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[Horseress]

Bum's reaction to Smash announcement at 33:50

http://www.twitch.tv/bum1six3/b/415552130

stahp STAHP

STAHP STAHP

Bum too real, gotta love that guy

 

[A Pretty Panda]

smash fans are terrifying

i'm worried about what will happen when you gather them all together in vegas

God, reminds me of Persona fans.

 

[OceanBlue]

df.HK for anti-airs from long angles (I think).

I've always wondered if this actually worked. I've never seen a Guile use this move to anti-air, but it looks like it'd be a good move to anti-air with. At the very least, it looks like Ryu's st.HK and that's a good anti-air. Maybe it's too slow or the hitbox isn't too good.

As for KOF13, hopefully a PC port will come and magically have good netcode or something.

 

[kirblar]

3) If none of the KOF characters have grown on you at this point then of course they're not memorable or special to you.

It's a "Vs"/"Smash" type game where no one knows any of the IPs.

Well, ok, they know more than PSABR.

 

[Slamtastic]

really terrifying

 

[Infinite]

smash fans are terrifying

i'm worried about what will happen when you gather them all together in vegas

 

[enzo_gt]

Real talk time.

Dr. Wily stage in Smash should've been in MvC3. Look how gorgeous that shit looks. #MissedMvC3Opportunities

Also Megaman looks more interesting to play in Smash than he ever did in any of the MvCs.

 

[A Pretty Panda]

It's a "Vs"/"Smash" type game where no one knows any of the IPs.

Well, ok, they know more than PSABR.

KOF has been going on so long I doubt there are many who know that it is that kind of game.

 

[Slamtastic]

Real talk time.

Dr. Wily stage in Smash should've been in MvC3. Look how gorgeous that shit looks. #MissedMvC3Opportunities

Also Megaman looks more interesting to play in Smash than he ever did in any of the MvCs.

If Capcom put Megaman in MvC3 though, they would have kept his old moveset even if it needed a revamp (like several characters in the game like Iron Man and Magneto)

 

[alstein]

Speaking of KOF, for those of you who ARE playing it:

As far as why KOF isn't so popular right now, it's a lot of factors. If you know fighting games and play a lot of them:

1) it's hard.
2) online sucks.

This is precisely why I stopped, and I loved 98. XIII is just way too different and got away from what I liked about KOF. Locally (KOF is probably the most popular game here), most of the old KOFers struggled because the execution was so much harder, and many just walked.

Then again I play VF, but I think VF is a much easier game. (and trying to learn a bit of SC5 as well, though it's annoying how chars can just disrespect in SC like it's a 2d game)

 

[SloaneRisette]

Real talk time.

Dr. Wily stage in Smash should've been in MvC3. Look how gorgeous that shit looks. #MissedMvC3Opportunities

Also Megaman looks more interesting to play in Smash than he ever did in any of the MvCs.

From the little we've seen so far, Sakurai has/will do a better job with Mega Man than Niitsuma ever would.

 

[enzo_gt]

If Capcom put Megaman in MvC3 though, they would have kept his old moveset even if it needed a revamp (like several characters in the game like Iron Man and Magneto)

I think so too. The unfortunate side affect of having a sequel to games that didn't get stuff very right in the first place, or were in a different time.

They were much quicker to change movesets for a character like Jill though, who I guess is more periphery. But if Jill underwent changes in her own games too, I don't see why they couldn't for Iron Man who's also changed a lot since the 90s.

 

[Papercuts]

From the little we've seen so far, Sakurai has/will do a better job with Mega Man than Niitsuma ever would.

Sakurai has impeccable attention to detail. One of the big reasons the Smash games are as renowned as they are.

 

[A Pretty Panda]

guys

smash isn't a fighting game

reason being is

TBD

 

[kirblar]

really terrifying

I just had a big smile on my face cause I kinda expected him, due to Namco. Reactions other people have are definitely scary.

X is the rep they should use for MvC4, though. You can do more with him.

 

[smurfx]

Real talk time.

Dr. Wily stage in Smash should've been in MvC3. Look how gorgeous that shit looks. #MissedMvC3Opportunities

Also Megaman looks more interesting to play in Smash than he ever did in any of the MvCs.

smash megaman is similar to what i was expecting in mvc3. instead dante got a million moves and we got shuma motherfucking gorath.

 

[Karsticles]

GGs Kadey, wife called. Advice is welcome.

