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[Crayon]

Sure, but why would one feel sorry for someone who bought an xbox?

 

[StereoVsn]

All of them. I know of several high-profile Bethesda titles whose port work started up a few months ago. I also have some knowledge on ABK in general, and not a single project that was in dev, or that has gotten an initial approval to have an exploratory milestone achieved, has had a single discussion on exclusivity. I also now know of several titles that fall squarely under XGS, titles that have yet to be announced, that now are doing PS/Xbox/Switch 2 development.

The console wars are basically over. The public just doesn't know it yet.

Wait, but I thought Disney was happy with Indiana Jones being exclusive to the Xbox!

Overall though this strategy makes a lot more sense then whatever the hell MS has been doing since like 2012.

It will be interesting to see if games like Fable or Avowed will show up on PS.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

If I'm Microsoft I'd do the following things

• Create a tiered GamePass that has first party AAA games and remove those games from the basic GamePass
• Port the following games to PS5/Switch/Mobile where appropriate
  • Halo MCC
  • Gears of War games
  • Sea of Thieves
• I'd make a deal with Sony/Bungie to do a multiplatform Halo game with 343i acting as a support studio
• Make CoD biannual
• Really try and build up Crash Bandicoot and Spyro the Dragon into transmedia properties
• Put out an Xbox Streaming device and bundle it with Xbox controller
• Make deals with as many TV manufacturers and streaming device manufacturers to carry the Xbox App

 

[Killjoy-NL]

All of them. I know of several high-profile Bethesda titles whose port work started up a few months ago. I also have some knowledge on ABK in general, and not a single project that was in dev, or that has gotten an initial approval to have an exploratory milestone achieved, has had a single discussion on exclusivity. I also now know of several titles that fall squarely under XGS, titles that have yet to be announced, that now are doing PS/Xbox/Switch 2 development.

The console wars are basically over. The public just doesn't know it yet.

Let's be honest, there were many who called this last-gen already.
Many who have been banned for saying so throughout the years, because they were supposedly fanboying.

I think there is just a large part of the gaming community that is trying to stay positive or 'neutral', because they think it's somehow the right thing to do.
But at this point it's just straight up denial.

There literally is nothing else left to do for MS when it comes to the Xbox division.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Analyzing Microsoft's deep price cuts, they mean one of two things

Either they're readying to discontinue the Xbox Series and this was a move to clear as much inventory before that announcement, which seems unlikely at this point or they are trying their hardest to stay close to Sony's numbers in the US.

I wonder how long Microsoft will maintain the new prices for the XBS and at what point we see difficulty finding units at US retailers.

What we know right now is the XBS is readily available and it still isn't selling super well even with the steep cuts in price.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Let's be honest, there were many who called this last-gen already.
Many who have been banned for saying so throughout the years, because they were supposedly fanboying.

I think there is just a large part of the gaming community that is trying to stay positive or 'neutral', because they think it's somehow the right thing to do.
But at this point it's just straight up denial.

There literally is nothing else left to do for MS when it comes to the Xbox division.

You can't be dead in Asia AND Europe, and in major decline in North America...and be considered in a healthy condition.

I somehow doubt South America is where they are overperforming.

It is time for people to kind of wake up to the reality of this. People were in denial about Sega too and you still hear many today think that Sega might still re-enter the market... I think it was why you saw SO many people want Microsoft to buy Sega.

At this point, it's a matter of time/patience of Nadella.

If we see signs of inventory drying up, that's all we'll need to know.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

You're conflating being a publisher and a platform holder. As a publisher you're unable to take the risks that a platform holder can take. It's much more difficult for a publisher to absorb losses on games that don't hit. You don't have extraneous revenue coming in.

When Sega went 3rd party their game output drastically reduced.

When you're a publisher, you can't release games that compete with each other. Look at EA with F1 and WRC. I seriously doubt EA maintains both licenses/releases annual games for both franchises. Gran Turismo is already eating their lunch on PlayStation. Racing games are extremely crowded at the moment. Microsoft wanted a direct competitor to GT7 which is why there is Forza Motorsport, but the game bombed and Forza Horizon is more popular. The platform doesn't have a userbase large enough to support both. If Forza released on PS5 as well, it still would have bombed.

The more expensive games get to develop the more selective you ultimately have to be with your release schedule. You've got to put significant marketing presence into every game you publish. Microsoft is more doomed to failure as a 3rd party publisher than it is as a platform holder.

GamePass has already failed. First, we'll see a price increase within the next 12 months, probably within the next 6. And within the next 2 years it won't exist as it exists today. At minimum they'll have a more tiered approach to it.

If Microsoft are more doomed as a publisher than a platform holder, then there's no reason for them to be in the industry altogether. However, I genuinely don't think their prognosis within the industry (if they become a fuller publisher) is that dire (not yet, anyway).

