Complex Shadow
Cudi Lame
bruuuh. just finished watching second season of rectify. that show needs be watched by more people. its soo good.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
GAF-Hop |OTXI| Five Year Nation
- Thread starter Cheddahz
- Start date
- Status
Rastafarian42
Member
Just found out what group rip means today always waited for a 320 or a iTunes.
Vince Staples hates trap music and thinks it's a bunch of bullshit. He also hates features for the most part and the morning sunrise.
so where's that song?
so where's that song?
PhoenixDark
Banned
I agree with Vince on trap music, it almost never feels gritty or dark, which is surprising giving how bleak things are in Chicago. Listen to The Infamous and then listen to most trap rap, it's night and day.
Another interesting thing: the inability of most trap rap to paint vivid pictures or say anything interesting.
Another interesting thing: the inability of most trap rap to paint vivid pictures or say anything interesting.
Rastafarian42
Member
Im feeling what Vince is saying in that interview.
I was gonna argue this with Lil Herb's tape, but even that sounds lighthearted most of the time.
Blue Suede, which has some ridiculous lyrics, sounds darker than most of the trap music I've listened to, only because of the Bomb Squad vibe it has.
The Return of
Banned
Vince Staples needs to just shut up if he is going to release shit like this Blue Suede. Plenty of trap music is grittier than that. I mean listen to how basic that shit sounds. Herb definitely has plenty of tracks
Nah breh, that bass and eerie synth raises the hair on my skin, compared to the typical trap Fazoland beats.
Lil Herb on that Blue Suede production would be a perfect combo, only because he's got a better flow and mic presence than Staples.
The Return of
Banned
Sorry, I meant lyrics which I assume is what he is talking about as well
Don't agree with Vince at all, trap is pretty much a product of that environment, and that's not just the struggle. Life isn't all struggle struggle struggle, and the music is a direct product of trying to concentrate that energy into something positive but with a frame of reference full of negativity. It doesn't have to be preachy, or even reflective. Even if you just take it at face value, it's putting that abrasiveness out there for you to see and judge yourself. It portrays a side of a lifestyle, whether you like it or not, or want to supplement that with alternative perspectives or not. Caricatures, perhaps, but real ones and with real reference points..
All of his complaints could apply to NWA and what Pac did as well, even if you take away the introspective records they did, so yeah, I can't rock with that.
Also, general lol @ categorizing a subgenre of music characterized by gun shot drops, heavy bass, thumping, bombastic drums and generally dark sounds as "happy" music. I have no idea what this dude is listening to, but trap is not happy. It might bump, you might be able to dance/party to it, but happy? Nah fam. Dude makes too many disparate points.
All of his complaints could apply to NWA and what Pac did as well, even if you take away the introspective records they did, so yeah, I can't rock with that.
Also, general lol @ categorizing a subgenre of music characterized by gun shot drops, heavy bass, thumping, bombastic drums and generally dark sounds as "happy" music. I have no idea what this dude is listening to, but trap is not happy. It might bump, you might be able to dance/party to it, but happy? Nah fam. Dude makes too many disparate points.
Eh it's a single, if his whole EP is like that then I'll hate.
Listen to Shyne Goldchain Vol. 1. Great mixtape.
The Return of
Banned
It's not even about listening to a whole EP. Why would I or you have to do that? I'm judging a song from him just like how he comes off as he heard one trap tape and decided the whole sub genre is like that.
Vince staples hating on being in the studio is such a good reason. I remember him saying how much he hates being in the studio with Mac Miller and Ab Soul because they are always pushing for him to rap lol
for the most part i agree w/ him. but that's what i like about trap music. it's just so far removed from any grounding and realism.
i could totally see how you could listen to it and think it's a bunch of bullshit though.
in some ways i think that ties into the lack of good storytelling in trap music that got mentioned a few pages ago.
i could totally see how you could listen to it and think it's a bunch of bullshit though.
in some ways i think that ties into the lack of good storytelling in trap music that got mentioned a few pages ago.
True. I think his generalizations hold some weight regardless.
On the other hand, he seems to have a narrow minded view of what that kind of music should be like. As enzo said, just because the subject in hand can be dark doesn't mean it always should. It's almost all exaggerated anyway, so some of the goofy, lighthearted production suits it.
Rastafarian42
Member
I'd also say check out Stolen Youth and Shyne Coldtrain Vol.2 both good tapes.
thats a bad quote. Lots of drill music sounds more apathetic and numb rather than happy per se.
Stolen Youth is excellent, Shyne Coldchain was kinda ehhh for me.
