Dynamite Shikoku
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GAF Indie Game Development Thread 2: High Res Work for Low Res Pay
- Thread starter Jacksinthe
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That site doesn't load properly on my iPad
ugh.... yep.. mobile issues for sure. Well so much for being done for the day. thx
fixed I think
Jacksinthe
Banned
No direct help but I can tell you I get inspiration for some of my non pew pew game elements by creating math riddles. Its a weird source of inspiration but so are my other knick-knacks laying around.
Have you ever played Trine or Trine 2? I think they have some non-killing puzzles you might get inspired by.
Also, Aquaria is a cute sidescrolling exploration game presumably inspired by Super Metroid, but I don't know if puzzles feature heavily in it.
Do you have something like an inventory? because maybe finding objects that can interact with others could be something nice (ex.: a fuel cell dropped by an enemy could power up some old alien device, the reward for that is up to you).
I don't know much about your game but in Dust you could free other indie characters and see them in a manor. Maybe you could have something like a base to return where you can gather trophies, rescued characters or something.
Don't worry, I won't sue you if you take any of these ideas, scout's honour
(I never went to the scouts)
For me what usually ends up happening is I start drawing shapes or other random objects. The layer or abstraction helps me think of types of interactions between objects without constantly resorting to "point at thing, shoot thing, thing dies"
liliththepale
Banned
Repurpose the attacks and platforming. Make crystals that ring out at a certain frequency when struck, and shooting them in the right order triggers a cave in or other significant event. Pressure plates that have to be stepped on in the right order based off markings on the wall. A large patch of eggs that have to be cracked open in pairs like a memory matching game. Perform ashiatsu on a giant creature by "massaging" different parts of its back. Stuff like that.
Uncle Rupee
Banned
Spent some time on this today, trying to see where I can save money doing stuff myself:
I still have a bunch of work I have to do with it, but anyone with an artistic bent have any tips/feedback? Anything unacceptable going on here?
Hm.. other than the fact it looks like you may be using Fire Emblem GBA as a basis for your sprite...
TheHollowNight
Member
Freja's animations are ready!
I'll be having a big media blowout tomorrow for the folks who've not been following our little updates on Twitter, plus we should have a new devblog up this weekend some time!
I'll be having a big media blowout tomorrow for the folks who've not been following our little updates on Twitter, plus we should have a new devblog up this weekend some time!
I feel kind of bad for staying away from this thread for so long... If there's something I still haven't nailed down, it's coming up with a routine and sticking to it. I really should catch-up on what you guys have been up to.
What prompted me to come back is the fact that I've finally compe up with a project with a manageable scope (it was about time, I'd say). If things go the way I've planned, it should take me two to three more weeks to wrap things up and have the first version ready for release.
The project I've been working on for the past month and a half is a set of tools oriented towards handling anything that'd be needed to make a visual novel in Unity (or just using it a dialog system for other kinds of games). I intended to make it for personal use at first, but once I realized how visual novels had begun to shop up in Steam, I decided to make a set of tools good enough to release in Unity's asset store for anyone that might be interested in it.
Here's a very short video that shows the end result of some of the basic features I've been working on: http://youtu.be/WPZjUt1J4cs
Besides what is shown in the video, the toolset includes a script editor, managers for graphics, text and audio and a modular system of text tags that is used to interface with the managers (ie: {\setGraphic:MySprite|0} loads the sprite "MySprite" onto graphics layer #0). On top of all that, my goal is to make it as user-friendly as possible, so that people who might not be interested in writing the tag commands by hand can have the script editor type those in for them.
What prompted me to come back is the fact that I've finally compe up with a project with a manageable scope (it was about time, I'd say). If things go the way I've planned, it should take me two to three more weeks to wrap things up and have the first version ready for release.
The project I've been working on for the past month and a half is a set of tools oriented towards handling anything that'd be needed to make a visual novel in Unity (or just using it a dialog system for other kinds of games). I intended to make it for personal use at first, but once I realized how visual novels had begun to shop up in Steam, I decided to make a set of tools good enough to release in Unity's asset store for anyone that might be interested in it.
