Mauricio_Magus
Banned
My will to continue on has dwindled. I need to beat Fallen One and Warped Savior, but it seems only boring grinding remains to do so
Never give up!
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Etrian Odyssey Community Thread: The Ongoing Adventures of Fight and Heal
- Thread starter omlet
- Start date
Never give up!
My will to continue on has dwindled. I need to beat Fallen One and Warped Savior, but it seems only boring grinding remains to do so
You don't need to be level 99 to kill them, just so you know. Of course the higher your level the easier they are, but I know some people on GAF have beaten them with parties as low as level 84.
If you haven't already, I recommend you farm up some Formaldehydes and go work on farming any conditional drops you may have missed and then work on farming items to forge your weaponry to be nice and powerful. Kill the dragons a few more times for all their loot. Also you will probably want to get the two best accessories for your damage dealers, which are from rare/conditional drops from the Red Lions and the Hollows around the last floor of the postgame dungeon.
Don't worry about grinding experience points first, they will come naturally as you forge up your weapons and stock up on accessories. After all that, if you still can't beat them, no shame in doing a bit of auto-leveling.
Oh sweet Jesus. As if they weren't bad enough nearly wiping your entire team on turn 1 as their non-shiny version. I can imagine stories of terror where they somehow pre-empt Protector guards.
Actually I'm pretty sure they can't do that. Guards preempt pretty much everything in that game, just like Hexer commands on feared targets. However, on Expert mode, if you haven't hit them with Head Bind or Fear within the first two turns to block their beak attack that hits everyone, you are pretty much dead because they'll get so strong that it will OHKO most of your party.
I managed to kill several glowing Depth Dancers on expert mode. Usually on the first turn they will summon additional enemies. I'd have my DH use Action Boost and then Gag on turn 2 and my Hexer use Evil Eye until it lands. Evil Eye actually works on them (especially with boost) and then you can Suicide Word and they are a piece of cake. Medic would use Delayed Heal on turn 1 then Salve on turn 2. If two turns went by without fear or head bind landing, I'd have my paladin use Flee before I got wiped out lol.
Just yesterday a Shiny Plate Chaser grind my Medic to the ground before my Fortress can shield him. I ragequitted after that.
Parakeetman
No one wants a throne you've been sitting on!
No thats dorarnae dude is inhuman with these types of games lol.
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this community here has a ton of experts for this game which is pretty cool to see lol. lots of good info not to mention most of the regulars play on expert mode it seems. by far one of the better community threads around.
Maybe they do preempt the guards after all. It's been a few months since I was doing my expert mode playthrough in EOU and even longer since I played EOIV. One thing is for sure though and that is if you land Fear on a shiny FOE with a Hexer in EOU and then use a command like Suicide on them, Hexer will always use the command first before the FOE powers up and acts. Hexers <3
SatelliteOfLove
Member
SliceSabre
Banned
Starting to get my EOIII feet underneath me again. It was tough going on the first couple of floors.
I was stupid and a couple of my characters had nothing but their starter gear.
Winnie the Pimp
Member
(EOIV) So i now have my Dancer subbed as a Nightseeker and am wondering why it is that SOMETIMES when a second or 3rd attack activates with her (im assuming most of the time it's Blade Flurry since when it's Sword Dance it says so and you hear a sound cue right?) i only seem to do VERY LITTLE damage compared to my first attack?
Now is this because the blade flurry attacks are off-hand compared to main or is there another reason? I could swear that sometimes it DOES do the same amount of damage than the first attack? Say my main attack does 45 damage, then the second one only like 6 or 7 which totally sucks and makes me almost regret i invested in that skill. What am i doing wrong here? *Confused*
Now is this because the blade flurry attacks are off-hand compared to main or is there another reason? I could swear that sometimes it DOES do the same amount of damage than the first attack? Say my main attack does 45 damage, then the second one only like 6 or 7 which totally sucks and makes me almost regret i invested in that skill. What am i doing wrong here? *Confused*
The damage depends on the level of the skill and the second weapon equiped. I believe its 80% at max level. Sub classes can only go up to half of that so...
