Support NeoGAF

[Ainaurdur]

If you're talking about the Quest

Spoiler

with the Mage and Gargoyle...

Why on earth would they nerf that? It wasn't hard at all.

Have you seen the piles of dead THM corposes?

Yes, I was one of those THM corpses in phase 3. I honestly tried my best by taking several antidotes and potions. At least 3 times I tried and failed, until my friend reminded me I could just run to Gridania and unlock CNJ to get Cure. Then the fight was really easy.

Haha. I was one of them, until I realized "Oh...antidote and sleep." Then it was just easy sauce.

I feel like I had tried sleeping him, and for some reason it did not help me.
/shrug

 

[Dog food is delicious]

I know it wasn't, the trick was in the reward item from the previous quest , but you know how people are. Let me look for Yoshida's bit about it and I'll edit it back here.

Another thing I did was

Spoiler

pull the gargoyle away from the mage

, just in case.

 

[Dog food is delicious]

Can you describe how? I could not figure it out

From Central Shroud head south and keep following the road.

 

[tenchir]

You could do that, or you could just play for 2 more hours and get the air ship pass

I was getting my ass kick on a class quest for GLD( I had to hit and run to beat it because I couldn't dodge that dumb special attack for some reason) and then that spoiler quest. I think I stopped right there before the beta ended.

 

[Khrno]

Yes, I was one of those THM corpses in phase 3. I honestly tried my best by taking several antidotes and potions. At least 3 times I tried and failed, until my friend reminded me I could just run to Gridania and unlock CNJ to get Cure. Then the fight was really easy.

I also did it the first time as THM, and died the first 2 tries stupidly at the Gargoyle's hands, until I decided to read the battle log and see what had killed me. Third time went in and beat it with no problems thanks to just the antidote.

 

[Mechakira]

Even if that quest is doable, it's still a giant difficulty spike compared to everything up to then, especially with basically requiring items.

 

[Torquill]

Awww. You don't have to walk to the cities the first time you go? That's one of my favorite parts of an MMO. . Walking from Freeport to Qeynos, way before I had any business doing so, was still the single greatest adventure I've ever had.

 

[jiggle]

Can you describe how? I could not figure it out

From Dulldha to grid
central thanalan NE > eastern thanalan NE > south shroud > camp tranquil > hire a Choco porter for 90 Gil's to take u to grid

Nevermind misread I was thinking from Limsa Lominsa to ul'dah or gridinia. I'm assuming you cannot do that without an airship pass

they will probably unlock boat ride between limsa and western thanalan in retail
so it's still possible

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

If you're talking about the Quest

Spoiler

with the Mage and Gargoyle...

Why on earth would they nerf that? It wasn't hard at all.

As a THM that did the quest without Cure I say: You're wrong.

 

[Khrno]

I was getting my ass kick on a class quest for GLD( I had to hit and run to beat it because I couldn't dodge that dumb special attack for some reason) and then that spoiler quest. I think I stopped right there before the beta ended.

I also did that GLA quest, and I didn't have CNJ unlocked when I did it, but I did have MRD skills.Was it the one inside a tunnel with lots of enemies, or what was it?

 

[SoraanTribal]

That quest wasn't too hard as a Conjurer, but I think they should change the quest objective. I think it says "Defeat the Masked Mage!" or something like that. They should change it to "Defeat the Gargoyle!" I think some people were trying to attack the mage when that is definitely the wrong way to go about doing that quest.

 

[tenchir]

I also did that GLA quest, and I didn't have CNJ unlocked when I did it, but I did have MRD skills.Was it the one inside a tunnel with lots of enemies, or what was it?

Yup. Two sets of 3 mobs, then the boss.

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

That quest wasn't too hard as a Conjurer, but I think they should change the quest objective. I think it says "Defeat the Masked Mage!" or something like that. They should change it to "Defeat the Gargoyle!" I think some people were trying to attack the mage when that is definitely the wrong way to go about doing that quest.

That was what I did on the first try, then I started attacking only the Gargoyle. I still got owned a few times. The problem was the Gargoyle spamming Poison every 30 seconds.

 

[LowParry]

That quest wasn't too hard as a Conjurer, but I think they should change the quest objective. I think it says "Defeat the Masked Mage!" or something like that. They should change it to "Defeat the Gargoyle!" I think some people were trying to attack the mage when that is definitely the wrong way to go about doing that quest.

Is there not any sort of information in the quest itself to give you hints? Guildhests did this. I skipped every scene and text info as I played.