I've always wondered if this actually worked. I've never seen a Guile use this move to anti-air, but it looks like it'd be a good move to anti-air with. At the very least, it looks like Ryu's st.HK and that's a good anti-air. Maybe it's too slow or the hitbox isn't too good.

As for KOF13, hopefully a PC port will come and magically have good netcode or something.

What do Guile players use it for?

 

[Dahbomb]

In the beta. Crowd control rockets you can fire while moving, flying around everywhere, ground pound, chargeable unibeam that eviscerates everything in your way, repulsar barrage from his gauntlets which chews through everything.

Not worth $20 though, pricing is a bit out of control for that game. Waiting on a sale myself. I sorta agree it's an average game that's sorta lacking, but mostly because they're still adding to it. They've still got so much to implement like fixed damage numbers, Diablo-esque difficulties, etc. I thought durability was in the cards but I guess not anymore. But if you really really like Marvel you can find some enjoyment out of it.

I just saw the YT of Iron Man skills and yea its a very nice skillset for the 1st and 3rd tree with a bad ass ultimate skill. I don't like the Shield tree though that's too boring. It seems like they want you to play a Tank + Ranged DPS character with IM. IMO he should be like the Wizard class of the game, IM shouldn't have a whole tree dedicated to tanking up. Still much better than IM in the MVC games and way more fun than Hawkeye who is the most Vanilla of Vanilla ranged characters.


I think the game has a slew of problems, like its a significantly worse game than D3. Loot is boring as is the itemization. Not being able to stack craft materials is a fucking disgrace and this is compounded by the limited stash inventory space. Not a compelling end game at all. Bosses are extremely tedious at times. A lot of characters especially the free ones have boring skillsets plus are generally out classed by paid heroes. Can't toggle on item display. Can't studder step so the element of skill for kiting is greatly lowered. Game is imbalanced towards favoring ranged over melee. Party system is dildos and if you exit a party during like a boss run you get booted to the tower (has to be a design over sight). Not being able to play alone and have to deal with 20 people running around in the world fucking up your FPS is balls. Having separate drops for EXP is a shit design. Mob hit boxes are terribad. Sound and visual design is fairly abysmal as well.

And this is just from a limited time with the game.

 

["God's Beard!"]

I thought Karst would've played Sagat or Rose over Guile.

 

[Juicebox_FGC]

GGs Kadey, wife called. Advice is welcome.


What do Guile players use it for?

The hitbox on df.HK isn't good enough for general anti-air. However, if you land a level 2 or 3 focus attack and dash forward, it connects on some (not all) characters for a simple combo if you do it fast enough (df.HK, any flash kick).

 

[enzo_gt]

Sakurai has impeccable attention to detail. One of the big reasons the Smash games are as renowned as they are.

I would argue the same for Marvel. Both are fanservice: the game, and MvC3 is the apex of it. I think Niitsuma could do a lot if he wasn't constrained by what was in the legacy of the franchise, and obviously was coming into a very established fanbase and didn't want to piss anyone off. A lot of the safer decisions in MvC3 kinda reflect that IMO.

I just saw the YT of Iron Man skills and yea its a very nice skillset for the 1st and 3rd tree with a bad ass ultimate skill. I don't like the Shield tree though that's too boring. It seems like they want you to play a Tank + Ranged DPS character with IM. IMO he should be like the Wizard class of the game, IM shouldn't have a whole tree dedicated to tanking up. Still much better than IM in the MVC games and way more fun than Hawkeye who is the most Vanilla of Vanilla ranged characters.


I think the game has a slew of problems, like its a significantly worse game than D3. Loot is boring as is the itemization. Not being able to stack craft materials is a fucking disgrace and this is compounded by the limited stash inventory space. Not a compelling end game at all. Bosses are extremely tedious at times. A lot of characters especially the free ones have boring skillsets plus are generally out classed by paid heroes. Can't toggle on item display. Can't studder step so the element of skill for kiting is greatly lowered. Game is imbalanced towards favoring ranged over melee. Party system is dildos and if you exit a party during like a boss run you get booted to the tower (has to be a design over sight). Not being able to play alone and have to deal with 20 people running around in the world fucking up your FPS is balls. Having separate drops for EXP is a shit design. Mob hit boxes are terribad. Sound and visual design is fairly abysmal as well.

And this is just from a limited time with the game.

