The premier league, or at least the top 4, is on the decline though, United winning the league or not. Has been since Ronaldo left, imo. So, relative to the other top European teams, United don't seem that good. (Crashing out of Europe last season obviously did you no favors) That's not really United's fault, but I'm sure if United win in Europe this season, all will be forgotten.
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Football Thread |OT14| Only Wilbury's belly is smoother than BAAAYEEERNs season
- Thread starter Blablurn
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Freewheelin'
Member
As much as I'm hoping Mourinho wins it with Real Madrid, I also think it would be great if Fergie won another CL against all the odds.
This is because Arsenal are not challenging isn't it?(((((((((
I'd say that's partly the reason. Out of the three biggest clubs in England, only United are in the top four whilst Liverpool and Arsenal are doing very poorly by their previous standards.
But think about the other top European teams. Madrid are having a terrible season by their standards in a two team league and everyone still thinks they're either second or third best in the world, and we just drew with them away. Juventus have lost more times than us this season in what's perceived to be a weaker league (debatable, I'd probably disagree but their coefficient is lower and teams like Milan/Inter have fallen lower than even the PL's top 4 have).
Who are you comparing us to when you say top teams? If you mean Barca/Bayern/Madrid then yeah we're not as good. But we're arguably better than everyone else.
Lololol
pulga
Banned
Ok, #2 experiment. Which gif looks better?
I won't tell which method I used in which gif.
First one, Frymar.
Both Milan's seem to be back in it, though, after a shaky start.
Today's demolition not counting :interlol
pulga
Banned
Why would you even say such a lie, you're all a bunch of insufferable cunts who started watching Barca during/post Ronaldinho
</3
Vivalaraza
Member
Telegraph - Arsenal to spend £70m this summer.
The PL is back!
The PL is back!
pulga
Banned
AC Milan is 3rd and Interlol is 5th. They're doing better than Arsenal and Liverpool, for starters.
AC is getting help from the refs and you can't compare their positions to other clubs in other leagues.
All generated through player sales.
This is because Arsenal are not challenging isn't it?
Well we keep making top 4, so clearly the league is declining with us
But yeah, we've been in steady freefall for some time now. Liverpool, Chelsea too. City would make up the difference, but they're managed by Mancini.
Well this team is basically the same one (plus RVP) that crashed out of Europe twice last season and were outplayed by Bilbao. So, there's that.
Top teams: Barca/Bayern/Madrid/Dortmund/Juve/PSG. If they were in the CL, I'd guess you'd have trouble with Atletico too. Bottom line is I just don't see United winning the CL this year. Compared to a decade of PL teams constantly challenging for the CL, that's a step down, and United is dragged down with it.
That's like 4.5 Girouds, Arsenal to win 2013/2014 confirmed.
pulga
Banned
Yes, you did you compared Milan's standing in the table to Arsenal and Liverpool in their table.
Freewheelin'
Member
I'm sure Liverpool would give you £30m for Walcott
Plz stop. You already hurt us by taking RVP
Plz stop. You already hurt us by taking RVP
Bebe and Macheda can go the other way to ease the burden.
Freewheelin'
Member
pulga
Banned
Pulga, I thought we were friends
You actually don't pop into my mind when I say 'barcacunts' :lol
Pulglol comparing Liverpool to a top 4 team
But it's also the same Dortmund team (plus Reus) that crashed out of the CL group stages bottom of their group. The same PSG team (plus a few cunts) that lost the title to Montpelier. It seems reductive to base it on one tie or even just European exploits. If we're doing that then Chelsea were the best in Europe last year.
I don't see us winning it either, but then I didn't see Chelsea last year. I would also heavily bet that the two finals we got to, one in which we won the league the same season, we were probably called a weak team then (sans Ronaldo for the first I suppose) yet were only stopped by arguably the best team that ever was.