Sega eventually managed to find their footing as a publisher. SNK did as well, hell even Atari seem to finally be doing so (again) after how many years. In all those cases they focused in on core niches they were serving. Microsoft has some areas where they have good presence in: arcade racers (Forza Horizon), RTS (Age of Empires, Halo Wars, Gears Tactics), simulators (Flight Sim) I would say, are those niches where MS have had the most success in the past several years on a mix of commercial & critical acclaim.

Theoretically if MS were to cut the console out of the picture altogether and go fully publisher, they would automatically save a lot on operating expenses between console R&D, manufacturing/production/distribution, customer support for hardware (and associated warranties), so on and so forth. So even if they scaled back their software output as a full 3P and most of the games didn't see magnitudes of increases in software sales, they would probably have better profit margins simply through expunging the console hardware and associated costs alone.

However I think there's a more balanced path where the hardware can remain, just with a business model shifted away from a console style to PC hardware-centric, and making Xbox a full extension of Windows & Surface (but gaming-orientated) rather than what it currently is. But that's me being optimistic with a best-case given Xbox Series market share and hardware sales continue to shrink heavily, which definitely seems to be the case.

 

[GHG]

If Microsoft are more doomed as a publisher than a platform holder, then there's no reason for them to be in the industry altogether. However, I genuinely don't think their prognosis within the industry (if they become a fuller publisher) is that dire (not yet, anyway).

Sega eventually managed to find their footing as a publisher. SNK did as well, hell even Atari seem to finally be doing so (again) after how many years. In all those cases they focused in on core niches they were serving. Microsoft has some areas where they have good presence in: arcade racers (Forza Horizon), RTS (Age of Empires, Halo Wars, Gears Tactics), simulators (Flight Sim) I would say, are those niches where MS have had the most success in the past several years on a mix of commercial & critical acclaim.

Theoretically if MS were to cut the console out of the picture altogether and go fully publisher, they would automatically save a lot on operating expenses between console R&D, manufacturing/production/distribution, customer support for hardware (and associated warranties), so on and so forth. So even if they scaled back their software output as a full 3P and most of the games didn't see magnitudes of increases in software sales, they would probably have better profit margins simply through expunging the console hardware and associated costs alone.

However I think there's a more balanced path where the hardware can remain, just with a business model shifted away from a console style to PC hardware-centric, and making Xbox a full extension of Windows & Surface (but gaming-orientated) rather than what it currently is. But that's me being optimistic with a best-case given Xbox Series market share and hardware sales continue to shrink heavily, which definitely seems to be the case.

Purely as a publisher, without their diehard console fans roaming the Internet attempting to control the narrative surrounding their games/output, they would be nothing more than a low-rent EA/ubisoft in terms of how they would be perceived.

Thanks to how transparent and consumer friendly Steam is, everyone can see where their games sit overall. Also throwing all of their games on to Playstation/Nintendo systems isn't going to change anything unless they up their standards.

Who is going to play Forza Motorsport over GT7? Who is going to play Starfield over Tears of the Kingdom? Because that's the kind of on-platform competition they would be exposing themselves to if they were to go fully 3rd party. It's bad enough for them as it is on PC already but I believe it would be worse for them if they were to expand to other consoles in their current state.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

If Microsoft are more doomed as a publisher than a platform holder, then there's no reason for them to be in the industry altogether. However, I genuinely don't think their prognosis within the industry (if they become a fuller publisher) is that dire (not yet, anyway).

Sega eventually managed to find their footing as a publisher. SNK did as well, hell even Atari seem to finally be doing so (again) after how many years. In all those cases they focused in on core niches they were serving. Microsoft has some areas where they have good presence in: arcade racers (Forza Horizon), RTS (Age of Empires, Halo Wars, Gears Tactics), simulators (Flight Sim) I would say, are those niches where MS have had the most success in the past several years on a mix of commercial & critical acclaim.

Theoretically if MS were to cut the console out of the picture altogether and go fully publisher, they would automatically save a lot on operating expenses between console R&D, manufacturing/production/distribution, customer support for hardware (and associated warranties), so on and so forth. So even if they scaled back their software output as a full 3P and most of the games didn't see magnitudes of increases in software sales, they would probably have better profit margins simply through expunging the console hardware and associated costs alone.

However I think there's a more balanced path where the hardware can remain, just with a business model shifted away from a console style to PC hardware-centric, and making Xbox a full extension of Windows & Surface (but gaming-orientated) rather than what it currently is. But that's me being optimistic with a best-case given Xbox Series market share and hardware sales continue to shrink heavily, which definitely seems to be the case.

First, Microsoft doesn't care about games, they want revenue from an AppStore on iOS and Android since they missed the boat on Windows Mobile. An AppStore on both erases that failure for the most part. I could also see Microsoft getting back into phones and releasing a Windows branded phone with the Microsoft Appstore standard.