 

[Khrno]

Awww. You don't have to walk to the cities the first time you go? That's one of my favorite parts of an MMO. . Walking from Freeport to Qeynos, way before I had any business doing so, was still the single greatest adventure I've ever had.

That's right, you don't have to, but you can do it if you want to.

So get lv10 and go to the other 2 cities and unlock all the classes on their guilds before you are supposed to go there on quests business.

 

[Bogeypop]

As a THM that did the quest without Cure I say: You're wrong.

I was a THM who did it without cure too #BroFist

 

[SoopaMan2K]

Have you seen the piles of dead THM corposes?

Heh... nope. I had Cure, Protect and Aura(Push and Bind) with me. =P Still, even as a Pugilist I didn't have any problems.

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

Is there not any sort of information in the quest itself to give you hints? Guildhests did this. I skipped every scene and text info as I played.

I don't think so. The closer is that 2 or 1 quests before they give you free Antidote potions.

I was a THM who did it without cure too #BroFist

I felt quite badass after doing it, of course the reality involved lot of Sleep and kitting like a coward lol

 

[Khrno]

That quest wasn't too hard as a Conjurer, but I think they should change the quest objective. I think it says "Defeat the Masked Mage!" or something like that. They should change it to "Defeat the Gargoyle!" I think some people were trying to attack the mage when that is definitely the wrong way to go about doing that quest.

Well, that was exactly the first thing I did on my first attempt, attack the masked man lol

Yup. Two sets of 3 mobs, then the boss.

Right, I remember, indeed Cure and Protect would really help a lot there, I used potions and food, and had the MRD skills set.

 

[QisTopTier]

Heh... nope. I had Cure, Protect and Aura(Push and Bind) with me. =P Still, even as a Pugilist I didn't have any problems.

Well basically as a thm if you got poisoned twice you lost

 

[SoraanTribal]

Is there not any sort of information in the quest itself to give you hints? Guildhests did this. I skipped every scene and text info as I played.

I'm not really sure. I forget what the quest said in the journal. I just know it popped up "Defeat the Masked Mage!" on the screen for my objective. I mean technically, you do end up defeating him by the end, but... I dunno.

 

[Khrno]

Well basically as a thm if you got poisoned twice you lost

But that was just bad luck, I beat the quest with 3 different characters, and it never casted its poison more than once before the reinforcements. Maybe if kiting and took too long to deal enough damage for them to come I guess, but otherwise it should have just been one poison cast.

 

[tenchir]

Well, that was exactly the first thing I did on my first attempt, attack the masked man lol



Right, I remember, indeed Cure and Protect would really help a lot there, I used potions and food, and had the MRD skills set.

Did it as a pure GLD. The last quest I stopped at was the

Spoiler

Retrieving the Crown

quest.

 

[QisTopTier]

But that was just bad luck, I beat the quest with 3 different characters, and it never casted its poison more than once before the reinforcements. Maybe if kiting and took too long to deal enough damage for them to come I guess, but otherwise it should have just been one poison cast.

He cast it on me every 10 seconds if I was in melee range

 

[Arsenic]

How did some of you beat the quest so easily? I got my ass kicked at least 8 times before resorting to the extreme sleep/kite, measuring distance and timing and all.

Felt like FFXI all over again, with soloing at level 70 (when cap was still 75)


Antidotes was barely a solution. If one landed I'd be in the red, and antidotes have that ridiculous 150 second reuse timer on it.

 

[HiddenWings]

He cast it on me every 10 seconds if I was in melee range

The only time I saw it more than once was on my pugilist, on an attempt that went on long enough that I used Second Wind twice.

 

[Arsenic]

He cast it on me every 10 seconds if I was in melee range

RIght. I would kite the bastard and once I got within melee range he did that stupid backwards poison kick. It seemed really unfair and taxing to the unsuspecting newbs playing this game for the first time.

 

[Khrno]

He cast it on me every 10 seconds if I was in melee range

Man that wasn't bad luck, that was a glitch, on 2 characters I did it as MRD, and never had that happen. Irregular (as in random) behaviour maybe, or glitched, who knows. Hopefully it won't have these sort of problems, although I do hope that they keep the poison (at just 1 cast) so people that don't pay attention will die poisoned on the first attempt lol

 

[SoopaMan2K]

Well basically as a thm if you got poisoned twice you lost

Yeah, when I did it as a PGL(Just to try the class), I still had no problems. I didn't have Cure or Protect. I guess I was lucky because after he poisoned me the first time, he didn't do it after.

