Phantasmal Repose
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January 26th
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Fighting Game Headquarters |2| 0-2 vs Community
- Thread starter notworksafe
- Start date
- Status
January 26th
ShinMaruku
Member
So folks what did I do wrong at:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Xa1e9P60Rc
and how could I have better finished :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lfmb84IA87s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Xa1e9P60Rc
and how could I have better finished :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lfmb84IA87s
Any guesses on whether we'll get Pokken Tournament in the lineup? Just wondering........
I would bet money against it.
I can't tell if this is a troll or not.
I made it to the 0:50 mark and just stopped. You're just a bad Cammy. Stop hitting buttons, stop being Yolo, stop hitting buttons just because, stop hitting buttons on wakeup, stop doing random srk or spiral arrow, and stop hitting buttons. 90% of your problem is that you just keep hitting buttons. Stop hitting buttons. Learn to block.
SFV
UMVC3
Melee
MKX
GG Xrd
These are pretty much guaranteed on the last day. Probably two more slots to make it 7 games, if Tekken 7 is out by then, then it'll probably be on the list too. Pokken is highly unlikely but they do have a bunch of Wii U's from Smash 4 so hey, its not impossible.
Shin isn't trolling, he really plays like that. Outright saying someone is a bad player is kind of offsetting when he's just asking for help. He doesn't understand the meta and telling him to stop mashing buttons is pretty damn vague. *looks at video*
Now I think you're just blowing it out of proportions. Shin had a lot of good ideas, just poor execution. The random SRK's do need to stop but everything else was fine for a person at his level just starting out with street fighter.
ShinMaruku
Member
Now why would this be a troll? I think there is a serious problem when people would automatically assume it's trolling not everybody will connect to a game like you have.
I'll keep in mind what you are saying. Sometimes I need to better watch for the cross ups.
I expect IV to be there one more year though I could be wrong.
ShinMaruku
Member
Ideally if they are in a different game growth they should shelve sf4 and make another game get a slot. Would give other audiences to prove their evo worth. Would also say for smash but that is sucha unique community that is fractured in a interesting way.
IV would have no reason to be there, it has no CPT points on the line for it. SFV cause its a new game and CPT, the rest have prestige or don't have a sequel that the entire fanbase will agree to move on to. This is clearly Melee's case, Marvel is more of a historic game at EVO so I can see Wizard keeping it on there since they kept Marvel 2 for god knows how many years.
You're doing fine for now, you won't grow into a decent player within the span of a day by someone telling you to stop doing something. You definitely need to be a bit more patient and wait it out to see what your opponent does when they are in the air. Since they jump out off of the ground, it feels like you have no control over the neutral and this is a completely normal feeling, you just need to know your character's anti-airs. If you don't feel confident in anti-airing your opponent, anticipate which side they are going to be on and block that. Side switch anti-airs are apparently at thing is SFV due to how gravity works in the game but that still has a long way to go.
tl;dr
Be more patient but remain as aggressive as you can, you just need to time it right.
You're doing fine for now, you won't grow into a decent player within the span of a day by someone telling you to stop doing something. You definitely need to be a bit more patient and wait it out to see what your opponent does when they are in the air. Since they jump out off of the ground, it feels like you have no control over the neutral and this is a completely normal feeling, you just need to know your character's anti-airs. If you don't feel confident in anti-airing your opponent, anticipate which side they are going to be on and block that. Side switch anti-airs are apparently at thing is SFV due to how gravity works in the game but that still has a long way to go.
tl;dr
Be more patient but remain as aggressive as you can, you just need to time it right.
I agree, and I would prefer to see them go all in on V.
ShinMaruku
Member
I should perhaps set up trianing to see how some anti airs work, hard to do with the training in the beta.
Sony should insist on that.
Cindi Mayweather
Member
I'm too new to FGC gaf to make the thread. I haven't paid my dues yet.
ShinMaruku
Member
Ok next beta I'll try to work on that one.
