Passive Assassin
Member
League lol.
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Fighting Games Weekly | June 10-16 | We got new fighting games! And a new Smash Bros!
- Thread starter enzo_gt
- Start date
League lol.
Me too. My thumb started "clicking" in the morning about a month a half ago. Every time I think its gone away, I play UMVC3 like 2 nights in a row and its back. So, now I'm taking several weeks off from it. And I got myself a thumb brace I'm trying to wear most of the time. Marvel is the only game that really makes it act up, just happens to be my favorite :\
Ever since I started picking Vergil and put in a couple crack sessions to get some combos down. See kids, you pick Vergil and the evil destroys your body.
Apparently these hand issues aren't like regular soreness that goes away quickly, you really gotta baby it for weeks or else it'll be permanent damage.
edit: pad player here
sixteen-bit
Member
needs more sparks
Shouta
Member
A ferrari is more appropriate because a minivan vs rocket ship comparison isn't worthwhile The only thing they have in common is the fact that they're a vehicle. However, that ignores any sort of context when it comes to who can use it or how or for what purpose. Minivans can't fly or have rockets attached to it because it's not intended to do so. There will be similar points for rocket ships.
The same can be said of fighting games. Simply comparing them because they're the same genre is pretty silly because the type of game and series dictates what can and cannot be done by the characters.
A Pretty Panda
fuckin' called it, man
Karsticles
Member
The entire reason games are put within genres is to allow comparisons. What doesn't make sense is comparing an RPG to an FPS. But we put multiple games in the FPS category because that designates them as similar enough to one another for comparison. That's why I can say "I like fighting games", and as a result someone can recommend me a game within that genre with the expectation that I will be interested in it. If the games aren't comparable, then they should really be in different genres.
I agree that minivans can't do half the things rocket ships can - that's what I was going for. If you don't like the comparison between vehicle types, then I'd say that Tekken is a minivan, and this is Marvel:
irfaanator
Banned
Are they playing scrubs online?
You should try the next step:
CCCC2CCCCCC2CCC8C
It's quite a big gap from the first one, but maybe after a year of intense training you'll be able to make it. Like I did. Kind of.
Shouta
Member
The entire reason games are put within genres is to allow comparisons. What doesn't make sense is comparing an RPG to an FPS. But we put multiple games in the FPS category because that designates them as similar enough to one another for comparison. That's why I can say "I like fighting games", and as a result someone can recommend me a game within that genre with the expectation that I will be interested in it. If the games aren't comparable, then they should really be in different genres.
I agree that minivans can't do half the things rocket ships can - that's what I was going for. If you don't like the comparison between vehicle types, then I'd say that Tekken is a minivan, and this is Marvel:
Groupings aren't created for the purpose of comparison but for the fact that it has basic similarities. However, that doesn't speak to how varied or different they are within that environment. You can't compare RPGs to FPS because they only have very basic elements that are similar to each other (graphics, sound). However, within those genres, you can get some significant differences between them despite being similar. Call of Duty is vastly different from Deus Ex or System Shock despite being FPS. Final Fantasy is totally different than Elder Scrolls despite being RPGs.
The same thing works for fighting games. Marvel and Tekken are fighting games sure but they're vastly different because they belong to several subgenres within fighting games hence making the comparison less realistic. Comparing Tekken to say Virtua Fighter or Soul Calibur is fairly valid because they have the same subgenre like comparing Marvel to Blazblue or Guilty Gear would be good. But comparing VF to Blazblue wouldn't work because they don't have the same style of gameplay.
The minivan vs delorean would be a more valid comparison than a rocket ship but it has problems. a Minivan is constrained by the fact it's just a real world vehicle meant to transport people. the BttF Delorean is meant to break the travel through time and space. Now, if the Minivan was supposed to travel dimensions then we'd be on to something.
"God's Beard!"
Member
Which one is Deus Ex?
MiniBossBattle
Member
I like Marvel because of the spacing and area of controls change based off your character and the assists available. Its always changing.