Winnie the Pimp
Member
1) Not sure about the weapon since i equipped one that had like 20 dmg more than the previous one to see if it makes a difference and it was the same shit all over again, 6 or 7 damage basically just like the old weapon hmm can't say for sure though whether it was the same enemy as before lol
2) Yeah 40% then, basically is it even WORTH it then if you only have NS as a subclass?
Well offensive dancers are supossed to hit many many times per turn, 40% more damage is a lot and I believe it can proc sword dance too. Sometimes my dancer hit so many times that my links ran out but she still had 4 more hits. Not worth it for support dancers imo
E_Darkness
Member
My Canadian CD arrived today. Problem is that it arrived at home. I'm not home, I'm still leaving at uni for 2 more weeks.
No Etrian Odyssey 3 for me yet.
My bitter experiences shows that shiny FOEs always moves first, except Sonic Break IIRC.
I guess it's fair since they gushed out crapton of EXPs when killed, but damn getting your medic killed while you ordered your Fortress to shield him in that turn is still infuriating.
Parakeetman
No one wants a throne you've been sitting on!
Get dat Nectar ready lol.
That was my anger breaking point for me: I didn't bring any D:
Parakeetman
No one wants a throne you've been sitting on!
lol
The goddamned mantis from the other games, with its wonderful insta-kill sort of move. Good times.
My main dancer was Nightseeker sub for my entire time getting 100% completion. What was important was not the damage she did with her offhand but making sure that Mist Dance was getting up to 8 chances to activate each turn and that Trick Samba gave my NS main the full 3 chases from Trick Samba. My dancer was only hitting for 2-3 digits of damage but on a good day she was actually doing another 10000 damage by triggering extra hits from my NS. Every turn.
Sword Dance can give up to 4 attacks per weapon and subbing NS lets you hit with an offhand weapon, so with Mist Dance each of those 8 hits has a chance to stun the target (even bosses). At low level, like when you first get subclasses, subbing NS is not going to seem that useful, but with Sword and Mist dance maxed it's pretty amazing. I didn't use a Landshark link party but if you are using one I shouldn't have to explain any more about how awesome this is when used as your main linker.
A single dancer on her own is never going to be a major damage dealer. Unless you're doing a Beat Dance party of all dancers, look at it from the perspective of "She can heal well, buff like no one's business, evade like a champ, stunlock like a boss, give my main damage dealers more hits (chase/link),and still do a bit of damage on top of this? Dancer is awesome!" If you're doing a Beat Dance party of all dancers, just change the "a bit of damage" part to "a ton of damage."
Burst skills should activate before shiny FOES, shouldn't they?
They do, so you can use the Stun one, for example, to lock them down for a turn.
They do. I'll often break out the auto stun burst for a free turn when farming them.
Just loaded up my EO Untold file (Expert difficulty). I found a gold Depth Dancer and attacked it !
I wasn't remembering wrong. In EOU, paladin's Front Guard activates before gold FOE acts.
Delayed Heal activates before gold FOE acts.
Phoenix Wings (grimoire skill) activates before gold FOE acts (thus allowing your entire party to act before gold FOE).
Wolf Pack (grimoire skill) activates before gold FOE acts.
Conflict Word (and other Word skills from Hexer) activates before gold FOE acts.
Landed Fear and Head Bind on turn 2 (suck it, Demon Beak!). Easily defeated it within 4 turns for some really juicy exp.
Loaded up EO4 after that to check and you're right, it does work differently in 4. Gold FOE will act before F's Guard skills. MASANI FOE °д°
! I wasn't remembering wrong. In EOU, paladin's Front Guard activates before gold FOE acts.
Delayed Heal activates before gold FOE acts.
Phoenix Wings (grimoire skill) activates before gold FOE acts (thus allowing your entire party to act before gold FOE).
Wolf Pack (grimoire skill) activates before gold FOE acts.
Conflict Word (and other Word skills from Hexer) activates before gold FOE acts.
