Null / increased chance of being scum. Close to top three meanies but it is rather hard to put people like LP / Kalor / nin / acohrs / TWE / someone else? in order so the exact position is hard to say.
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Gafia 3 [Mafia] | Welcome to Lynchwood Acres
- Thread starter Ourobolus
- Start date
Null / increased chance of being scum. Close to top three meanies but it is rather hard to put people like LP / Kalor / nin / acohrs / TWE / someone else? in order so the exact position is hard to say.
Sorry, forgot it was lynch day, disorganised thoughts:
Gorlak - I see your statement that there was no bandwagon collapse on swamped. I know the vote count by itself supports that, but reading the thread at the time I was in no doubt that a swamped lynch was an option, and a likely one at that. I would even point to CCS' vote for swamped as the exact moment that the bandwagon collapsed. It was such an odd vote that it at least put me off from joining it and it looked like Sorian was perturbed by it as well (although he didn't mention it when I questioned him on it today).
Regarding Verelios: my read of him was mostly tied to swamped, and I feel the case against her is stronger. Most of the argument against Verelios himself seems to be "under the radar" etc which is true but a bit wishy washy for the amount of certainty it's being presented with (and accepted). I'm not against his lynch, but I still prefer swamped today.
Crab - that last outburst looked pretty fake, don't really see where the frustration came from this time. I'm also concerned about how you're moving the lynch away from swamped after pushing her so strongly before. Yes I see your vote/NK analysis but I didnt follow how it turned you so far against a swamped lynch. My concern comes from the fact that several people (myself included) have aired the feeling that one of you/swamped is scum - if this is true (with you as scum) it would explain the push towards a seperate target.
The current Kyan/Vere argument is telling me nothing btw. The amount of sarcasm on both sides feels pretty much NAI, maybe slight suggestion of town-town.
Burb points out that swamped using a commuter shot last night doesn't really make sense - I'm inclined to agree.
Swamped you lamented that there is no real case against you. Please:
-Your initial reaction to Crab's vote ("I had a feeling it would be me") smacks of a guilty conscience.
-You scumread him super hard in response to him voting you, saying he only did it because you voted him. I went back and found your initial vote and there's no reasoning attached, in fact it's a blank post. I seem to remember you claimed it was "for reactions" but I didn't get far enough through the thread to find if you ever explained it more than that before Crab voted you. In any case it doesn't seem to have been a particularly "hard" vote so I don't buy the story that Crab would vote for you because he feels threatened by it.
-Stuff with Verelios although I've somewhat changed my mind on this point.
-General impression shared by several that you are "under the radar", "flyby reads", etc.
-The vote yesterday, I'm sure it was avoiding someone, be it you, Crab or possibly Bronx. This is probably the most important point, the others push you ahead of crab/Bronx.
Someone already said it (Burb again?) but that acohrs post where he town reads our top 5 suspects was bad, bad, bad. If it turned out to be true I would have to assume acohrs is scum.
Gorlak - I see your statement that there was no bandwagon collapse on swamped. I know the vote count by itself supports that, but reading the thread at the time I was in no doubt that a swamped lynch was an option, and a likely one at that. I would even point to CCS' vote for swamped as the exact moment that the bandwagon collapsed. It was such an odd vote that it at least put me off from joining it and it looked like Sorian was perturbed by it as well (although he didn't mention it when I questioned him on it today).
Regarding Verelios: my read of him was mostly tied to swamped, and I feel the case against her is stronger. Most of the argument against Verelios himself seems to be "under the radar" etc which is true but a bit wishy washy for the amount of certainty it's being presented with (and accepted). I'm not against his lynch, but I still prefer swamped today.
Crab - that last outburst looked pretty fake, don't really see where the frustration came from this time. I'm also concerned about how you're moving the lynch away from swamped after pushing her so strongly before. Yes I see your vote/NK analysis but I didnt follow how it turned you so far against a swamped lynch. My concern comes from the fact that several people (myself included) have aired the feeling that one of you/swamped is scum - if this is true (with you as scum) it would explain the push towards a seperate target.
The current Kyan/Vere argument is telling me nothing btw. The amount of sarcasm on both sides feels pretty much NAI, maybe slight suggestion of town-town.
Burb points out that swamped using a commuter shot last night doesn't really make sense - I'm inclined to agree.
Swamped you lamented that there is no real case against you. Please:
-Your initial reaction to Crab's vote ("I had a feeling it would be me") smacks of a guilty conscience.