Shouta
Member
[QUOTE="God's Beard!";63320336]Which one is Deus Ex?[/QUOTE]
Hah, that's always a good one and I mentioned it but yeah, genres aren't really created for comparison purposes but as a descriptor for games. You can't really compare Deus Ex with an RPG because the basic gameplay is different but you can with FPS. Then the RPG elements become a difference from there. =P
Hah, that's always a good one and I mentioned it but yeah, genres aren't really created for comparison purposes but as a descriptor for games. You can't really compare Deus Ex with an RPG because the basic gameplay is different but you can with FPS. Then the RPG elements become a difference from there. =P
Hey guys don't forget the Southtown Arcade special event is this Saturday on twitch.tv/iplaywinner http://www.southtownarcade.com/archives/805 Probably the first regional injustice event in Norcal!
A Pretty Panda
fuckin' called it, man
There won't be tripping in the new smash apparently
irfaanator
Banned
whats that?
Sadly, they probably will still ban items in competitive play.
DryEyeRelief
Member
Shouta has more patience than Justin Wong, I swear.
YOu haven't seen him play VF then. ^_^
This is why Kuma is so awesome. Just do anything, because odds are they'll have no idea how to react to it! #PUTKUMAINSF4AE2013 !!!
He's been perpetually crapped on by Capcom for a long time, so its more just pure elation.
Karsticles
Member
Arguing about the "purpose" of groupings won't get us very far, since they weren't created by any one group or individual for a shared purpose. I like I said to GB, a lot of this stuff arose organically. However, the basis of making comparisons is the presence of similarities. That the games are similar is what makes them comparable. Is it more difficult to compare Tekken to Marvel than it is to compare Tekken to Soul Calibur? Absolutely. But they're still comparable to a high degree. Like I said, TES games are not RPGs. They're FPA games. It's a bit ridiculous that "RPG" has come to mean any game where there is character progression. As a result, people are saying ridiculous things like Borderlands is an RPG. Is Tekken Revolution an RPG now? You can level up your character (right? - that's what I've been reading). If I could customize my Tekken character's moveset, would it be an RPG? What if it had a story mode where I could get new gear to fight with? Would it be an RPG then?
I don't think so, it would just be a fighting game with character progression then.
Comparisons are based on similarities, and that means you can only make comparisons when the games have shared attributes. I'm sure you agree that we can compare Marvel and Tekken character designs, right? Both games do have this trait. Similarly, both games do have character movesets, and moveset diversity. I find those to be comparable as well. Now, what would be difficult to compare is balance, since Tekken and Marvel have to deal with two entirely separate concepts of game balance (team fighting vs. 1v1; still using T6 here since I've played it, and I haven't played TTT2). It would also be hard to compare projectiles, since the 3D vs. 2D setting fundamentally changes the roles projectiles have. I don't see character movesets as being difficult to compare when the context is diversity, though.
You can still compare the minivan and the delorean, just like you can compare the minivan and a modern vehicle with a bunch of digital tech put in (I rented a car in CO, and it was a 2013 with all these computer displays for MPG, distance traveled, route settings, dialing my phone through the dashboard, etc.). One vehicle having more advanced technology and purpose does not make them uncomparable. I assume, for example, that you think older, traditional phones are comparable to cell phones/smart phones. This roughly parallels the minivan vs. delorean comparison.
I said this in the PS+ thread, but if Sony offered me the entire backlog for a 1 year subscription right now, I would get it. There's some good stuff there. Can you re-use timed trials over and over? I'd consider abusing the P4A timed trial to learn a character for my locals.
How could Megaman being in Smash not be a big deal? He has been Capcom's mascot until this generation, and was one of the most wanted characters in Brawl. He got skipped over in Marvel and has had numerous canceled games. It's a big deal on several levels.
Parallax Scroll
Banned
Megaman's one of the most iconic NES characters. The character isn't owned by Nintendo but it's something that people strongly associate with playing games on the NES.
Menu/Turn based is just a subset of RPGs. RPG just means Role Playing Game which is a very broad definition really. If the criteria for an RPG was just menu/turn based game play then this is an RPG:
However on the flip side, anything with some sort of stats or character build up is considered an RPG these days which is also a bit incorrect. On that notion I can fully argue that the DMC games are action RPGs like Demon Souls/Dark Souls.
BTW Karst what do you think the new FFXV is? Is that an RPG?