Second, I don't think they're doomed as a publisher. I just don't think they're going to maintain the number of studios they have at the moment. It's just way too much risk involved. It's like Square Enix releasing Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy in the same month. You won't see it happen. Even when they were rivals, Square tried to avoid releasing near Dragon Quest.

There isn't much reason to believe that they can't be a successful 3rd party publisher. It just won't look like what they're doing today.

Like putting out a Windows branded phone, they could also put out Xbox branded gaming PCs, but their days as a console manufacturer are numbered.

There is no way they're making enough money to even warrant being in the European and Asian markets at this point. And with almost full concentration on North America, they're still in decline.

Tell me, what was their last big 3rd party exclusive announcement? They're not even trying at this point.

 

[DEAD ORIGINAL]

meaningless numbers
MS dont focus on console sales.

No

Do people actually believe that the x/s are bad machines? That was probably true for the xbox one, but these things are very well engineered and the software running on them seems quite stable, at least from my experience.

Or is this because "there is no games" ?

Yer but that dashboard sucks also the big exclusives have been let downs except Forza Horizon 5 and even that's not as good as 4 but that's cause Mexico stinks compared to Lake District..... Mexico stinks as a setting I didn't say mexican people stink

 

[jm89]

Vgchartz estimates(aaron greenberg approved) just for fun

Some vgchartz followers are gonna have a fit.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

Purely as a publisher, without their diehard console fans roaming the Internet attempting to control the narrative surrounding their games/output, they would be nothing more than a low-rent EA/ubisoft in terms of how they would be perceived.

Thanks to how transparent and consumer friendly Steam is, everyone can see where their games sit overall. Also throwing all of their games on to Playstation/Nintendo systems isn't going to change anything unless they up their standards.

Who is going to play Forza Motorsport over GT7? Who is going to play Starfield over Tears of the Kingdom? Because that's the kind of on-platform competition they would be exposing themselves to if they were to go fully 3rd party. It's bad enough for them as it is on PC already but I believe it would be worse for them in their current state if they were to expand to other consoles.

Definitely true, the standard of quality has to be increased. Already availability isn't too much the issue for MS because Game Pass is on Xbox, it's on PC, and it's on things like Samsung TVs (other TVs too IIRC, just not bundled) & mobile devices via xCloud. Combined that's already at least 1+ billion people, but the market numbers for Xbox show nothing reflective of reaching anything more than 3-4% of all of those people.

They'd basically have to do for their IP, the type of stuff Sega did for VF going from VF3 TB on Dreamcast (which wasn't a great port, and got outdone by Soul Calibur) to VF4: EVO on PS2 (which actually helped substantially increase the IP's appeal in the West). But you need the right type of management to do that, and I don't think Microsoft have it in the gaming side. They may have some talented people spread out throughout their studios but either leadership in some of those studios is complacent, or (especially likely) management at the high level of the division itself just doesn't know how to cultivate & grow things creatively.

So I guess the answer to MS's problems are a lot more complicated than simply getting their games onto PlayStation & Nintendo systems, that's for sure.

First, Microsoft doesn't care about games, they want revenue from an AppStore on iOS and Android since they missed the boat on Windows Mobile. An AppStore on both erases that failure for the most part. I could also see Microsoft getting back into phones and releasing a Windows branded phone with the Microsoft Appstore standard.

Second, I don't think they're doomed as a publisher. I just don't think they're going to maintain the number of studios they have at the moment. It's just way too much risk involved. It's like Square Enix releasing Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy in the same month. You won't see it happen. Even when they were rivals, Square tried to avoid releasing near Dragon Quest.

There isn't much reason to believe that they can't be a successful 3rd party publisher. It just won't look like what they're doing today.

Like putting out a Windows branded phone, they could also put out Xbox branded gaming PCs, but their days as a console manufacturer are numbered.

There is no way they're making enough money to even warrant being in the European and Asian markets at this point. And with almost full concentration on North America, they're still in decline.

Tell me, what was their last big 3rd party exclusive announcement? They're not even trying at this point.

Yeah, for sure they will close down certain studios if they went full 3P. Either that or significantly downsize them into support roles, and fold any useful people over into other, healthier studios. It probably won't look as bad as what Embracer is doing right now, but it won't be too far removed from it, either.

It would seem going with your thoughts, MS's future for success in the industry really hinges on regulators opening up Google & Apple's mobile platforms (justified or not is another topic) and pushing their own app store there, and maybe bringing back Windows Phone. They don't completely exit the console market, certainly not the PC market, but they definitely aren't the priority in that scenario.

 

[Insane Metal]

So, is that 18:1 info real? No way, right?

 

[Coulomb_Barrier]

It's dead isn't it. You know which one I am talking about

 

[yurinka]

Are we sure that 20% down applies to both. Seems a but flippant, maybe xbox is down 50% and ps5 isn't down at all.

