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Fitness |OT8| Dad Bods, Bulge Swelfies, and Wait...Do you even lift bro?

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Psychotext

Member
So I did my first session of 5/3/1 style for my bench last night and noticed a few things (I appreciate these may not apply for the other weeks).

1: Was much, much lighter than I expected it to be. Coming from 5 sets of 5 at max.
2: Was a lot less volume than I expected it to be (I'm tempted to try the multi set AMRAP).
3: Because it was so light I completely forgot to take a proper break between my working sets. I just changed the weights over and got back on with it.
4: It felt much less punishing mentally. I didn't feel like I was at risk of failing to hit my target, instead I felt like I could try my best to go for a decent number of reps on the AMRAP. I was actually tempted to try a few jokers, but I'd already got a meaningful amount of shoulder pain so that would have been stupid.

Of course, I have no idea if this will end with me getting past this nightmare in terms of being stalled out, but it's a much more enjoyable way of doing things in my opinion.
 
mdsfx

mdsfx

Member
Psychotext said:
So I did my first session of 5/3/1 style for my bench last night and noticed a few things (I appreciate these may not apply for the other weeks)...
Click to expand...
Yep, this was my experience too. Volume was much less than 5x5, but I'm still progressing somehow. I usually do 5/3/1, then my cardio, then extra sets at higher reps of whatever compounds I did that day along with a few isolated lifts.
 
K

Kntj

Member
Should I do the deload week of 5/3/1 on a cut? I don't really feel like I need it yet, but I wonder if I would regret skipping it in a week or two.
 
M

maximum360

Member
velociraptor said:
I could never imagine fasting for 24h..

I'd literally die
Click to expand...

It's completely a mental thing. When I'm resolved about it I can do up to three times a week. It's also easier when I'm busy so work days are best. Example, I'll eat until dinner on Sunday and then not eat until dinner Monday. Monday dinner through Tuesday dinner is eating normally. I can even have more food on non-fast days but try to stay away from junk food.

With not eating cleanly I was about to lose 6-8 pounds in three weeks doing this.
 
S

SilentSoldier

Member
So, I'm running into a wall with OHP (again) and I need to figure out some accessories to add to help with that lift. Anybody got any ideas? I did kind of take about 2 weeks off due to being sick and just overall stress from studying for boards. Ugh, I'll be so glad when I take this stupid test and can get back to a normal life (before clinical rotations that is).
 
entremet

entremet

Member
SilentSoldier said:
So, I'm running into a wall with OHP (again) and I need to figure out some accessories to add to help with that lift. Anybody got any ideas? I did kind of take about 2 weeks off due to being sick and just overall stress from studying for boards. Ugh, I'll be so glad when I take this stupid test and can get back to a normal life (before clinical rotations that is).
Click to expand...

Wise but simple advice from strength coach Pavel Tsatsouline:

"If you want to Press a lot, you need to Press a lot"

Once a week pressing won't do much. Try 2x a week at least. This advice works similar to most of the major compounds. Frequency is underrated.

You may also need to up your caloric intake some. Upper body lifts are very diet dependent.
 
M

Megasoum

Banned
I decided to start going to the gym in the morning before work instead of after work... This means that I need to take a shower at the office and so I need a bigger bag than my work backpack I've been using forever.

Anybody have good suggestions for a good gym bag that is not too big but still has enough room for the change of clothes, towel, etc.

Also, I need to carry around my work laptop everyday and I'd love to have a space for it in the gym bag so I don't have to carry two bags.

Any ideas?

Thanks!
 
S

SilentSoldier

Member
entremet said:
Wise but simple advice from strength coach Pavel Tsatsouline:

"If you want to Press a lot, you need to Press a lot"

Once a week pressing won't do much. Try 2x a week at least. This advice works similar to most of the major compounds. Frequency is underrated.

You may also need to up your caloric intake some. Upper body lifts are very diet dependent.
Click to expand...

Currently doing Stronglifts MWF, I just took that two week breather to recover from being sick, as well as general med school stress. Right now, I do the work outset and then go to a lower weight and try AMRAP, but I know there's more I can do, I just don't know those exercises :/

Psychotext said:
...

...might as well give up now then. lol
Click to expand...

lol, I'm gonna defy the odds and make it work... hopefully
 
entremet

entremet

Member
SilentSoldier said:
Currently doing Stronglifts MWF, I just took that two week breather to recover from being sick, as well as general med school stress. Right now, I do the work outset and then go to a lower weight and try AMRAP, but I know there's more I can do, I just don't know those exercises :/



lol, I'm gonna defy the odds and make it work... hopefully
Click to expand...