Here's a very short video that shows the end result of some of the basic features I've been working on: http://youtu.be/WPZjUt1J4cs
Besides what is shown in the video, the toolset includes a script editor, managers for graphics, text and audio and a modular system of text tags that is used to interface with the managers (ie: {\setGraphic:MySprite|0} loads the sprite "MySprite" onto graphics layer #0). On top of all that, my goal is to make it as user-friendly as possible, so that people who might not be interested in writing the tag commands by hand can have the script editor type those in for them.
Is there a sprite in particular that you're talking about?
I actually hired an artist for the base sprite, pictured left here:
I edited the helmet to the one on the right and went with it based on some feedback. The animation is absolutely 100% my own. I didn't use any FE reference for it. I just figured out the magic of Graphicsgale the other day and have been making use of it.
Or do you just mean stylistically? That isn't entirely unintentional.
So this might actually be.. an unintentional compliment?
It looks really good. And yeah, I agree. Website stuff is interesting the first go around when you're picking it up, but after that it's just a headache. I'm the type of person that spends way, way, way too much time on the smallest design either-or.
First thing that jumps to mind is mini-time trials. Ever play Valdis Story: Abyssal City? It had instances where you had to hit something, I think it was a crystal, then make it to a certain point within a very precisely-timed period. I dunno if it would work in Ghost Song though. VS had a reward/advancement structure that was conducive to that sort of thing, I don't think GS works in the same way from what I've seen.
Why is that unacceptable?
My opinion is that it would depend whether an artist literally started with copyrighted art (e.g. a FE sprite) and edited/traced it, which might be illegal or something, or whether they looked at it for inspiration but did their new art from scratch themselves.
NipplesAndToes23
Member
Does anyone need any help with writing?
Honestly, on one hand, dude should be scared of everything he ever does because it's just going to be measured against Minecraft.
On the other hand, he should give zero effs, for obvious reasons.
I would hope that he would opt for the latter, but I guess I can see how public perception becomes tangible at that degree of success.
just a few ideas - for a Metroidvania game, you could for example make an area where the player has control over the water level or temperature (freezing), an area that fills up with lethal gas (or the temperature is quickly rising) and the player must rush from vent to vent (or terminal or whatever) before it reaches critical levels, make the player indirectly control a moving object (a robot for example) to clear a path from debris or hazards, have them reconnect the power connection to several areas via a complex power grid puzzle, logic puzzles that require some thinking from the player (bomb timer is optional, heh), physics-based puzzles are always fun if the engine supports it, time-sensitive puzzles that require you to be at a certain location at the right time (in intervals), a rail or elevator system that connects various areas and is required to move objects around, also riddles!
the Trine games, LostWinds games and The Cave could offer some inspiration for 2D platformer puzzles
it's not but some people will notice and if the similarities are too obvious (like, if the sprites are almost identical) it cheapens your game somewhat. Midora had this problem in the beginning with many art assets looking very similar to Minish Cap
I guess you could try tying puzzles to the genre: Rather than having (just) self-contained ones that are obvious, players could find a strange plant that glows when you shoot it or something, and then begin finding more of them later with different colors, showing a pattern and making them finally get that they might be more than just one-shot decorations. After this set-up, you could then unveil what they were supposed to be the keys for: maybe there are some special doors that only open when the combined colors of each plant which is "turned on" results in the corresponding door color (say, red and blue plants being left emitting light could activate some purple objects).
I feel like that kind of organic puzzles fit a sense of exploration more, but then there's the double-edged sword of making a puzzle that some players might end up missing altogether, so it's up to you to decide how to handle things. Maybe you could find a way to give them hints if they skip over too many things, or you could limit what you're gating to avoid having them miss too many important things (however, only gating easter eggs or simple collectibles might be too small a reward for players who decide to take your challenge and crack every gate).
hobblygobbly
Member
Notch should get a pseudonym/pen name much like music artists and writers do. Keep it mysterious for a while (or indefinitely?), work on some ideas, release it publicly for free like a prototype/demo, see reception, etc.
That's what I would do. Music artists/writers use it to differentiate from their other known work especially when they are experimenting and whatnot to avoid that attention of comparisons and stuff.