I thought the same when saw the sentence.

Well, I honestly don't know how true this is but it tracks with what Shinobi said the other day on the other forum so I guess we'll have to wait and see what happens.

We know MS will continue releasing many of their games on PS, they did for many years and signed that CoD will continue releasing at least for 10 years on PS and that Sony will be able to get the entire ABK past catalog plus future catalog for at least 15 years for their service via Ubisoft (if interested Sony will have to negotiate it with Ubi, not MS).

Phil in recent years has been talking about putting their games everywhere, and other acquired companies by MS continued releasing on PS after acquisition.

Now that the Xbox market share is collapsing in favor of PS it would make more sense than ever to continue publishing MS games on PS if they aim to have profitability in their gaming division, or at least to reduce its loses.

 

[kruis]

All of them. I know of several high-profile Bethesda titles whose port work started up a few months ago. I also have some knowledge on ABK in general, and not a single project that was in dev, or that has gotten an initial approval to have an exploratory milestone achieved, has had a single discussion on exclusivity. I also now know of several titles that fall squarely under XGS, titles that have yet to be announced, that now are doing PS/Xbox/Switch 2 development.

The console wars are basically over. The public just doesn't know it yet.

If you're right then Sony will know too, since they'll be sending PS5 Pro dev kits to dozens of studios under Microsoft's umbrella right now ....

 

[graywolf323]

Lmao magine having to explain something as simple as this.

Also is Ding on MS payroll or what?
Don’t remember him being this delusional before.

he didn’t used to be, IIRC a lil while back he got a LOT of backlash from the Xbox ‘faithful‘ (frightful) over something and since then he’s become incredibly milquetoast

 

[DJ12]

Just curious, now that they are done, how does that look like in your world?

You'd have known if you read on....

 

[SneakersSO]

If you're right then Sony will know too, since they'll be sending PS5 Pro dev kits to dozens of studios under Microsoft's umbrella right now ....

Sony would've known by virtue of devs/pubs basically informing them and signing SLAs in order to ultimately ship to those platforms. MS didn't start doing PS versions of both ports and new releases without Sony being in the know.

 

[SneakersSO]

If Microsoft are more doomed as a publisher than a platform holder, then there's no reason for them to be in the industry altogether. However, I genuinely don't think their prognosis within the industry (if they become a fuller publisher) is that dire (not yet, anyway).

Sega eventually managed to find their footing as a publisher. SNK did as well, hell even Atari seem to finally be doing so (again) after how many years. In all those cases they focused in on core niches they were serving. Microsoft has some areas where they have good presence in: arcade racers (Forza Horizon), RTS (Age of Empires, Halo Wars, Gears Tactics), simulators (Flight Sim) I would say, are those niches where MS have had the most success in the past several years on a mix of commercial & critical acclaim.

Theoretically if MS were to cut the console out of the picture altogether and go fully publisher, they would automatically save a lot on operating expenses between console R&D, manufacturing/production/distribution, customer support for hardware (and associated warranties), so on and so forth. So even if they scaled back their software output as a full 3P and most of the games didn't see magnitudes of increases in software sales, they would probably have better profit margins simply through expunging the console hardware and associated costs alone.

However I think there's a more balanced path where the hardware can remain, just with a business model shifted away from a console style to PC hardware-centric, and making Xbox a full extension of Windows & Surface (but gaming-orientated) rather than what it currently is. But that's me being optimistic with a best-case given Xbox Series market share and hardware sales continue to shrink heavily, which definitely seems to be the case.

I really don't think MS cuts hardware altogether. None of the conversations I have had indicates thats what the plan is.

MS still makes boat loads of revenue from the Xbox platform. Not on HW sales, but on services & subscriptions. Sure, if they begin announcing regular releases on PS/Nintendo, some of those users may just opt to leave, but the likelihood is that those users will still engage with MS' output, just on their terms.

Everything i've seen indicates that MS' approach will likely mirror how they treat the Surface line. Keep making a HW line for a very dedicated consumer base. Make your SW and services revenue on every other device.

 

[DJ12]

Purely as a publisher, without their diehard console fans roaming the Internet attempting to control the narrative surrounding their games/output, they would be nothing more than a low-rent EA/ubisoft in terms of how they would be perceived.

Thanks to how transparent and consumer friendly Steam is, everyone can see where their games sit overall. Also throwing all of their games on to Playstation/Nintendo systems isn't going to change anything unless they up their standards.

Who is going to play Forza Motorsport over GT7? Who is going to play Starfield over Tears of the Kingdom? Because that's the kind of on-platform competition they would be exposing themselves to if they were to go fully 3rd party. It's bad enough for them as it is on PC already but I believe it would be worse for them if they were to expand to other consoles in their current state.

