Mathematics
Neo Member
Theory crafting is fun. But looking at my hero list...
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Fire Emblem Heroes |OT|The Future of Fire Emblem
- Thread starter Shun
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I don't know because Triangle Adept specifies the weapon triangle. You'd have to just test it and find out if you are going from 20% bonus damage to 40% bonus damage against colourless units.
No.
How about activate in combat stat buffs?
GoldCrusader
Member
Boooooo I can't give Lancebreaker to my Alphonse.
I don't think they'd rollback anyway because I'm sure whales have already begun spending like crazy to make their over-powered one shit heroes.
This is interesting. As others have noted, the impact on most players isn't going to be huge, at least in the near future, because it's hard to track down all the skills you want. And natural 5*s are actually in a weird position where they're going to have a very hard time scrounging up the SP for all these skills. I mean, Lucina doesn't even get enough from leveling to 40 to get all of her own skills.
I did a couple obvious things like giving Lucina Fury 3 and Takumi Vantage 3, but I'm quickly going to start running out of units if I want to lots more out.
One obvious thing to do that should significantly improve the effectiveness of most heroes is giving them good Assist skills. Some of these will often function as a pseudo-Dance and can be fantastic for reaching targets and getting away. Plus the heroes with them will generally have access to them as 3*s, so they're very easy to inherit.
The list:
Draw Back: Fae, Nino, Sully
Shove: Est, Gordin, Roy
Smite (super-Shove): Bartre, Effie
Swap: Arthur, Stahl, Subaki
Reposition: Barst, Selena, Olwen (5*)
Cherche, Eirika, and Marth have Pivot, which is not quite as good for this but is still movement-related.
So, Smite is an offensive Dance (plus it can go over rivers and mountains and I think over enemy heroes). You can use it to dump someone into the enemy backline. Reposition strikes me as the overall best one. You can use it to get 2 extra movement forward, with a few more limitations than Dance or Smite. Or you can use it to pull someone who just engaged back 2 spaces, leaving a body in front of them. Compare to Draw Back which ends with two units in the same positions but with the already-weakened one in front. A melee hero with Drag Back can be Repositioned out of range of even a ranged hero standing next to their target.
Edit: I share others' concerns that this sort of makes future heroes mostly interesting just for what can be scavenged from their corpses. I think you'll always have reason to maintain one copy of a hero given bonuses in events, so it's not too bad for 5*s, but it's all about unique weapons and stats, and we already have really solid choices in those areas. A new non-unique skill just isn't going to be appealing.
I did a couple obvious things like giving Lucina Fury 3 and Takumi Vantage 3, but I'm quickly going to start running out of units if I want to lots more out.
One obvious thing to do that should significantly improve the effectiveness of most heroes is giving them good Assist skills. Some of these will often function as a pseudo-Dance and can be fantastic for reaching targets and getting away. Plus the heroes with them will generally have access to them as 3*s, so they're very easy to inherit.
The list:
Draw Back: Fae, Nino, Sully
Shove: Est, Gordin, Roy
Smite (super-Shove): Bartre, Effie
Swap: Arthur, Stahl, Subaki
Reposition: Barst, Selena, Olwen (5*)
Cherche, Eirika, and Marth have Pivot, which is not quite as good for this but is still movement-related.
So, Smite is an offensive Dance (plus it can go over rivers and mountains and I think over enemy heroes). You can use it to dump someone into the enemy backline. Reposition strikes me as the overall best one. You can use it to get 2 extra movement forward, with a few more limitations than Dance or Smite. Or you can use it to pull someone who just engaged back 2 spaces, leaving a body in front of them. Compare to Draw Back which ends with two units in the same positions but with the already-weakened one in front. A melee hero with Drag Back can be Repositioned out of range of even a ranged hero standing next to their target.
Edit: I share others' concerns that this sort of makes future heroes mostly interesting just for what can be scavenged from their corpses. I think you'll always have reason to maintain one copy of a hero given bonuses in events, so it's not too bad for 5*s, but it's all about unique weapons and stats, and we already have really solid choices in those areas. A new non-unique skill just isn't going to be appealing.
toastyToast
Member
The current implementation doesn't let you carry inherited skills to further units. They're going to allow you do that after a patch.