I think the shield tree (the passive tree) is there just cause every character has a passive tree. Also craft materials will be stackable in an upcoming patch, there are technical reasons why it wasn't like that from the get go. They were against item display though. Also melee characters don't get good until very high levels. I like separate drops for XP, I don't want folks stealing my XP and why not if everyone can get it for their own character? Unified/non-instanced health and mana drops suck though.

 

[kirblar]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";63186606]I thought Karst would've played Sagat or Rose over Guile.[/QUOTE]
Neither's a good beginner character.

 

[Beckx]

Ouch

 

[Sayah]

VF, then DOA. Unmemorable is the worst possible thing you can be. I think it's a problem endemic to 3D fighters, actually. Tekken isn't much better.

Now this right here is where you're wrong brotha.
One of the reasons I prefer Tekken over other fighters is because of the characters. I mean you got the Williams. You feel what I'm sayin?

 

[kirblar]

Now this right here is where you're wrong brotha.
One of the reasons I prefer Tekken over other fighters is because of the characters. I mean you got the Williams. You feel what I'm sayin?

Tekken's not nearly as bad as the others, but a lot of the newer characters are "Ann Veal"- esque.

 

[alstein]

Now this right here is where you're wrong brotha.
One of the reasons I prefer Tekken over other fighters is because of the characters. I mean you got the . You feel what I'm sayin?

Tekken I give the roster advantage, the iconic VF chars tend to be bland (the newer chars are much better- from like VF4 on), DOA chars are a little too cartoony.

SC- the iconic chars are great (up to SC3), but the newer chars suck.

 

[Kadey]

You did a lot better than people who have played longer. I think you just needed to be more aggressive and dont go for obvious stuff all the time like sonic boom blockstring into throw. Your usage of the Mexican uppercut was on point. I kept jumping on you to see if you would use that. Also use back and mk to move away while throwing sonic booms or forward and lk to move forward. It helps so that you can keep charging.

 

[call_kotaku]

I guess all games should design characters around aggressive stereotyping so they'll be iconic to people who can't remember names or lore and therefore have better mass culture penetration.

Though all the new SF4 characters are pretty mediocre.

 

[Dahbomb]

I think the shield tree (the passive tree) is there just cause every character has a passive tree. Also craft materials will be stackable in an upcoming patch, there are technical reasons why it wasn't like that from the get go. They were against item display though. Also melee characters don't get good until very high levels. I like separate drops for XP, I don't want folks stealing my XP and why not if everyone can get it for their own character? Unified/non-instanced health and mana drops suck though.

The shield tree isn't his passive tree, that's his first tree. The shield tree is his defensive tree which sucks even compared to the free characters.

Separate drops for EXP is dumb because every other game rewards you with automatic EXP as soon as you kill the enemy. There is no need to have those yellow drops in the first place.

 

[Sayah]

Tekken's not nearly as bad as the others, but a lot of the newer characters are "Ann Veal"- esque.

Those new characters may be hated by some but they also drive a lot of casual interest. I'm not a big of fan of Lars/Alisa/Lili/etc. but it's undeniable how popular these characters are (with the ceaseless amount of cosplaying being done with them). And them being chosen over series veterans for Tekken Revolution is another indication.

 

[Beckx]

Sorry for leaving after a few matches, need sleep. Wish I'd found the lobby earlier. Couldn't do anything once you turned it on, hah.

 

[A Pretty Panda]

I guess all games should design characters around aggressive stereotyping so they'll be iconic to people who can't remember names or lore and therefore have better mass culture penetration.

But what about Blanka? When I think of Brazil I don't think about Blanka looking people, I think about huge asses.

 

[kirblar]

Those new characters may be hated by some but they also drive a lot of casual interest. I'm not a big of fan of Lars/Alisa/Lili/etc. but it's undeniable how popular these characters are (with the ceaseless amount of cosplaying being done with them). And them being chosen over series veterans for Tekken Revolution is another indication.

"Miguel" is the type of thing I'm talking about.

Big, broad, memorable- these are all good things. (Lili/Alisa/Lars certainly all qualify.)

 

[Karsticles]

Now this right here is where you're wrong brotha.
One of the reasons I prefer Tekken over other fighters is because of the characters. I mean you got the Williams. You feel what I'm sayin?

Tekken has a handful of interesting characters, but half of them are shirtless karate guys with different haircuts. The movesets of most of the charaters is also very bland. I ended up playing ~20 of T6 last week, BTW. I was stomping my BIL pretty hard after a while.

Neither's a good beginner character.

