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Final Fantasy XIII |OT|
- Thread starter Kagari
- Start date
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Beat the game last night, and while I really enjoyed it there's a lot that just feels unfinished. Chapter 11 is the only part that felt fully-realized, while the structure of pretty much every other chapter wound up feeling like a demo. I guess they were going for a sort of thematic tie between level design and level location (
), but they misjudged the balance pretty badly. It's not just that the chapters are linear as hell, but that there's essentially no bonus activities to do in them.
The story was, as frequently mentioned, horribly told. Up until almost the end, the data logs were making it possible to at least follow what's going on, but from the second
to the end it's like all rational cause and effect vanished. And while trying to puzzle out the events of the ending, it just makes earlier events look dumber. I don't know if unlocking all the analects would help, but what ultimately was the deal with the end boss?
And, in retrospect, what was the point of Vanille? Aside from some supremely irritating vocal choices (both in the actress and the habit of having her giggle pointlessly any time the character crossed the screen), what purpose did she actually serve in the story proper? Apparently
I pretty much really want an FFXIII-2, which it seems you could easily pull off by having a band of characters set out to
The battle system is good, and with tweaks could be great. Certain aspects of the backstory are pretty interesting, and it's a freaking gorgeous game, so it'd be a shame for this to be the end forever.
Cocoon as the fal'Cie-created, highly restricted experience vs Gran Pulse as the untamed natural existence in which any attempt at fal'Cie rule is doomed to failure
The story was, as frequently mentioned, horribly told. Up until almost the end, the data logs were making it possible to at least follow what's going on, but from the second
Fang decides to try to whack Vanille with her staff
From what I've read in the analect section, Barthandelus must be Lindzei who created Cocoon and lured humanity there for this eventual point? Yet he spends a ton of time bitching about how fal'Cie must serve their preset function--is he the "go batshit crazy and try to kill everyone to get mommy to pay him attention"-designed fal'Cie? Was he Orphan all along, or did he merge with Orphan or was Orphan just psychotic? Why the hell--if his/Orphan's goal was actually losing to the l'Cie--would he start whipping out the supremely stupid insta-KO spell? It almost seems like it should be impossible to lose that fight; anything else would be self-defating.
And, in retrospect, what was the point of Vanille? Aside from some supremely irritating vocal choices (both in the actress and the habit of having her giggle pointlessly any time the character crossed the screen), what purpose did she actually serve in the story proper? Apparently
Fang was Ragnarok, Fang tried to destroy Cocoon, and Fang ultimately failed. WTF did Vanille do? Why even send her? If the fal'Cie can make themselves look like any human at any time, why the hell wake her up? Why not just dress up like Vanille and torture Fang until she turns into a killing machine. Again. The only thing having Vanille there really accomplished was ultimately saving Cocoon which they wouldn't do on purpose.
I pretty much really want an FFXIII-2, which it seems you could easily pull off by having a band of characters set out to
destroy the remaining Pulse fal'Cie, since the Pulse fal'Cie apparently just kind of hang out and turn humans into l'Cie to deal with pest control.
Thanks Zen and Yoshichan for your thorough responses, but this time I didn't need to think the fight through at all; I equipped some better accessories, went in with a Fortisol and Aegisol, and SLAUGHTERED him; only took me 2 minutes (target time was 12+ minutes!) and he didn't even do the "Metamorphose" move :lol managed to keep him in the air all the time. Still, many thanks guys!
Die Squirrel Die
Member
iammeiam said:
It seems that the Maker favoured human over Fal'Cie. I imagine that Lindzei/Barthandelus' role must have been to nurture and protect humans. He can't go against his assigned role so creating Cocoon was his way of using his purpose to enact his plan of bringing the Maker back.
The way I see it, Barthandelus' story is essentially one of thinking that his kind were the favoured ones, but ultimately being undone by his arrogance. He (and the other Fal'Cie I assume) thought that the Maker had abandoned them and that by bringing him/her/it back, it would reorder the world and put them above humans. However if the stuff about the Maker draining Fangarok of her power during the War of Transgression and then changing the focus of the party during the final battle is to be believed, the Maker was watching over the world the whole time, just not as the Fal'Cie thought they would.
