I guess my hangup is that whatever "strategic" and "ease of play" gains they think they've made have come at the expense of moving around feeling any good at all. Sometimes you don't need to reinvent the wheel to discover why it works so well.
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Fighting Games Weekly | Feb 2-8 | The Great Cave-In Offensive
- Thread starter enzo_gt
- Start date
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
What does the high low part mean?
I assume lower portion of high tier (which is a huge jump for Axl). High tier (which is A to me) is where I felt Ky was always at though.
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
Ah yeah Ky was always there he was super solid in the game to begin with. Damn A tier Axl is pretty scary though. But he's an awesome character and I like using him just no point in learning much with his current version.
That's still illegal, which is why I went through the dumb process. Thankfully my wii was already broken into before for PM.
They want me to suffer. My laptop doesn't even have a CD drive... Time to boot up another computer and do it the way you did it. I guess I'll do the same for Brawl, if I can legally, and get PM running on my laptop. It'd be pretty sweet to have a setup each time I'm out of the state. Now if I could somehow do this for Marvel...
It still hurts even after all this time...
You now have time work on your sleeping schedule.
Professor Beef
Banned
Punshing rolls isn't hard. Roll-happy players are easy enough to read, and even easier if you use a fast character. Defensive characters
KidA Seven
Member
Gods Garden Kao TV in Australia
http://live.nicovideo.jp/watch/lv209347409?ref=notify&zroute=subscribe
edit: Cost money to watch now.
http://live.nicovideo.jp/watch/lv209347409?ref=notify&zroute=subscribe
edit: Cost money to watch now.
Coffeeling
Member
And this is where we're going. "He's great because he wasn't nerfed as bad".
With good reason. The nerf list is hilarious.
Not referring to roll-happy players or scrubs.
Talking about good players who know how to abuse rolls and use them in the correct situations.
My time investment in to Slayer and Axl is paying off!
atomic moth
Member
Anyone play Fightcade? Do you know if it works in windows XP? I'm trying to get it in an arcade cab with minimal effort.
Also, does anyone else like to play random games on there? No real knowledge of the game, no movelists, just figure it out as you go? I kind of miss that new game in the arcade feeling.
Also, does anyone else like to play random games on there? No real knowledge of the game, no movelists, just figure it out as you go? I kind of miss that new game in the arcade feeling.
VanillaCakeIsBurning
Member
After watching that trailer I hope we get a Persona 5: Arena at some point.
Karsticles
Member
Reposting from the Xrd thread, since we're talking about Zato changes:
I think the biggest problem to me is that Zato has three ways to play with his shadow:
1) Summon Eddie in the neutral and try to approach while controlling both characters.
2) Summon Eddie from a puddle, safely, when an opponent is above or behind it.
3) Summon Eddie after a knockdown with Zato.
1 and 2 are both getting nerfed. Method 1 is very high risk, and you usually have to play Eddie on the assumption that you will lose him in exchange for a 22H knockdown. Then you can pressure solo with Zato until Eddie recovers, and it ends up being a slightly beneficial exchange due to chip and the initial 22H. Now, if Eddie recovers slower, it isn't such a good trade.
They basically want to penalize Zato players for doing anything but 3. For a mediocre Zato like me, it is pretty frustrating. I can understand nerfing 2, because puddle summons are extremely good, but 1 and 2 taking a hit seems extreme to me.
I am also basing this on Ogawa's play more than mine. When he goes for method 1, he almost always loses Eddie like I mentioned above. I feel like the current Eddie recharge timer is pretty fair. If they want to make puddles attack-able, I am okay with that because Ram and Elphelt are also getting nerds to their ranged pressure game, so it seems like they are trying to make matchups more reasonable for Potemkin. Plus, Zato can space himself to punish a puddle kill, so it adds a new level of mind games to him. It could deepen his play while balancing matches, so that is fine.
Costing Eddie meter for a summon is more annoying than anything. When I get a knockdown, I usually summon from the puddle just because it is positioned behind my opponent. I guess I would need to see how much shadow meter it takes.
Zato is really easy to anti-air without Eddie backing him up. Unless the j.K hitbox change is massive, I don't think it is a big deal. It will make double overheads slightly easier, but who cares about that?
I think the biggest problem to me is that Zato has three ways to play with his shadow:
1) Summon Eddie in the neutral and try to approach while controlling both characters.
2) Summon Eddie from a puddle, safely, when an opponent is above or behind it.
3) Summon Eddie after a knockdown with Zato.
1 and 2 are both getting nerfed. Method 1 is very high risk, and you usually have to play Eddie on the assumption that you will lose him in exchange for a 22H knockdown. Then you can pressure solo with Zato until Eddie recovers, and it ends up being a slightly beneficial exchange due to chip and the initial 22H. Now, if Eddie recovers slower, it isn't such a good trade.
They basically want to penalize Zato players for doing anything but 3. For a mediocre Zato like me, it is pretty frustrating. I can understand nerfing 2, because puddle summons are extremely good, but 1 and 2 taking a hit seems extreme to me.