Three things:
Hit confirm your shit. You're doing whatever cancellable normals you feel like into DP on block most of the time. That's easy crush counter combos if your opponent is looking for it. If you're not going to do that, at least don't end with a DP which is quite punishable in 5.
Second, V-trigger is not a reversal for cammy. You're not super punishable I think but you're not safe either and I don't think it has invincibility like Nash' V-trigger. Don't wake up with it like it's an Ultra.
Learn to block, and I don't just mean that in a "be patient" manner but literally learn to block when your opponent jumps at you bc you got tagged by a lot of crossups. You can't play the game if you're losing to jump crossups all day.
skLaFarebear
Member
Prefacing this by saying this might not be the absolute best advice since I'm still kind of a beginner myself.
Your two biggest problems are that you jump a lot and you really don't block. You constantly approach with her HC->Cannon strike and you always press buttons, even on wake up, and take a ton of Crush Counters as a result. It's also important to know why you're throwing out a DP on your opponent. I was fine with it when you were playing the Ryu since he was even more button happy than you were and also didn't know how to block. But a smarter player will know to keep the appropriate spacing or go for the cross up or block and you'll be eating a ton of damage.
I also noticed you jumped away from your opponent a few times when you were really close to them. I'm not a Cammy main, but I'm pretty sure her playstyle is meant to always be in the opponents face hitting them with mixups.
I'd recommend practicing some of the most important fundamentals like blocking, anti-airs, and your spiral arrow confirms/links. Spiral arrow is super dangerous on block, so screwing up the link or not confirming it can be deadly.
ShinMaruku
Member
Some of those inputs are kind of messed up because I am customarily not used to playing Cammy on pad so some of my things are off. But Yeah I will try to work on confirms but mainly first I need to have a better way to get a hit in the first place.
The cross up thing is really is what is pissing me off.
Was not trying Vtrigger was not really ment to be on a reversal but more for if I can get a quick spiral onto the other set for a cross up.
KidA Seven
Member
I don't think he's played it much aside from that. His gamertag was Zet-Familia or something like that. I remember it from Infiltration's stream.
Are fighting games too resource-intensive to make for an indie dev to really make a go of it in the genre? A few efforts have failed to ever see the light of day. Yatagarasu got out the door but didnt really find an audience (and you might be able to chalk some of that up to resources- the game being very barebones, ghetto UI, net code issues IIRC, etc). Skullgirls managed to find its own niche and theres some kind of playerbase for the game, but it still certainly cost a lot to make, took a lot of time, and it hasnt made much in the way of in-roads to being a common tournament game (I know some tournaments have it, just saying).
Some very non-traditional stuff showed up during development as hype side-games/exhibition things- Divekick and Nidhogg come to mind, but they disappeared as quick as they came- maybe they didnt have the depth and lasting appeal to ever stick around for that long?
I wonder... how low res/simple (character sprites or whatev) can you go and still be appealing and have characters with personality? SFII-level? If you wanted to make a straight up SFII clone with good netplay, how many people and how much time would you need? (assuming they were working full-time on the game). What kind of ideas do you have to bring to the table to get people to take notice?
Some very non-traditional stuff showed up during development as hype side-games/exhibition things- Divekick and Nidhogg come to mind, but they disappeared as quick as they came- maybe they didnt have the depth and lasting appeal to ever stick around for that long?
I wonder... how low res/simple (character sprites or whatev) can you go and still be appealing and have characters with personality? SFII-level? If you wanted to make a straight up SFII clone with good netplay, how many people and how much time would you need? (assuming they were working full-time on the game). What kind of ideas do you have to bring to the table to get people to take notice?
Arguably it is Melty Blood because of it's origins. It gained a lot of traction as a game and as a franchise and although you may not be able to call it "indie" anymore, it had very similar roots as a doujin self published game. Starting from a very limited release on PC to a wider release on Sega cabinets and PS2.
What helped Melty Blood wasn't just the fact that it had good gameplay and decent SNK/Street Fighter 3 era type sprite work, it was that it also appealed to the non competitive players through it's story and how Melty Blood connected with other Type Moon franchises. That gave it some broader appeal.
