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[MiamiWesker]

Doesn't it have to?

Look at the Bulls with Jordan. As a Pacer fan, I take pride in the fact that we took them to 7 games in the '98 Eastern Conference Finals. They were so good and so unbeatable, simply coming closer than any other team felt like a moral victory.

The fact that the Patriots lost when most of their players are still in their prime and they were heavy favorites does put a blow into their overall dynasty. Losing at the beginning or end is one thing - you're players are young or too old - but at this point, it takes away some of their sheen.

Yeah I agree. But isn't it weird that losing in the SB hurts so much more than losing at any other point in time. Lets put aside the undefeated thing cause that makes everything complicated, lets say they lost in the playoffs like the last two years I wouldn't see that as hurting what they did in the past. The Pats could have never made it to the SB again and it wouldn't hurt their image. But they do make it to SB, lose and now you have to see it differently. Its like being punished for going so far but not finishing.

I find it weird how much impact a Super Bowl has on the overall view of the teams and sport. A part of my brain is saying hey they made it to the SB so they did better than previous years but everything else is telling me that the Pats lost something greater than they ever did over the last two years.

 

[yankeeforever2]

So which team won?

Bills

 

[Gigglepoo]

It says...they lost one game.

Probably be right back in the big game next year.

The other one loss teams didn't get back to the Super Bowl the following year and the Niners and Bears didn't suffer catastrophic losses at the end of the year.

 

[XiaNaphryz]

Shout out to Brady for going 80 yards, light, when his team needed it.

So where was Brady in that last drive then? They had enough time with 3 timeouts to get into field goal range. Instead, they kept going for the long ball.

 

[biggkidd32]

It says...they lost one game.

Probably be right back in the big game next year.

Shout out to Brady for going 80 yards, light, when his team needed it. Defense just couldnt finish.

I doesn't matter if he could not win the game.

 

[J2 Cool]

It says...they lost one game.

Probably be right back in the big game next year.

Shout out to Brady for going 80 yards, light, when his team needed it. Defense just couldnt finish.

Yup, that's true too. Brady did what he was supposed to at the end. The supporting cast keeps changing in NE. The only constant is Belichick, Brady, Bruschi, Vrabel, Matt Light. Sometimes the supporting cast isn't as good, mentally, toughness.. Where as the Steelers pretty much kept the same team those 6 years. It was on the same players to define their legacy, responsible if they win it or not. Brady did his job as a leader and a quarterback. It's almost impossible though to create any more of a dynasty in this era. So should they be judged on the same basis as previous dynasties or not?

If nothing else, it diminishes Belichick a bit. As an ultimate mastermind, and candidate for greatest coach of any sport, he lost the game more than Brady. Both in having the team prepared and in making the right calls. The FG coming to mind.. But then the pressure of a perfect season also had it's effect, and if they lost a game simply, Belichick probably has them looser and more focused. I don't know.

In any case, reaching a team's limit is basically what it's about. The team's that don't lose those games have no limit. It's left to the imagination how far their greatness extends. Where as with the Patriots it's defined. I think that's what changes with this.

It depends on how they respond next year. The Celtics and Lakers of the 80's both lost NBA Finals, but came back to compete and win years after. Because of that, they're both in any short list of all-time great teams. Unfortunately the Pats lost to the Giants, not an all-time great. I'm not sure how that will go down.

 

[sorryaboutdresden]

I hope everyone is watching Around the Horn and will watch PTI. This is hilarious. :lol

 

[XiaNaphryz]

I hope everyone is watching Around the Horn and will watch PTI. This is hilarious. :lol

Can't at work. Bulletpoint the highlights!

 

[J2 Cool]

I hope everyone is watching Around the Horn and will watch PTI. This is hilarious. :lol

Damn it! ESPN News in 40 minutes will show ATH again, thank goodness. :lol

 

[Karakand]

If nothing else, it diminishes Belichick a bit. As an ultimate mastermind, and candidate for greatest coach of any sport, he lost the game more than Brady.

That's what-have-you-done-for-me-lately hyperbole. Belicheat was nowhere near equaling Wooden's coaching achievements last night, nor will he ever be able to.

BTW, it was pretty awesome that a disciple of Wooden (Coughlin) put the screws to Belicheat, coaching mastermind.

 

[bionic77]

So where was Brady in that last drive then? They had enough time with 3 timeouts to get into field goal range. Instead, they kept going for the long ball.

Not to mention that the clock was acting weird on the final possession (after seeming to screw the G-Men out of a few seconds here and there on their last drive). That 38 seconds was probably like 50 the way they were working the clock. Plus the Pats had 3 timeouts.

They didn't even try to move the ball into FG range with some underneath routes. A lot of credit probably goes to the Giants on that one that the Pats thought they couldn't move it 50 yards.

 

[twinturbo2]

I'm just glad the NFC team won a Superbowl.

Opens the way for the next 9er's dynasty in next decade!

:lol

 

[vas_a_morir]

How many years in a row has the NFC won the toss?

 

[biggkidd32]

Wellington, is Chris Russo from WFAN eating crow?