Just not to fuse away characters that you have inherited skills already since the skills will be gone forever. A future patch in April will fix that.
I didn't think of Triangle Adept for Robin. If it works with his weapon, then that skill would essentially be twice as good. For purposes of just deleting Takumi he probably won't need much help as most of the time right now they live with at most 2-3 hp - if I use Fury and change one of my characters' C skills to Rally Speed he'd double any Takumi except for a +spd one. But Triangle Adept would allow him to kill Kagero for free and deal with reds more effectively. Will consider it, but 20k feathers on my only Selena or Cordelia would hurt.
As for mounted healers, if I go with the cavalry buffs/blarblade Ursula strategy then I suppose Clarine could be useful. I have a 4* at 40 from leveling random goobers. Clarine+Ursula though, would be hitting the point where my arena score would be so gimped they'd only be useful on grand hero/tower maps.
This opens up so many possibilities. It might be worth spending feathers leveling up units for their skills rather than upgrading existing units to 5*.
There's a limit on the number of skills a unit can have equipped, right? Is it three? I was wondering what I could do with Effie since her two skills are already super useful. I was thinking about giving her a Brave Lance and then either giving her a regeneration skill, or Wings of Mercy for SURPRISE MOTHERFUCKER Effie.
Maybe give that auto-counterattack first skill to someone who can hit at all ranges, like Hector or Ryoma...
There's a limit on the number of skills a unit can have equipped, right? Is it three? I was wondering what I could do with Effie since her two skills are already super useful. I was thinking about giving her a Brave Lance and then either giving her a regeneration skill, or Wings of Mercy for SURPRISE MOTHERFUCKER Effie.
Maybe give that auto-counterattack first skill to someone who can hit at all ranges, like Hector or Ryoma...
If I decided to use a healer for arena, I think the skills I'd go with:
Panic or maybe Pain
Rehabilitate
Heavenly Light
Speed +3
Live to Serve
Savage Blow
That's all I could get to work with. I couldn't give a healer Wary Fighter because it's restricted by movement type so only armoured units can learn it.
And there's so many weapon type restrictions against healers too.
Panic or maybe Pain
Rehabilitate
Heavenly Light
Speed +3
Live to Serve
Savage Blow
That's all I could get to work with. I couldn't give a healer Wary Fighter because it's restricted by movement type so only armoured units can learn it.
And there's so many weapon type restrictions against healers too.
Hmm. That's interesting. I wouldn't mind sacrificing my Roy to the gods (I hate his art), if it means my Robin can benefit from it, but I don't know if its confirmed that Triangle Adept affects his attack against colorless foes.
I was looking at healer stats to see which ones were really tanky. I noticed that Azama and maybe Lissa are pretty durable?
Maybe it would be worth giving one of them Martyr so that they can take a hit and then suddenly become super single-target healers.
Combine that with Live to Serve and then you pretty much have to kill the healer in one turn, or else they'll go back to full the next turn.
So I am having a bit of choice paralysis with these skill options...
I also pity non-whales for the next few weeks until IntSys has a chance to adjust the way their arena matchmaking/scoring works. I never got amazing scores in the first place, so I am going to be mostly fine.
I also pity non-whales for the next few weeks until IntSys has a chance to adjust the way their arena matchmaking/scoring works. I never got amazing scores in the first place, so I am going to be mostly fine.
Since we're getting Michalis fairly soon and it stands to reason Iote's Shield will be transferrable (Sheena's shield can be inherited by armor), I wonder which flyer would benefit the most from it. I believe it would take up the A slot that Minerva has Life and Death in but I'm assuming she still has good stats without it.
all those people complaining about nothing to use stamina on, lol. Good luck in the 10th stratum. I got a couple perfect wins with infantry but yeah 15 wins is a bit steep for some of these. Still, that's a lot of easy free orbs and I appreciate a long term timesink instead of quests I bang out in 15 minutes.
all those people complaining about nothing to use stamina on, lol. Good luck in the 10th stratum. I got a couple perfect wins with infantry but yeah 15 wins is a bit steep for some of these. Still, that's a lot of easy free orbs and I appreciate a long term timesink instead of quests I bang out in 15 minutes.