I am also basing this on Ogawa's play more than mine. When he goes for method 1, he almost always loses Eddie like I mentioned above. I feel like the current Eddie recharge timer is pretty fair. If they want to make puddles attack-able, I am okay with that because Ram and Elphelt are also getting nerds to their ranged pressure game, so it seems like they are trying to make matchups more reasonable for Potemkin. Plus, Zato can space himself to punish a puddle kill, so it adds a new level of mind games to him. It could deepen his play while balancing matches, so that is fine.
Costing Eddie meter for a summon is more annoying than anything. When I get a knockdown, I usually summon from the puddle just because it is positioned behind my opponent. I guess I would need to see how much shadow meter it takes.
Zato is really easy to anti-air without Eddie backing him up. Unless the j.K hitbox change is massive, I don't think it is a big deal. It will make double overheads slightly easier, but who cares about that?
Wasn't it just an incredibly perfect trailer? Wow.
theprodigy
Member
sixteen-bit
Member
with all the spinoffs P4 got, I think P5A is a forgone conclusion
Coffeeling
Member
What I really hate about it is that it makes Zato more bipolar. Basically so that more time in the matchup is spent with one player or the other not being allowed to really play neutral. The direction they took with the first iteration of Xrd Zato was great - take awya unblockables so he has to actually mix the opponent up, and compensate with neutral game tools.
Now they're just crapping on that development.
Dunno why just buffing the lower tiers is such an impossible thing. Feels like nowadays people don't even ask if the top tiers have actual bullshit (and if having bullshit is fine in the context of the game - IMO it is in GG), they should be nerfed just because they're the best. Which leads to an endless parade of nerfs because there's always a best thing. It's disgusting.
CountBlack
Member
Sixfortyfive
He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
This is what bothers me about the complaints surrounding Diddy Kong in Smash 4. I'd much rather have other characters' abilities and kill potential be brought up to his level than to just weigh him down as well.
Karsticles
Member
Zato does still have unblockable resets, though. They're just not guaranteed, and their setups are circumstantial. I see Ogawa fail at them all the time. I agree with your general perspective, though.
Coffeeling
Member
I know he has them. I just mean the direction they took the character in. They took away many routes to unblockables.
Karsticles
Member
Understood.
That Dude John
Member
so, how long til Persona 5 Arena?
That fucking trailer is incredible. I wonder if they'll add in a DLC character from Persona 5? It's a helluva pipe dream but I want it. I mean, they did that with Starkiller and SC4 and look how well that......oh.
He would be too good if he had it, you should know this by now bruh
in other news, r/kappa has just started a fundraising campaign to send infiltration and poongko to the cannes winter clash which is happening later this month. if you're interested in chipping in, go to this link: http://www.youcaring.com/sports-fun...on-poongko-to-cannes-winter-clash-2015/302356
EDIT: my bad, it's infiltr'ass'ion not infiltration
EDIT: my bad, it's infiltr'ass'ion not infiltration
Karsticles
Member
I think it might be a hard-to-blockable, and you can't perfectly time Eddie's [D]. Also, I think bursting beats the unblockable. At least, it beats me when I try it.
theprodigy
Member
93 entrants? that seems so small...lol
CommandThrower
Member
That's part of the fun, though!
Play your character and slowly realize they got a LOT of unlisted nerfs. :[
I think it might be a hard-to-blockable, and you can't perfectly time Eddie's [D]. Also, I think bursting beats the unblockable. At least, it beats me when I try it.
Ahh- so they're not 'truly' unblockable even if they can seem like it?
@Mr. X- apparently there is a more complete document you can read if you actually attend the loc test (based on what people are waying on twitter)
KidA Seven
Member
Hopefully sooner rather than later.
However, I hope they fix the current release at the moment. lol
I don't think Shadow Chie should be able to do 80% average damage off a midscreen bnb with 36 meter. At 50, I think she can kill anyone in the cast.
I'm assuming they will adjust this quickly like they did in the past with certain egregious things that slipped by their balancing radar.
The Last Emperor
Member
what a legend
Coffeeling
Member
When your character gets nothing but nerfs and then people discover more nerfs, it results in a ticket to the salt mines.
You can block the unblockable if you alternate your guards with just frame timing. A projectile and a physical hit can't hit on the same frame in GG as far as I know. Of course Zato can mix it up which one hits first and the block is borderline impossible anyway, so...
KidA Seven
Member
Bonchan just said on stream that he's going to the Red Bull Kumite. Not sure if he got invited or he's planning on winning one of the last 2 spots. I could have heard wrong, but that's what I thought I heard him say.
CountBlack
Member
Top 8 USF4 at the Shadaloo Showdown are all best of 5?
take lessons TOs. Already better than Capcom Cup
take lessons TOs. Already better than Capcom Cup
biosnake20
Member
Now they just need A Rival and Red Rapper and they're golden.
CountBlack
Member
KidA Seven
Member
BTW, Sako also agreed with Ogawa about Zato.