I don't necessarily agree, without a console to support and be under pressure to release any old shite to move the hardware maybe the quality will increase, ms has made good games before and there's no reason they won't in the future.

While I won't choose to play forza over gt7 if that was my option, I do play forza on pc. It's not great but I still enjoy it. Same way I still play need for speed, it's utter shite these days, but still has its moments that make it a good time pass.

 

[Buggy Loop]

Bruh... I'm from Europe and I just a bought a Series X

Its ok bruh

I bought a Sega MS rather than a NES in the 80's

When I got to the rental store to see the choices and there were 4 walls of NES games and half of one for Sega, I felt like this, even at 7 years old.

 

[Raonak]

When you think about it, 54k is a lot!

I bet you guys have NEVER sold 54k of anything!!
Hell, most of you don't even get paid 54k a year.

So embarrasing of you guys to make fun of xbox like this.

Spoiler

/s cause you can never tell these days

 

[Crayon]

Mmmm I still don't see them putting games on ps. It's still a competing platform in terms of being a gaming network if not a console. I guess it's not exactly a radical change of plan compared to dropping out of consoles, or at least the console war, though.

 

[hepfom]

Mmmm I still don't see them putting games on ps. It's still a competing platform in terms of being a gaming network if not a console. I guess it's not exactly a radical change of plan compared to dropping out of consoles, or at least the console war, though.

they're already publishing games on Playstation. All they have to do is publish more of them. We're at the stage of Windows Phone when Microsoft bought Nokia.

 

[Flabagast]

In the end, Starfield happens to be one of the rare cases in the history of gaming of being an absolute anti system-seller.

After having been marketed as a GOTG by Bethesda, MS and Xbox fans, the game was so much a disappointment that it discouraged potential buyers on the fence to choose an Xbox, and led them to purchase a PS5 instead.

Quite the feat, and it could very much be true that Xbox sales this automn would have been higher, had Starfield not released.

 

[ShadowkillXNA]

You forgot about "The tools."

The "tools" have been there all along:

 

[Generic]

It's dead isn't it. You know which one I am talking about

Why are so many people happy with the Xbox selling poorly? Serious question.

 

[thismeinteil]

That Indiana Jones decision still making financial sense, Disney?

 

[VideoGameEnjoyer]

Why are so many people happy with the Xbox selling poorly? Serious question.

People thought that their strategy for the last decade was dumb as hell, and it is good to be proven right. And maybe it will finally force them to change what they are doing that has failed so massively.

I own an XSX since day one btw, so part of the problem over here. But glad the rest of the world is wising up.

 

[GHG]

I don't necessarily agree, without a console to support and be under pressure to release any old shite to move the hardware maybe the quality will increase, ms has made good games before and there's no reason they won't in the future.

While I won't choose to play forza over gt7 if that was my option, I do play forza on pc. It's not great but I still enjoy it. Same way I still play need for speed, it's utter shite these days, but still has its moments that make it a good time pass.

We are gaming enthusiasts, a lot of us will play/try any old shite. The general public isn't like that, most people play only a handful of games until the wheels fall off. This is part of the reason why gamepass isn't taking off like they hoped.

Forza is a perfect example. Why is someone who has invested thousands of dollars into iracing and has hundreds of hours of playtime with that sim suddenly going to switch to Forza? What's the pull? The same example can be used vs Forza for most of the other racing games available on PC minus the thousands of dollars invested (I'm using iracing because it has the most active playerbase amongst PC racing sims by some margin). In Forza Motorsports current state, the vast majority of GT players wouldn't even bother trying it, let alone switch entirely, even if it was a choice on the very same platform.

That's why, as long as they don't fuck it up, COD is a good buy for them because it has a sticky playerbase, year after year. It's one of those games that hundreds of thousands of people exclusively play, and nothing else, all year round. Even with it's obvious and glaring issues, there's not much else out there that's like it, in its current state it's a moat.

People often ask why EA don't get any fresh competition as far as FIFA is concerned, it's this kind of aforementioned player behaviour that deters anyone from even investing money to try.

Of the games that they've released this gen I could only see Forza Horizon 5 being a consistent top seller on Sony and Nintendo platforms. Flight sim isn't a console game, same goes for AOE. Pentiment, Grounded and Hi Fi Rush, as good as they are for what they are, aren't games that have the capacity to light up sales charts (although in the case of Hi Fi Rush I could see it doing much better on Sony/Nintendo platforms than it has done on Microsoft ones). The rest of the games, now that the initial hype led marketing cycles are over along with the cat being out of the bag in terms of real-world impressions, they don't have a chance in hell in their current states. They have all promptly disappeared from all visible sales charts, even on storefronts that don't have access to gamepass.