From comments I guess the interest spread and western fans came to like it. I don't know what people would want or expect from a fighting game at a western point of view since people are so caught up with wanting a certain mechanic and aesthetic, only to reject it in the end.
Rather than get caught up in an art style that tries too hard to cater to such a fractured community that all want different aesthetics, maybe it is just better to focus a lot on the gameplay and just do you when it comes to sticking with art. So long as the art is consistent and it has heart, people will warm up to it.
What helped Melty Blood wasn't just the fact that it had good gameplay and decent SNK/Street Fighter 3 era type sprite work, it was that it also appealed to the non competitive players through it's story and how Melty Blood connected with other Type Moon franchises. That gave it some broader appeal.
From comments I guess the interest spread and western fans came to like it. I don't know what people would want or expect from a fighting game at a western point of view since people are so caught up with wanting a certain mechanic and aesthetic, only to reject it in the end.
Rather than get caught up in an art style that tries too hard to cater to such a fractured community that all want different aesthetics, maybe it is just better to focus a lot on the gameplay and just do you when it comes to sticking with art. So long as the art is consistent and it has heart, people will warm up to it.
ThatCrazyGuy
Member
I think (and hope) sf4 gets one more year at evo. Just make it a sat night event after sf5 semis or something.
Hope they do a ST grandmaster type of thing as well.
Hope they do a ST grandmaster type of thing as well.
Melty Blood is one of the best examples of something with indie origins that found an audience, but it did come into existence in a different era (first released in 2002 according to wikipedia) and the landscape certainly has changed. You could chalk up some of Melty Bloods success to coming out and coming into its own during the dark age of 2D fighting games.
Its interesting you mention how it appealed to non-competitive players. I wonder if going after people who are already big competitive fighting game heads is kind of a dead end- those people have already found the games that they love and its not going to be easy to get them to invest serious time in your game. If you can build your own audience, they can do their own thing/form their own scene.
Multi-player games require a lot of effort and marketing to keep fresh in the community's conscience, much more than a single player game that mostly sells itself.
While old fighting games look dated now they were often considered some of the most graphically impressive games of their time and were heavily marketed, plus available on all the major consoles and often front and center on the console box itself. And thanks to how attached the community is to them there's always support for them. Contrast this with a game like Yatagarasu which besides being barebones and looking very simple is pc exclusive from a small team with no marketing whatsoever who if I recall correctly were hoping for their... Less than appropriate art to help spread the word. Skullgirls also benefited from that community if I'm not mistaken, though they were angered recently when L0 changed some angles for some of their character's attacks.
Also, didn't Melty benefit from the time the community voted for it to appear at EVO as a joke?
While old fighting games look dated now they were often considered some of the most graphically impressive games of their time and were heavily marketed, plus available on all the major consoles and often front and center on the console box itself. And thanks to how attached the community is to them there's always support for them. Contrast this with a game like Yatagarasu which besides being barebones and looking very simple is pc exclusive from a small team with no marketing whatsoever who if I recall correctly were hoping for their... Less than appropriate art to help spread the word. Skullgirls also benefited from that community if I'm not mistaken, though they were angered recently when L0 changed some angles for some of their character's attacks.
Also, didn't Melty benefit from the time the community voted for it to appear at EVO as a joke?
SolarPowered
Member
No, if I played Sas I wouldn't be very good. I play Hsien-Ko which is harder but more rewarding for me.League points and character levels.
You play Sasquatch? Hope I can learn some stuff watching your vids then
They're already not worth the work and money for middle of the road companies that lack fighting game design experience. It would only be worth the hassle for large game companies and most don't have the experience to handle the genre. Critics and skeptics would also burn the game to ash if things go wrong. We've got games we already like and we're not exactly an audience pining for new experiences.
Well said on both counts. It really helps to make something robust that good players will enjoy. Community outreach and niche audiences from there will help you carry it if the art has strong pull (niche or otherwise). Trying to focus on art style while hoping you can control external factors and reactions is folly.