-You scumread him super hard in response to him voting you, saying he only did it because you voted him. I went back and found your initial vote and there's no reasoning attached, in fact it's a blank post. I seem to remember you claimed it was "for reactions" but I didn't get far enough through the thread to find if you ever explained it more than that before Crab voted you. In any case it doesn't seem to have been a particularly "hard" vote so I don't buy the story that Crab would vote for you because he feels threatened by it.
-Stuff with Verelios although I've somewhat changed my mind on this point.
-General impression shared by several that you are "under the radar", "flyby reads", etc.
-The vote yesterday, I'm sure it was avoiding someone, be it you, Crab or possibly Bronx. This is probably the most important point, the others push you ahead of crab/Bronx.
Someone already said it (Burb again?) but that acohrs post where he town reads our top 5 suspects was bad, bad, bad. If it turned out to be true I would have to assume acohrs is scum.
I have the same feelings as my previous readlist, closer to null now though.
YesNOnoNOYes
Member
DAY 2 CURRENT VOTE TALLY:
Crab (9)
Bronx-Man 1452
Swamped 1454
nin1000 1467 1597
Faddy 1519
CCS 1520 1796
Blargonaut 2007
nin1000 2010
TheWorthyEdge 2035
Verelios 2036
Gorlak 2081
Crab 2090
CCS (3)
WhereAreMahDragonz 1811
StanleyPalmtree 1913
Lone_Prodigy 2110
Verelios (2)
CCS 1799 1851
Crab 1991 2090
Kyanrute 2005
CCS 2028
Burbeting (2)
Lone_Prodigy 1867 2042
Kalor 1876
Blargonaut 1901 2007
acohrs 2134
Swamped (2)
Sorian 1431 1924
Lone_Prodigy 1624 1867
Kawl_USC 1744
Blargonaut 1746 1802
CCS 1796 1799
*Splinter 1936
Kalor (1)
Burbeting 1384 1399
Burbeting 2009
acohrs (1)
flatearthpandas 1895
Faddy (1)
Crab 1718 1991
franconp 1914
Blargonaut (1)
Sorian 1924
Lone_Prodigy (0):acohrs 1482 1916
StanleyPalmtree (0):TheWorthyEdge 1703 2035
Bronx-Man (0):Sorian 1372 1431, Crab 1490 1675, WhereAreMahDragonz 1536 1811
WhereAreMahDragonz (0):CCS 1851 2028
Kyanrute (0):Gorlak 1832 1885
Everyone voted!
Day 2 ends:
Automated vote tally here
12 votes for majority
Crab (9)
Bronx-Man 1452
Swamped 1454
Faddy 1519
Blargonaut 2007
nin1000 2010
TheWorthyEdge 2035
Verelios 2036
Gorlak 2081
Crab 2090
CCS (3)
WhereAreMahDragonz 1811
StanleyPalmtree 1913
Lone_Prodigy 2110
Verelios (2)
Kyanrute 2005
CCS 2028
Burbeting (2)
Kalor 1876
acohrs 2134
Swamped (2)
Kawl_USC 1744
*Splinter 1936
Kalor (1)
Burbeting 2009
acohrs (1)
flatearthpandas 1895
Faddy (1)
franconp 1914
Blargonaut (1)
Sorian 1924
Lone_Prodigy (0):
StanleyPalmtree (0):
Bronx-Man (0):
WhereAreMahDragonz (0):
Kyanrute (0):
Everyone voted!
Day 2 ends:
Automated vote tally here
12 votes for majority
Well this seems dumb. Stacked votes an hour and a half before time when we have no definitive information one anything. And Crab voting for himself which is dumb shit I don't tolerate anyway.
Why? I voted him with like 10 hours left in the day. I was unaware that people are incapable of switching their votes during that time.
I do agree with this. Dissect the claim for a minute. What possible reason would Swamped have to use a shot N1? There's usually a small nugget of a truth in the lie. All she would be dodging N1 is cop checks or a vigilante kill. No one evil was going to kill her.
Why? I voted him with like 10 hours left in the day. I was unaware that people are incapable of switching their votes during that time.
I do agree with this. Dissect the claim for a minute. What possible reason would Swamped have to use a shot N1? There's usually a small nugget of a truth in the lie. All she would be dodging N1 is cop checks or a vigilante kill. No one evil was going to kill her.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Very infrequently, but yes, I've known set-ups with them.
There was one in overwatch mafia.
I think it's been done before. X-shot is also even harder to verify than the usual odd/even variations.