But to touch on your first paragraph, I don't think the fact that they are a platform holder has anything to do with their repeatedly poor output. If anything, being a platform holder should be more incentive to produce quality that stands above the 3rd party offerings on the console, not less. It's been going on long enough now that there is something clearly very broken in terms of their internal development processes and scheduling. The irony is that if they fixed that then their console sales would improve and we wouldn't even need to be having this hypothetical "xbox as a publisher" discussion.

 

[Crayon]

they're already publishing games on Playstation. All they have to do is publish more of them. We're at the stage of Windows Phone when Microsoft bought Nokia.

I guess so. It's already a game for game basis so it's a matter of choosing the more notable ones. Maybe I'm in denial. Maybe I'm almost scared of what's going to happen to the internet if they announce elder scrolls 6 on PlayStation lol.

Why are so many people happy with the Xbox selling poorly? Serious question.

I would be looking forward to the shilling and astroturfing cooling off. God, that would be nice. The narrative building and evangelism got old long time ago, to put it lightly.

I'd also be really happy if they turn their anti-competitive tendencies elsewhere. Their musings about buying Nintendo and valve and going scorched earth on PlayStation should back me up on that. Shit company to have around, really. At least to have around something you're passionate about.

 

[yazenov]

Why are so many people happy with the Xbox selling poorly? Serious question.

Honestly? I can't speak for everyone but for me, it is the following:

1- Fuck MS, why would anyone cheer for the 2 trillion dollar mega-corporation?
2- It's nice to see the trillion-dollar company that has been flexing its "war Chest" by buying publishers and taking away games from other companies being humbled by the other smaller companies
3- Selling poorly may lead them to exit the hardware business and release their games on the relevant platforms, like Sega.
4- I want Game Pass to fail. The Netflix gaming model is devaluing games and this business model sets a dangerous precedent for the gaming industry IMO. I much prefer Sony's and Nintendo's traditional business model.
5- Bitter tears from the Xbox shills and influencers are delicious

 

[LordCBH]

Why are so many people happy with the Xbox selling poorly? Serious question.

I like my Xbox. It’s nice. But Microsoft hasn’t shown any indications that they’re actually serious in competing for about 13 years now. They’re so against competing that they just want to snap everything up they can so they don’t have to.

 

[Thirty7ven]

Sony would've known by virtue of devs/pubs basically informing them and signing SLAs in order to ultimately ship to those platforms. MS didn't start doing PS versions of both ports and new releases without Sony being in the know.

You’re writing a lot of checks.

 

[mayham2199]

The not caring about console sales thing would be much more believable if Gamepass subscriber numbers were through the roof. Even being so available on so many devices, the needle does not seem to be moving.

Those of us who absolutely loved their 360's and ever since have just been looking at every move Xbox makes like:

It has been a fumbling of absolutely epic and embarrassing proportions. That's all there is to it. People acting like it is a good thing and everyone should be happy when this company, that hasn't put out a smash hit or made a smart business move in over a decade, buys up a bunch of massive publishers and IP, are the biggest clowns of all.

Yep loved my 360. I didn't want to move to PS4 because I wanted to keep my trophies and was committed to Xbox. I already saw the exclusives were kind of drying up but I was still willing to stick with them. Then they announced the used game policy and I was out. I was to poor at the time to be involved in something like that. Getting new games for me often meant selling whatever games I had to get some money towards the new game. Even when they reversed it, it was to late because I didn't trust them to go right back to it after that. I didn't want to be invested in that ecosystem anymore.

What's funny is by the time the PS4 came out I had a much better job and went all digital almost immediately because getting up from the couch sucks.

 

[jroc74]

they're already publishing games on Playstation. All they have to do is publish more of them. We're at the stage of Windows Phone when Microsoft bought Nokia.

All this, but especially the bolded.

Over the years some of us have used Windows Phone as a comparison.

 

[Generic]

Honestly? I can't speak for everyone but for me, it is the following:

1- Fuck MS, why would anyone cheer for the 2 trillion dollar mega-corporation?
2- It's nice to see the trillion-dollar company that has been flexing its "war Chest" by buying publishers and taking away games from other companies being humbled by the other smaller companies
3- Selling poorly may lead them to exit the hardware business and release their games on the relevant platforms, like Sega.
4- I want Game Pass to fail. The Netflix gaming model is devaluing games and this business model sets a dangerous precedent for the gaming industry IMO. I much prefer Sony's and Nintendo's traditional business model.
5- Bitter tears from the Xbox shills and influencers are delicious

"2- It's nice to see the trillion-dollar company that has been flexing its "war Chest" by buying publishers and taking away games from other companies being humbled by the other smaller companies"

But Sony spent years buying exclusivities. Street Fighter V was never released on Xbox.

"3- Selling poorly may lead them to exit the hardware business and release their games on the relevant platforms, like Sega."

Having Sony as the only console maker in the market would be bad. (Nintendo doesn't count because the Switch is a portable machine)

4- I want Game Pass to fail. The Netflix gaming model is devaluing games and this business model sets a dangerous precedent for the gaming industry IMO. I much prefer Sony's and Nintendo's traditional business model.