This is one of the biggest negatives that is really being overlooked. Future characters are going to be seen as just skill sticks. I really wish the system was more restricted than it is.
I don't know, I'd prefer Rehabilitate just for being able to fully heal a unit when they're below 50% health.
There are restrictions.
Weapon type restrictions, movement type restrictions, etc.
With regards to new units on the banner, you won't be able to take Ike's Ragnell because they've restricted exclusive weapons.
So technically, 5* banner units are still going to have exclusive skills.
Plus, it's not as though people will get 5* characters easily and, you'd need at least two to three of the same 5* hero to inherit almost all of their skills. So we're talking a lot of orbs just to be able to summon two to three of them.
ah yeah that's a good thing to keep in mind. My Robin has over 1000 extra SP because he's been carrying my team for a long time, but the Lucina I got during the voting battle still doesn't have Astra.
I've been getting a lot of mileage out of Draw Back on Sully as she replaced Olivia this week, as I need them bonus points. It seems really great on a cavalry unit as she can do all kinds of crazy maneuvers to drag units around.
How do the A/B/C skill slots work anyway? Do certain skills only go into certain slots?
Sully is great as a bonus character. Draw back means that even a level 1 throwaway Sully can contribute a lot to arena battles.
Certain skills go into certain slots. For example, Armored Blow is in the A slot. You can't stack Death Blow or Attack +3 with it since they're in the same slot.
Yes.
I'm thinking, maybe Vantage 3 isn't always the superior skill. Desperation 3 seems better suited for units that can actually take a hit. It'd be funny if Vantage would work with Distant/Close Counter though. Did anybody do research on that?
It works on Takumi. I'm not sure about others who use a skill instead of a weapon to get that trait.
Man-is-Obsolete
Member
Well all right then! Soooo do I give Roy Draconic aura and Hone Atk 2 from F Corrin? That would be about 18-19 extra damage on a 3 charge and of course buff anyone next to him for 3 Atk.
This update is making my head spin, I'm not really sure what I want to do with my units right now. I'll have to figure out who I want to keep and who I want to sacrifice. The problem is I don't really want to sacrifice any of my 5*, even if they suck. Other than that stupid second Karel, he can go.
Technoweirdo
Member
Have nobody with Triangle Adept 3. Suppose I could sacrifice my 4* Cordelia who has Adept 2, but that feels like a--waaaaait a minute, I HAVE 5* ROY.
WHERE'S MY BOY, ROY?
(Okay, this might be even worse of a waste. lol)
Don't have Reinhardt/Olwen, but if Alfonse can't benefit from his own Spur Attack, I'll assume no to that too.
Personally attempting...:
Assault
Recover
Heavenly Light
Life and Death 3
Live to Serve 3
Hone Cavalry
My Elise is missing Life and Death right now, but I do see this as one of the most interesting applications of her high Atk and Spd by healer standards, even if this would make her without a doubt the most fragile unit in the game and even if healers as a whole deal shit for damage for some silly reason. If she successfully tanks a single hit while dealing two back, she'd instantly charge Heavenly Light for a massive heal to herself and everyone else.
They can inherit that? Interesting...If they change the arena to factor BST less (They are doing that, right?), I don't think your arena score would be hurt too much...
Sort of, there's a few skills you'd just have to look out for.
Vantage, Desperation, Defiant <Insert Stat Here>, Wary Fighter, Brash Assault, Threaten <Insert Stat Here>, etc.
And all specials because anyone can have specials now.
Usually you can spot a brave weapon on a character on screen if you didn't check their skills.
Wings of Mercy is going to break arena imho.
Yeah I tested it myself, it doesn't work. Ugh, now I need to rethink my plan to put Goad Fliers on Catria.