Although if false I guess she would have been gambling on noone targeting her last night?
It's the obvious answer, but I would expect swamped to know better.
Verelios (Posts I think were more than just shitposts included only):
Day 1
71 - Flavor Vote, lot of people were doing those.
344 - Defending CCS from a note I made. It was early game, but it could imply something in case either of them is scum.
Some light push for swamped to contribute in posts 396, 449 and 452. Nothing worth linking, but notable. There was also a light argument with Sorian.
470 - Light defence on Faddy. The wording because they are here cooperating is bit puzzling. Does Verelious town read people only because they are posting in the thread? Or does cooperating imply something else? The wording is vague.
485 - Light answers to few questions presented. What made me raise an eyebrown a little was the middle of the pack comment on WAMD. But thats mostly because I feel like I cant read, is in the middle is just a lazy circling around the fact that a player is coasting. But lot of people use that excuse, so dunno.
542 - Again defending Faddy with very light reasons, so much so that even Faddy questions them. If Verelios is scum, he could be trying to pocket a townie (=town reading a town member just so that they would seem more trust-worthy in the eyes of that towny).
726 - Puts himself against policy lynching inactive players, citing its nothing more than rolling a dice. I incline to agree with this read.
823 & 833 is the first time Verelios is interacting with Squidyj, D1 lynch target. Im a little bothered with these posts, mostly because it almost feels like he is role fishing Squidyj for information (it later became apparent that Squidyj is ordinary due to the flip). Post 835 is also speculation on Squidyjs possible power role too. Noteworthy: Faddy is part of this fishing too.
Some light push from Fran towards Vere, Vere responds in posts 951, 954. Nothing really interesting here, but its the first time Verelios is actually pushed about something in the game.
1130 - A reads list in D1 is usually a scum read for me, even if town also does it sometimes (For example: Natiko). Its especially confusing in this game, where most of D1 was nothing but shitposting. Most of the reads in this list were not much at all. Just 1-2 notes about every player does not really a good reads list make. Only read that has really any interesting points is his read on Crab. Interesting note: Verelios kept reading Faddy as town with flimsy reasonings earlier, but has now reverted to null/scum read all of a sudden.
1323 - Interesting vote on Kalor, reasoning being you swinged the vote too late to deadline. 20 minutes to deadline is kinda close to deadline, but its not 5 minutes or anything.
1353 and 1360 has him question Squidyj lynch, due to him only null reading.
Going through D2 next. There were lots of posts from Vere in d1, but not that many with that interesting content. His reads list was by far the most interesting part.
Day 1
71 - Flavor Vote, lot of people were doing those.
344 - Defending CCS from a note I made. It was early game, but it could imply something in case either of them is scum.
Some light push for swamped to contribute in posts 396, 449 and 452. Nothing worth linking, but notable. There was also a light argument with Sorian.
470 - Light defence on Faddy. The wording because they are here cooperating is bit puzzling. Does Verelious town read people only because they are posting in the thread? Or does cooperating imply something else? The wording is vague.
485 - Light answers to few questions presented. What made me raise an eyebrown a little was the middle of the pack comment on WAMD. But thats mostly because I feel like I cant read, is in the middle is just a lazy circling around the fact that a player is coasting. But lot of people use that excuse, so dunno.
542 - Again defending Faddy with very light reasons, so much so that even Faddy questions them. If Verelios is scum, he could be trying to pocket a townie (=town reading a town member just so that they would seem more trust-worthy in the eyes of that towny).
726 - Puts himself against policy lynching inactive players, citing its nothing more than rolling a dice. I incline to agree with this read.
823 & 833 is the first time Verelios is interacting with Squidyj, D1 lynch target. Im a little bothered with these posts, mostly because it almost feels like he is role fishing Squidyj for information (it later became apparent that Squidyj is ordinary due to the flip). Post 835 is also speculation on Squidyjs possible power role too. Noteworthy: Faddy is part of this fishing too.
Some light push from Fran towards Vere, Vere responds in posts 951, 954. Nothing really interesting here, but its the first time Verelios is actually pushed about something in the game.
1130 - A reads list in D1 is usually a scum read for me, even if town also does it sometimes (For example: Natiko). Its especially confusing in this game, where most of D1 was nothing but shitposting. Most of the reads in this list were not much at all. Just 1-2 notes about every player does not really a good reads list make. Only read that has really any interesting points is his read on Crab. Interesting note: Verelios kept reading Faddy as town with flimsy reasonings earlier, but has now reverted to null/scum read all of a sudden.
