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[Lime]

Are you sure it's that and not just kids being antagonistic assholes, latching onto anything to get a reaction out of someone?

I definitely think it's one of the factors. By being constantly informed that avatars not being White in this virtual world isn't normal, players get the impression that anything that isn't normal requires a "reaction" (this is not normal therefore I should comment on it).

But antagonistic assholes is also another factor

 

[entremet]

I remember a black guy appearing on AGDQ and the Twitch chat went to racial epithets almost immediately. The mods cleaned it up, but it was just so damn sad.

This is also the reason I don't play MP FPSes.

 

[FleetingFlowAir]

I have never used a mic to talk with anyone online that isn't someone I know as a friend in real life. I don't use my mic to talk to my internet friends, not just because of shyness, but also since they would indentify what type of person I am.

 

[Teknoman]

I always mute people online unless I know them personally. I dunno, it just feels weird talking to strangers online with some crappy mic.

I've never understood the appeal. I'm not surprised there's a bunch of prejudice Americans spewing racism. Probably a lot of 11-16 year olds from the south, and I can't entertain listening or interacting with them.

Monster Hunter online MP or any game with a huge co-op focus (Dead Island, Borderlands, Resident Evil etc).

And then GAF co-op with voice chat or even competitive with voice chat is always fun.

I guess this is why people dont talk in online random games anymore...makes me miss early PS2 online / XBL / PSN days.

 

[soultron]

Fantastic piece. Still digesting most of it, having read it through once.

 

[SerTapTap]

IMO a good way to understand and hopefully improve this situation is by paying attention to/following some of the (too few) black voices in the industry. Shawn Alexander Allen from the article is a great follow.

I identify with the "Black Nerd" comment. I get some flak from my black friends, but even from my white friends. I'm now the whitest black guy they know. As if being educated, and liking intelligent topics, somehow makes me less black.

This stuff bugs the fuck out of me as I knew several "black nerds" in high school and they often got shit for it. Society in general has a gross attitude about being smart, but shitting on your own friends for being smart, successful, whatever, ridiculous, harmful stuff.

When you think about it, that's such a disheartening thing to read in 2015.
Obviously, I'm not blaming you at all, dude, "mute all" has been my default option for any public game for years now.

I eventually quit TF2 because I didn't have (good) headphones and I was playing in my dorm room, every few matches I'd get someone spouting racial slurs. And it was one of the better games regarding online behavior at the time, from my experience.

I'm never one of the "I don't call myself a gamer" types, but that's one of the few things that really does embarrass me about the hobby. Why must assholes also like things I like.

 

[Monster Zero]

Yea, I've been called a nigger on Xbox live for a decade, I don't even respond anymore, it's not worth it. I've been to enough tourneys to know none of these dudes would say it to your face

 

[Morrigan Stark]

I started playing Arma 3 Life yesterday. It's really strict about roleplaying. You aren't supposed to break character at all. You can't even preface out of character speech with OOC without breaking the rules and getting a temporary ban.

Anyways, my character is black. I'm not.
As soon as I signed on I was getting made fun of for being black. There was a group of like 12 people talking about me and laughing. One of then knocked me down and they made racist jokes. They ended up calling me Jay-Z and making fun of my lips. It was fucking disgusting.

Rather than roleplaying the game, I'm actually primarily roleplaying being black.

I know this is trivial compared to what its like to have this happen in real life (in game or not), but it was really bizarre to me.

:/

That is fucked up. Now imagine actually being black instead of just roleplaying, and receiving that kind of hate on a near-daily basis. :\

Reminds me of one of the rare times I went online to play Gears of War 2 (Horde mode, so a coop game, not competitive with trash talk or anything) with randoms. I played very few times, and used the mic maybe twice in total. One time was totally fine and not only I didn't get any shitty comments, I even got complimented on my playing by getting the final kill on the last wave. Cool.