Starting a game with a beginner character is the surest way to get me to quit. I don't want to start out easy, I want to invest in a character I want to play.

You did a lot better than people who have played longer. I think you just needed to be more aggressive and dont go for obvious stuff all the time like sonic boom blockstring into throw. Your usage of the Mexican uppercut was on point. I kept jumping on you to see if you would use that. Also use back and mk to move away while throwing sonic booms or forward and lk to move forward. It helps so that you can keep charging.

Thank you. I didn't start using c.LK after Sonic Boom until that last fight, and it's definitely something I'll do more. It has huge range and great recovery.

How do I keep my charge if I push f.LK? I know there's something called charge partitioning, but I don't really understand how it works since Shuma-Gorath can't do it in Marvel (lol).

Thank you again for the lessons.

 

[call_kotaku]

But what about Blanka? When I think of Brazil I don't think about Blanka looking people, I think about huge asses.

Any OG street fighter character can be described in around 3 words, the cultural stereotyping just helps with that. Blanka is "Green Electric Monkey", Dhalsim is "Stretch Limb Indian", etc.

You'd recognize the characters even if you don't know their names or played much of the game.

 

[Kadey]

I meant back and lk.

Also don't forget he has an overhead with forward and mp. Mix it up and Guile can be a huge pain in the ass to fight.

 

[OceanBlue]

Sagat is so much fun. It's a shame I'm awful at being patient and I'm bad at keeping people out once they get past his cr.MK range, because I'd love to be able to play him. Sagat players are so good at using his normals. He requires too much smarts and I'm too dumb. :<

 

[kirblar]

Starting a game with a beginner character is the surest way to get me to quit. I don't want to start out easy, I want to invest in a character I want to play.

Beginner characters can still be good characters. "Beginner character" just means that they've got simpler decision trees. Guile, Ken, Ryu- great characters to start with because they don't need complicated execution or mastery of detailed movelists to get good with them/get a feel for them. (I feel the same way about Sentinel in MvC3.) They're all also all still good characters.

 

[Karsticles]

I meant back and lk.

Also don't forget he has an overhead with forward and mp. Mix it up and Guile can be a huge pain in the ass to fight.

I actually went for the overhead a lot. It might have looked like I did Sonic Boom into throw, but I was actually trying Sonic Boom into overhead. Whiffed throws and the overhead look similar enough that it probably seemed like I never went for it. You always jabbed me out of it, though. b.LK - noted!

Beginner characters can still be good characters. "Beginner character" just means that they've got simpler decision trees. Guile, Ken, Ryu- great characters to start with because they don't need complicated execution or mastery of detailed movelists to get good with them/get a feel for them. (I feel the same way about Sentinel in MvC3.) They're all also all still good characters.

I didn't say they're bad characters!

 

[Dahbomb]

Any OG street fighter character can be described in around 3 words, the cultural stereotyping just helps with that. Blanka is "Green Electric Monkey", Dhalsim is "Stretch Limb Indian", etc.

You'd recognize the characters even if you don't know their names or played much of the game.

The simplicity of the characters is also why they are iconic. Some people don't see to understand that. Also even in SF2 there some cool looking characters like Vega, Cammy and Bison. And fucking Guile... manly as fuck. When I was a kid growing up abroad I thought Americans air pilots were manly bad asses with crazy hair cuts. Actually I had just two views of the American fighter pilot.... Maverick from Top Gun and Guile from SF2.

 

["God's Beard!"]

Here's some typical Guile BnBs catered towards Marvel players, Karst.

 

[kirblar]

Here's some typical Guile BnBs catered towards Marvel players, Karst.[/URL]

Looks like Killer Instinct combos.

 

[xCobalt]

How do I keep my charge if I push f.LK? I know there's something called charge partitioning, but I don't really understand how it works since Shuma-Gorath can't do it in Marvel (lol).

Thank you again for the lessons.

I don't have a lot of experience with guile but I don't think you should be using those command normals. If you have to, use them sparingly. If your purpose is for movement, it's tough to use because good players will be able to whiff punish you.

Not sure about charge partitioning but there's charge buffering. Instead of doing back then forward for your sonic boom, you do back, forward, back. This lets you charge your second boom even before the first one comes out.

If you haven't already, check out dieminions matches at evo 2012. His matches against the Japanese players were on point. He used all of guile's best normals and anti airs.

 

[Shouta]

Characters are only as memorable as the time and attention you put into the game.