 

[msdstc]

Not to mention that the clock was acting weird on the final possession (after seeming to screw the G-Men out of a few seconds here and there on their last drive). That 38 seconds was probably like 50 the way they were working the clock. Plus the Pats had 3 timeouts.

They didn't even try to move the ball into FG range with some underneath routes. A lot of credit probably goes to the Giants on that one that the Pats thought they couldn't move it 50 yards.

yeah really? Watch the last drive for the giants. They added probably 30 maybe 40 seconds.

 

[jordan0386]

Wellington, is Chris Russo from WFAN eating crow?

Somewhat.

 

[Striker]

Kornheiser from PTI says the Rams/Patriots is a bigger upset game than the Giants/Patriots.

 

[sorryaboutdresden]

Can't at work. Bulletpoint the highlights!

Shit I should have. Sorry, my bad. Try to catch it on ESPN News later. I can't think of any particular lines, its just great to hear all these guys suck off the giants a day after completely writing them off.

 

[sorryaboutdresden]

Kornheiser from PTI says the Rams/Patriots is a bigger upset game than the Giants/Patriots.

Yeah, that was pretty absurd. I think he's a little bitter that his 19-0 prediction didn't come true.

 

[bionic77]

yeah really? Watch the last drive for the giants. They added probably 30 maybe 40 seconds.

They added time on the clock because they kept it running when the refs were doing things like measuring the spot or for other rulings on the field.

I almost counted to two before the clock started on two of the Pats final plays before I stopped caring. On one of Brady's bombs, like only 3 seconds expired from the clock, which just shouldn't happen when you air our the ball 50+ yards.

It isn't like it mattered, but it is just something I noticed. Probably something you only notice when you really want a team to win/lose.

 

[el Diablo]

Wilbon just destroyed Belicheck for walking off the field.

 

[sorryaboutdresden]

Wilbon just destroyed Belicheck for walking off the field.

I thought Wilbon was really annoying when he was talking about this. I didn't think it was that big of a deal at all.

 

[Robert R1]

Cry Baby Brady and Moss opt out of pro bowl!

Now that's some selfish shit. Letting the other 5 Pats to answer questions about those 2 all week in hawaii.

 

[Robert R1]

I thought Wilbon was really annoying when he was talking about this. I didn't think it was that big of a deal at all.

Hate to defend Bill here but they clock DID rundown and then time was added back at 1 second while he was walking across the field.

 

[Tom Penny]

Cry Baby Brady and Moss opt out of pro bowl!

Now that's some selfish shit. Letting the other 5 Pats to answer questions about those 2 all week in hawaii.

Brady doesn't go to any of the Pro Bowls. So I guess he's selfish every year. Nice try though

 

[Striker]

Who cares if Moss or Brady don't attend the Pro Bowl? They serve no purpose there. Neither does Osi.

 

[Robert R1]

Brady doesn't go to any of the Pro Bowls. So I guess he's selfish every year. Nice try though

I'm sure he'd be up for this one had they won. Certainly Moss would be. Anyway, I much rather see Ocho Cinco. Much more entertaining!

 

[Slo]

They still play the Pro Bowl? Seriously?

 

[Striker]

Derek Anderson out of all players are going because of dropouts.

Exciting, amirite!

 

[iapetus]

So which team won?

The good guys.

Damn, but it sucks that football is now over for the year. You want to know how much it sucks? It's Monday night and I'm watching the World Series of Backgammon on my sports channels. Monday Night Backgammon.

 

[CajoleJuice]

Kornheiser from PTI says the Rams/Patriots is a bigger upset game than the Giants/Patriots.

bahaha

 

[NomarTyme]

Kornheiser from PTI says the Rams/Patriots is a bigger upset game than the Giants/Patriots.

It is... to me.

 

[Wellington]

Brady doesn't go to any of the Pro Bowls. So I guess he's selfish every year. Nice try though

Hey am I still wrong about the key to the game being the physicality at the LOS and point of attack?

 

[jordan0386]

They still play the Pro Bowl? Seriously?

Gonna be moved to that in between week for the Super Bowl, I have heard. Or they may just can the game.

 

[alr1ght]

So Anderson going is just going to result in him asking for even more money. Great (thank you Tony Romo & Agent). :\

 

[Malleymal]

I never get hyped for any other team's success, but when strahan got that sack and did the flex thing I got hype as hell like Jared Allen did it, and grabbed my perfect pushup things and went to work

 

[Dilbert]

Wow, holy shit, etc. I'm still in shocked disbelief that the Giants came through...but damn, am I happy. And yeah, fuck that noise about Rams/Patriots from a couple of years ago -- last night's game was the BIGGEST UPSET in Super Bowl history. Hell, the Giants' upset of the Bills in the 20-19 classic was a bigger upset than that Rams/Patriots game.

Although I was busy entertaining my guests at our Super Bowl party and watching the TV with rapt attention all night, I did find my thoughts drifting back to GAF from time to time. You know that weird, tense, almost nauseous-in-a-good-way feeling you get when you are hoping for the near-impossible and think it might actually come through, but can't vocalize it for fear of jinxing it? And then the rush when the miracle actually happens, even though you know it's just an amazing moment that must someday fade? I thought to myself, "Y'know, this is probably what those batshit insane Nintendo fans must have felt like when the Wii first came onto the market. Maybe I should cut them more slack in the future." And then I thought, "Nah," and had another beer.