PhoenixDark
Banned
Trap music is basically just a less melodic version of the shit Dipset and G Unit were doing: pop gangsta music.
Considering Vince released one of the top 5 best songs of the year I'll ride with him.
Considering Vince released one of the top 5 best songs of the year I'll ride with him.
Rastafarian42
Member
Nah. Its posts like these that aware me to your lack of southern rap sensibilities.
Shit might be influenced by some of the melodic sensibilities and hook writing of post 50 cent but Dipset? Nah, wrong. Shit is more like.... All the hopelessness of three six mafia combined with the thoughtless materialism of 00s hip hop combined with crunk music. Trap also draws very heavily from a lot of the ringtone rap that came out in the 00s, a lot of t-pain and akon type shit as well. Alladat, especially the latter, was mad popular in Atlanta, which i personally consider the home of trap. Guys like TI, Jeezy, and Gucci laid a blueprint that came from a lot of disparate sources. But trap rappers don't fuck with a lot of NY hip hop.
Oh and Wayne/ Cash Money in general of course.
PhoenixDark
Banned
I'm talking less about the regional sound differences and more about what connects it to G Unit and Dipset: try-hard thug shit, wack lyrics, no imagery or vision, all packaged in a sonically appealing package for suburbanites. Hell, right now the biggest difference is that they're dumb kids who don't actually know how to hustle anything and thus are missing out on various merch opportunities that Camron and 50 Cent capitalized on.
At least the south had some genuine energy and an interesting perspective at times.
tbh, production from no id on sc2 was pretty garbage.
shyne coldchain vol. 1 and winter in prague will always be my fav tapes from vince tbh
wot
i agree with what you said but don't get the comparison w/ three six mafia especially if you listened to their older shit.
That's specifically what I'm referring to. That early three six shit has a lot of the tone less vocals I hear from drill rappers in delivery, the godlessness, the darkness, the hedonism.
CountBlack
Member
Cudder/Biz/Enzo y'all gonna be at Fan expo tomorrow?
PhoenixDark
Banned
I think we're talking past each other. Nobody is going to deny 50 Cent sold drugs, got shot, did grimey shit, etc. Yet his music since his Interscope days has been gangsta pop shit. Dipset's entire image is based around being alleged street huslers who somehow rock immaculate clothing at all times yet are super gangsters impervious to anything. I'm not denying that Chief Keef...did crazy shit in Chicago; that's pretty clear. My problem is that his music, like most trap music, sounds like gangsta pop music to me. Hell, you could easily argue a lot of 2pac muisc is gangsta pop. And the problem with most mainstream pop, whether it's rap or not, is that it's simplistic, boring, safe, etc. That's my view of the vast majority of trap music, sue me. Especially in 2014, it's played out.
You would think that living in Chicago in 2014 would birth some pretty dark, scary shit. Like, DMX type shit: energetic at times, completely gutter at other times. But I listen to this shit and it's basically just mantras and anthems with absolutely no variety.
That's just my opinion. I recognize a lot of people here still like trap music. Good for you. What I hear is an absence of lyrics, repetitive production, no vision or imagery, no musical curiosity/IQ (how many of these dudes have listened to a non-rap album in their life), etc. I fuck with some trap songs, everyone knows I love Love Sosa, etc. But overall this is one of the worst rap "movements" since the shiny suit era.
CountBlack
Member
Personally that Chiraq beat is some chilling shit.
I can imagine just driving down a Chiraqian road and just hearing that Chiraq beat playing but not coming from my car.. next thing you know you naked in ya socks for stopping at a stop sign smh
I can imagine just driving down a Chiraqian road and just hearing that Chiraq beat playing but not coming from my car.. next thing you know you naked in ya socks for stopping at a stop sign smh
Pickles the Firecat
Banned
= expressing emotion in hip hop is not limited to lyricism. You can create imagery and have vision without any emphasis on lyrics, which good trap and good drill do. Even without the meta-narrative of Chiraq and inner city hopelessness. The aggression, bluntness, materialism, and carelessness of these records creates landscapes you should be able to view in your mind. I know damn well Migos paints a picture in my head. I know damn well Gucci puts an image in my head. I know damn well Keef puts an image in my head. A dark ass, murderous world where dudes bust guns over simple shit and celebrate taking life and creating addicts. That's powerful in and of itself.