SL is good. That's pretty decent frequency.

I wouldn't worry, man. You're obviously going through a stressful and unique time of your life. Med school can be crazy I hear.

Just focus on getting your workouts in, eating well, and rest/recovery (I know this may be hard now)

As a long time trainee, you start learning to be easy on yourself when you hit more stressful periods of your life.

Remember the body doesn't want to build muscle or strength unless a great stimulus is applied--caloric surplus and consistent training.

It's very efficient, which is why building muscle/strength is so hard, especially naturally.
 
J

Jacksinthe

Banned
entremet said:
Wise but simple advice from strength coach Pavel Tsatsouline:

"If you want to Press a lot, you need to Press a lot"

Once a week pressing won't do much. Try 2x a week at least. This advice works similar to most of the major compounds. Frequency is underrated.

You may also need to up your caloric intake some. Upper body lifts are very diet dependent.
Click to expand...
I couldn't disagree more with the bolded.

If you're following a good program and not seeing results, 99.9999999% of the time it's going to be diet related. Too many people on 1x per week programs making amazing progress. If you're on point with a routine and diet and you're still not progressing, its time to see a doc, more than likely an endo.

Can people benefit from higher frequency? Yes. Is it always needed? No. Do most beginner programs recommend this? Yes.

Everyone who starts out lifting and hell, even intermediate fitness geeks will find their diet can always be improved. One of the biggest pitfalls of peeps new to fitness training is over-training when they hit a wall because things like food, stress and rest are usually the last things they think are the culprits.

I'm always against suggesting higher frequency or volume if the program is on point and point to diet and other areas first.

Just my .02
 
F

Faiz

Member
Chocobro said:
I'm pretty sure that's about 95kg. Two 15kg and a 10kg on each side = 80kg. +15kg women's bar = 95kg.

#kilosnotpounds lol

Anyway, Mattie Rogers is strong. Last month she competed at the USA Weightlifting Junior Nationals and set eight American records; two snatch, 3 CNJ, 2 total.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LR9IbcdVDu4
Click to expand...

I was about to say, there was another video on her IG that looked like two 20kg on each side. She's impressive for sure. Accidents happen!

Does seem weird to be doing snatches so close to a window though lol.
 
B

bchamba

Member
I don't know of many programs where outside of deadlifts the compound movements are programmed for 1x week. Even when running 5/3/1 it's common to make your secondary movement on each day a variation of the opposite compound lift (so some kind of squat on your deadlift day, some kind of bench on your OHP day). Volume is the biggest factor in increasing both muscle size and strength.
 
entremet

entremet

Member
Jacksinthe said:
I couldn't disagree more with the bolded.

If you're following a good program and not seeing results, 99.9999999% of the time it's going to be diet related. Too many people on 1x per week programs making amazing progress. If you're on point with a routine and diet and you're still not progressing, its time to see a doc, more than likely an endo.

Can people benefit from higher frequency? Yes. Is it always needed? No. Do most beginner programs recommend this? Yes.

Everyone who starts out lifting and hell, even intermediate fitness geeks will find their diet can always be improved. One of the biggest pitfalls of peeps new to fitness training is over-training when they hit a wall because things like food, stress and rest are usually the last things they think are the culprits.

I'm always against suggesting higher frequency or volume if the program is on point and point to diet and other areas first.

Just my .02
Click to expand...

Diet only goes so far if you have shit programming. And overtraining is very hard to do. It's a huge bogeyman that has been incorrectly spread by internet fitness "experts". I't's not gonna happen to office jockeys going to the gym 3 to 4x per week.

However, I do agree to use a proven program and not just add frequency willy nilly. Most of the programs in the OP have you doing compounds frequently.
 
J

Jacksinthe

Banned
bchamba said:
I don't know of many programs where outside of deadlifts the compound movements are programmed for 1x week. Even when running 5/3/1 it's common to make your secondary movement on each day a variation of the opposite compound lift (so some kind of squat on your deadlift day, some kind of bench on your OHP day). Volume is the biggest factor in increasing both muscle size and strength.
Click to expand...
Variations are one thing. That's what I would call increasing volume. But needing to hit strict OHP more than once per week to progress? You can, but it's not needed.

entremet said:
Diet only goes so far if you have shit programming. And overtraining is very hard to do. It's a huge bogeyman that has been incorrectly spread by internet fitness "experts". I't's not gonna happen to office jockeys going to the gym 3 to 4x per week.