 

[j-wood]

That was game tying. Nit-picking, but a sub-3 minute TD drive is just... I mean, it doesn't happen! McNair came super close, though.

Did you really have to say that? That still makes me cringe. ONE YARD KEVIN DYSON. ONE YARD.

 

[J2 Cool]

It is... to me.

I think so too - possibly a dead heat, but I think it's a slightly bigger upset. The Rams won the previous year's Super Bowl, and were in an absolute groove for about a year and a half at that point. They were so used to dominating teams offensively. The Patriots dominated, but in a shorter burst of more dominant victories. Becoming capable offensively but not excessive near the end. The Rams only knew how to be excessive. They didn't beat teams as badly but did it pretty consistently and for a long time. The only team that stopped them offensively was those Bucaneer teams.

I do remember thinking the Pats had a chance that year. They lost 20-17 in the regular season. I thought they could beat them, but I couldn't imagine how. They didn't have a terrific defense. Very good, but not a beast. The Giants had a ridiculous d-line. They had their strengths to fight the Patriots strengths with. Most people didn't expect that to be enough, but they had a chance. Who knew where the '01 Patriots strength would come from? They ended up winning with a brilliant defensive scheme, a game manager of a QB becoming a great leader, and the clutchest kicker of all-time's 2nd great kick.

All things we hadn't seen before, and had no idea would occur. We knew more about Eli's story, and the Giants defense than we did about the '01 Patriots.

 

[SickBoy]

Did you really have to say that? That still makes me cringe. ONE YARD KEVIN DYSON. ONE YARD.

Best open-field tackle in Super Bowl history

 

[Cruceh]

I think so too - possibly a dead heat, but I think it's a slightly bigger upset. The Rams won the previous year's Super Bowl, and were in an absolute groove for about a year and a half at that point. They were so used to dominating teams offensively. The Patriots dominated, but in a shorter burst of more dominant victories. Becoming capable offensively but not excessive near the end. The Rams only knew how to be excessive. They didn't beat teams as badly but did it pretty consistently and for a long time. The only team that stopped them offensively was those Bucaneer teams.

I do remember thinking the Pats had a chance that year. They lost 20-17 in the regular season. I thought they could beat them, but I couldn't imagine how. They didn't have a terrific defense. Very good, but not a beast. The Giants had a ridiculous o-line. They had their strengths to fight the Patriots strengths with. Most people didn't expect that to be enough, but they had a chance. Who knew where the '01 Patriots strength would come from? They ended up winning with a brilliant defensive scheme, a game manager of a QB becoming a great leader, and the clutchest kicker of all-time's 2nd great kick.

All things we hadn't seen before, and had no idea would occur. We knew more about Eli's story, and the Giants defense than we did about the '01 Patriots.

That's an easy question to answer.

Spoiler

Those Rams practice tapes.

 

[woodchuck]

yeah, i said in the last thread that this would be the most watched super bowl ever simply because the pats had a chance to make history. pats games have almost consistently been the most watched games this year.

and everyone got to watch them go 18-1

 

[Cooter]

I really don't think it was a huge upset because of the game they played a month earlier.

 

[woodchuck]

and in determining the bigger upset, just go by the vegas line

 

[J2 Cool]

That's an easy question to answer.

Spoiler

Those Rams practice tapes.

:lol That's why I honestly wouldn't be suprised to find out this was true. If I was in those Pat's shoes, I would have done anything to give us an edge in that game. But I'll wait for more info on that before I take away anything. That was an incredible victory as well. I actually hope it stays remembered like that.

 

[j-wood]

Best open-field tackle in Super Bowl history

We were so close. So freakin close. My dad and I watched that game. I remember complete excitement up to that point, thinking we were fixing to have a great comeback win. Then complete and utter despair set in. I just sat there, my dad almost threw the remote through the tv.


/tear

 

[Tamanon]

We were so close. So freakin close. My dad and I watched that game. I remember complete excitement up to that point, thinking we were fixing to have a great comeback win. Then complete and utter despair set in. I just sat there, my dad almost threw the remote through the tv.


/tear

That's what you fuckers get for ruining our chance at being undefeated!

 

[Wakim]

Thank god the patriots lost. I have to deal with a lot of people in Boston through work and I'm tired of hearing thier shit.

Giving away my age, but I was at SB:XIII. It was big back then, but when I look at the spectacle they make about it today I can only laugh. When I was there the stadium was full of fans, but fans hardly get any tickets directly these days.

 

[j-wood]

That's what you fuckers get for ruining our chance at being undefeated!

huh? I was talking about the Titans v Rams super bowl when we (the titans) lost.

 

[Hootie]

As a Pats fan I just feel bad for Welker, he really played his ass off that game. If the Pats ended up winning it, he would be the hands down MVP of the game. I can't wait to see him tear it up next year!