 

[QisTopTier]

Here's some typical Guile BnBs catered towards Marvel players, Karst.[/URL]

Karst can't do combos in arc sys games and you expect him to do those?

 

[Parallax Scroll]

Flux won Battle Circuit.

 

[call_kotaku]

The simplicity of the characters is also why they are iconic. Some people don't see to understand that. Also even in SF2 there some cool looking characters like Vega, Cammy and Bison. And fucking Guile... manly as fuck. When I was a kid growing up abroad I thought Americans air pilots were manly bad asses with crazy hair cuts. Actually I had just two views of the American fighter pilot.... Maverick from Top Gun and Guile from SF2.

I like the approach to the SF3 character designs too, which seemed to be stereotypes with a very dramatic twist. "Kung fu dude...who skateboards", "Black boxer...who's a British Gentleman", "Hot tribal African Woman... who fights with breakdancing", "Humphrey Bogart from Casablanca... as a robot", etc.. It makes their "meh whatever" attitude to SF4 character design that much more perplexing, but I guess the EX games were just as uninspired.

 

[kirblar]

Characters are only as memorable as the time and attention you put into the game.

A Virtua Fighter player would say that.

 

[Sayah]

Tekken has a handful of interesting characters, but half of them are shirtless karate guys with different haircuts. The movesets of most of the charaters is also very bland. I ended up playing ~20 of T6 last week, BTW. I was stomping my BIL pretty hard after a while.

You might want to look beyond the "karate" look. Every single character is pretty unique and vastly different from the other (not just in personality but also in gameplay/moveset unless we're talking clones, of course). To give an example. A character like Bruce won't fit the African American stereotype in personality or in moveset. Characters that many people think may fit that stereotype (the capo's Eddy and Christie) are, in actuality, Brazilian, not African American. Things like that make me appreciate the roster more. Aside from the fact that the whole cast can be considered over the top and crazy. That's not to say that there aren't stereotypes like Fat American Bob or mystical Arabian Zafina but even some of the stuff like that has a backstory (quick story recap, for instance: Bob was originally slim and purposefully became fat). You even have stuff like the Bruce Lee (Law) and Jackie Chan inspirations (Lei). But considering the roster as a whole, I find it extremely appealing. In fact, far more appealing than any other fighter I've played.

And niiiiiiiiiiiiiice with that Tekken 6. Would be even nicer if you got TTT2.

 

[Karsticles]

Here's some typical Guile BnBs catered towards Marvel players, Karst.[/URL]

You would think this is useful.

And IMO Marvel's defining features are movement and creativity, not combos. That's why Smash Bros and Marvel go hand-in-hand.

Karst can't do combos in arc sys games and you expect him to do those?

I can combo in ASW games. My Elizabeth combo in P4A:
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

I don't have a lot of experience with guile but I don't think you should be using those command normals. If you have to, use them sparingly. If your purpose is for movement, it's tough to use because good players will be able to whiff punish you.

Not sure about charge partitioning but there's charge buffering. Instead of doing back then forward for your sonic boom, you do back, forward, back. This lets you charge your second boom even before the first one comes out.

If you haven't already, check out dieminions matches at evo 2012. His matches against the Japanese players were on point. He used all of guile's best normals and anti airs.

I need to look at frame data...

You might want to look beyond the "karate" look. Every single character is pretty unique and vastly different from the other (not just in personality but also in gameplay/moveset unless we're talking clones, of course). To give an example. A character like Bruce won't fit the African American stereotype in personality or in moveset. Characters that many people think may fit that stereotype (the capo's Eddy and Christie) are, in actuality, Brazilian. Things like that make me appreciate the roster more. Aside from the fact that the whole cast can be considered over the top and crazy. That's not to say that there aren't stereotypes like Fat American Bob or mystical Arabian Zafina but even some of the stuff like that has a backstory (quick story recap, for instance: Bob was originally slim and purposefully became fat). You even have stuff like the Bruce Lee (Law) and Jackie Chan inspirations (Lei). But considering the roster as a whole, I find it extremely appealing. In fact, far more appealing than any other fighter I've played.

And niiiiiiiiiiiiiice with that Tekken 6. Would be even nicer if you got TTT2.

I looked at the full movesets of the entire T6 cast.

You must admit that saying Tekken characters have "vastly" different movesets is a bit silly. Super Skull compared to Dormammu is a vast difference. Having different poke animations with different frame data is not.

I thought about picking TTT2 up for my BIL, but I'm not sure how much leverage he would get out of it.