However, I do agree to use a proven program and not just add frequency willy nilly. Most of the programs in the OP have you doing compounds frequently.
Click to expand...
Who's talking about "internet experts"? The amount of cortisol your body releases under stress says overtraining is a very real thing. Going to the gym 3-4x per week is fine. Hitting the exact same exercise over and over isn't. Most office jockeys who mildly hit the gym will have a much longer recovery time if their bodies aren't used to the stresses brought on by exercise. Let's say you do 4 sets of 10 for OHP. Hitting it 3x per week will yield 120 reps excluding accessories, which you should be doing for a multitude of reasons outside of "beach muscles". Adding in 2 accessories for 4 sets each will bring that total number up waaaaaaaaay to high to make any legitimate repair before the next session. If you're hitting 10 sets max on any given muscle group I would say a second day is needed, but that's pretty low volume, IMO.

If all you're doing is OHP and nothing else for shoulder accessory, adding in more OHP would work. If your program uses plenty of accessories then you'd be overtraining like hell adding more because of a plateau.

Let's not forget you said pressing 1x per week won't do much. I whole heartedly disagree to the point of calling that broscience. There's a LOT more to increasing the amount you can move in exercise A by including exercises B and C. If you're lifting with a good program and eating properly, everything will be fall into place.
 
entremet

entremet

Member
Jacksinthe said:
Variations are one thing. That's what I would call increasing volume. But needing to hit strict OHP more than once per week to progress? You can, but it's not needed.


Who's talking about "internet experts"? The amount of cortisol your body releases under stress says overtraining is a very real thing. Going to the gym 3-4x per week is fine. Hitting the exact same exercise over and over isn't. Most office jockeys who mildly hit the gym will have a much longer recovery time if their bodies aren't used to the stresses brought on by exercise. Let's say you do 4 sets of 10 for OHP. Hitting it 3x per week will yield 120 reps excluding accessories, which you should be doing for a multitude of reasons outside of "beach muscles". Adding in 2 accessories for 4 sets each will bring that total number up waaaaaaaaay to high to make any legitimate repair before the next session. If you're hitting 10 sets max on any given muscle group I would say a second day is needed, but that's pretty low volume, IMO.

If all you're doing is OHP and nothing else for shoulder accessory, adding in more OHP would work. If your program uses plenty of accessories then you'd be overtraining like hell adding more because of a plateau.

Let's not forget you said pressing 1x per week won't do much. I whole heartedly disagree to the point of calling that broscience. There's a LOT more to increasing the amount you can move in exercise A by including exercises B and C. If you're lifting with a good program and eating properly, everything will be fall into place.
Click to expand...

In terms of plateau with compounds, pressing once a week is can be inefficient after you've passed your novice gains.

It's why specific programs like Smolov exist, which target a specific lifts and hit them with frequency. This is something the Soviet bloc knew decades ago and it's how most strength athletes still train today--high frequency.

Also, he's already training high frequency using a proven program. My guess the reason he's not progressing is his currently taxing medical school schedule and two week layoff.

High frequency training has also been proven by science too.

http://neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=172994404

I see you're talking about accessories too. That's another discussion. I'm pro accessory by the way, but it starts getting complicated since they're so varied. They're harder to study in terms of overtraining.

Also bringing up the hormonal axis is a bit too much honestly. Cortisol is needed for hypertrophy and strength. It's not totally bad. It exists for a reason. But I do think over focusing on hormones if you're healthy is a bit of majoring in the minors.

Also I'm enjoying this debate and I hope you're not taking it personally :)

I can be a bulldog in my tone, so my apologies if so. Not my intention.

I do mostly agree with you, but using m own experience with lagging lifts (Not scientific, I know), research, and looking at proven methods show that programming is very important in overcoming strength plateaus.

I also agree that most trainees do undereat, by a lot.
 
B

bchamba

Member
Jacksinthe said:
Let's say you do 4 sets of 10 for OHP. Hitting it 3x per week will yield 120 reps excluding accessories, which you should be doing for a multitude of reasons outside of "beach muscles". Adding in 2 accessories for 4 sets each will bring that total number up waaaaaaaaay to high to make any legitimate repair before the next session. If you're hitting 10 sets max on any given muscle group I would say a second day is needed, but that's pretty low volume, IMO.
Click to expand...