Landed Fear and Head Bind on turn 2 (suck it, Demon Beak!). Easily defeated it within 4 turns for some really juicy exp.
Loaded up EO4 after that to check and you're right, it does work differently in 4. Gold FOE will act before F's Guard skills. MASANI FOE °д°
Winnie the Pimp
Member
Holy shit so yeah i really feel like a total retard right now, but guess what i JUST figured out now? That this whole time (i am nearly level 40) when i thought i was using Links i really was NOT LOL! People here have explained how Links worked to me before, but somehow they either forgot or i missed the part where it said i need to actually unlock Sonic Raid FIRST in order to unlock the Link skills so i could even USE LINKS. When i read the description of Sonic Raid it sounded like it wouldn't be much use to me and i didn't know that level 3 of this skill LEADS to Link skills i guess so i ignored it and ONLY invested into Improved Link and Vanguard.
It also never occurred to me that Links were supposed to be additional attacks and not just additional attack DAMAGE on ONE attack, so i was completely mistaken ugh.
TLDR; I fucked up with not even using Links (being the EO noob that i am) and made it pretty far, but now that i figured out how this stuff REALLY works, i foresee the difficulty of this game dropping by a truckload just like that because i can do like twice or 3 X the damage i did before)))))))))))))
It also never occurred to me that Links were supposed to be additional attacks and not just additional attack DAMAGE on ONE attack, so i was completely mistaken ugh.
TLDR; I fucked up with not even using Links (being the EO noob that i am) and made it pretty far, but now that i figured out how this stuff REALLY works, i foresee the difficulty of this game dropping by a truckload just like that because i can do like twice or 3 X the damage i did before
)))))))))))))Mauricio_Magus
Banned
Did you have Improved Link and no link moves? lol
At least now you can see why the Landshark is good.
At least now you can see why the Landshark is good.
A Link to the Past
Banned
Just a wild tangent, but with Etrian Odyssey crossing over with Mystery Dungeon and Persona, I wonder how long until we see a Pokemon-EO collaboration? Granted the first two crossovers are both under the same corporate umbrella, but SEGA has made Pokemon games before, so it's not out of the question.
Spike Chunsoft is under the same corporate umbrella as Sega and Atlus?
A Link to the Past
Banned
In a way - SEGA routinely publishes their games.
A dungeon crawler where you have a party of Pokemon or you fight Pokemon as enemies? Either way, the 2 games don't really mesh as well as say Pokemon x MonHun. But then, Pokemon Conquest came out, so...
A Link to the Past
Banned
Both :v Your party could be five Pokemon, and you can recruit in random battles. Or you could have five trainers on a team, each with a selection of Pokemon that can use abilities.
The problem with a party format is that Pokemon is more skewed to single or double Pokemon battling, so having more than that makes it less... Pokemon-y. Maybe the Trainer is like a Wilding, and can call out a Pokemon out of his 6 to assist him in combat, or maybe you play as a Pokemon ala Mystery Dungeon and are limited to you and a partner Pokemon.
Recruiting is very SMT BTW. A SMTxPokemon seems more likely
A Link to the Past
Banned
The problem with a party format is that Pokemon is more skewed to single or double Pokemon battling, so having more than that makes it less... Pokemon-y. Maybe the Trainer is like a Wilding, and can call out a Pokemon out of his 6 to assist him in combat, or maybe you play as a Pokemon ala Mystery Dungeon and are limited to you and a partner Pokemon.
Recruiting is very SMT BTW. A SMTxPokemon seems more likely
Honestly, I think that the only way they could do SMT X Pokemon is to combine themes, but they seem wholly incompatible.
But as for the logistics problem, the one-at-a-time thing is only a mechanic in the main series; Conquest lets you have six on the field at once, and in the anime and manga, trainers can be seen with multiple Pokemon out at once. We could also use a setting justification for PXEO, where the trainer(s) are in more dangerous regions so they need to use all of their Pokemon at once.