1323 - Interesting vote on Kalor, reasoning being you swinged the vote too late to deadline. 20 minutes to deadline is kinda close to deadline, but its not 5 minutes or anything.
1353 and 1360 has him question Squidyj lynch, due to him only null reading.
Going through D2 next. There were lots of posts from Vere in d1, but not that many with that interesting content. His reads list was by far the most interesting part.
Since you seem to be here after all, what is your read on Swamped and Kalor right now?
Verelios had a talk with Sorian at the start of Day 1. Afterwards, both days, he is posting but not saying much, definitely a null.
If anything this "discussion" between him and Kyan makes me feel worse about Kyan. Somewhere along the lines they both got impolite and talk about petty stuff, however the kickstart argument by Vere - Kyan voting squidyj without justification - convinces me. I perceived a lack as well and Kyan only quoted a post from today, which means nothing.
If anything this "discussion" between him and Kyan makes me feel worse about Kyan. Somewhere along the lines they both got impolite and talk about petty stuff, however the kickstart argument by Vere - Kyan voting squidyj without justification - convinces me. I perceived a lack as well and Kyan only quoted a post from today, which means nothing.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Irrelevant. Neither are getting lynched at this point. You'll have enough to discuss after my flip that by the time you get back to them, anything I could say now would be meaningless.
Don't act like this, Crab. Even if you cannot be saved, if you flip town, we can look at your reads from the POV that a town member did them.
Only scum players would want to limit the amount of information coming from them after flip.
Well you clearly have not totally given up since you are still participating in the thread. So if you going to flip town it would help if we had your reads for future reference.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
-shrug-
I have no interest in doing so. If you want my reads, you keep me alive. I'm not giving anything to a town that does nothing for itself.
TheWorthyEdge
Member
That's ridiculous.
I helped save you yesterday Crab! Where is the love?
Lone_Prodigy
Member
I mean, I've been in Crab's shoes so I know it's frustrating, but saying "you get nothing unless you save me" is awfully petty.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
No. I already did that. That's what the last however many pages are. Now, you decide. All of the material is there. You have all of my reads. You have all my reactions. I have nothing to add. I can't help you any more.
StanleyPalmtree
Banned
just going out like a bitch huh?
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Like, seriously. My foses are Verelios and Faddy. I've made that clear abundant times. What more do you want me to say? Produce a magic scumslip out of my hat proving that they did once and for all? Suddenly go "my god, I've had an epiphany, my read on Kalor has totally changed!!!!!"? Game doesn't work like that. I've produced more content than almost any other player. I consistently argue for who I want to be lynched and don't hold back. That's what I've done. So, at this point, I have nothing left to say. Your choice.
This is a better argument post, at the very least.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Pointless, though. Half the players who voted for me aren't even present. I only bothered telling you because you're one of my favourites
What? Throwing a tantrum 30 minutes from day end isn't holding nothing back. Having two scum reads isn't giving everything for town. If you really did believe in this than you'd be making a case now instead of this manipulative shit you've got going.
Lone_Prodigy
Member
Alright.
Vote: Verelios
Vote: Verelios
StanleyPalmtree
Banned
well thats certainly better.
work with us crab, i genuinely believe you are town, and i really dont think this is as hopeless as you think.
take it from someone who's imminent death is looking much more certain than yours.
work with us crab, i genuinely believe you are town, and i really dont think this is as hopeless as you think.
take it from someone who's imminent death is looking much more certain than yours.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
1717 covers most of the material. Beyond that, Verelios seems to be suspected by a lot of people yet never manages to pick up votes, has strange voting patterns and is always away from the action or in with the crowd, obfuscates a lot (see the Kyan conversation), makes bad arguments. I don't really have the time to do anything expansive now.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Again, though, this is mostly pointless. There's functionally no chance the wagon on me changes. If it doesn't, you'll have more information from my flip than I can persuade you of now. Me giving me reads just means if they're wrong, scum will use them as a hammer to beat you with. So I'm reluctant to say.
D2
1383 - Notes that Kyan is suspicious due to his vote with no reasoning on Squidyj D1. I dont know if I agree on this, surely scum Kyan would have tried to justify his vote somehow, since it would otherwise look really bad on him later? The thing about scum is that they usually overthink things, and try to make themselves seem as good as possible. So it would have been a bold move from scum Kyan. But if Crab flips scum, then it could be useful to take a look at Kyan again.