I wonder how difficult it would be to keep that under wraps.
When he had ideas about 0x10c and started making it, it was such an early prototype that almost every site picked it up because the Minecraft-creator was making a new game and so on, it spawned a huge community that was doing things with the DCPU computer and writing software/emulators for it since Notch released the specs, it was great but the amount of attention it was getting was maybe too much pressure and expectation for him to handle when it was nothing else but an early prototype. He became quieter and quieter about it until he announced he's put it on hold. Was kind of bummed myself because I loved doing stuff with the DCPU spec and the community that surrounded it.
MrNyarlathotep
Banned
Out of interest, have you looked at / were you aware of Fungus?
Just to save you re-inventing the wheel.
EDIT:
In addition to the suggestions above, some more generic advice on fleshing out existing mechanics into additional activities;
- Break down your game into verbs of player actions; eg move, jump, shoot, explore. Think of things relating to those verbs that you have seen elsewhere (not even in videogames - for example, with the verb 'jump' you can recreate this famous scene from Big with a fixed environmental prop.
- Think of non-standard inputs, and how you can apply numeric or logic puzzles to them; if you have a "counting platform" for example where you jump a certain number of times to enter a number, you open up all sorts of possibilities for 'solving' puzzles. You can even combine this with other inputs to offer 'codebreaking' solutions; the famous Konami code (as well as unlocking GAF Gold) was a solution to not having a keyboard to enter cheatstrings into.
- Recreate famous or well tested logic puzzles within a game environment; for example, the famous chicken / fox / boat puzzle can be directly placed into any game where you have NPCs that can attack other NPCs and player pickups, or the 'fill a jug with a specific amount of water with only two other jugs that don't have that amount' puzzle.
EDIT2:
I've literally used both the chicken/fox/grain puzzle and the "make a jug with this much water in" directly in game content before, and they were both well received by players.
Woah... I made sure to check the Unity Asset Store but all I found was a single asset package, so I thought that was all there was. It's a bit disheartening to see someone has already been there, but thanks a lot for letting me know! I still don't think I'll be dropping the project since it's nearly ready for release, but I definitely will have to take a look at Fungus for reference to see if I can do anything that can let my tools stand out.
MrNyarlathotep
Banned
Don't be too disheartened, a lot of Open Source projects are incompatible with the Asset Store licencing requirements, so there's clearly room for both to co-exist - as you just discovered a lot of people don't look beyond the asset store, so having clean room implementation of code that is asset store permissable could well work in your favour, particularly if you want to monetise your asset.
Jacksinthe
Banned
1 incredibly small paragraph and a link to your website press kit. Many journos will simply delete your email if it contains anything more without reading it.
At least I'm assuming it was more than a simple paragraph with the mention of embedding.
Make 1 small but explosive paragraph and that's it and include only 1 link.
Sounds counter productive to tell as little as possible about your game but that's the point. You need to convey the hook as quickly as possible. If they want to know more they can follow your press-friendly link.
plagiarize
Banned
Super excited to see how Primitive looks on my Shield tablet now that UE4 engine specifically supports its high end innards... Any minute now...
It'd be super lovely even if this just smoothes out the performance issues I'd been having on later more complex levels.
Thanks for the input.
I've made a few changes. Added another finger and changed the fingernail a bit.
I'm also documenting the engine. This task will take a while because Poke as become a very big project. I have yet to review all the english writing...
You can check the wiki here
Poke Wiki
And the API reference here:
Poke API reference
Expand PK. Only the classes that have a description are documented.
Me, too.
Did lots of 3D graphics programming.
Want do use the DCPU in another game of mine.
This advice is spot on. Game press are FLOODED with emails trying to get them to cover indie games. If you can't grab them in 1-3 sentences and and good link, then into the trash the email goes
---
StarDiver stickers for the GDC sticker swap:
And a Human battle platform:
I've missed your posts w/ all the awesome oldschool graphics tech emulation. How have you been?