PSG are unknown entities at this level and certainly haven't shown enough yet I think to be declared one of Europe's powerhouses. The rest you could certainly argue are better but - especially in the case of Juventus and Dortmund - I don't think there's as much a margin as its made out to be sometimes.
But it's also the same Dortmund team (plus Reus) that crashed out of the CL group stages bottom of their group. The same PSG team (plus a few cunts) that lost the title to Montpelier. It seems reductive to base it on one tie or even just European exploits. If we're doing that then Chelsea were the best in Europe last year.
I don't see us winning it either, but then I didn't see Chelsea last year. I would also heavily bet that the two finals we got to, one in which we won the league the same season, we were probably called a weak team then (sans Ronaldo for the first I suppose) yet were only stopped by arguably the best team that ever was.
PSG are unknown entities at this level and certainly haven't shown enough yet I think to be declared one of Europe's powerhouses. The rest you could certainly argue are better but - especially in the case of Juventus and Dortmund - I don't think there's as much a margin as its made out to be sometimes.
I don't know if I should believe you.
Who does come to mind? fady? That dude is a cunt.
fady, you are awesome
Let's be honest, even me, a pretty pessimistic person all around, that carries that burden to football as well, thinks Liverpool isn't far from a top 4 team. What do Liverpool need?
Consistency. First and foremost. How do you get that: by bringing better players or a better manager?
You tell me.
I wouldn't say the United defence is all that bad, we've had a lot of bad luck with injuries this year for it so it constantly changing week in week out hasn't helped, although it seems to have stabilised now and we're becoming more solid.
Both. Breaking into the top 4 doesn't just require consistency, it requires pushing one of the current top 4 out, which is no easy feat. Even if Arsenal crash out in the coming seasons, we'll just be replaced by Spurs.
This is a better united team than the one that won the league in 2011 IMO.We basically relied on individual moments of brilliance from Nani and Berbatov to win us the league. I know we reached the Champions League final that year but we really didn't perform all that well throughout the season. Scholes was on his last legs and Rio was always injured.
And we're certainly in better shape than last season. Remember we had to ask Scholes to come out of retirement because we were struggling in the winter months. And even then we crumbled and handed the title to City.
We're still dodgy in defence and our wingers are out of form but there is a drive in the team thats been missing for the last few years. The team has also benefited from the younger talent coming through. Cleverley and Evans have improved and can now be seen as first team regulars. Jones and Sampling have also made strides towards nailing down first team places.
And we're certainly in better shape than last season. Remember we had to ask Scholes to come out of retirement because we were struggling in the winter months. And even then we crumbled and handed the title to City.
We're still dodgy in defence and our wingers are out of form but there is a drive in the team thats been missing for the last few years. The team has also benefited from the younger talent coming through. Cleverley and Evans have improved and can now be seen as first team regulars. Jones and Sampling have also made strides towards nailing down first team places.
It's written in the stars. Bebe to return for the CL final.
:lol I was only being cheeky. Hard to say whether they'll be top 4 again consistently because of the strength of City and Spurs now, but the PL could become a league where 3rd-7th switches between 5 clubs every season. That would be quite exciting.
They play better football, or football I prefer to watch anyway; but teams tend to sit deeper against us than they do Dortmund. Tactically they're sound but they're obviously not used to balancing league and cup perfectly yet. Great team though.
Our defence has been chopped and changed all season. Jones, Smalling and Vidic out for long periods of time, Rio with long term problems. Not an excuse, but understandable I suppose that they have been leaking shit.
True, the same can be said for Dortmund (minus the stabilised part). Even De Gea and Weidenfeller a pretty similar.
Tbh I'd take ManU over Dortmund but I doubt many would trust my judgement me because I'm a Bayern fan. Dortmund hasnt been that great this season and lifes by it's teamspirit and luck. That's the reason I dont want Bayern to play them (because Dortmund knows / believes they can beat us and thus give us their absolute best), but seeing them getting trashed in the next round wouldnt surprise me in the slightest.