The way I see it, Barthandelus' story is essentially one of thinking that his kind were the favoured ones, but ultimately being undone by his arrogance. He (and the other Fal'Cie I assume) thought that the Maker had abandoned them and that by bringing him/her/it back, it would reorder the world and put them above humans. However if the stuff about the Maker draining Fangarok of her power during the War of Transgression and then changing the focus of the party during the final battle is to be believed, the Maker was watching over the world the whole time, just not as the Fal'Cie thought they would.
FateBreaker said:
Vesperia, Hearts, and Abyss had pretty nice writing and direction. I think if they ever went back and fixed them into something a bit more focused, Vesperia and Abyss in particular, they'd be some really nice stuff.
And the turtles are more a matter of preparation than difficulty.
I'd say the Gigantuar or Neochu were the hardest things I fought. There's not a whole lot of preparation you can do, and there's a cheap trick to killing them, but without it you just have to tough it out.
Rpgmonkey said:
I'd have to agree with you and say that Gigantuar and Neochu are up there as the hardest marks to beat without cheap tricks. I may go back and try to beat Gigantuar without a lucky break soon, I got really close on my first try without lucky break and brought him down to 25% before he needled lightning two times in a row(the one time I switch from fang to light!).
I was so looking forward to Long Gui all this time, thinking that he'd be as hard as the turtles were initially when I wasn't super prepared. I did 57-63 over the last couple of hours so Long Gui is roaming around now, I see my first one and proceed to run into it without even changing my paradigms or using fortisol, etc. It opens with ultima and kills vanille right off the bat and I'm thinking, this is going to be a tough fight. I quickly use a phoenix down on her and buff myself, staggered one leg, did a highwind on it and it survived, that was nuts and cool. Then I looked at the total hp of the leg and laughed. Took out the other leg, Long Gui is now on the ground and I take away half of its 16million hp in one go. Seeing full well that I'm capable of taking out the legs with ease I decide to use a summon to speed up the process and bring it down again. Dead Long Gui, first try without preparation. I'm a bit disappointed to be honest.
I noticed that it becomes weak to every element once it is knocked down, so having a character do En-fire fang and light will only make it die even faster. Looking forward to farming the little one now to get some dark matter. I tried mission 64 for 2 minutes before heading out the door and from what I saw it didn't seem too hard. Will try to beat and get 5 stars to get the trophy that requires all hunts and 5 stars.
Fun Factor
Formerly FTWer
Himuro said:
:lol
It's typical anime garbage, you honestly think it's that good?
Fimbulvetr
Member
FTWer said:
That's the joke.
Finally got to the Grand Pulse section but haven't actually done anything there yet, saving that for another time. Chapters 9 and 10 were just phenom. The section on Chapter 9 where you are battling downwards to take on the final boss there was excellent. Some genuinely hard fights where you need to keep adapting your strategy.
The guy halfway through Chapter 10, god almighty... I did him first try but christ what a fight, epic.
Loved all of it though. Really like the team of people in the game, most solid squad of characters for a long time. Does feel like XII was a bit of a mis-step in terms of characters and story. I never felt compelled to keep playing and playing, just because I was waiting to see what was going to happen next.
Found the storytelling quite interesting. How it is effectively a setting of scene/characters, flight from peril and then a regroup to face their destiny. Turning on Non-Scene subtitles helped though as it is sometimes a little hard to pick up what your team chips in with/people in towns are saying to you as you press through the game.
Looking forward to seeing what the quests are like on Pulse, my guys were relatively well levelled by the time I got there. Already able to progress into their hugely expensive level of the Crystarium and a few of my guys weapons were levelled to * or at least level 15+ of their chosen weapon. One area on Chapter 9 was just rife for ravaging for Incentive Chips and tech drops.
I find so many elements of past FF's in this game when playing. Moments in Chapter 10 felt like the sprawling dungeons of FFXII, and then the odd piece of music that was similar to X would float in.