The other time, after a few waves with randoms (no mic + muting everyone) I was invited to a private game. I wasn't sure why, I didn't know these guys, but I thought ok sure and joined their game. They were chatting it up so I turned on the mic, and... well, it was... a weird experience, nothing that awful compared to what goes on in some online games but still not very pleasant. The subject of race bizarrely came up because I was playing as Dom Santiago, and one of the guys asked me if I was Hispanic. I said no. He asked me why I was playing Santiago if I wasn't Hispanic, which really, really confused me. I said "why not?" and they seemed to think it was really weird, like I was presumptuous or something. :S I then said "but I'm also a girl, and Dom is a guy, and what does it matter?" (note, GoW2 didn't have any playable female characters) and they didn't have a counter-argument to that I guess. Then I was asked what race I was, and I quote, "so uh Morr-ee-gon, what race are you then if not Hispanic? Are you white, or are you a nigger, or...?".
I don't remember what I said then, I think I just said "what does it matter?" and they said "just curious is all", but the way they just casually dropped the n-bomb like that, and the bizarre obsession with knowing the race of a random player, was just so damn creepy. Needless to say, I finished one wave and left that lobby. I honestly don't think these guys realized how much they were being racist dicks, the way they spoke it was all normal game chattering. But it was really obnoxious and I don't even want to imagine what the competitive game modes must be like. *shudders*

 

[vypek]

The comment section...dear god ...if I had the power of a deity, I'd be ejecting people into space at a ridiculous rate.

Yeah, a lot of shit-tier quality comments.
"This isn't important"
"I don't want to hear about this"
"I'm black and I disagree so the whole article is wrong"

 

[Messofanego]

I remember a black guy appearing on AGDQ and the Twitch chat went to racial epithets almost immediately. The mods cleaned it up, but it was just so damn sad.

This is also the reason I don't play MP FPSes.

Which ties well to that paragraph:

"Gaming culture is a direct reflection of our society," she said. "The only reason racism and sexism run rampant in gaming is because racism and sexism run rampant in society. But in physical spaces, mostly, it's not overt. It's subtle. It's covert. So, yes, these issues manifest in a similar manner in gaming, but I contend that they present themselves worse. It's not subtle. It's in-your-face racism. A black person may not be called a nigger to their face, but they can almost guarantee it will happen in virtuality."​

One part of it could be the people in these livechat streams want to intentionally be trolls. As always, not much consequence on internet for these intentional trolls. So when a black person comes in, the easiest way to troll is by being racist. They are aware of how fast chat goes (are there Twitch measures like Giant Bomb where you can slow down the comments to catch people in time?), so mods unable to cope with the speed can't reprimand those accounts in time. If they could, the message would be clear much like the rules here that any abusive or hate language would be an automatic kick out.

 

[Sayter]

I identify with the "Black Nerd" comment. I get some flak from my black friends, but even from my white friends. I'm now the whitest black guy they know. As if being educated, and liking intelligent topics, somehow makes me less black.

This is me. I used to get picked on by friends and cousins when I was younger. I used to hear 'you're not black enough' or 'stop being white'. Like it was a choice for me. It made me a shamed for a long time. I had a crisis of identity for a long time.

 

[Koppai]

I don't even play games on,one with voice chat. I think I did with animal crossing for wii a few years ago but that was it,

 

[striferser]

Mute button is where it at.
I don't play online game in public lobby for this reason. Or voice chat. I tend to mute them.

I started playing Arma 3 Life yesterday. It's really strict about roleplaying. You aren't supposed to break character at all. You can't even preface out of character speech with OOC without breaking the rules and getting a temporary ban.

Anyways, my character is black. I'm not.
As soon as I signed on I was getting made fun of for being black. There was a group of like 12 people talking about me and laughing. One of then knocked me down and they made racist jokes. They ended up calling me Jay-Z and making fun of my lips. It was fucking disgusting.

Rather than roleplaying the game, I'm actually primarily roleplaying being black.

I know this is trivial compared to what its like to have this happen in real life (in game or not), but it was really bizarre to me.

:/

HOLY SHIT!
That sucks :/

 

[Interfectum]

While I usually don't get harassed I definitely try to stop other people from getting harassed and use the report button all the time. My only concern is if reporting ever does anything. The only game that tells me that I've been successful is Dota 2. The rest I feel like I'm sending into the void of nothingness.

It's pretty disgusting to hear such blatant racism in 2015 and sucks for people who have to deal with that shit.

 

[Steel]

I haven't played a game where people are actually using public voice chat for anything beyond annoying other people with their backround noise of loud music or babies crying in years. From my perspective, this article's perspective on online experiences is dated, it's just dead out there.

Of course I also haven't played Counter-Strike in years, so who's to say.

 

[Teknoman]

I haven't played a game where people are actually using public voice chat for anything beyond annoying other people with their backround noise of loud music or babies crying in years. From my perspective, this article's perspective on online experiences is dated, it's just dead out there.

Of course I also haven't played Counter-Strike in years, so who's to say.

Yeah, what with parties and everything, it does seem like alot is just background noise these days.

