we ever going to see a tangible difference from BRD compared to HD-DVD?

If you are talking the same movie using the same compression at the same date-rate on each, no, there should be no difference.

Warner titles reportedly look identical (except the first few which were MPEG2).

Differences come when studios choose to use different compression schemes, or provide different audio codecs (i.e. Warner giving some HD DVD titles lossless TrueHD but not to Blu-ray, which is one of the next-gen audio formats).

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

Technical question: Are the drives themselves for HD-DVD and BluRay the same? With software, could one be made to read the other? In other words, could PS3 be made dual-format?

I'm assuming no, but this article got me wondering.

 

[Alcibiades]

Technical question: Are the drives themselves for HD-DVD and BluRay the same? With software, could one be made to read the other? In other words, could PS3 be made dual-format?

I'm assuming no, but this article got me wondering.

no

the way they read discs is different

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

This will undoubtedly be my ultimate solution if Criterion ever decides to pony up with one of these chuckleheads.

 

[Bebpo]

Are we ever going to see a tangible difference from BRD compared to HD-DVD?

Not really. Expect both formats to look the same and transfer quality to be up to the individual studios mastering them.

Honestly I just expect 2 disc HD-DVD releases to combat 50gig Blu-ray releases where both versions have the same transfer quality, same extras, etc...

They're basically both the same thing for all general purposes. This format war has been stupid from day 1.

 

[Bad_Boy]

I thought something like this was illegal?

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

I thought something like this was illegal?

Illegally great for the consumer!

 

[Beer Monkey]

Frankly, it's the only thing that makes sense. Anybody who thinks that this thing is going to end soon is high. Just like with DVD-A and SACD, anybody who chooses to have only BD or only HD-DVD is going to miss out bigtime.

I thought something like this was illegal?

It's not illegal. There has been chatter that Sony is refusing to license BD playback to any appliance that plays HD-DVD, but the reality of the business is that there is going to be too much pressure for them to keep that up.

 

[mrklaw]

this is conjecture IMO

Broadcom already have chips that will support all the codecs across both platforms. It makes sense for them to do that. But they are still sold into either bluray or HDDVD drives, not both.

This is just talking about the techinical possibilities. Eg some vendor puts together a SoC that can handle bluray or HDDVD. So they just need one inventory item to sell to both sides. Doesn't mean a dual player.

Until we see the actual player manufacturers talking about it, it won't happen in practice

 

[Shogmaster]

Technical question: Are the drives themselves for HD-DVD and BluRay the same? With software, could one be made to read the other? In other words, could PS3 be made dual-format?

I'm assuming no, but this article got me wondering.

I think the only commonality (is that a word?) is that they both use the same blue laser diodes. HD-DVD's data is kept pretty much the same depths on the disc as DVDs while BR keeps them much much closer to the surface of the disc, so the way that the drive motor and the laser assembly works are quite different for the two.