Interestingly, there is lot probing on people who voted for Squidyj in the next posts. 1409, 1421, 1424. Town could do posts like these, but it could also be a scum going for a you stupid townies, why didnt you listen to me narrative in order to seem more trust-worthy later.
There is later shitting on Bronx claim in posts 1444 1598 1601. Im bothered with the we absolutely have to lynch Bronx line of thought in these posts. Yes, the claim was stupid, but it was also a claim made by a hastily panicking town player, not scum one IMO. No reason to lynch Bronx at the time, unless he suddenly has become a master tactician.
1771 A longer post from Verelios, but its mostly just reactionary, responding to comments made about him. There is some poking at Kawls vote, though.
Some push towards CCS in posts 1871, 1873, 1877, 1879, 1882
1918 First post in D2 where Verelios really mentions Crab. There was some Crab mention in posts with Bronx, but that put Crab into a positive light. Now Crab is scum read again. To note though, Verelios does scum read Crab in his D1 reads list, which I assume is what he is referecing to in his post 2036. That post also starts the shitstorm that is conversation between Verelios and Kyan, which was more or less load of nothing
Except that Kyan notes Verelios did not actively pursue on his scum reads from D1. The scum reads are LP, Kalor, Crab, Natiko, Kyanrute. There has been some light push from Verelios towards Kyan and Crab, but thats all. I wouldnt really call it Active Pursuing myself, either.
--
There isn't anything in either day from Verelios that screams 'scum' to my ears, but he is very coasting. This is surprising, with his post count being pretty high. Biggest concerns are his pretty useless D1 reads list he keeps using as a crux (like when I asked for his Kalor read), and boast that he has been scum reading Crab all the time, when there has been actually quite a little notes about Crab in Verelios' posts outside few mentions.
I'll take a look at that post Crab noted next, to see his arguments.
1383 - Notes that Kyan is suspicious due to his vote with no reasoning on Squidyj D1. I dont know if I agree on this, surely scum Kyan would have tried to justify his vote somehow, since it would otherwise look really bad on him later? The thing about scum is that they usually overthink things, and try to make themselves seem as good as possible. So it would have been a bold move from scum Kyan. But if Crab flips scum, then it could be useful to take a look at Kyan again.
Interestingly, there is lot probing on people who voted for Squidyj in the next posts. 1409, 1421, 1424. Town could do posts like these, but it could also be a scum going for a you stupid townies, why didnt you listen to me narrative in order to seem more trust-worthy later.
There is later shitting on Bronx claim in posts 1444 1598 1601. Im bothered with the we absolutely have to lynch Bronx line of thought in these posts. Yes, the claim was stupid, but it was also a claim made by a hastily panicking town player, not scum one IMO. No reason to lynch Bronx at the time, unless he suddenly has become a master tactician.
1771 A longer post from Verelios, but its mostly just reactionary, responding to comments made about him. There is some poking at Kawls vote, though.
Some push towards CCS in posts 1871, 1873, 1877, 1879, 1882
1918 First post in D2 where Verelios really mentions Crab. There was some Crab mention in posts with Bronx, but that put Crab into a positive light. Now Crab is scum read again. To note though, Verelios does scum read Crab in his D1 reads list, which I assume is what he is referecing to in his post 2036. That post also starts the shitstorm that is conversation between Verelios and Kyan, which was more or less load of nothing
Except that Kyan notes Verelios did not actively pursue on his scum reads from D1. The scum reads are LP, Kalor, Crab, Natiko, Kyanrute. There has been some light push from Verelios towards Kyan and Crab, but thats all. I wouldnt really call it Active Pursuing myself, either.
--
There isn't anything in either day from Verelios that screams 'scum' to my ears, but he is very coasting. This is surprising, with his post count being pretty high. Biggest concerns are his pretty useless D1 reads list he keeps using as a crux (like when I asked for his Kalor read), and boast that he has been scum reading Crab all the time, when there has been actually quite a little notes about Crab in Verelios' posts outside few mentions.
I'll take a look at that post Crab noted next, to see his arguments.
I don't know... it could be easily a staged show, something me and acohrs did to each other in Pop.
Lone_Prodigy
Member
Again, what's with these sweeping "must be town" declarations?
You know how scum is playing really well? They get all these "must be town" pats on the back from town.
StanleyPalmtree
Banned
vote: Verelios
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
One thing I will say is that remember that just because someone didn't vote for me today, that doesn't mean they are town. Scum know who town is and if they sinking town, they love to rush to defend them, especially if that town was always a lost cause.
Think that's the last thing I had to say.
Think that's the last thing I had to say.