 

[Riposte]

The problem is that THM needs their own cure or defensive technique for very basic soloing. In this fight, bind/gravity and sleep don't really cut it (and it is very tight with the class quest too). I really wonder why they got something like Scathe instead of Drain or whatever could fill that function at that level. I'm guessing someone is a FFXII fanboy, because Scathe is just a waste of a "progression slot", at least creativity speaking. It doesn't have much of a point until you get the trait (which means it takes two "slots") and at the end of the day THM should be designed around managing Fire, Blizzard, and Thunder spells for damage and productivity (which I'm not quite satisfied with either). People like to complain about the class system, but I feel the only issue is all of the classes are not designed as well as they could be and some are just dreadfully designed (Gladiator / Paladin in particular). The pattern of giving you an action that only really becomes good (if that, see: "Enhanced Awareness") when you get a trait for it a dozen levels down the line is bad. Traits improving actions should be reserved for cross-class skills.

The fight itself could use more clear directions, like not attacking the mage and being ready for poison. Otherwise, I quite like it and hope they don't nerf it (too much). Difficult quests is what will make me like this game. If they don't take their content seriously, I won't either.

 

[Mastamind]

He cast it on me every 10 seconds if I was in melee range

That was the problem I had as a pug, i could time potions and second wind, but when he poisoned me a second time it would do more than my total hp bar and antidote would still be on cooldown. The only reason i won was because he missed a second poison.

 

[Khrno]

How did some of you beat the quest so easily? I got my ass kicked at least 8 times before resorting to the extreme sleep/kite, measuring distance and timing and all.

On my first character I was MRD with no other skills, first time I died because I went for the masked man, thought he would be squishy, but I was wrong.

Second attempt, didn't pay attention to what the Gargoyle was doing, I was doing dmg and taking dmg when I noticed my HP going down fast, nothing that a single potion could do. The masked man wasn't an issue since I didn't move close to him.

Third attempt, after reading the log to see what killed me and found out I was poisoned and realised how clever it was to give the antidotes on the previous quest (and how stupid I was to just stand there fighting taking dmg not paying attention what the Gargoyle did). So yeah, for the third fight I tried to evade every single of its attacks and as soon as I got poisoned popped the antidote and a potion and kept dealing dmg, then reinforcements arrived and the quest was done.

 

[C.Dark.DN]

I got my ass kicked 20 times using varios kiting strats on a PUG, I even attacked the masked guy one attempt, before I facerolled him after using an anicdote.

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

The problem is that THM needs their own cure or defensive technique for very basic soloing. In this fight, bind/gravity and sleep don't really cut it (and it is very tight with the class quest too). I really wonder why they got something like Scathe instead of Drain or whatever could fill that function at that level. Scathe is just a waste of a "progression slot", at least creativity speaking. It doesn't have much of a point until you get the trait (which means it takes two "slots") and at the end of the day THM should be designed around managing Fire, Blizzard, and Thunder spells for damage and productivity (which I'm not quite satisfied with either). People like to complain about the class system, but I feel the only issue is all of the classes are not designed as well as they could be and some are just dreadfully designed (Gladiator / Paladin in particular). The pattern of giving you an action that only becomes really good (if that, see: "Enhanced Awareness") when you get a trait for it a dozen levels down the line is bad. Traits improving actions should be reserved for cross-class skills.

The fight itself could use more clear directions, like not attacking the mage and being ready for poison. Otherwise, I quite like it and hope they don't nerf it (too much). Difficult quests is what will make me like this game. If they don't take their content seriously, I won't either.

They only need cut the spam of the Poison skill. Everything else is fine.

 

[whyreggielie]

How did some of you beat the quest so easily? I got my ass kicked at least 8 times before resorting to the extreme sleep/kite, measuring distance and timing and all.

Felt like FFXI all over again, with soloing at level 70 (when cap was still 75)


Antidotes was barely a solution. If one landed I'd be in the red, and antidotes have that ridiculous 150 second reuse timer on it.

I feel your pain. Going full INT THM with terrible defensive stats made this fight hell. Honestly if you weren't good at kiting and sleeping then it was over for you, finally figured out that antidotes don't share a timer with hi-potions so I relied on both. Some people probably invested a couple points into vitality or got cure from CNJ, for those of us that didn't go into those made this fight brutal.

Still, I enjoyed the difficulty so I'm somewhat disappointed in them nerfing it.

 

[theSlacker]

Even if that quest is doable, it's still a giant difficulty spike compared to everything up to then, especially with basically requiring items.

I honestly think there is something odd with the poison he does since I did it first try across three different classes and never needed an antidote. Lancer, Marauder, and Archer just killed with no trouble. Left me scratching my head every time someone mentioned his poison.