Gamepass give consumers more choices. Some people prefer to pay $10 a month to play 100+ games instead of paying $70 for each game. Also if it's so bad, why did Sony adopt it?

"5- Bitter tears from the Xbox shills and influencers are delicious"

Now this is just emotional.

 

[Generic]

I'd also be really happy if they turn their anti-competitive tendencies elsewhere. Their musings about buying Nintendo and valve and going scorched earth on PlayStation should back me up on that. Shit company to have around really. At least to have around something you're passionate about.

Sony doesn't allows refunds. They increased the price of the PS+ Extra while giving consumers 10 years old games.

Nintendo never reduces the prices of their games.

 

[Generic]

People thought that their strategy for the last decade was dumb as hell, and it is good to be proven right. And maybe it will finally force them to change what they are doing that has failed so massively.

I own an XSX since day one btw, so part of the problem over here. But glad the rest of the world is wising up.

Releasing their games on Gamepass day-1 on both console and PC is a great thing for consumers. Imagine if Sony and Nintendo did the same thing. You have to buy a Switch to play Nintendo games and pray the games run at 30 fps.

 

[GHG]

"2- It's nice to see the trillion-dollar company that has been flexing its "war Chest" by buying publishers and taking away games from other companies being humbled by the other smaller companies"

But Sony spent years buying exclusivities. Street Fighter V was never released on Xbox.

"3- Selling poorly may lead them to exit the hardware business and release their games on the relevant platforms, like Sega."

Having Sony as the only console maker in the market would be bad. (Nintendo doesn't count because the Switch is a portable machine)

4- I want Game Pass to fail. The Netflix gaming model is devaluing games and this business model sets a dangerous precedent for the gaming industry IMO. I much prefer Sony's and Nintendo's traditional business model.

Gamepass give consumers more choices. Some people prefer to pay $10 a month to play 100+ games instead of paying $70 for each game. Also if it's so bad, why did Sony adopt it?

"5- Bitter tears from the Xbox shills and influencers are delicious"

Now this is just emotional.

Something something "but Sony".

This is the same Sony that just released high quality free (not "free") DLC for one of their flagship titles, even given their current market position and momentum.

Focus your worries closer to home would be my advice.

Releasing their games on Gamepass day-1 on both console and PC is a great thing for consumers. Imagine if Sony and Nintendo did the same thing. You have to buy a Switch to play Nintendo games and pray the games run at 30 fps.

And yet more nonsense thinking that the business in last place with the worst quality products should be able to dictate the direction of the market and make wholesale decisions for all consumers.

Seriously?

At what point do you not just look at this and say that most people don't want what Microsoft are offering and my own personal feelings on the matter are irrelevant?

Look at the sales figures in this thread. If their products and business model were as good as you thought they were then people would be buying it.

 

[H-I-M]

Why are so many people happy with the Xbox selling poorly? Serious question.

Because they tried to 'Spend Sony out of business' but failed miserably.

Microsoft was ready to “go spend Sony out of business” to strengthen Xbox

A key email in the FTC v. Microsoft case

www.theverge.com

 

[Gambit2483]

The "tools" have been there all along:

 

[VideoGameEnjoyer]

Yep loved my 360. I didn't want to move to PS4 because I wanted to keep my trophies and was committed to Xbox. I already saw the exclusives were kind of drying up but I was still willing to stick with them. Then they announced the used game policy and I was out. I was to poor at the time to be involved in something like that. Getting new games for me often meant selling whatever games I had to get some money towards the new game. Even when they reversed it, it was to late because I didn't trust them to go right back to it after that. I didn't want to be invested in that ecosystem anymore.

What's funny is by the time the PS4 came out I had a much better job and went all digital almost immediately because getting up from the couch sucks.

Wow, are you me? Basically exactly my experience, right down to going all digital from day one with my PS4.

Releasing their games on Gamepass day-1 on both console and PC is a great thing for consumers. Imagine if Sony and Nintendo did the same thing. You have to buy a Switch to play Nintendo games and pray the games run at 30 fps.

Well the 'consumer' has spoken and it seems they don't give a shit about that service or those games. So....

It's just the not the silver bullet you and Xbox want it so desperately to be. People would rather pay for great games than rent the poo poo platter game library. How much more evidence is needed?

 

[Crayon]

Sony doesn't allows refunds. They increased the price of the PS+ Extra while giving consumers 10 years old games.

Nintendo never reduces the prices of their games.

All worth it if I get to hear 10% less of this zealous bleating.

 

[ulantan]

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Yeah, for sure they will close down certain studios if they went full 3P. Either that or significantly downsize them into support roles, and fold any useful people over into other, healthier studios. It probably won't look as bad as what Embracer is doing right now, but it won't be too far removed from it, either.