The guy halfway through Chapter 10, god almighty... I did him first try but christ what a fight, epic.
Loved all of it though. Really like the team of people in the game, most solid squad of characters for a long time. Does feel like XII was a bit of a mis-step in terms of characters and story. I never felt compelled to keep playing and playing, just because I was waiting to see what was going to happen next.
Found the storytelling quite interesting. How it is effectively a setting of scene/characters, flight from peril and then a regroup to face their destiny. Turning on Non-Scene subtitles helped though as it is sometimes a little hard to pick up what your team chips in with/people in towns are saying to you as you press through the game.
Looking forward to seeing what the quests are like on Pulse, my guys were relatively well levelled by the time I got there. Already able to progress into their hugely expensive level of the Crystarium and a few of my guys weapons were levelled to * or at least level 15+ of their chosen weapon. One area on Chapter 9 was just rife for ravaging for Incentive Chips and tech drops.
I find so many elements of past FF's in this game when playing. Moments in Chapter 10 felt like the sprawling dungeons of FFXII, and then the odd piece of music that was similar to X would float in.
I'm over some of my abject resentment and anger towards the game, and am gonna try and pick it up again later this week to try out the missions. The much-touted expanded Crystarium was disappointing.
I haven't tried out any of the unique Ravager skills yet, like
I just realized two now-standard FF tropes were missing from the game, unless I wasn't paying attention.
I've gotta reiterate how much I like most of the battle music in the game, particularly the standard battle theme, and the standard boss battle theme. The one used for the game's main recurring villain was cool at first, and quickly became grating and annoying though. Choral, two-note chanting should accent a piece, not dominate half of it. My fingers found Volume Down pretty quickly. Final-battle music was disappointing. I can't even remember it.
I wish these games had the option to independently lower and higher music and sound effects. Or do they? :lol
And I've gotta add how dismal (ending spoilers)
I have to confess that I still don't fully 100% understand every mechanic about summons either. From what I gathered through trial and error, they run on their own gambit when you first summon them. Then, you should ideally wait till the Gestalt meter is almost out before hitting Square to transform into that mode (was there a penalty or bonus for timing it properly somehow, other than to aid you in your circumstantial staggering efforts?), and once in that mode, you could enter various combinations that each cost a certain amount of....'fuel', shall we say, as indicated on the screen. I assume if you ran out of fuel, you couldn't execute the Triangle "final" maneuver, like
Or would it occur anyway? I always hit Triangle when I was down to 01 or 00 'fuel'. Am I correct in assuming the Circle ability was always typically magical/elemental in nature? Such as Thunder for Lightning's, etc?
Just another ring of expensive stats, no new abilities?
I haven't tried out any of the unique Ravager skills yet, like
Army of One, and Highwind -- I assume these are the only character-specific unique abilities, and they're only in the RAV tree?
I just realized two now-standard FF tropes were missing from the game, unless I wasn't paying attention.
The Victory Fanfare, though I thought I remember reading in a GAF post that it plays at just one point in the game. Don't recall hearing it myself.
And Limit Breaks/Overdrives/etc. - or are abilities like Army of One and Highwind effectively the replacements for them?
And Limit Breaks/Overdrives/etc. - or are abilities like Army of One and Highwind effectively the replacements for them?
I've gotta reiterate how much I like most of the battle music in the game, particularly the standard battle theme, and the standard boss battle theme. The one used for the game's main recurring villain was cool at first, and quickly became grating and annoying though. Choral, two-note chanting should accent a piece, not dominate half of it. My fingers found Volume Down pretty quickly. Final-battle music was disappointing. I can't even remember it.
I wish these games had the option to independently lower and higher music and sound effects. Or do they? :lol
And I've gotta add how dismal (ending spoilers)
the dialogue is in the finale. Holy shit. "WE CAN DO IT. I'M THE HERO. FOCUS FAL'CIE L'CIE. FOCUS. I BELIEVE IN US. WE CAN DO IT." Jesus. Enough.