Nobody serious about playing Skullgirls (or just about any fighter) was seriously put off by this. It also surfaced right around the time of the Indivisible crowdfund. Crowdfund periods are known as some of the worst for companies for a reason. People reach peak levels of dickery, fabrication and skepticism during them.
Popular new multiplayer-centric games appear on Steam all the time. There are always originators, but copycats inevitably rise and become successful for a while. The fighting game genre is the dark souls of game development and audience retention in comparison.
Valkerionseven
Member
So anyone get a early heads up or can magically know and ask the people who would know, if SFV is going to have any weird region oddities? IE Game language is set to the console language like a good number of other games, or if online is region locked (seriously doubt it will be)
Just trying to decide if I want to get a physical copy here in Japan or just PSN it.
Just trying to decide if I want to get a physical copy here in Japan or just PSN it.
Street Fighter V Arcade Edition on Nesica when? Sony step up your arcade, no one cares about PS4 in the rest of the world, only game center (｡◕ฺˇε ˇ◕ฺ｡）
Valkerion, I'm not sure if the PS4 language settings change the region the game is in since I don't have a PS4.
On the PS3 how it worked was usually on Region All marked games on the box or other games, it would default to the language the console is in. Since my PS3 is Japanese and in Japanese, some of the NA games I borrow or buy would change to Japanese like with End of Eternity or Street Fighter. That's usually only with the NA version. The Japanese version of the game is almost always only in Japanese with no alterations if you change your language to English with maybe some game exceptions? That's usually the case.
If it is really important to you, get it in English digital. If not, the JP copy might be cheaper and easier to get anyway and it is easy to get by.
In regards to doujin and independent fighting, I am not an independent developer but my thought on it would just to do you rather than say you will be a "clone" or similar product to Marvel or Street Fighter or SNK or Smash Bros. By giving that perception, especially prior to gameplay footage, you only make your work difficult because of the preconceived notions people may bring when the product releases. It is one thing if some community member makes a comparison, but if the developer team themselves make comments like that it hurts the brand and product you are trying to make and get out to people.
Rather than try hard to be the next clone or successor, wouldn't it be better to have your own systems, gameplay, and art and refine that. There will be similarities because the genre has tropes and shared mechanics, but that shouldn't define your product and the community can decide for themselves how they see the product through footage or playing themselves. Comparing and labeling your product puts your competitor on a pedestal and it really doesn't do you any favors.
But that is just my opinion on it. I may be right or wrong, but I always find core gameplay to come first and be the most important aspect.
Valkerion, I'm not sure if the PS4 language settings change the region the game is in since I don't have a PS4.
On the PS3 how it worked was usually on Region All marked games on the box or other games, it would default to the language the console is in. Since my PS3 is Japanese and in Japanese, some of the NA games I borrow or buy would change to Japanese like with End of Eternity or Street Fighter. That's usually only with the NA version. The Japanese version of the game is almost always only in Japanese with no alterations if you change your language to English with maybe some game exceptions? That's usually the case.
If it is really important to you, get it in English digital. If not, the JP copy might be cheaper and easier to get anyway and it is easy to get by.
In regards to doujin and independent fighting, I am not an independent developer but my thought on it would just to do you rather than say you will be a "clone" or similar product to Marvel or Street Fighter or SNK or Smash Bros. By giving that perception, especially prior to gameplay footage, you only make your work difficult because of the preconceived notions people may bring when the product releases. It is one thing if some community member makes a comparison, but if the developer team themselves make comments like that it hurts the brand and product you are trying to make and get out to people.
Rather than try hard to be the next clone or successor, wouldn't it be better to have your own systems, gameplay, and art and refine that. There will be similarities because the genre has tropes and shared mechanics, but that shouldn't define your product and the community can decide for themselves how they see the product through footage or playing themselves. Comparing and labeling your product puts your competitor on a pedestal and it really doesn't do you any favors.
But that is just my opinion on it. I may be right or wrong, but I always find core gameplay to come first and be the most important aspect.
