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[Eric the Red]

Time to dole out the winners here. And the master debaters are:

10. Metroid II (Ben Moore vs Daniel BloodWorth)
09. The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past (Kyle Bosman vs Brad Ellis)
08. Shadows of the Damned (Daniel Bloodworth vs Michael Huber)
07. BioShock (Kyle Bosman vs Brandon Jones)
06. Alien Isolation (Brandon Jones vs Michael Huber)
05. Fallout New Vegas (Michael Huber vs Ben Moore)
04. Kingdom Hearts (Brandon Jones vs Brad Ellis)
03. Knack (Ben Moore vs Michael Huber)
02. Borderlands 2 (Brad Ellis vs Kyle Bosman)
01. The Last of Us (Ian Hinck vs Brandon Jones)

09 Brad couldn't put together a good argument from being so flustered but wins anyways since Kyle couldn't stop saying insane things that made no sense.*

07 I like that last point about the ending acting like they're blowing your mind just because you went down the path they funnel through to which there is no alternative. Bosman you win it just on that.

05 Ben Moore has the GUMPTION to not just make his point, but actively sell it to Huber like a lobbyiest in congressional office. That backdoor shady deal almost had Huber I can tell.

03 "WHEN YOU SAY KNACK DOESN'T GROW, COME ON." - Huber sincerely affirms

02 Borderlands 2 co-op is like boarding a crashing plane with a friend. It's already going down but now you're involving innocent bystanders. Dear god Brad, Randy Pitchford might have kids or something and you just murdered him. What a monster.


*footnote: No it's not different strokes Kyle, you made no sense. You complaining that Link would have explored everything already because the world's so small is like me asking how the Kingdom of Hyrule could sustain itself with only 20-25 subjects. Everyone would know each other, not to mention the rampant inbreeding. These are necessary abstractions because it was 1991. It is insane to expect the map to be 20x bigger with blank field screens inserted just to satisfy your insane expectation.

 

[mrklaw]

His argument on how The Last of Us being a game that should have offered choice yet didn't I can kind of get.

So many things Joel did just had me going like, "wut."

The ending, so fucking bad. One girl, to save humanity? Nope, let's execute the best researchers/doctors left in the country and kill the leader of the fireflies. Cus like, father and daughter relationship amirite?

So dumb. I liked the game because of it's technical accomplishments and it's gameplay. If there was ever a game that could have benefited from a choice system it would have been TLoU.

Who said she would save humanity? Who said they're doctors left in the country?

My interpretation was that the fireflies were desperate to win and were clutching at straws. Let's risk the lives of innocent people just in case we find a cure. And those doctors could just be random doctors - possibly not even qualified surgeons.

There is plenty of ambiguity to support both sides of the argument, which helps make it a good story.

 

[Diprosalic]

TLOU is mediocre as fuck. i agree GT guy.

 

[Spinx]

If Kyle played System Shock 2 he would hate Bioshock even more.

 

[Salty Hippo]

Not surprised one bit about Bosman's opinions. He's full of shit more often than not about most things.

 

[Lemonheap]

Agree completely about Link to the Past. I think most Zelda games are proper shite altogether really, it's all about nostalgia and not much about substance. Never been a Nintendo fan except for Mario.

 

[Zemm]

Looks like Kyle Bosman has terrible taste

 

[FelipeMGM]

Now I get why Kyle doesnt review games on GT

Spoiler

/s

 

[im_dany]

I'd love to see more videos like this one from other big websites, it's really good to see different perspectives about a game.

I agree about TLOU and BioShock "hate" opinions (I don't hate them though, I just think they're decent/good game but overhyped).
I think the F:NV "love" opinion would've needed the 36 minutes alone to cite all the good reasons why it's one of the best RPG ever made.
Borderlands 2... uhm. If you analyze the game you'll find many flaws (enemies are bullet sponges, they literally inserted every damn meme that exist, jokes are pretty dumb) but I still had a blast playing through it in coop. The jokes are dumb, yeah, but they help making the game feel like a game. It doesn't take itself too seriously, the whole game is a joke and some of them made me laugh anyway.