I have to confess that I still don't fully 100% understand every mechanic about summons either. From what I gathered through trial and error, they run on their own gambit when you first summon them. Then, you should ideally wait till the Gestalt meter is almost out before hitting Square to transform into that mode (was there a penalty or bonus for timing it properly somehow, other than to aid you in your circumstantial staggering efforts?), and once in that mode, you could enter various combinations that each cost a certain amount of....'fuel', shall we say, as indicated on the screen. I assume if you ran out of fuel, you couldn't execute the Triangle "final" maneuver, like
Odin's Zantetsuken.
Im on chapter 9 right now and my conclusion is:
-I like that the game seems to still be of a typical FF length despite all the detailed graphics assets.
-The graphics are gorgeous and varied. So much work went into all of the worlds, just wish i could explore more of them.
-Battle system is fun and fast paced. Also seems pretty well balanced at keeping things interesting. Crystarium is a mixed bag, on some occasions it feels like im on a linear path and others i feel like i had to make a choice.
I dont like:
The story. Horrible. The dialog is shit. This game's biggest flaw are these two things. If they were actually good, like a Bioware game or something, this game would have been a whole lot better. The cheese is everywhere!
And because the story has problems, it just points out the flaws int he game design even more because that is the part that is forced to be the game's saving grace.
-I like that the game seems to still be of a typical FF length despite all the detailed graphics assets.
-The graphics are gorgeous and varied. So much work went into all of the worlds, just wish i could explore more of them.
-Battle system is fun and fast paced. Also seems pretty well balanced at keeping things interesting. Crystarium is a mixed bag, on some occasions it feels like im on a linear path and others i feel like i had to make a choice.
I dont like:
The story. Horrible. The dialog is shit. This game's biggest flaw are these two things. If they were actually good, like a Bioware game or something, this game would have been a whole lot better. The cheese is everywhere!
And because the story has problems, it just points out the flaws int he game design even more because that is the part that is forced to be the game's saving grace.
Magnus said:
As far as I can see, this is the right way to use a summon:
Almost stagger a tough foe. Summon. Keep chaining alongside your Eidolon and build up the Gestalt meter. Once it's full and the enemy is staggered, hit square (or the X360 equivalent). You can also wait out the SP meter, but beware, when it hits 0, it'll start using up the Gestalt meter. Use the Gestalt form to drive up the damage multiplier, I usually just use Auto-Gestalt, and on the last move, unleash the level 3 finisher. No matter who you are, an Eidolon finisher at 900%+ damage is going to hurt.
An additional use is to summon in order to revive your team. Sure, Renew does that for one TP less, but you have 5 TP, so why not get some free damage alongside the full-heal?
FateBreaker
Member
FTWer said:
It wasn't supposed to be worthy of a Pulitzer Prize. The characterization, some plot twists, and direction is good. Someone just linked to a bug scene in Vesperia...which I don't think is bad. I mean, we get NOTHING like that in FFXIII. Everything is just about saving the world
somehow, but we don't know how
So, to me, FFXIII as possible anime shit is not a big deal; it still has the potential to be enjoyable or memorable. The problem is that the script and direction in FFXIII SUCK. It's too bad because I think it had a nice premise.
Is there some kind of Ribbon you can find in this game? I swear if I have to deal with one more enemy spamming status ailments, I'm going to
/rage
In an unrelated note, Lightning has to be one of the, if not the coolest female character in the history of Final Fantasy. She just oozes cool even when she walks but she's really at the top of her game in battles. Her Odin animation is top notch too. Come to think of it, I never like lead character in FF game as much as I like her.
knock over the magazine rack.
In an unrelated note, Lightning has to be one of the, if not the coolest female character in the history of Final Fantasy. She just oozes cool even when she walks but she's really at the top of her game in battles. Her Odin animation is top notch too. Come to think of it, I never like lead character in FF game as much as I like her.
RPGCrazied
Member
I'm sorry, but the end boss of chapter 12 can blow me
Ugh,
I'm trying to beat mission
I'm trying to beat mission
12, but I can't beat this guy. I was looking at some videos for help, but everyone seems much higher levels than me. I only have mid 2k HP, while I'm seeing mid 4k in these videos. Should I be grinding more before I can beat this thing? If so, where's the best place/enemy to get a lot of CP?
