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F1 2010 |OT| The 12th Annual Hermann Tilke Championship

olimpia84

olimpia84

Member
This game is fun but there are some things that completely break the game. Last night I completed my 3rd race in career mode in my Lotus. I managed to go all the way to Q1 and got 10th place to start the race. The race starts, after a few laps I manage to go all the way up to 5th (a bit unrealistic considering I'm driving a Lotus) then I loose control and spin and go back to like 9th place. No big deal. I set my strategy to pit early so I go into the pits and as I come out I'm in 21st place....not very realistic imo considering I put some amazing lap times previously. Then my teammate (Jarno Trulli) who was in 19th place throughout the WHOLE race up to that point pits in and somehow he manages to exit the pits in front of me. Absolutely ridiculous, this scenario is impossible considering he was behind me the entire race (and by a lot). I'm obviously pissed off at that point and started driving like crap...I managed to get past a few cars and get to 14th place but then I made some mistakes and finshed the race in 20th place with my stupid ass teammate in front of me.

Seriously, how the hell can this happen? It ruins the experience, at least for me.
 
G

gutterboy44

Member
Anyone here playing it on PS3 with a wheel? How sim is it? I am looking for something to hold me over until GT5 and the game looks great and I would love to race some of these new circuits I never have before. I am not expecting the greatest sim of all time but as long as the physics are decent sim and challenging on the PS3 I think I will pick it up today.
 
S

Sent

Member
gutterboy44 said:
Anyone here playing it on PS3 with a wheel? How sim is it? I am looking for something to hold me over until GT5 and the game looks great and I would love to race some of these new circuits I never have before. I am not expecting the greatest sim of all time but as long as the physics are decent sim and challenging on the PS3 I think I will pick it up today.
Click to expand...

This guy is pretty pro on PS3. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vOqFAPBLuQc

He says it's not hard dry, but wet it's harder. I haven't done wet much but I suck anyway so...
 
mclaren777

mclaren777

Member
Even better than before...

http://www.virtualr.net/f1-2010-realistic-sun-mod-1-0-released/

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CjCkH.jpg
 
moojito

moojito

Member
Not better in my eyes. Look at the first pair. The light shading/reflection on the road is gone. The colourful one looks like daytooooooooona. But if the people using it prefer it, grand. It's not the definition of better, though.
 
D

Diablohead

Member
moojito said:
Not better in my eyes. Look at the first pair. The light shading/reflection on the road is gone. The colourful one looks like daytooooooooona. But if the people using it prefer it, grand. It's not the definition of better, though.
Click to expand...
Well said, it was the same with the dirt 2 lighting mod.
 
1

1-D_FTW

Member
moojito said:
Not better in my eyes. Look at the first pair. The light shading/reflection on the road is gone. The colourful one looks like daytooooooooona. But if the people using it prefer it, grand. It's not the definition of better, though.
Click to expand...

Yeah. But look at how the sun now reflects off the front right tire. You don't get that with stock.

I don't like it either. But to each his own.
 
A

Az

Member
gutterboy44 said:
Anyone here playing it on PS3 with a wheel? How sim is it? I am looking for something to hold me over until GT5 and the game looks great and I would love to race some of these new circuits I never have before. I am not expecting the greatest sim of all time but as long as the physics are decent sim and challenging on the PS3 I think I will pick it up today.
Click to expand...

I play on PS3 and it's not a sim but I am having a blast. I had a amazing time online with a good group couple of days ago. But at other times it was just frustrating getting the pole position in quali and getting rammed off the road in race by someone who can't break.

It's up to you and if you mind spending the extra money for about a month of gameplay.
 
L

Lucius86

Banned
Diablohead said:
The talk over was a bit weak, too quiet maybe? Also would using the above head camera not work better instead of seeing it from the driver's eyes? The beginning was well put together.
Click to expand...

Yeah, my mic is shit - if I did the volume of my voice louder, it would be all distorted. Basically I need a better mic!!

As for the viewing angle, hate to say it but tough - that's the way I prefer to drive, and the way it should be played :lol

Juicy Bob said:
Am I an idiot for only just noticing the leg animations under acceleration and braking in cockpit view?
Click to expand...

I only noticed during editing :p
 
L

Lucius86

Banned
Mastah said:
Statement from Codemasters about AI and bugs:

http://community.codemasters.com/forum/f1-2010-game-1316/433396-ai-issues-response.html
Click to expand...

For the lazy...

Hi everyone.

As you are aware work is on-going towards a patch for the game, and we will release details on this as we move through the patch creation process. Your constructive feedback has been invaluable in helping us both identify and work to resolve issues with the game, and we appreciate your detailed posts.

Some of the identified issues have led (understandably) to people making assumptions about the game that are not accurate, so we felt that in order to reassure you and explain better the process which we are going through at the moment, we’d address a few common queries, in particular relating to AI. In putting this post together, we spoke to various people from across the development team, including the leads and specialists who are working directly on addressing the issues that have been raised.