 

[Static Veins]

This is like an extended episode of Opinion Yell. Love it.

https://youtu.be/hm3gUpDZQHk

 

[Nibel]

Ian on point with his TLOU observations

 

[Markitron]

I like Kyle, but he needs to get himself some new and better opinions.

06. Alien Isolation - No opinion

06. Alien Isolation - no opinion

You need to get yourselves an opinion on this.

 

[so1337]

10. Metroid II - no opinion
09. The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past - Agree with Brad
08. Shadows of the Damned - Agree with Huber
07. BioShock - Agree with Jones
06. Alien Isolation - no opinion
05. Fallout New Vegas - Agree with Huber
04. Kingdom Hearts - Agree with Jones (KH is the least appealing series by a company that makes products with little to no appeal)
03. Knack - no opinion
02. Borderlands 2 - Agree with Brad
01. The Last of Us - Agree with Ian (but still like the game)

 

[OléGunner]

Kyle is spot on with Bioshock.

 

[Heartfyre]

I've probably seen Kyle do hundreds of hours of programming.

Yet nothing prepared me to see him, in the same video, decry A Link To The Past and defend Borderlands 2.

I'm experiencing a mixture of horror and disgust.

 

[LiquidSolid]

His argument on how The Last of Us being a game that should have offered choice yet didn't I can kind of get.

So many things Joel did just had me going like, "wut."

The ending, so fucking bad. One girl, to save humanity? Nope, let's execute the best researchers/doctors left in the country and kill the leader of the fireflies. Cus like, father and daughter relationship amirite?

So dumb. I liked the game because of it's technical accomplishments and it's gameplay. If there was ever a game that could have benefited from a choice system it would have been TLoU.

If you paid even a little attention throughout the game, it was made fairly clear that it was humans that were the real threat, not the infected, and the fireflies were part of the proof of this. "Best researchers/doctors left"? Based on what? The only context the game gives you is that they're desperate and have no clue what they're doing. They were willing to murder a 14 year old on just the hope that they'd somehow discover something while digging through her brain.

But no, you're right, there totally should've been an option for Joel to stand back and let them murder and dissect a kid he'd just spent a year looking after and getting close to. That totally would've made sense in the context of the story. SMH.

 

[flatearthpandas]

This was really entertaining, actually. Even for the games I haven't played.

 

[Hasney]

Now I get why Kyle doesnt review games on GT

Spoiler

/s

Apart from this barn burner
https://youtu.be/F1cszv8G-Sw

 

[so1337]

You need to get yourselves an opinion on this.

I was interested in it until I heard it was 25 hours long.

 

[Markitron]

I was interested in it until I heard it was 25 hours long.

? Where did you hear this. I am an average player and it took me 17 hours.

Edit: According to howlongtobeat.com the average is 18 hours. Give it a go.

 

[Maintenance]

TLOU is Joel's story. The game is not a "choose-your-own path though don't expect the ending to be different" type of thing. It has a beginning, a middle and an ending carved in stone.

If you want the other type of game go play Tales from the Borderlands, Life is Strange, etc.

 

[so1337]

? Where did you hear this. I am an average player and it took me 17 hours.

Edit: According to howlongtobeat.com the average is 18 hours. Give it a go.

Idle Thumbs. 18 hours still seems excessive for a horror game.

 

[Deadman]

As always Ian is right.

 

[A Link to the Past]

I like Kyle, but he needs to get himself some new and better opinions.





You need to get yourselves an opinion on this.

If I was forced to guess my opinion, I'd go with hate. Isolation is almost definitely not a game that I would like, but I've never once played it. I don't really get into stealth games with a high risk associated with being noticed.

 

[Messofanego]

If I was forced to guess my opinion, I'd go with hate. Isolation is almost definitely not a game that I would like, but I've never once played it. I don't really get into stealth games with a high risk associated with being noticed.

With that stance, I'm guessing you haven't played a horror game recently (Capcom remasters don't count) either cause a lot of the more notable ones have stealth.