Jacksinthe
Banned
That sticker would look ace on my laptop (wink wink, nudge nudge)This advice is spot on. Game press are FLOODED with emails trying to get them to cover indie games. If you can't grab them in 1-3 sentences and and good link, then into the trash the email goes
---
StarDiver stickers for the GDC sticker swap:
And a Human battle platform:
4 (top row) is my personal favorite (with the bottom row trousers). 5 looks like a jester, 2 is a bit too similar to the typical 'witch' outfit. Some nice design though
I agree with 4. I really like 5 though. Enough to make another class.
It's all coming back. Big time!
I work hard on many subjects some of which require me to go full circle.
Keep going on StarDiver! Looks like a game! :+
Chaotic Kitten
Member
Friken, those stickers are really cool! Every few minutes I find another reason to feel bummed about choosing to go to PAX and SXSW, and skip GDC :/
to add to the press email tips, I always try to make the subject line of the email short but catching and relevant, and I try not to make them impersonal. It is nutso time consuming the first time, so I only do it with the bigger sites, and the journalists that I really like. If you keep track of the list, it gets easier over time.
Also, based on what I've heard/seen often 20-50% of your emails never even get opened.
to add to the press email tips, I always try to make the subject line of the email short but catching and relevant, and I try not to make them impersonal. It is nutso time consuming the first time, so I only do it with the bigger sites, and the journalists that I really like. If you keep track of the list, it gets easier over time.
Also, based on what I've heard/seen often 20-50% of your emails never even get opened.
legacyzero
Banned
Knowing what I know about your game, which is a moderate amount.. I could see the puzzles being subtle. Not obvious. Possibly not even required. Like a world-secret that, once you've fulfilled the criteria, opens up to a secret section of the world, or a secret weapon or power-up.
Don't even tell your customers/players/community that it's there. Let folks find out for themselves. Kinda like the Megladon from BF4.
Does that make sense?
mantrakid
Member
This is what I was sending out to press at PAX and got a very good response -- many people including some higher profile actually said it was one of the best PR emails they ever got... Because of that, I share here.
I didnt mailing list these, I sent each one out by hand (almost 300!!!) via Mac Mail. Because of this, i made up a nickname for every person I was addressing.
---
John "Rattlesnake" Doe,
(Im making nicknames for press. Hope you enjoy.. it’s not legally binding.)
If you have a minute and don’t want to read another shitty press email (i get it), you can click this youtube link and I’ll beatbox and sing a song to you instead: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I7DRb8NS1kY
Quick Bit: Im almost done my game COSMOCHORIA. It’s stellar. I’m showing it off in the Indie Megabooth at PAX East in 1 week! I would LOVE to meet you and show you in person just how awesome it is. It has a little naked cartoon spaceman in it. His cartoon nipples are vacuum cold.
Let me know if you have time to swing by the Megabooth!!
Info @ http://www.cosmochoria.com/indiemegabooth
Hugs & Respectoids,
Nate Schmold
I didnt mailing list these, I sent each one out by hand (almost 300!!!) via Mac Mail. Because of this, i made up a nickname for every person I was addressing.
---
John "Rattlesnake" Doe,
(Im making nicknames for press. Hope you enjoy.. it’s not legally binding.)
If you have a minute and don’t want to read another shitty press email (i get it), you can click this youtube link and I’ll beatbox and sing a song to you instead: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I7DRb8NS1kY
Quick Bit: Im almost done my game COSMOCHORIA. It’s stellar. I’m showing it off in the Indie Megabooth at PAX East in 1 week! I would LOVE to meet you and show you in person just how awesome it is. It has a little naked cartoon spaceman in it. His cartoon nipples are vacuum cold.
Let me know if you have time to swing by the Megabooth!!
Info @ http://www.cosmochoria.com/indiemegabooth
Hugs & Respectoids,
Nate Schmold
This is what I was sending out to press at PAX and got a very good response -- many people including some higher profile actually said it was one of the best PR emails they ever got... Because of that, I share here.
I didnt mailing list these, I sent each one out by hand (almost 300!!!) via Mac Mail. Because of this, i made up a nickname for every person I was addressing.
---
John "Rattlesnake" Doe,
(Im making nicknames for press. Hope you enjoy.. its not legally binding.)