The delts/shoulders are smaller muscles which can recover faster than larger muscle groups. Even if they were larger muscle groups, any good program is going to contain some form of undulation so that you're not working at the same intensity or rep scheme each workout. With undulation it's common to have programs where people can squat 3-4x per week and be recovered enough for the next session.

My recommendation, if somebody is looking to increase their OHP, would be to add OHP a second day per week on the day where your main movement is the bench press. I would program this session to be the opposite of the previous OHP session, so that if last time I did low intenisty for high reps (60 - 75% of 1RM for sets of 8-12), I would do higher intensity and lower reps the second session (75 - 85% of 1RM for sets of 3-6). Then, I would proceed with whatever else I was going to do for my bench/chest day.
 
K

kris.

Banned
man, i lifted back in high school and was in pretty decent shape by the end of that class (315lb squat max, ~215lb bench) and then college happened and i stopped completely. i just started starting strength last night because i was able to get a semi-cheap gym membership and was struggling to get through my 3 squat sets at fucking 85. time is a bitch. really pumped to get this going though, i've missed lifting heavy things.
 
mdsfx

mdsfx

Member
kris. said:
man, i lifted back in high school and was in pretty decent shape by the end of that class (315lb squat max, ~215lb bench) and then college happened and i stopped completely. i just started starting strength last night because i was able to get a semi-cheap gym membership and was struggling to get through my 3 squat sets at fucking 85. time is a bitch. really pumped to get this going though, i've missed lifting heavy things.
Click to expand...

With your history i bet your numbers will go up fast. Stick with ti!
 
J

Jacksinthe

Banned
entremet said:
In terms of plateau with compounds, pressing once a week is can be inefficient after you've passed your novice gains.

It's why specific programs like Smolov exist, which target a specific lifts and hit them with frequency. This is something the Soviet bloc knew decades ago and it's how most strength athletes still train today--high frequency.

Also, he's already training high frequency using a proven program. My guess the reason he's not progressing is his currently taxing medical school schedule and two week layoff.

High frequency training has also been proven by science too.

http://neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=172994404

I see you're talking about accessories too. That's another discussion. I'm pro accessory by the way, but it starts getting complicated since they're so varied. They're harder to study in terms of overtraining.

Also bringing up the hormonal axis is a bit too much honestly. Cortisol is needed for hypertrophy and strength. It's not totally bad. It exists for a reason. But I do think over focusing on hormones if you're healthy is a bit of majoring in the minors.

Also I'm enjoying this debate and I hope you're not taking it personally :)

I can be a bulldog in my tone, so my apologies if so. Not my intention.

I do mostly agree with you, but using m own experience with lagging lifts (Not scientific, I know), research, and looking at proven methods show that programming is very important in overcoming strength plateaus.

I also agree that most trainees do undereat, by a lot.
Click to expand...
Oh we're fine dude :D This is just how I debate, too. If I get mad it'll usually start with "YOU MOTHERFUCKER" XD

I get where you are coming from but my entire fitness life has been from the lens of the microscope because I kinda have to be. That's why I mentioned cortisol during stress. Its needed, but like many other hormone, too much is no bueno.

All of my experiences are through the lens of someone who lives by a food scale and measuring cups. Not because I want to, but because I'm a T1 diabetic with Hashimotos and zero thyroid function. So just about everything I do is calculated from my food to my lifts (I do cheat from time to time, everyone does). I also don't follow a "program" designed by anyone. I know they work, I know some are excellent, but I made my own through trial and error and what's best for the shit I go thru. There's a lot I took in from other programs and a lot I figured out on my own.

I just dislike the notion that only doing any compound once per week is too little to progress because even with 2 jobs, very little sleep, health piled up against me - I still move forward like mad. I may not be a monster at 225-230 but I've come a long way the past 11 months and I place that on my methodology.

I'm also a programmer which means I have very little personality and I'm OCD.
 
entremet

entremet

Member
Jacksinthe said:
Oh we're fine dude :D This is just how I debate, too. If I get mad it'll usually start with "YOU MOTHERFUCKER" XD

I get where you are coming from but my entire fitness life has been from the lens of the microscope because I kinda have to be. That's why I mentioned cortisol during stress. Its needed, but like many other hormone, too much is no bueno.