Shit even the contrast between bombastic "fun" (how is trap fun?) production and upbeat narratives tied to descriptions of blown out hellscape neighborhoods speaks to the world these artists live in. The world they're relating to you. What it is to be a young dude in a fucked up world, trying to live as young dudes have throughout all of time, knowing at any moment life or death scenarios could drop on you. That's powerful. That's interesting. That's perspective. And you don't need Nas literally walking you through the logistics of it all to understand it.
And that shit bangs, too.
PhoenixDark
Banned
Nah, I'm just not hearing it. Vapid materialism and trigger thin tempers sure, I can tell. But I don't hear anything that gives me pause from a damn Migos record. Or at least, not a pause beyond the "these kids are stupid" view that I get from a Nicki Minaj song as well.
IrishNinja
Member
see i don't know if i'm subbing to PD's old man take on the absence of that shit or reading Pickles' post & just realizing that even if i could, i'm not really so much looking for that vision anyway...but yeah, happy for those here into trap that there's so much on the table for ya'll, but whereas TM101 type shit was at least on that grind/interesting motivation and shit, i don't really get anything off migos & such, and i'm willing to accept that i might simply not be open to it. not everything's gotta cater to my weird tastes.
IrishNinja
Member
see i think that's oversimplification, cause personally i can enjoy some mindless shit too...not everything needs to be a rapper telling a story backwards or whatever
it just so happens most trap i fuck with sounds kinda samey and with few exceptions, even the production doesn't really interest me enough to revisit it. i think it's kinda shit that a false dichotomy is lingering here, like i gotta be on some high brow REAL HIP HOP shit to say the sub-genre of trap just isn't for me, when that applies to other sub-genres as well
some ol equivocation up in here
it just so happens most trap i fuck with sounds kinda samey and with few exceptions, even the production doesn't really interest me enough to revisit it. i think it's kinda shit that a false dichotomy is lingering here, like i gotta be on some high brow REAL HIP HOP shit to say the sub-genre of trap just isn't for me, when that applies to other sub-genres as well
some ol equivocation up in here
Pickles the Firecat
Banned
"These kids are stupid" is the narrative. Their lack of self awareness is the narrative. The brokenness of their communities is the narrative. The connections between violence and partying and addicts and money and family and how they live in a world where all this shit is intertwined is the narrative.
Gucci is a fucking murderer. Straight up a murderer. So when he jumps on a track and says he will kill someone that is powerful. When Keef says it over a 'happy' (really, wtf?) beat it is super powerful. That is the frame of mind these places are breeding. Murder is some trivial shit. Let's catch this nigga, get high, and bounce to the club. How is that not engaging on an intellectual level? How is that not creating an atmosphere, a visual space, transferring emotion? Trap/drill communicates the vibe of a specific time and place extremely well and I think it will help describe this era in America well in the future.
It's all arbitrary beeps and boops and bangs anyway breh, dig what you dig.
PhoenixDark
Banned
breh I love Love Sosa, I Don't Like is dope...but I'm still trying to find a single second of Young Thug I can listen to and say "ah, ok I may not like it but I get why people fuck with this." Trap has reached parody point to me.
we'll have to agree to disagree, I just think this shit is wack juice of the highest level. That No Flex Zone song blew my fucking mind, and not in a good way.
guess I need to go compare Timberland boots and army fatigues with Count.
Tokubetsu
Member
traptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptrap
traptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptrap
traptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptrap
traptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptrap
traptraptraptraptraptraptraptrap
traptraptraptraptraptraptraptrap
traptrap
traptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptrap
traptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptrap
traptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptraptrap
traptraptraptraptraptraptraptrap
traptraptraptraptraptraptraptrap
traptrap
CountBlack
Member
90's East Coast or 90's West Coast?
Come on bruv
You just mostly like long winded talky and numbery shit. You exclusively play stat tracking loot RPGs that are multifactorial point and skill buckets. You mostly like the dialoguiest of tv shows. You like thick plots and lots of overewrought intrigue and pages spent describing shit in books when a handful of sentences would do. To you, it's not really worth it if it's simple, raw, marked by brevity. You prefer music with vocals, and spend a lot of time on lyrics. But rarely does feeling factor into it.
If we were in medieval europe, you'd be the abbot of a monastery my friend. Poring over vellum tomes, nahmean?
IrishNinja
Member
...no one told me we'd be pullin cards tonight
PhoenixDark
Banned
Tokubetsu
Member
That's just your taste and style man. I noticed that you like complex things verbally but inconsistently, maybe straight up rarely bite on more abstract or layered music. The dualities. Who knows though. Maybe you'll bump Sun-Ra and Reger in 2015. I see you've been listening to Aphex recently.
- Status