Witchfinder General
punched Wheelchair Mike
When should I start upgrading my weapons? I've just started chapter 10 and the guide suggests that I start now but I don't know which weapons and accessories to focus on.
marathonfool
Member
Oli said:
Just make sure to use physical resists accessories. IIRC the enemy does AOE physical attacks. A Sentinel would be a good option to reduce damage for the entire party. Also, buffs and debuffs are lifesavers. I went with a Fang/Snow/Hope party.
DigitalDevil
Member
chapter 11 spoilers
arggggggggh. I just beat the boss at the
and STILL haven't gotten an expanded crystarium. I got all 6 characters maxed out to level 4 in their main three roles, and now I have something like 400,000 CP for each character and nothing to do with it! It's burning a hole in my proverbial pocket! How much longer must I deal with this???
arggggggggh. I just beat the boss at the
top of the tower, before Oerba
FateBreaker
Member
DigitalDevil said:
It will be expanded at the next boss.
Mr. Wonderful
Member
I don't understand the complaints in regard to any Final Fantasy's story. Or the writing, for that matter.
And yes, while Tales can have great overall plots and some characters, I'm not embarrassed to play Final Fantasy, while Tales... Well...
And yes, while Tales can have great overall plots and some characters, I'm not embarrassed to play Final Fantasy, while Tales... Well...
Manmademan
Member
Mr. Wonderful said:
It might be a matter of simply outgrowing the material. When I was a teenager I'd happily watch anime bullshit until the cows came home.
These days I just don't have the patience for it
GillianSeed79
Member
Manmademan said:
This. This is it exactly. If I were still a teenager or younger I would have eaten this shit up.
Now, though, it's just I want to scream at my TV sometims that no one talks like this. Ever.
Mr. Wonderful said:
Personally, people joke about anything I play because it's all crazy crap. I don't even care anymore and I even agree with them.
I was playing ToV a while ago and someone said "Are you doing weird shit like the rest of your games?", then I played FFXIII and that same person said "I see you still have to do weird shit." :lol
These games have little sense of normalcy and do all kinds of awkward stuff, I feel I'd be lying if I put FF above Tales or most other RPG franchises. It's actually become part of why I enjoy JRPGs, going from SMT to Tales to Star Ocean to Final Fantasy is such a trippy experience because of all the themes, characters, locales, and creatures presented to you, and I think it's a lot fun, even if 80% of it can be quite cheesy.
As for FF stories and writing, I think many of them suffer from a lack of focus, or they try to make something bigger than what their concept allows (or what they're capable of doing), so many of them just start to fall apart the further you get into it, and what interesting aspects that were presented to you earlier in the game end up falling flat.
That's why I really like FFV's story and characters, probably above any other FF, because it's like one big parody of JRPGs and fantasy in general. All kinds of weird events and characters, lots of comedy, yet it keeps it all within a fun fantasy adventure. I thought it kept things simple without it getting boring.
Manmademan
Member
GillianSeed79 said:
Don't get me wrong, I like the game, but I reached Gran Pulse yesterday and I'm pretty comfortable saying at this point I'm playing more for gameplay than story here.
ZephyrFate
Banned
Isn't that, ultimately, what a game should be compelling you to do?Manmademan said:
Mr. Wonderful said:
Every JRPG has cringe worthy scenes, FF isn't immune to this. I wanted to kill myself anytime I had a Vanille scene and people were watching. Also, my dad thought Serah and Snow were brother and sister by how they looked, that being an actual relationship looks really creepy to people.
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
Will saves from the Japanese import of XIII work on the US version or vice versa?
I strongly doubt it.. but it would be very sweet if I could just swap discs based on which audio track I wanted.
I strongly doubt it.. but it would be very sweet if I could just swap discs based on which audio track I wanted.
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
Come on that's not a universal reaction at all...Papercuts said:
Snow looks like a giant white American and Serah looks like a little Japanese girl.- Status