My main dancer was Nightseeker sub for my entire time getting 100% completion. What was important was not the damage she did with her offhand but making sure that Mist Dance was getting up to 8 chances to activate each turn and that Trick Samba gave my NS main the full 3 chases from Trick Samba. My dancer was only hitting for 2-3 digits of damage but on a good day she was actually doing another 10000 damage by triggering extra hits from my NS. Every turn.
Sword Dance can give up to 4 attacks per weapon and subbing NS lets you hit with an offhand weapon, so with Mist Dance each of those 8 hits has a chance to stun the target (even bosses). At low level, like when you first get subclasses, subbing NS is not going to seem that useful, but with Sword and Mist dance maxed it's pretty amazing. I didn't use a Landshark link party but if you are using one I shouldn't have to explain any more about how awesome this is when used as your main linker.
A single dancer on her own is never going to be a major damage dealer. Unless you're doing a Beat Dance party of all dancers, look at it from the perspective of "She can heal well, buff like no one's business, evade like a champ, stunlock like a boss, give my main damage dealers more hits (chase/link),and still do a bit of damage on top of this? Dancer is awesome!" If you're doing a Beat Dance party of all dancers, just change the "a bit of damage" part to "a ton of damage."
Dancer/NS is pretty much the epitome of "Utility Character".
Mauricio_Magus
Banned
Dancer/NS for the win, I already talked about but damn she's just amazing. She was pretty good at healing for the whole game, she just danced once every 6-7 turns and then having tons of free turns to boost my attack, chase, give first turns, stun the shit out of EVERYTHING thanks to subbing her as Nightseeker, helping me with links, and evading almost anything.
Fallen One was a joke because my Dancer had him stunned all day.
Fallen One was a joke because my Dancer had him stunned all day.
Winnie the Pimp
Member
yeah, basically i didn't know there WERE Link moves that you needed, i just thought when you activate improved Link it would add the damage to your regular attacks automatically, when it wasn't even damage being added but separated additional attacks ugh ;(
Winnie the Pimp
Member
So if i understood all this correctly, i could do BOTH for my Dancer? Meaning invest into Sword Dance AND Trick Samba AND Link so i'd have these additional attacks from Sword Dance which would then trigger a Link Attack each time AND have others chase EVERY attack i do in addition? hmm.. With me already having invested a ton of points into support/buff skills, will there be enough points available to do it all by the end?
You need both a Land and a Dancer, not both in the same character. I think the general idea is to set up Chase/Trick Samba and get off a ton of hits with Sword Dance, and/or Rush Dance with a Nightseeker main at the front that does Swift Edge. If you don't have a NS main... which is purposely gimping yourself given how overpowered they are... then you have to have someone else trigger Links. You have to ask if you want your Dancer to be your main proccer for Links, essentially. If so, then just set up Chase/Trick and go to down with basic attack.
If you're a lucky SOB and can get off binds reliably, though, then grab a back Sniper and Squall Volley after a leg bind. Links for days.
Like Verilligo said, you are misunderstanding a bit, lol. You don't sub L on your Dancer and give your dancer link skills.
As I think you have figured out now, link attacks from L are dependent on another character hitting the target, then the L "chases" that attack. Using dances like Chase Samba and Trick Samba and Rush Dance all use "chase" mechanics and can trigger even more attacks but aren't directly related to links.
In my case I didn't use an L in my main party, I had a NS, so I wasn't setting up link attacks. However, Trick Samba was still a very good skill later in the game because when a NS puts ailments on a target their normal attacks become very powerful against that target. Since my Dancer would basically always hit a target at least 3 times (getting all 8 Sword Dance hits is rare, but getting 1 proc happens almost always), my NS would chase with 3 additional normal hits, essentially turning my dancer's normally weak attacks into a lot of damage done (teamwork!).
Here's the dancer build I used in my main team (or this is close to it, anyway):
7221x83803868103090xx01230880003000000000030000000000
Copy and paste that into the EOIV skill calculator you can find on the site linked at the bottom of the OP. This is pretty much a one-size-fits-all endgame support dancer build.