Of course not, but it wasn't just fighting games fans that were into Skullgirls. I mostly just remember one guy saying he's not supporting Indivisible because of it but I'm not sure if he was serious or not. I'm there there were a few who did though because it's the Internet and people there are crazy.
.la1n
Member
Markman mentioned wanting to get Tekken 7 FR out to tournaments the same as he did for Tekken 7 last year so I could see that being in EVO. The console version sure as hell won't be out in time. Assuming Namco isn't worried about tournament players bad mouthing the game after they win
I'm going to be brutally honest, Melee on Sunday is a chore to get through, I'd rather see it on Saturday.
I'm going to be brutally honest, Melee on Sunday is a chore to get through, I'd rather see it on Saturday.
Tekken 7 Fated Retribution loketests don't even start until mid February and it is only open for 3 days and only 3 locations compared to the loketests that other games host which are open to more locations and run for longer. Assuming we get more loketests after that, which we probably will, I don't see Tekken 7 FR launching until late Spring maybe even early summer. It would be great to have any kind of build for a tournament, but it will take some time before a full release.
Gundam Maxi Boost On had it's last loketest in October/November and the update isn't even out until Spring 2016 and we don't know if there are more loketests for those until release.
I laugh at the thought of a reasonable console release for either due to how profitable they are in game center as well. I would like to be wrong, but it's gonna take a while.
Gundam Maxi Boost On had it's last loketest in October/November and the update isn't even out until Spring 2016 and we don't know if there are more loketests for those until release.
I laugh at the thought of a reasonable console release for either due to how profitable they are in game center as well. I would like to be wrong, but it's gonna take a while.
SolarPowered
Member
One half of the Indivisible fanbase is all in so that we can get Skullgirls 2 and the other half is busy shipping the Indivisible cast to hell and back. Ren is probably going to be the poster boy for sexualized male characters in the 2010s.
You think not-Japan has Nesica cabs?
ShinMaruku
Member
Well I am not trollin when I said Tekken 7 will be in 2017 for western players on console.
I wonder how L0 would tackle q SG 2. Start from scratch or build on what they have.
As for Ren, yeah he's going to be pretty popular. None of the female characters are as striking as he is, either.
SolarPowered
Member
I know Lab Zero is probably not fond of crowdfunds after everything, but I hope SG2 has a funding arrangement similar to Indivisible's. The latter's budget (over two times that of Skullgirls) never could have happened under a traditional publishing model and Autumn must know there is crazy good money at a higher price point with no Konami and console patch shenanigans getting in the way.
If we're talking characters... I'd say Annie, Isaac and Minette will be near locks.
What does this mean and where does it come from? I think people think that we're going to lose characters or something which is definitely not the case. It'll probably be the current SG with an extra 6-8 characters, THCs (probably changeable like assists), higher super jumps, a more fleshed out story mode and cross-play (please Ravi pls) if we're lucky.
If we're talking characters... I'd say Annie, Isaac and Minette will be near locks.
I don't know anything beyond what I've read on the internet, but it doesn't look there will be a region lock. Someone had mentioned this is the case with most games on PS4 (outside of MKX). You should be fine with buying there.
Karsticles
Member
Remember that SKill said $500k is a good deal for one fighting game character. That is a lot of money for Indies.
How much did the SG kickstarter bring in, again? If they want big bucks, I think they need to shift to a different art style.
How much did the SG kickstarter bring in, again? If they want big bucks, I think they need to shift to a different art style.
Only if moneyhatted. I think the game will be dead on arrival. A few folks have said it even flopped in Japan.
This is exactly how I learn new characters. Start with a poke and anti-air. Then add the ideal aerial approach, and I focus on understanding how the specials shape the character into its ideal playstyle.
Karsticles
Member
It was the most entertaining stream in a year. I felt warm and fuzzy inside. Is this how people feel when watching their favorite soap opera?
Watching thee stream from where i left off
My god that Mike and Combo set was hilarious.
i heard chris ceglia was the one who did all the instant replay videos though
ShadowSoldier89
Member
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