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God, I so agree with this. I really can't think of a lead character any more absurdly feminine like this.

every fucking thread i swear

 

[Socreges]

WHICH IS WHICH!! :O

 

[Pimpbaa]

Do people really care so much about whether the characters look masculine enough or not? I'm genuinely curious about this. Is it just that it's a convenient pretext for a knee-jerk response, or are people seriously bothered by this? Seems like an awfully minor point, whether you like it or not.

Yes I'm bothered by it. If an RPG is going to force a lead character on me rather than let me create my own, he or she better be a character I like. What makes me especially bitter about this is the fact that the other characters seem rather cool and any of them would have made a better lead character.

 

[totoro'd]

That closeup pic of Vaan in the background looks atrocious. He literally looks like Micheal Jackson, no exaggeration

 

[Socreges]

If an RPG is going to force a lead character on me rather than let me create my own, he or she better be a character I like.

With videogames, and particularly RPGs, you to some extent take the identity of the main character. So I'm surprised that so many are complaining that some people are complaining.

What makes me especially bitter about this is the fact that the other characters seem rather cool and any of them would have made a better lead character.

 

[u_neek]

The ingame character mocels in this game look so amazing!

Without a doubt my most wanted game in 2005!

 

[Arcticfox]

God, I so agree with this. I really can't think of a lead character any more absurdly feminine like this.

Come on. Vaan has nothing on the main character from Magna Carta:

 

[u_neek]

^ Isn't that a chick? i see boobs...

Hot art!

 

[Pimpbaa]

Come on. Vaan has nothing on the main character from Magna Carta:

That's a guy?! :lol

 

[Prine]

Come on. Vaan has nothing on the main character from Magna Carta:

WTF?

Im not too hot on girly looking men either. But eh, what you gonna do, im sure its going to rock

 

[Amir0x]

Social genius and sexual commentator. Perhaps we can come to you with our future questions about girls? And ‘that’ stuff…

I think you should leave ‘that’ stuff to someone a bit more... qualified.

 

[SolidSnakex]

You guys might wanna go back and check some of Amano's FF leads before tagging Vaan with that worst looking main character ever award.

 

[Bizarro Sun Yat-sen]

With videogames, and particularly RPGs, you to some extent take the identity of the main character. So I'm surprised that so many are complaining that some people are complaining.

Just to clarify, I understand why people care whether the main character is appealing. What I don't really understand is why they seem to care so much about one particular attribute of the characters, namely whether they're masculine or feminine or whatever. To me, that's an awfully minor part of a person's identity.

 

[Socreges]

Just to clarify, I understand why people care whether the main character is appealing. What I don't really understand is why they seem to care so much about one particular attribute of the characters, namely whether they're masculine or feminine or whatever. To me, that's an awfully minor part of a person's identity.

Well, for one, I'm not I'm entirely show about "care so much". Anyone that is basing their purchase conditional on Vaan is out of their mind, no doubt. But those that so much as express their disproval should be perfectly fine. The problem is, I guess, that you have several people mentioning this. It adds up and Square fans get upset (even iapetus).

And the "one particular attribute" happens to be his appearance and invariably part of the character's essence. Which is a large deal when it's done RIGHT, so it certainly should be acceptable to note when done WRONG (according to some).

 

[Pellham]

arguing over character designs is fucking stupid, this is Final Fantasy, it's had prettyboy main characters for almost 10 years now.

Now what'll make this game good (I hope) is the fact that Matsuno is directing it. He's a god among video game directors.

 

[Pellham]

With videogames, and particularly RPGs, you to some extent take the identity of the main character. So I'm surprised that so many are complaining that some people are complaining.

Except that this is Final Fantasy, the game series where you sit back on the couch and watch cinematic movies in between random battles and walking from A to B. It's not like Dragon Quest or other RPGs where you actually identify with the main character through the use of RPG conventions (such as figuring things out on your own or being able to explore outside of a linear path).

However, if there's anyone who's going to make the best damn cinematic RPG ever, it's going to be Matsuno.

 

[SantaC]

argueing over character designs is not stupid, especially in a classic RPG like Final Fantasy. The main character do look too feminine.

Hopefully the game is great anyway...

 

[Zilch]

Except that this is Final Fantasy, the game series where you sit back on the couch and watch cinematic movies in between random battles and walking from A to B. It's not like Dragon Quest or other RPGs where you actually identify with the main character through the use of RPG conventions (such as figuring things out on your own or being able to explore outside of a linear path).

However, if there's anyone who's going to make the best damn cinematic RPG ever, it's going to be Matsuno.

I'd argue that I identify more with the characters in a cinematic game than in a "real" RPG.

 

[Amir0x]

argueing over character designs is not stupid, especially in a classic RPG like Final Fantasy. The main character do look too feminine.