If you have a minute and dont want to read another shitty press email (i get it), you can click this youtube link and Ill beatbox and sing a song to you instead: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I7DRb8NS1kY
Quick Bit: Im almost done my game COSMOCHORIA. Its stellar. Im showing it off in the Indie Megabooth at PAX East in 1 week! I would LOVE to meet you and show you in person just how awesome it is. It has a little naked cartoon spaceman in it. His cartoon nipples are vacuum cold.
Let me know if you have time to swing by the Megabooth!!
Info @ http://www.cosmochoria.com/indiemegabooth
Hugs & Respectoids,
Nate Schmold
That's a good template to branch off of, thanks. I tend to have the habit of writing out every little thing and proof reading over and over (as probably shown by this post itself).
Question, though; at what point is it keeping things professional and at what point is it going a bit overboard in the "quirky dude!" stuff? I've always felt a bit weird trying to be all buddy-buddy with the cards I swapped with, but I always feel like I'm being too formal.
Michael Armbrust
Member
Since we are asking for suggestions, please I need some ideas for the name of the main enemy of my game: they are basically a fleet of ships controlled by a super advanced AI that resides in a planet sized computer (something like a Matrioshka Brain). They don't engage in diplomacy or trading or politics, they only gather to hunt Mankind for mysterious reasons.
This is how most of their ships look (like some sort of biomechanical creature):
The placeholder name I have is "Great Enemy" since Mankind has some kind of religious fear of them but it sounds lame. The idea is that this is the name that humans and other races give them since they don't introduce themselves (like the Reapers of Mass Effect).
This is how most of their ships look (like some sort of biomechanical creature):
The placeholder name I have is "Great Enemy" since Mankind has some kind of religious fear of them but it sounds lame. The idea is that this is the name that humans and other races give them since they don't introduce themselves (like the Reapers of Mass Effect).
Having a playable demo would be a boon. Most send screenshots and trailers, very few send demos. The other advice here is great too.
This sounds like you'd just have to write "x meets x", I don't like how this is a trend (although it seems to be dying out a bit which is good, but often I saw indie devs trying to lure people just by writing something like "Zelda meets Peggle" or whatever, is that still what hooks people when advertising or has something else taken the top spot these days?
MrNyarlathotep
Banned
Run with that theme, have them described solely by their actions as best people understand them. Pick descriptors that can sound sinister when applied to sentient life.
eg
- collectors
- harvesters
- destroyers
- devourers
Thanks for your suggestions. Yeah, I want to follow that theme, it seems the best adjectives are taken though
Cheesy suggestions since they don't talk:
Mutes
Silents
Unspoken
...or just hit up the thesaurus
http://www.thesaurus.com/browse/mute?s=t
http://www.thesaurus.com/browse/Hunter?s=t
Jacksinthe
Banned
X meets x isnt a small paragraph so no.
Pick up a book, read the back cover. There you go. Explain your game in as few words as possible as explosively as possible.
X meets x is definitely not telling me anything about your game. Keep the intro short and sweet and post a link to your press info. That's it. No embeds, no attachments, etc.
I didn't knew that website, I'll check it out, thanks.
The greatest mystery of all when making an indie game is how to get the press to respond to emails, thus far I have failed miserably at this.
Some stuff did improve my chances though like keeping emails very brief and focused, 1 paragraph that covers who you are what the game is and why the game is actually amazing (preferably with an angle the person you're emailing can run with, as opposed to it just being 'really really good' which has often been my problem).
Then provide them with resources they need, a video link to see the game for themselves (YouTube is best), a link to a presskit or asset pack where they can find additional information and artwork for an article/video, and if possible a preview key (this is especially important for YouTubers, do not bother emailing them with 'hey if you'd like a key hit me back' as it wastes everyone's time).
If you can work something personal about their site or that person and why you specifically emailed them about your game that's a bonus and well worth doing, I sort of doubt you're picking people or sites at random so getting that across to the person you're emailing can be important.
Good luck! I kind of wish giving them an angle wasn't so important when contacting the press but the world is what it is.
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