 

[SoopaMan2K]

I feel your pain. Going full INT THM with terrible defensive stats made this fight hell. Honestly if you weren't good at kiting and sleeping then it was over for you, finally figured out that antidotes don't share a timer with hi-potions so I relied on both. Some people probably invested a couple points into vitality or got cure from CNJ, for those of us that didn't go into those made this fight brutal.

Still, I enjoyed the difficulty so I'm somewhat disappointed in them nerfing it.

This is how I feel.

 

[SkyOdin]

I think the Lesser Gargoyle might be on a timer. You might be able to beat it by simply prolonging the fight long enough. It was pretty straight-forward as a Gladiator, but my brother really had to drag out the fight as a Conjurer.

I really warn against skipping all of the quest text in FF XIV. Most of the class quests and such are designed to teach you how to play your class effectively in a group. For example, the GLA level 10 quest (the tunnel fight) exists to teach you how to keep aggro off of your healer. I had some trouble with that fight, since I was having issues dodging the AoE attack, but it is a pretty straightforward fight if you keep your ally alive by acting like a tank. If you just listen to what the NPCs say, it is obvious what you need to do in most situations.

 

[omlet]

Is the crew on Sargatanas calling their free company "Red Dot"? That makes less sense when you keep in mind crests no longer appear in names.

Yes, we are.

 

[supergiz]

What Khrno said.

More memory will help a little, especially if your GPU has a gig or less of video memory, but unless you're multi-tasking you should have system memory to spare even then.

Faster memory is likely to do you more good than extra system memory. If you're mother board is running DDR3 1333 memory, and can handle higher speeds, you may want to considering finding higher speed RAM and swapping it out. This is because, unless you have 4GB of memory right on your GPU, the game is probably going to be using system memory quite heavily,and will intermittently be waiting for system memory to catch up before completing a task.

Even this probably wouldn't make, THAT big of a difference for you. Even if you went from 1333 to one of the OCed RAM speeds available, I'd expect only a few FPS difference.

Thanks guys. Good to hear it is not the same old wait for group for hours then level situation. I remember waiting sometimes for 3 or more hours at higher lvls in 11.

I think I will go ahead and make the jump with the ram then.

 

[SoopaMan2K]

I think the Lesser Gargoyle might be on a timer. You might be able to beat it by simply prolonging the fight long enough. It was pretty straight-forward as a Gladiator, but my brother really had to drag out the fight as a Conjurer.

I really warn against skipping all of the quest text in FF XIV. Most of the class quests and such are designed to teach you how to play your class effectively in a group. For example, the GLA level 10 quest (the tunnel fight) exists to teach you how to keep aggro off of your healer. I had some trouble with that fight, since I was having issues dodging the AoE attack, but it is a pretty straightforward fight if you keep your ally alive by acting like a tank. If you just listen to what the NPCs say, it is obvious what you need to do in most situations.

Yeah, as a CNJ it was cake walk. Heal NPC's till they kill all mobs,(Gargoyle) Protect, Cleric Stance, Stone, Aero and if you need to heal... Arua(Push and Bind), Cleric Stance off and Cure. Repeat.

 

[Xavien]

I feel your pain. Going full INT THM with terrible defensive stats made this fight hell. Honestly if you weren't good at kiting and sleeping then it was over for you, finally figured out that antidotes don't share a timer with hi-potions so I relied on both. Some people probably invested a couple points into vitality or got cure from CNJ, for those of us that didn't go into those made this fight brutal.

Still, I enjoyed the difficulty so I'm somewhat disappointed in them nerfing it.

Pretty much, I kited as a THM without Cure, basically did thunder then sleep (Thunder ticks don't interrupt sleep) with the occasional fire thrown in when i was far enough away. Still ate 2 poisons though but luckily antidote was off cooldown, but relying on Hi-potions for HP was painful to say the least especially considering that nearly all forms of damage for a THM up to that point required standing still.

 

[Arsenic]

On my first character I was MRD with no other skills, first time I died because I went for the masked man, thought he would be squishy, but I was wrong.

Second attempt, didn't pay attention to what the Gargoyle was doing, I was doing dmg and taking dmg when I noticed my HP going down fast, nothing that a single potion could do. The masked man wasn't an issue since I didn't move close to him.

Third attempt, after reading the log to see what killed me and found out I was poisoned and realised how clever it was to give the antidotes on the previous quest (and how stupid I was to just stand there fighting taking dmg not paying attention what the Gargoyle did). So yeah, for the third fight I tried to evade every single of its attacks and as soon as I got poisoned popped the antidote and a potion and kept dealing dmg, then reinforcements arrived and the quest was done.