Hopefully the game is great anyway...

Because, as we all know, males who have a feminine air about them cannot go on magical adventures filled with death defying challenges to save the world. It sure does indicate that the guy is a pussy cat, and when I play I won't be able to take him seriously! What can I do, the game is ruined!

 

[jett]

So, whatever happened to the alleged redesigns of the characters?

 

[Zaptruder]

As pretty boy as Cloud and Squall were... they still managed to maintain a good deal of masculine angst around them... even if it could be too easily percieved as teen angst... but they were a step above what vaan looks like... and half a step above tidus it would seem.

But going back further... they had decently manly leads in FFIV, with Cecil, Kain and Cecil prime


Incidentally the guy that did that female passing off as a male character from magna carter isn't incapable of doing a good male lead... see Saladin from War of Genesis 3 for proof.

 

[jiggle]

So, whatever happened to the alleged redesigns of the characters?

I wonder if they actually redesigned these two. Cuz that FMV was shown before, and they look the same then as now.
The promo images were probably photoshoped, hence the difference... i'm guessing.

 

[Pimpbaa]

When the hell are we going to see an overly masculine female lead!

 

[SolidSnakex]

But going back further... they had decently manly leads in FFIV, with Cecil, Kain and Cecil prime

This dude?

Looks like he was ripped off the cover of one of those romance novels. Like I said if you go back and look at alot of Amano's male leads, I don't think people would complain about what Nomura was doing with characters in FF8 and X ect.

 

[belgurdo]

As pretty boy as Cloud and Squall were... they still managed to maintain a good deal of masculine angst around them... even if it could be too easily percieved as teen angst... but they were a step above what vaan looks like... and half a step above tidus it would seem.

But going back further... they had decently manly leads in FFIV, with Cecil, Kain and Cecil prime

Then again, both Cecil and Kain are clad almost head to toe in plate armor, making it hard to determine what they really look like anyway. Besides, using Amano designs aren't exactly the best way to go about when giving examples of "manly" characters

And given your Cloud and Squall example, men can only be men if they're grunting soldiers/cowboys? And on Tidus, check my first comment in this topic

 

[Doom_Bringer]

This game will be AMAZING. I love all the trailers they have released so far. I love Vagrant Story and Final Fantasy Tactics, can't wait to see what Matsuno does with this.

I hope the World map makes a return with air and sea travel.

 

[SantaC]

This game will be AMAZING. I love all the trailers they have released so far. I love Vagrant Story and Final Fantasy Tactics, can't wait to see what Matsuno does with this.

I hope the World map makes a return with air and sea travel.

IAWTP. If it's something I miss it's the good old world wap. It goes you a nice overview.

 

[Pimpbaa]

This dude?

Looks like he was ripped off the cover of one of those romance novels. Like I said if you go back and look at alot of Amano's male leads, I don't think people would complain about what Nomura was doing with characters in FF8 and X ect.

You can't compare artwork like that to Vaan. Artwork like that is stylized and not realistic, whereas Vaan and his crew look almost like real people. That's why Vaan looks so wierd, he looks like a real androgenous person.

 

[jiggle]

This game will be AMAZING. I love all the trailers they have released so far. I love Vagrant Story and Final Fantasy Tactics, can't wait to see what Matsuno does with this.

I hope the World map makes a return with air and sea travel.

air travel is a sure thing given what was seen at the end of the trailer

 

[SolidSnakex]

You can't compare artwork like that to Vaan. Artwork like that is stylized and not realistic, whereas Vaan and his crew look almost like real people. That's why Vaan looks so wierd, he looks like a real androgenous person.

Ok fair enough. Here's an FMV version of an Amano character:

 

[soundwave05]

Amano's art style was never used for the characters in game though, was it?

When you actually played, the characters looked different.

I'll still pick the game up, but definitely not crazy about the artstyle at all.

The whole "female body with a David Beckham hairstyle/90210 and Michael Jackson face" thing is really making the FF series seem more like a teen pop music saga than a serious epic fantasy adventure.

 

[SantaC]

Amano's art style was never used for the characters in game though, was it?

When you actually played, the characters looked different.

I'll still pick the game up, but definitely not crazy about the artstyle at all.

The whole "female body with a David Beckham/90210 head" thing is really making the FF series seem more like a teen pop music saga than a serious epic fantasy adventure.

:lol sadly you are right. Don't get me wrong, I love the FF series, and will buy this game. But damn, I don't like the art at all...

on a sidenote, I think Zidane from FF9 was one of the best main characters. Probably gonna be hated for saying that.

 

[Pimpbaa]

Ok fair enough. Here's an FMV version of an Amano character:

Yeesh! That looks like an old woman. Vaan still looks more freaky tho, due to the realism.