It would seem going with your thoughts, MS's future for success in the industry really hinges on regulators opening up Google & Apple's mobile platforms (justified or not is another topic) and pushing their own app store there, and maybe bringing back Windows Phone. They don't completely exit the console market, certainly not the PC market, but they definitely aren't the priority in that scenario.

Xbox was always a means to an end for Microsoft. I think they regret getting out of the mobile space so early, but aren't under the illusion that they definitely would have been successful had they stayed in. Now they don't need to have Windows Mobile as OS, they just need that access.

I'm not saying they give up gaming, I think they still believe in xCloud and GamePass as a future, but that console element I think is significantly degraded for them.

They have to ask themselves how they can build GamePass so that it is sustainable on PC, Cloud, and Mobile without console or with very limited console.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

All of them. I know of several high-profile Bethesda titles whose port work started up a few months ago. I also have some knowledge on ABK in general, and not a single project that was in dev, or that has gotten an initial approval to have an exploratory milestone achieved, has had a single discussion on exclusivity. I also now know of several titles that fall squarely under XGS, titles that have yet to be announced, that now are doing PS/Xbox/Switch 2 development.

The console wars are basically over. The public just doesn't know it yet.

Does your uncle work for Bethesda?

Serious answer: I'll believe it when I see it.

 

[Flutta]

Why are so many people happy with the Xbox selling poorly? Serious question.

Because cancer failing to spread through the body is always a good thing wouldn’t you agree?

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

I thought the same when saw the sentence.


We know MS will continue releasing many of their games on PS, they did for many years and signed that CoD will continue releasing at least for 10 years on PS and that Sony will be able to get the entire ABK past catalog plus future catalog for at least 15 years for their service via Ubisoft (if interested Sony will have to negotiate it with Ubi, not MS).

Phil in recent years has been talking about putting their games everywhere, and other acquired companies by MS continued releasing on PS after acquisition.

Now that the Xbox market share is collapsing in favor of PS it would make more sense than ever to continue publishing MS games on PS if they aim to have profitability in their gaming division, or at least to reduce its loses.

That doesn't completely get rid of the threat Microsoft poses to Sony in terms of foreclosure strategies though, unless Microsoft either get rid of the Xbox hardware or significantly revamp the hardware side into a PC-centric business model and product type.

Unless that happens, even if they expand their publishing output on other platforms, it can be a problem for competitors if the gains in revenue with such a strategy basically let Microsoft ride out with Xbox hardware as a traditional console business model-wise. It'd just let them build up a cash flow that could keep Xbox as a console on life support for any number of years and consolidate control of the 3P market under their ownership.

Then pressure companies like Sony or Nintendo into catalog-type deals, threaten foreclosure of certain titles etc. and give Xbox a massive push again. That's a long-term play any company smaller than Microsoft would not be able or want to sustain because of all the operating expenses incurred in the meantime, but that just shows the danger of a company as big as Microsoft potentially trying to play both hands, since gaming revenue still means little to nothing in their bottom line cash flow within the entire company itself.

So chances are, something would still have to give, especially if MS want Game Pass on competitor platforms. It'll likely be time for them to make a big choice sooner rather than later.

I really don't think MS cuts hardware altogether. None of the conversations I have had indicates thats what the plan is.

MS still makes boat loads of revenue from the Xbox platform. Not on HW sales, but on services & subscriptions. Sure, if they begin announcing regular releases on PS/Nintendo, some of those users may just opt to leave, but the likelihood is that those users will still engage with MS' output, just on their terms.

Everything i've seen indicates that MS' approach will likely mirror how they treat the Surface line. Keep making a HW line for a very dedicated consumer base. Make your SW and services revenue on every other device.

That's interesting. But, does that mean they pivot Xbox to that type of Surface angle just in terms of messaging & marketing, or do they fully commit and shift the whole business model more along those lines? Because IMO those are two different things.

For example, if it's the former, they still more or less keep Xbox the way it currently is: hardware subsidized in upfront MSRP to make up through 3P cuts, subs, peripherals etc. Very closed ecosystem-wise (no alternative gaming storefronts for example), no real purpose for aspects of productivity (which shifting OS to a more general-purpose Windows would allow), etc. So while they in a sense could make more money by otherwise publishing all their content everywhere, they still eat into their profit margins because Xbox itself otherwise just functions the way as current, which is eating at operating expenses for very little gains.

It still means they're producing systems at high-million volumes annually, still handling marketing in the space of a traditional console, still bleeding users to competing platforms, still bleeding money in subsidization of hardware MSRP just to keep user bleed from getting worst, etc. IMO if MS are looking to grow their profit margins, they'd have to retool the entire business model for Xbox from the root and up. Just treating it more like a Surface-type endeavor for optics & messaging won't accomplish that, not by a long shot.