I'll detail my strategy (I wish I recorded a video....oh wait nvm).

I enter the fight, hit the gargoyle with an offensive spell**, cast sleep immediately.

If he lands that fucking poison early, Ill antidote AND potion up immediately to start the timers as early as possible and remain full health.

The first sleep always lasts 30 seconds. I set my casting distance as far as possible and when the countdown to 5, I start casting blizzard or fire and then immediately cast sleep. Again, praying he doesn't hit me.

The second sleep always last 15 seconds, so I repeat the above steps in a much faster pace.

The third sleep lasts only 7 seconds, so theres hardly time to set, cast, sleep without the risk of fumbling something and getting fucking poisoned, so I hit sprint and kite as far as possible for a few seconds and then hit sleep, and then....

....the sleep cycle starts over again. 30, 15, 7. In that time frame I can only do very little damage.

If I ever got too close, he will hit me with the poison skill.

After about 20 minutes my rescuers come. Yay. Not.

I did this fight at least 8 times as THM, and trust me its very unfair. I'm against making things easy, but they really need to cool down that poison fucking attack or something. (or maybe the ticks, I got like 30HP off with each tick). Maybe make the Antidotes recasts faster. Or maybe make a worthwhile difference between Potions and Hi-Potions. Fuck.

**I never use thunder, because I think the DOT is weaker than the overall damage of blizzard or fire, In fact, I have no idea why THM gets thunder so early. I haven't found a useful situation where the weakass DOT is better than spamming blizzard...which essentially has no MP cost and does more damage in 10 seconds. Someone please tell me I'm wrong, I really need to understand this.

/angryLalafellRant

 

[Arsenic]

I think the Lesser Gargoyle might be on a timer. You might be able to beat it by simply prolonging the fight long enough. It was pretty straight-forward as a Gladiator, but my brother really had to drag out the fight as a Conjurer.

Not true. I had one fight reach to 3 minutes left. IIRC, its 25 minutes long.

 

[Xux]

**I never use thunder, because I think the DOT is weaker than the overall damage of blizzard or fire, In fact, I have no idea why THM gets thunder so early. I haven't found a useful situation where the weakass DOT is better than spamming blizzard...which essentially has no MP cost and does more damage in 10 seconds. Someone please tell me I'm wrong, I really need to understand this.

/angryLalafellRant

Thunder (the first one) has a total potency of 190 which is 40 more than Blizzard and it's unaffected by the fire or ice buffs so it's good to lead after a Fire->Ice Transpose so the MP cost is eaten up by Umbral Ice. Sleeping enemies aren't woken up by DoT damage ticks, either.

 

[erawsd]

The higher level we go to and more complex the fights get the more that dps will need to switch targets and even tanked targets moving around will become the normal encounter design. So unless they decide to stick with the design decision of making boss encounters and mobs mostly stationary (something that I thought the combat system was changed to prevent the limitation of) then having the strict position requirements for one class will be hard to balance. All the combat changes were not made just so we can forever have tank and spank fights. They were made to remove the limits that the old system had on how you could design encounters.

Or something.

Yeah, exactly. The fights we've seen so far have been the basic tank+spank variety. However, I imagine raid bosses will be far more inventive and complex. For example, Demon Wall -- can that thing even be attacked from the back or flank?

I hate to speak so prematurely, but its something I'm sensitive to since ive seen it in other games. They can go in 2 directions with this:

1. Encounter design is crippled by class design
2. Monk ends up being a very fragile class that starts to crack and break the second we have an encounter that requires any type of mobility, stacking, or phases where they cant hit something for short periods of time.

None of those are ideal, I'd just rather they find some other way to make the class unique and fun.

 

[MogCakes]

1. Encounter design is crippled by class design
2. Monk ends up being a very fragile class that starts to crack and break the second we have an encounter that requires any type of mobility, stacking, or phases where they cant hit something for short periods of time.

2 is the better option. Monk skills can more easily be fixed than having to reprogram boss fights. I think so anyway.

 

[mingus]

I got my ass kicked 20 times using varios kiting strats on a PUG, I even attacked the masked guy one attempt, before I facerolled him after using an anicdote.

lol an anecdote

C.Dark.DN used AMUSING STORY...it was SUPER EFFECTIVE

 

[ezekial45]

Any good videos of high level play?

 

[The Karasumori]

Any good videos of high level play?

You won't, or rather you shouldn't be able to find any videos of phase 3 gameplay as it's under NDA. Thankfully, SE should allow videos of phase 4.

My attempt at a female Wildwood Elezen.