However on the flip side, anything with some sort of stats or character build up is considered an RPG these days which is also a bit incorrect. On that notion I can fully argue that the DMC games are action RPGs like Demon Souls/Dark Souls.
BTW Karst what do you think the new FFXV is? Is that an RPG?
Karsticles
Member
It doesn't have to be turn-based, otherwise Chrono Trigger wouldn't be an RPG. Just menu-based combat. And I wouldn't say that all menu-based combat games are RPGs, just that menu-based combat is a defining feature of RPGs IMO (RPGs are a subcategory of menu-based games). The word "menu" isn't perfect, either, since I would consider most classic MUD games to be RPGs. Neverwinter Nights is also an RPG, since you select your spells and such from a menu. A game becomes an RPG hybrid when menu selection is part of your combat experience, but other factors are involved as well (Mass Effect, Diablo). There is a kind of dangerous slippery slope here where someone can argue that cycling through your guns is going through a "menu", but I'd rather not get into that right now. I don't have the particulars of RPG hybrid standards worked out yet.Menu/Turn based is just a subset of RPGs. RPG just means Role Playing Game which is a very broad definition really. If the criteria for an RPG was just menu/turn based game play then this is an RPG:
However on the flip side, anything with some sort of stats or character build up is considered an RPG these days which is also a bit incorrect. On that notion I can fully argue that the DMC games are action RPGs like Demon Souls/Dark Souls.
BTW Karst what do you think the new FFXV is? Is that an RPG?
I'm glad that there's one person in the world who agrees with me on Demon's Souls not be an RPG. Now I just need to find one person in the world who agrees that Skyrim is not an RPG...
I haven't watched anything for FFXV (E3) yet. I just got home yesterday, and while abroad I only had a 2GB limited cell phone connection. I tried not to watch videos, so I'm behind on a lot of stuff. I watched the 40 minute Nintendo Direct, though. I'll go try and find a video now, because I'm very curious to see where the system is going.
Edit: Watched the FFXV gameplay trailer. Looks like an action game to me, though it's hard to know how all that stuff is happening. Definitely not a pure RPG, though. Maybe an ARPG (hybrid between the types) at most. This is probably best for the series, since Final Fantasy games have always been awful RPGs in terms of game mechanics.
Nabs
Member
Divekick Charity Tournament hosted by Seth Killian @ the Playstation Booth. http://www.ustream.tv/playstation
~Devil Trigger~
In favor of setting Muslim women on fire
DIVEKICK at PSblog tourney
http://blog.us.playstation.com/2013...s-conference-livestream-today-at-6pm-pacific/
edit: divekicked
http://blog.us.playstation.com/2013...s-conference-livestream-today-at-6pm-pacific/
edit: divekicked
SloaneRisette
Member
Even with two buttons fighting games are still too hard for the press.
Semi-Kappa
Semi-Kappa
A Pretty Panda
fuckin' called it, man
Karsticles
Member
To be fair, they've only had to press one button to win this entire generation. Two buttons is like...double the difficulty of an AAA game.
Karst by your definition MAX is an RPG (the game I posted as a pic example). You give attack and move commands via menu system and the game is turn based. Its actually just a turned based strategy game. With that notion the Disciple series is also an RPG. Under your definition most menu based strategy games are RPGs as are most trading card games. I can't really accept that because I feel that RPGs have to include the core idea of what it means.... that you are role playing someone and you are making decisions that alter the character's progress and growth. If your character is not progressing or changing over the course of the game then I can't see the game as an RPG. I personally think you have the idea reversed... menu based game play CAN be a feature of an RPG.
I wasn't agreeing that Demon/Dark Souls is not an RPG... I was just saying that the base logic applied for that game to call it an RPG can be applied to DMC as well. I sure as hell don't think DMC is an RPG but I think the DS games are closer to an RPG than the DMC games are.
On the note of FFXV, what you are seeing is all menu driven combat. You should look at the bottom left hand of the screen.. there are commands for Attack, Warp and other stuff. Under your definition this is an RPG.
I wasn't agreeing that Demon/Dark Souls is not an RPG... I was just saying that the base logic applied for that game to call it an RPG can be applied to DMC as well. I sure as hell don't think DMC is an RPG but I think the DS games are closer to an RPG than the DMC games are.