The AI system implemented in F1 2010 is very complex, and is certainly not scripted in any way. Every AI driver is trained with a series of race behaviours such as overtaking, defending a position and slipstreaming etc. On top of these behaviours we have a unique set of characteristics. These characteristics are defined per driver so you’ll notice some subtle differences. Some drivers are better at race starts or are better at overtaking (they look for narrower gaps), or are better in the rain, or are more aggressive, or are better around certain race tracks. We also have a system which can make certain drivers have a particularly good or bad race depending on a number of factors. All of this driver variance is of course combined with the cars themselves also having varying levels of performance.

It’s also important to note that in order to make the tracks as richly detailed as they are, we use far more textures than the consoles can physically hold. As with many games, we actively stream in and out textures based on the position of the player. This, plus the fact we don't simulate many visual effects on the far side of the track from the player - a "level of detail” system employed to save valuable processor time - would mean there would be a significant pop or delay if we were to allow you to switch cameras between drivers on track.

Practice & Qualifying AI
In practice & qualifying (P&Q) there are two fundamental issues which have meant that we had to make some implementation decisions for the AI in F1 2010. These two issues are our jump-to-sector feature and the fast-forward feature that is available on the car monitor in the garage.

The jump-to-sector feature necessarily simulates teleporting a car instantly to a position while the fast-forward feature allows the player to speed up time. The latter prevents us from simulating the actual AI travelling around the track 100% of the time as we cannot accurately simulate 24 cars where we have accelerated the passage of time by as much as a factor of 30. An F1 car can move at over 200mph. With 30 times speedup, we cannot simulate car physics at 6000+mph without losing some fidelity. F1 cars obviously cannot move this fast. We therefore implemented a system whereby the AI times in such circumstances are calculated based on a ‘football management” style simulation model. Using this model all of the race factors, such as the car, driver, weather, tyres, engine, track conditions, traffic are all taken into account and a lap time is produced. These generated times are well considered and guided by a huge amount of data; they are not randomly generated. Nevertheless they remain simulated approximations using this model.

For P&Q sessions we spent a long time experimenting with flipping back and forth between this simulated system and actual AI physical timing, as the fast-forward is engaged and disengaged, but it lead to the potential for subtle exploits which we were not comfortable with. Therefore all AI times in these P&Q sessions use this simulation method.

Race AI
As none of the above feature restrictions are relevant in the race itself, we DO NOT use any other systems in the race other than the AI cars all physically driving the race just as the player does. Other factors also contribute to the AI lap times and the variation in their race pace. These include race start behaviours, their ultimate race pace which takes into account elements such as fuel and tyre degradation, weather, conserving / cooling engines etc, their in and out laps in the pit stop phase and their finishing pace.

We have seen several email and forum threads which suggest that an AI car’s performance is determined by where they are positioned currently in the race, or where they are in relation to the player which absolutely isn’t the case.

Based on some of the feedback we’ve received we are looking into the variation of AI race pace, as well as working hard to address as many of the following issues as possible in the upcoming patch, which aren’t AI specific but are adding to the assumptions that we are using fake or scripted AI:

Pit Stop
Several pit stop issues have been reported;

The AI not making a mandatory pit stop during a dry race of 20% or more
The player being forced to wait in the pits before being released
The player or AI cars becoming stuck in the pit lane
The use of flashback breaking the AI pit strategies
We’re currently investigating each of these issues and recognise that these would have a significant impact on the way that the race pans out. As ever with fixing these issues it’s a case of finding out how to repeat the problem so that we can track the issues down and fix them.

Split times
A few of you have correctly spotted that the race leader isn’t always the quickest on the first lap of the race. This is an issue whereby the start line is resetting the AI lap timings rather than everyone’s time being taken from when the start lights go out, which of course should be the case on the first lap.

It’s important to also note that the lap times displayed on screen in F1 2010 are compared to the gap to the leader, rather than being split times to the car in front or behind. They are calculated on the time difference within sectors, on a lap by lap basis. For example, the players lap and individual split times on any given lap is compared to the race leader only.

Track reset
There are a few videos and threads where the AI have been seen to spin off and then teleport around the track. Again this isn’t an intentional component of the AI systems. We have a retrieval system that will reset cars to the track if they manage to get out of the world which is intended for use in a number of scenarios such as violent collisions. In these cases it appears that this retrieval system has fired off by mistake.

Race engineer speech
There are a few issues whereby the information which the race engineer is feeding you in relation to gaps to the car in front seems to be at odds with what is happening in the race. Again this isn’t tied into the AI at all. It’s purely speech logic and triggers.

Fuel simulation and tyre degradation
This has been implemented for both players and AI cars. We’ll investigate the drop offs and see if the numbers need tweaking as part of the patch.

As ever your feedback really helps us track down these issues so many thanks to everyone who has taken the time to post up as many details as you have. We have already made significant advances against some of the issues thanks to those of you who have contributed a clear and comprehensive account of problems. We will let you know the full details of what the patch will include and when you can expect it as soon as possible.