All of my experiences are through the lens of someone who lives by a food scale and measuring cups. Not because I want to, but because I'm a T1 diabetic with Hashimotos and zero thyroid function. So just about everything I do is calculated from my food to my lifts (I do cheat from time to time, everyone does). I also don't follow a "program" designed by anyone. I know they work, I know some are excellent, but I made my own through trial and error and what's best for the shit I go thru. There's a lot I took in from other programs and a lot I figured out on my own.

I just dislike the notion that only doing any compound once per week is too little to progress because even with 2 jobs, very little sleep, health piled up against me - I still move forward like mad. I may not be a monster at 225-230 but I've come a long way the past 11 months and I place that on my methodology.

I'm also a programmer which means I have very little personality and I'm OCD.
Click to expand...

Your outlook and recommendations make sense given your background--specifically Type 1 Diabetes plus Hashimotos.

I wish you the best of luck with those conditions. Those could a pain to deal with. It's good that you're training, especially with weights.
 
M

Matugi

Member
Finally hit my double of 405 last week on deads, this week couldn't even move it off the ground. Even 335 felt heavy. Think that's a good sign that it's time to deload, been about 15 weeks
 
P

Psychotext

Member
Think I'm going to have to quit squats again for a while. This pain in my the upper outside of my shins / just below my knees has carried over to my cycling training, and I can't have that.

Noticed it when I pushed hard to start some intervals. Sigh.
 
P

Psychotext

Member
Unrelated to my injuries... one thing I'm pretty pleased about is that I'm about 15lbs heavier but I can still see my abs (don't get me wrong, I'm not ripped, but they're there).

Can't be too bad.
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
CherryWoodFuton said:
Jujimufu is his name I think. He has an IG at least
Click to expand...

Psychotext said:
He was on supertraining recently. He's a big ball of psychotic energy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfopcXzN48E
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBk-KNjM9BM
Click to expand...

Spiritreaver said:
Jujimifu is one of the few fitness guys on YT I follow. I do so purely for motivational purposes. The guy really enjoys himself, being fit, and taking his body to crazy levels. I totally admire that.
Click to expand...

Thanks! He's got a new fan in me.
 
B

BumRush

Member
Fitbros, I've done it... I've discovered the perfect omelette.

3 eggs
Black pepper
1 tbsp ranch dressing
As much hot sauce as you want

Stir until mixed well

Oil in the pan, medium high heat. When it gets hot (3-4 minutes):

Add egg mixture.

After a minute or two add grilled chicken and cheddar cheese

Take off stove when done

Let cool

Add avocado slices on top

Hnnnnng!
 
mdsfx

mdsfx

Member
Shit. I'm going to end up running this race regardless of my injury. I can feel it. The excitement for the race is building now that it's only a few days away. I'm going to convince myself that I'm fine somehow.

It's like I'm working against myself lol
#MULTIPLEPERSONALITIES
 
B

Brolic Gaoler

formerly Alienshogun
FallingEdge said:
Dope ty
Click to expand...


You're more than welcome.



mdsfx said:
Shit. I'm going to end up running this race regardless of my injury. I can feel it. The excitement for the race is building now that it's only a few days away. I'm going to convince myself that I'm fine somehow.

It's like I'm working against myself lol
#MULTIPLEPERSONALITIES
Click to expand...


The trick is to find a race a few months after and plan on that one. Get a new goal to fixate on.
 
mdsfx

mdsfx

Member
Brolic Gaoler said:
The trick is to find a race a few months after and plan on that one. Get a new goal to fixate on.
Click to expand...
I have a 10k race 3 weeks after :) I think my fixation on this one is that quite a few people from work run it. Im not sure why that makes it competitive for me. Impressing people at work is my last concern (or so I would think). It's also a really fun course through the city.

I'll try my best to not do something I might regret. I guess I really want a new 8k time. Your idea is a good one. I'll find another 8k to replace it sometime this year. There is a bit of a gap in my races after May...
 
F

FallingEdge

Member
monthly progress pic, not too much of a drastic change from the pic last month but little things here and there that I notice are popping out more. Hovering around 223-225.

BFt8aLQ.jpg
Click to expand...

Brolic Gaoler said:
You're more than welcome.
Click to expand...

yeah, I plan on hopping back on the strength train eventually, just want to go at it the best way possible
 
S

Sutton Dagger

Member
FallingEdge said:
monthly progress pic, not too much of a drastic change from the pic last month but little things here and there that I notice are popping out more. Hovering around 223-225.





yeah, I plan on hopping back on the strength train eventually, just want to go at it the best way possible
Click to expand...

Shit dude, looking big. The best is putting the most recent pics next to starting shots.
 
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