 

[SolidSnakex]

Is the new Cloud design girly too?

I just want to get a perspective on what some of you consider girly.

 

[belgurdo]

Amano's art style was never used for the characters in game though, was it?

When you actually played, the characters looked different.

I'll still pick the game up, but definitely not crazy about the artstyle at all.

The whole "female body with a David Beckham hairstyle/90210 and Michael Jackson face" thing is really making the FF series seem more like a teen pop music saga than a serious epic fantasy adventure.

RPGs can only be serious when the characters look like this

now?

And the characters in old FFs didn't look like Amano's art because it was impossible to translate his scribbles into passable looking sprites back then. Still doesn't excuse the fact that his designs are far more "feminine" than anything made after Nomura came on the scene (weak, bullshit "realism" arguments aside)

 

[soundwave05]

I'm not crazy about the new Cloud model either (why didn't just expand on the CGI look of FF7 the game?).

But compared to the FFXII guy he's like freaking Bruce Willis next to Clay Aiken. p

I think honestly Square is catering to Japanese teenagers by making their characters look like gay pop stars, but its really making it hard to take the franchise as seriously.

 

[Pimpbaa]

Is the new Cloud design girly too?

I just want to get a perspective on what some of you consider girly.

He is but to a lesser extent. My problem with that movie is that everyone has the same freakin facial structure, guys and girls.

 

[SolidSnakex]

"why didn't just expand on the CGI look of FF7 the game"

Because FF7's CG looks like sh!t now? I don't think i've ever laughed at a CG character as much as I did when I saw Tifa's model. I don't know WTF they were thinking with that.

 

[belgurdo]

He is but to a lesser extent. My problem with that movie is that everyone has the same freakin facial structure, guys and girls.

That comes from the art style moreso than some kind of appeal to feminism/masculinity. All artists do this subconsciously.

And I'd really like to see the kinds of girl you hang out with

 

[soundwave05]

There are different FF7 CGI models, there are extremely high end ones, which still look decent today. I think they should've just taken those and made them smoother.

FF7: AC really has a dry/lifeless look to it, which is a shame because FF7 was one of the most eye popping games production design wise ever.

 

[SantaC]

There are different FF7 CGI models, there are extremely high end ones, which still look decent today. I think they should've just taken those and made them smoother.

FF7: AC really has a dry/lifeless look to it, which is a shame because FF7 was one of the most eye popping games production design wise ever.

I liked FF8 better TBH.

I can't decide my favorite, but it's everything from FF6-FF10.

Actually it is FF6-FF9 > FF10

FF8 because their cool limits breaks...

The End and Final Heaven was damn sweet! Zell > All

They should make a FF8-2 with Zell as main character.

 

[Pimpbaa]

That comes from the art style moreso than some kind of appeal to feminism/masculinity. All artists do this subconsciously.

And I'd really like to see the kinds of girl you hang out with

Looks more like a lack of originality than an art style, as if the artists got lazy and copy and pasted the same face to every character with some minor tweaks (this is a complaint with that ff7 movie, not ff12). Oh, as for the girls I hang out with, they all look like Vaan :lol

 

[SantaC]

Looks more like a lack of originality than an art style, as if the artists got lazy and copy and pasted the same face to every character with some minor tweaks. Oh, as for the girls I hang out with, they all look like Vaan :lol

:lol

Too bad this game is one year away for english version...

When FF12 and new Zelda arrives in holidays of 2005 I will be in gaming heaven.

 

[SolidSnakex]

There are different FF7 CGI models, there are extremely high end ones, which still look decent today. I think they should've just taken those and made them smoother.

FF7: AC really has a dry/lifeless look to it, which is a shame because FF7 was one of the most eye popping games production design wise ever.

I think you might be remembering FF7's FMV looking better than it actually does now.

FF7 Barrett:

FF7 AC Barrett:

FF7 Cloud:

FF7 AC Cloud:

Seems like a natural advancement.

 

[Zaptruder]

Then again, both Cecil and Kain are clad almost head to toe in plate armor, making it hard to determine what they really look like anyway. Besides, using Amano designs aren't exactly the best way to go about when giving examples of "manly" characters

And given your Cloud and Squall example, men can only be men if they're grunting soldiers/cowboys? And on Tidus, check my first comment in this topic

Cecil was revealed later (in pld form). Yes, he was another 'pretty' guy... but he had at least a manly (or mature) aura around him, despite his prettiness.

As for the Cloud/Squall example... let me turn your comment around and say: "Cars can only be cars if they're ferrari's/volvos?" No... those are cars, but they're obviously not the only type of cars.

 

[jett]

Amano's designs look pretty nice in FF6psx's FMV(with the exception of Kefka...which has always looked fucked up anyway )

 

[Do The Mario]

When I first sore him I thought he was a she!