Rest assured that we do read the forums and your feedback is extremely important to us.
Click to expand...
 
A

Adamm

Member
AHHHH! im so close to throwing this game in this bin
(and by that i mean un-install it as a bought it on steam)

I some how managed to qualify in 11th in monaco even though im horrible at that track. Even better than that - i managed to get up to 9th in the race without crashing into a wall!

All was going well until i got called into the pits - i had a 9 second pit stop (which wasnt too bad in the grand scene of things) but some how managed to come out in 24th place.
I didnt think too much off it as i assumed they would all have to pit......but of course not (why would they?)
I spend the remaining laps trying to fight my way back up the field while eventually getting to 19th in the end.
But none of those cars pitted! There is no way i lost out on 15 places because of a pit stop that was 5 seconds longer than average

Its not like this is a quick 10 minute run - you spend hours in practice & qualifying just to be thrown to back of the field in the race!

How am i suppose to do well if half the field doesn't even pit?

I give up
 
D

Diablohead

Member
Lucius86 said:
As for the viewing angle, hate to say it but tough - that's the way I prefer to drive, and the way it should be played :lol
Click to expand...
No problem with that but I was just saying so because we always see it from above the driver on the tele :p
 
A

AcridMeat

Banned
Lucius86 said:
For the lazy...
Click to expand...

I hope they take into serious account the fuel load for AI cars. There is no way in hell that after qualifying 9th, once the race begins I'm slower than everyone on the field. The pole was set with a 1:23 and the second lap of the race was in the 1:23s.

Also in that statement they mentioned they made a reset for the AI in case there is a huge collision. WHY? Who cares if there's a collision the AI should have to navigate around it like a real race.
 
L

Lucius86

Banned
cjelly said:
Props to them for releasing such a detailed statement.

I expected Community Managers to just be locking threads. :lol
Click to expand...

Yeah, a good initial response. Let's just hope they follow through on this and release a patch that fixes a lot of these issues people are having. Fingers crossed.

They ought to. With it selling like hot cakes, if it remains bugged to buggery then no one will buy F1 2011. It also allows them to get to work on 2011 with a solid foundation.
 
D

Diablohead

Member
Once they sort out the problems which plague the single player to no ends such as AI pits and too common punctures i'll be jumping in on pc, just a shame they released the game in it's current state, they must have known about the problems in some areas and just wanted to get the game out there on time.
 
J

Juicy Bob

Member
AcridMeat said:
Also in that statement they mentioned they made a reset for the AI in case there is a huge collision. WHY? Who cares if there's a collision the AI should have to navigate around it like a real race.
Click to expand...

I think that's designed to work if a car ends up in a grandstand or over the barriers or somewhere else it shouldn't be.
 
A

AcridMeat

Banned
Juicy Bob said:
I think that's designed to work if a car ends up in a grandstand or over the barriers or somewhere else it shouldn't be.
Click to expand...

True I just got home and read it over again. Still frustrated because it clearly happens when they're still well on track. :/
 
K

kamkor

Neo Member
AcridMeat said:
I hope they take into serious account the fuel load for AI cars. There is no way in hell that after qualifying 9th, once the race begins I'm slower than everyone on the field. The pole was set with a 1:23 and the second lap of the race was in the 1:23s.
Click to expand...

That's the most annoying part about f1 2010 ai for me. In the end, I do practice and qualification with legendary ai and then usually do race with professional.
 
L

Leunam

Member
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Lucius86 walks us through Albert Park in this Hot Lap

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The qualifying session begins this weekend at ~9:30am Pacific, 5:30pm for those in the UK. Since we only have 12 spots available, this will be run on a first come first serve basis.

For the guys in Australia, if you guys would like, you can join us, but if it's at an inconvenient time, you can host a league on the side as well.

Since it's our first race, I hope to see a lot of this:

O37oj.gif


Have fun guys! I'll put up another results post/preview once our grid is set.
 
L

Leunam

Member
Problem is, you can't switch cars during the replay. More than one of us would have to record and then splice clips together. :(

GGs Codemasters
 
L

Leunam

Member
A note to the drivers: Those boxes are like your helmet. If there's anything you want me to do to customize it for you, let me know in a PM. Flag, helmet, car, gradient color, whatever.
 
T

TylerD

Member
Excellent post Leunam! I just have to hope I don't get any work related calls during qualifying and the race. It has been a very slow week thus far so I am hoping it says that way.

Really nice statement on CM's part. I hope they do all they can to fix the issues that are keeping the game from being truly great. One of the things that I really hope they fix is I have seen numerous AI cars that crash out, lose a wheel, etc... just disappear to pop back on the track and continue racing. Those cars should be DNFs and should not finish the race.

I still am planning on buying F1 2011 from what I have played and enjoyed in multiplayer alone.
 
Animal

Animal

Banned
I was just doing a race in Melbourne with a Mercedes GP car and I was running 3rd and got myself owned by a flat front left at the end of the pit straight on before last lap. Finished last. :lol
 
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