On the note of FFXV, what you are seeing is all menu driven combat. You should look at the bottom left hand of the screen.. there are commands for Attack, Warp and other stuff. Under your definition this is an RPG.
A Pretty Panda
fuckin' called it, man
JEO stage in divekick
At least one of the journos on the stage has entered FG tournaments. Not very high level, but at least tries. It's hard when you have to spend 20-30 hrs a week on tedious C-list handheld games.
I wonder how ten non-FGC GAF would do on there vs ten game journos. That would be interesting.
"still too complex, this game is for hardcore guys only, who has the time to memorize 5 moves, no compelling narrative, not even any emotional cut scenes, no little girls to protect, Mass Effect 3 is a 9/10 masterpiece"
Lazy vs Crazy
Member
Ryan Hart makes Sagat fun to watch.
Cosmo Clock 21
Banned
First time I've seen mention of sticks (assuming 360) not being compatible with the X1, although I knew it wasn't going to happen.
I don't like what this could potentially mean for Xinput devices on Windows.
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
You all need to be watching Aris play Tekken Revolution. This is hilarious. http://www.twitch.tv/avoidingthepuddle
Passive Assassin
Member
jlai pls
PS3 sticks won't work on PS4 according to http://www.joystiq.com/2013/06/13/playstation-4-incompatible-with-ps3-mad-catz-tournament-edition/
Professor Beef
Banned
SHOCKING NEWS
SixMachine
Member
I got thinking and there could be a rotation system used for tournaments that can actually be used that takes advantage of the Xbone's accounts. I'm a proponent of making games most easily available so while I still think PS4 will still be standard there could be a way Xbone has a benefit.
Someone told me games on the Xbone are tied to the account. So say you wanted to play a game at a friend's Xbone who wanted to play something he didn't own yet, you can sign in your account at their Xbone so you don't need to bring over your physical copy of the game and download it there. Now imagine for tournaments that are associated like the Evo qualifiers. If they set up multiple accounts that had the games on them (is silver membership still okay on Xbone?) and run the tournament, and then after they finish running the tournament they rotate the accounts to other tournaments so they have the games to run without having to pay for them. I could see the cost for TOs to buy the copies of the games going down because they would just be using the same accounts across multiple events, which of course means that this model will be more cost efficient if more tourney/stream organizations join in.
Though it would be a lot of work to organize and not step on each others toes with the rotation, especially if weeklies and monthlies are taken in account. Though of course the easiest route and the best would just to buy a PS4 and not deal with the DRM, but if there was an Xbone exclusive that was tourney viable I wonder if a tourney rotation system to save the cost on a game could prove beneficial if people work together. This is especially the case if games try to be F2P and make you buy characters piecemeal.
Also would someone give me a number on how many copies of a game do they use to run a major? How many setups are running at once?
Someone told me games on the Xbone are tied to the account. So say you wanted to play a game at a friend's Xbone who wanted to play something he didn't own yet, you can sign in your account at their Xbone so you don't need to bring over your physical copy of the game and download it there. Now imagine for tournaments that are associated like the Evo qualifiers. If they set up multiple accounts that had the games on them (is silver membership still okay on Xbone?) and run the tournament, and then after they finish running the tournament they rotate the accounts to other tournaments so they have the games to run without having to pay for them. I could see the cost for TOs to buy the copies of the games going down because they would just be using the same accounts across multiple events, which of course means that this model will be more cost efficient if more tourney/stream organizations join in.
Though it would be a lot of work to organize and not step on each others toes with the rotation, especially if weeklies and monthlies are taken in account. Though of course the easiest route and the best would just to buy a PS4 and not deal with the DRM, but if there was an Xbone exclusive that was tourney viable I wonder if a tourney rotation system to save the cost on a game could prove beneficial if people work together. This is especially the case if games try to be F2P and make you buy characters piecemeal.
Also would someone give me a number on how many copies of a game do they use to run a major? How many setups are running at once?
MiniBossBattle
Member
What about the 8arc?
Likely nothing that currently works on PS3 will work on PS4 if that report's accurate. It's likely Sony will go with the Xbox 360 model (require a security chip so only "officially licensed" products will work).
Lost Fragment
Obsessed with 4chan
Eh I'll worry about it when they actually announce some next gen fighting games.