Yeah I can't believe how attacking most teams are playing against. You most certainly cant outrun / out work them. Dortmund is overhyped because of the group phase, it was a really group but we shouldn't forget that ManCity plays like absolute crap in the CL.
Spurs have a team that really suit their playing philosophy, and Arsenal have one of the best managers in the game. Liverpool are getting there on the first one, and need time for the second one to gain any traction.
I know a lot of the Pool lads trust B-Rod and that matters far more than my opinion, but even at this junction I'm not sure if he has the quality to be a top top tier manager. I know he's young still and I do think he should be given a chance (the next two years at least), but I just don't know if he's the one to take them in the next level.
Wilbury: we'll agree to disagree on United's current reputation. '09 they were favorites in that final, iirc, and '11 they had a pretty easy route to the final. If United beat the big teams this season (starting with finishing off Madrid), they'll get the credit they're due. If they crash out in the round of 16, then it'll just be more evidence that the PL is on the decline.
Well, Spurs and Arsenal's are clearly superior in that they've both beaten Liverpool this season I really don't rate much of the Liverpool first XI though. Suarez is obviously fantastic, but everyone else? Meh.
As for the defenders, maybe that is down to the managers. It's not like managers like Wenger or Pep, who pride themselves on possession football, are known for their defensive discipline.
Well, Spurs and Arsenal's are clearly superior in that they've both beaten Liverpool this season
I really don't rate much of the Liverpool first XI though. Suarez is obviously fantastic, but everyone else? Meh.As for the defenders, maybe that is down to the managers. It's not like managers like Wenger or Pep, who pride themselves on possession football, are known for their defensive discipline.
pulga
Banned
That's the bundesliga, you cunt.
But those other teams in the Bundesliga don't have as many awesome players as the EPL does.
Maybe switch "awesome" with "star player attraction".
That's the bundesliga, you cunt.
Haven't heard of it.
They played excellent defense against Madrid. I think United are strong contenders for the CL win this year.
Well, Spurs and Arsenal's are clearly superior in that they've both beaten Liverpool this season
As for the defenders, maybe that is down to the managers. It's not like managers like Wenger or Pep, who pride themselves on possession football, are known for their defensive discipline.
Suarez and Johnson would get into any team in the league I think when you compare them to respective positions - only Raf and Zab have been equal to Glen this season - , and Gerrard still has the propensity for some magic, but Spurs especially have a far stronger first team than Liverpool at the moment I think. Better keeper, better centre backs (on current form at least), better left back, better wingers, and at least equal midfield (if you include Sandro). Liverpool's strikers poop on Spurs' though.
Arsenal is a toughie; Wilshere, Arteta and Cazorla are stars but I can't think of a worse back five for you lot in all my time following football.
LanceVance
Member
Keit4 says hi
bubububu he supports Deportivo
luff u keit
The real nut jobs are Big Boss and Andres
:lol :lol I was just going to name these two.
Btw, I thought it was Andres that supports Deportivo?
Well I don't know, even your last point is debatable. Would going out to Real Madrid - who admittedly are getting an awful lot of flak for their league performances but are still heralded as Europe's second or third best team - really prove the PL is on the decline, or just that the leagues best team isn't as good as La Liga's second best, which is something we all probably think anyway?
I'd fancy our chances against anyone but Barca and Bayern at the moment; Dortmund and Juve, who personally I do think are better teams, can be beaten because even they don't come close to the strength of the two/three top teams on paper, as fantastic as they are.
I want us to wrap up the PL title as early as possible.
Hopefully City drop more points next week and United get past QPR. Then we can afford to rest the team before the Madrid match.
Liverpool players that would get into all teams besides Manchester sides:
Suarez
Johnson
Gerrard
Lucas (he's been reminiscent of his pre-injuries self lately)
Sturridge (let's be honest, he's fucking awesome. Just a little wasteful.)
And while players like Downing and Henderson aren't highly regarded, they are working very well as a team.
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