 

[ArkhamFantasy]

Alien Isolation felt like it would make a great 2 hour experience but the publisher didnt want to sell it for 15 dollars so they added a bunch of bloat to it and made it boring so that they could charge 60 for it.

 

[eot]

I agree 100% with Kyle.
LTTP is boooring.

 

[NeonBlack]

Watched the last one. Maaan, just another reason to write off Ian Hinck. The black sheep of the GT crew right there.

He made a pretty good argument. The AI companions do suck and having to craft everything isn't fun.

Now Kyle on the other hand is a madman.

 

[A Link to the Past]

With that stance, I'm guessing you haven't played a horror game recently (Capcom remasters don't count) either cause a lot of the more notable ones have stealth.

I have, that's how I came to the determination that I don't enjoy them. I prefer my horror to be

1. VN-style (ie 999)
2. Power fantasy (ie Dead Space)
3. Ammo/health management/mild power fantasy (ie Resident Evil)

 

[ElTorro]

Whaaaaaat, Bosman criticized LTTP?

I've lost another personal hero today.

 

[Itchy//Tasty]

Brandon messing with my heart in this one; defending the legendary Bioshock against Bosman's bullshit, but then disparaging my GOTY 2014 Alien Isolation.

Love all you guys regardless though.

 

[Zafir]

I'm inclined to agree with Brandon in that the games length was kind of what scared me most in Alien Isolation. The thought of doing all of that stealth to find stuff with the punishing save system for atleast 15 hours just put me right off. And i play alot of long games.

I can accept what it tried to do though. The atmosphere and world was fantastic.

I'm inclined to agree with Ian over TLoU aswell. Although the lack of story choice didn't bother me. The AI (ally and enemy), the repeated puzzles, the poor pacing and a few other nitpicks made me feel kind of meh on the game.

Don't agree with Kyle regarding Bioshock though. The only thing i will say was the ending choices were really shit. I killed one little sister to see what happened and saved the rest. It made me out to be some super evil dude in the ending....

Knack and KH I'm really on the fence over.

 

[Liamc723]

Alien Isolation felt like it would make a great 2 hour experience but the publisher didnt want to sell it for 15 dollars so they added a bunch of bloat to it and made it boring so that they could charge 60 for it.

Is that why I enjoyed every single hour of it? I love its length, stop giving me these short horror experiences because for some reason people think these games should be no longer than 5 hours long.

Alien Isolation is a fantastic game and easily one of the best of 2014. Far better than Shadow Of Mordor.

 

[timetokill]

AI is one element of gaming that has slowly advanced. So the potential for Ellie to run out when you're with a group of Clickers would always be there. And that would frustrate the hell out of players. So they chose what I think many would agree is the lesser issue of the two. Yes it might not be realistic, but it doesn't insert unnecessary frustration into the mix.

Perhaps, but it doesn't change the fact that for many people it can destroy tension and break immersion.

 

[A Link to the Past]

Is that why I enjoyed every single hour of it?

Alien Isolation is a fantastic game and easily one of the best of 2014. Far better than Shadow Of Mordor.

What wasn't better than Shadow of Mordor in 2014?

 

[Messofanego]

I have, that's how I came to the determination that I don't enjoy them. I prefer my horror to be

1. VN-style (ie 999)
2. Power fantasy (ie Dead Space)
3. Ammo/health management/mild power fantasy (ie Resident Evil)

Then they're not so horrifying. Don't you want your horror games to be stressful?!

 

[so1337]

What wasn't better than Shadow of Mordor in 2014?

Destiny?

 

[HyperCubed4]

Making this post without having seen the video.

I'd love to hear what everyone has to say, but I'm really curious about Ian's thoughts on The Last of Us. Hopefully he talks about the gameplay.

 

[A Link to the Past]

Then they're not so horrifying. Don't you want your horror games to be stressful?!

Ammo management puts plenty stress, thank you. :v I get enough stress from playing MGS and fretting over getting caught!

 

[Earthpainting]

I enjoyed this.