I haven't been able to use Wings of Mercy yet with my Nino. I just adjusted stat totals so I should be able to fight against less level 50 heroes in arena now.
Wings of Mercy is one of those things that's far more effective on the AI, because it multiplies the possibilities of AI movement during their turn, similar to a dancer.
Blarblade on cavalry sounds nice, but it has the fundamental issue of whether you're giving up arena points to chase that synergy. You definitely are going to use at least two cavalry for that.
Blarblade on cavalry sounds nice, but it has the fundamental issue of whether you're giving up arena points to chase that synergy. You definitely are going to use at least two cavalry for that.
Stat distribution is more important than base stats because base stats is fundamentally tied to the unit type and hardly deviates..For example, armored units have the same base stat totals between 168 and 169, but only Effie and Hector have much higher than 30 base attack. Other than Effie and Hector, the other armored units don't really do enough damage before they get swarmed by other units.
It's hard to tell now how the upcoming arena changes will change this, it sounds like the base stat totals will still matter so armored units will still give you more points than others.
That's the main way I spot Ruby Sword users too. Somehow that ornate hilt stands out to me more than the equivalent Lance and Axe users.
Indeed, I meant the allocation of base stats, but yeah.
These changes mean the most for whales, which is kinda unfortunate, but it also is still fun to customize your own units. I'm regretting selling all those "crappy" 4 stars and 3 stars that I thought I'd need to sell for feathers.
Can you attack after warping?
I sent home 3 Lonqu's yesterday. No idea what I was thinking haha.
As a previous post mentioned, I don't think this fundamentally alters the dynamics between whales and other players as much as people would suspect. Units like Hina, who are extremely offensive, would still be difficult to achieve +10 stats on 5* since they don't drop 5* naturally. Plus someone who would decide to go that far have to be extremely dedicated and should be rare.
Just some quick notes.
Obviously some heroes at 4* learn some skills at level 3 earlier compared to others. For example, Hinata iirc learns Fury level 3 at 4* compared to other units that have to be 5*. Cain has Wing of Mercy level 3 at 4* compared to others that learn it at 5*, etc.
It looks like enemies at level 35 are the lowest you can kill to gain SP in the training tower so you're still stuck doing the lunatic stratum levels 8, 9, 10.
Obviously some heroes at 4* learn some skills at level 3 earlier compared to others. For example, Hinata iirc learns Fury level 3 at 4* compared to other units that have to be 5*. Cain has Wing of Mercy level 3 at 4* compared to others that learn it at 5*, etc.
It looks like enemies at level 35 are the lowest you can kill to gain SP in the training tower so you're still stuck doing the lunatic stratum levels 8, 9, 10.
uh, why? I've actually been looking at her as a green to try for on her upcoming banner. I need a physical green and most are slow as shit, plus we have Iote's Shield incoming on the next grand hero battle. I could just go with Anna but even though I never find 5* units anyways, the fact that you can't +1 her ever is a bit annoying.
Raven's actually looking like someone you could customize into a great unit but mine is -atk.
Damn. I was actually hype to pull two of them by accident while trying for Lucina, even though one was -atk (he would be the king of 0x2) and one was 3*.
And yeah I believe you can based on how many times I've been wiped in the 10th stratum or lunatic 9-5 by wings of mercy fucks.
Actually, it sounds like base stats will matter much less in April. No more Vanilla Effie = 40+10 Robin.
Based on the notification, the four things that would affect matchmaking, and hence arena points, are essentially the same as what it is today.
I believe the question is how the weighting will change.
Wasn't paying attention and learned the wrong skills with Lucina, now I have to grind for SP to get Desperation, bleh.
Cool feature, I don't think it will be as crazy as some people. Sure, people who drop thousands on this game will have crazy teams, but they would have anyway.
Donnel does.
Cool feature, I don't think it will be as crazy as some people. Sure, people who drop thousands on this game will have crazy teams, but they would have anyway.
Which units have a Brave Lance? I know that Hinoka has one, but I don't want to lose her if possible.
Also, upgrading people to 5* to give their skill to someone sounds like a huge drain on feathers.
Donnel does.
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