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Euro 2016 |OT| Take a bow sson

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John Dunbar

correct about everything
hopefully wales can hold onto a draw because england going into the final group match with only 2 points would be delicious.
 
I think there seems to be some confusion about this, at least regarding how I used the terminology, given that I'm not a native speaker. An unnatural hand movement is deliberate and therefore can certainly count as a 'deliberate act of a player making contact with the ball with his hand', e.g. increasing your "surface".


There are lots of grey areas, sometimes there's just no space or time to move your hand or arm out of the way, like in this case, it was a point blank header by the English player to the Wales player, he absolutely had no time or space to react, as they both were trying to win the loose ball.
 

El Topo

Member
There are lots of grey areas, sometimes there's just no space or time to move your hand or arm out of the way, like in this case, it was a point blank header by the English player to the Wales player, he absolutely had no time or space to react, as they both were trying to win the loose ball.

He had no time to react, but you could also argue that he should have kept his arms closer to him, i.e. that he fully took into account the possibility that he could/would alter the ball movement. An example are free kicks, where players that build the wall typically keep the arms close to their body to not increase the surface. That said, really, it's a single scene and it's not as if it matters all that much. One decision is nothing.
 

azyless

Member
I think there seems to be some confusion about this, at least regarding how I used the terminology, given that I'm not a native speaker. An unnatural hand movement is deliberate and therefore can certainly count as a 'deliberate act of a player making contact with the ball with his hand', as e.g. increasing your "surface" with full knowledge that it may hit the ball. Whether that is the case here, i.e. whether the unnatural or careless movement was a deliberate act to hit the ball is debatable, of course.
I mean yeah it's somewhat up to interpretation what is deliberate and what isn't but there is nothing whatsoever about increasing your surface in the rules. I wasn't shocked at all by the decision.
 
He had no time to react, but you could also argue that he should have kept his arms closer to him.

Yes but he also thought he was going to get to the ball before the English player, they were both going for it, not like he saw the English player coming a mile away and put his body and arm in front of him. Both players were in mid air trying to reach for the ball, when the ball was headed to his arm.
 

El Topo

Member
Yes but he also thought he was going to get to the ball before the English player, they were both going for it, not like he saw the English player coming a mile away and put his body and arm in front of him. Both players were in mid air trying to reach for the ball, when the ball was headed to his arm.

I'm not saying it's a clear cut decision. These things rarely are.
 

Jabo

Member
If this ends in a draw oh man Hamsik and Kucka are going to eat you all for breakfast.

I LOVE YOU BAAAAAAAAAAABY
KuGsj.gif
 
I'm not saying it's a clear cut decision. These things rarely are.

I understand, but in this case, calling it a handball would definitely fall towards the "bad call" side of the argument.

There are very, very rare occasions where the ball touches the defender's arm or hand and the ref should not call it, and this was a perfect example of it. I think timing and space and speed (trajectory) of the ball should all be considered for a handball call. and of course how close is the arm to the body of the culprit (not reaching out to cover more space)

This was the right call by the ref.
 
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