10. Metroid II - I think it's a good game for its hardware, but it's not something I would recommend to your average gamer in 2016
09. The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past - Decent game, but I'm with Kyle on this. ALttP is a game where I do not care about the characters, the places are thematically weak, and most of the bosses are boring sword fights. It's a good SNES game, but far from my favourite 2D Zelda.
08. Shadows of the Damned - I see both points, but I'm leaning towards liking it more. The game is juvenile in bad, eye-rolling ways, but it's a game that can surprise at times.
07. Bioshock - I liked this game, but I'm with every single one of Kyle's points. Enjoying being in Rapture was enough to edge out all of its many weaknesses.
06. Alien Isolation - I can't play this game. Played it for 6 hours or so, and just had to quit. It made me physically ill, so I can't really judge it fairly. I do like its ideas, but I guess Brandon did too in theory.
05. Fallout New Vegas - New Vegas does so much right, but at the end of the day it had to build on the Fallout 3 framework that I wasn't a big fan of. It was an uphill battle, that I just could finish.
04. Kingdom Hearts - I agree with Brandon here, but Brad just absolutely nailed it. It is incomprehensible, unfocussed trash? Absolutely, but that's OK! It's a beautiful train wreck that you can't look away from, like the more out-there fanfic.
03. Knack - Don't care for it.
02. Borderlands 2 - I don't hate this game, but I agree with Brad. All the characters are annoying, and the game has no impacts. Had it not been co-op, I wouldn't have played it.
01. The Last of Us - Don't care for this game, and Ian did a decent job at articulating why. Maybe my expectations were wrong, but the game felt too by the numbers. It seemed to live off its story and presentation. But if it were a movie, it would be one I wouldn't watch.

 

[Acquiescence]

He made a pretty good argument. The AI companions do suck and having to craft everything isn't fun.

Now Kyle on the other hand is a madman.

In what way do the A.I. companions suck? Ellie can be pretty handy to have around when shit goes down. And the crafting, doesn't that just literally comprise of holding down a button for a few seconds and voila - item crafted? I don't see the issue there.

 

[Tankard]

Wow. Kyle Bosman's arguments against these games sound like he's been told to disagree with the stupidest fucking arguments. Seriously, is this a comedy sketch?

It's not something worth getting mad about, seriously. We all have controversial opinions, I bet you hate several games that people mostly love.

 

[Kouichi]

This is a really neat idea. I hope they do this again.

Though I felt the parts with Bosmon were the only downside. He never really offered any meaty arguments and it just seemed like rambling, while the other GT members always articulated their arguments. I also completely agree with Ian on Last of Us.

 

[A Link to the Past]

This is a really neat idea. I hope they do this again.

Though I felt the parts with Bosmon were the only downside. He never really offered any meaty arguments and it just seemed like rambling, while the other GT members always articulated their arguments. I also completely agree with Ian on Last of Us.

I think he did fine w/ BioShock, but his argument is almost senseless for ALttP.

 

[hydrophilic attack]

Are there spoilers in the discussion about TLOU?

 

[Exploratory]

Ian completely ignored the excellent multiplayer and the unique characteristics of TLoU's setting.

Also I saw Mass Effect in the opening montage but it wasn't discussed. Glad they came to their senses.

 

[DNAbro]

I do think LTTP is the most overrated Zelda game by far and I agree with Kyle that it isn't a charming game or the most well designed world. I would even say the dungeons are pretty bland and boring. All the handheld Zelda games are much better imo(except maybe Phantom Hourglass). Link's Awakening is top 2D Zelda easily.

 

[SpideySenses]

Brandon did a pretty awful job of defending TLoU, the choice argument from Ian should have been completely torn apart.

 

[fengshuifever]

This is like an extended episode of Opinion Yell. Love it.

https://youtu.be/hm3gUpDZQHk

I was thinking the same thing, i want moooore.

Ian seems to get a lot of shit and criticism but I think he's severely underrated. This and this weeks GT Time is proof of that.

Loved this video

 

[Piers]

I can relate to what Brad says regarding BL2, but the gunplay really is fun.
TLOU is an interesting one. Wasn't sure who to side with.