In your case since you are using an L, you can use basically the same build if you want, but for you the Chase/Trick samba is less important than the Sword Dance and Blade Flurry. In order to maximize the link potential of your L, you need your party to be able to deliver a lot of hits to targets to trigger all your link attacks. This is where Sword Dance shines. For a party build around a L using links, Trick Samba is not that big of a deal because L's basic attacks don't hit that hard so having your L do more basic attacks is not really anything special. Trick Samba is better off for giving extra hits to a NS, bloodsurging Bushi, or maybe an Imperial.
Mist Dance is just icing on top, because once your Dancer has set up the one or two dances she needs to be doing, she gets 4-5 turns to attack before needing to reapply buffs.
Hope that helps.
Winnie the Pimp
Member
yeah this does help somewhat, it is all very overwhelming to me as this is my very first EO game (or dungeon crawler in general) and since i am not a big numbers guy, it's even worse lol...
What i gathered though is i will stop worrying about it so much and simply focus on Blade Flurry and Sword/Mist Dance, and link with my L like a madman, should be enough to get me through the main game, not sure about post game though should i be interested in that
What i gathered though is i will stop worrying about it so much and simply focus on Blade Flurry and Sword/Mist Dance, and link with my L like a madman, should be enough to get me through the main game, not sure about post game though should i be interested in that
My original squad, which I beat the game with, was:
Fort/Dancer, Link, Dancer/NS
NS/Arc, Sniper/Arc
It was seriously awesome that I could craft a party without a Medic or a Runemaster main.
Mine was somewhat more "generic." Landlink/Bushi, NS/Bushi, Imp/Rune, Fort/Dance, Arc/Med. I originally had a Sniper, but replaced out for a Imp once they became available. It's really hard to resist that incredibly massive burst. I should do a replay and get a little more creative, EO4 is just balanced so incredibly well. The only classes that really "suffer" are Medic and Bushi mains, but even they can be used well.
Winnie the Pimp
Member
Damn so i thought i was overpowered at level 40 for that Baboon King sidequest...
yeah, turns out he kicked my ass like nobody's business I'm actually doing great until he decides to spawn his 2 little healing helpers EVERY damn turn when i defeat them until he gets one special attack in and one shots my entire back row
yeah, turns out he kicked my ass like nobody's business
I'm actually doing great until he decides to spawn his 2 little healing helpers EVERY damn turn when i defeat them until he gets one special attack in and one shots my entire back row Damn so i thought i was overpowered at level 40 for that Baboon King sidequest...
yeah, turns out he kicked my ass like nobody's business
Put sleep, paralyze, or bind on the healer helpers if you can.
I know that feeling. When I first tried that fight, I was able to bind his arms to stop him from throwing those rollers, but my binds wouldn't stick for more than a turn because my level was too low. But when I came back at level 45 or so, everything went a lot smoother and I brought him down without much trouble.Damn so i thought i was overpowered at level 40 for that Baboon King sidequest...
yeah, turns out he kicked my ass like nobody's business
Winnie the Pimp
Member
That's the thing, even if i DO manage to land a bind.... it wont stick for long...
Kinda experiencing a similar problem with the boiling Lizard right now, although i did figure out that its better to take down that huge fire spike so i start the battle at 50% health gone for him!
Still got my ass kicked and had to bail out of there pronto because (again) those DAMN HELPERS, scales in this case.
Does it make a difference when i actually destroy ALL of the scales in the room before i face him? I mean would that translate to NO helpers showing up or is that not related and he just spawns at least 2 during the fight at all times? Also didn't help that i couldn't even so much as TOUCH those helpers, not with magic OR with raw physical attacks, binds also don't stick to those buggers!
No, only icing the big one makes any difference (the other smaller ones in that room are just to impede your movement). You have to deal with the scales, but they're pretty easy if you just ice them. Having a R makes it really easy but even without one you have options that should be obvious.
In case the previous hint was too subtle, keep in mind that ice stakes are an item you can use during the fight with the Boiling Lizard.