 

[NumberTwo]

There is this trend with internet media in general that features black people where the mere fact of them being black incites a torrent of racial epithets or racist discussions in the comment section. You look at random things like tech reviews, game reviews, etc.. and almost always there is going to be a toxic discussion calling attention to the fact that they are black and are doing something that (apparently) subverts some peoples racist preconceived notions. MKBHD is one of the few to garner mainstream appeal despite all that. Most of the discussion around his videos actually happen to be about the content of the video (for once).

This extends to gaming as well. I remember the old days of SOCOM II and the many many times I had 'nigger' thrown out because the opposing team got swept. This would happen before I spoke, but it almost always picked up after I did. After the PS2 era ended, I tended to play most of my online games without a mic. Even to this day, I prefer to play games like Destiny, or FarCry without one because I just don't feel like drawing attention. Listening to random players is more often than not going to be grating experience by itself, so I don't see the point in making things worse.

 

[Jeronimo Jones]

I wonder what it takes to be considered the "whitest black guy" someone knows. I haven't ever been called that and it would piss me off honestly.

I think some of us (people) confuse other people because we don't easily fit into stereotypes. Others are seen as fitting more closely and are teased or lumped in with them.

I'm college/grad school educated, like games and tech, and art but I also like and follow sports, hip-hop, tats, and sneakers. Too many checkboxes on either side I guess...

 

[Monster Zero]

I identify with the "Black Nerd" comment. I get some flak from my black friends, but even from my white friends. I'm now the whitest black guy they know. As if being educated, and liking intelligent topics, somehow makes me less black.

I'm gonna argue this point, there are plenty of intelligent black men both young and old who are socially accepted by other blacks, it's about how you carry yourself, being black/educated/nerd is not recipe for teasing from your peeps, not to that extent.

 

[Razzorn34]

This is me. I used to get picked on by friends and cousins when I was younger. I used to hear 'you're not black enough' or 'stop being white'. Like it was a choice for me. It made me a shamed for a long time. I had a crisis of identity for a long time.

I'm with you. I struggled with what I enjoy and want to be, and what friends and society says I should be. It's tough to be confident in yourself and have high self-esteem, when everyone around you isn't giving you any positive reinforcement.

 

[Silky]

I wonder what it takes to be considered the "whitest black guy" someone knows. I haven't ever been called that and it would piss me off honestly.

I was called that in high school because I was relatively quiet and intelligent. It was shitty.

 

[K.Jack]

The one game I play online (Mechwarrior Online), I haven't told a single person that I'm black.

 

[Jeronimo Jones]

I was called that in high school because I was relatively quiet and intelligent. It was shitty.

That can't be all because so was I, but I wasn't called that then and haven't been so far, was what I meant.

 

[SerTapTap]

Mute button is where it at.
I don't play online game in public lobby for this reason. Or voice chat. I tend to mute them.

Mute button is presently a godsend, but it's really depressing that it's so necessary, and it majorly harms cooperative online play when people can't talk. It's a bandaid.

That can't be all because so was I, but I wasn't called that, was my point.

Not everyone (mis)treats their friends the same.

 

[Steel]

I wonder what it takes to be considered the "whitest black guy" someone knows. I haven't ever been called that and it would piss me off honestly.

I think some of us (people) confuse other people because we don't easily fit into stereotypes. Others are seen as fitting more closely and are teased or lumped in with them.

I'm college/grad school educated, like games and tech, and art but I also like and follow sports, hip-hop, tats, and sneakers. Too many checkboxes on either side I guess...

Frankly it pisses me off when a friend of mine gets called the "whitest black guy" by mutual friends and I'm not even black. I've talked to him and them about it casually and they all seem to be fine with it though, so there's really nothing to be done about it. It still makes me cringe on the inside when they talk about how "white" he is, like black people should default to ghetto-speak.

 

[dark10x]

One of the many reasons why I simply do not enjoy or play multiplayer games with anyone outside of friends and family. I've come to realize that, while I like the concept of multiplayer games, it is not possible for me to enjoy them due to the audience. The behavior of people online combined with the fact that I don't have the time or ability to become truly proficient at these games means that there is just no place for me there.

 

[Kyzon]

I wonder what it takes to be considered the "whitest black guy" someone knows. I haven't ever been called that and it would piss me off honestly.

My voice is all people usually need to call me that. I've even had people come into interviews for my job and to my face tell me "Oh... I thought you were white when we spoke on the phone." I speak intelligently, and I sometimes use bigger words as well, so people automatically assume I can't be black. I also used to get the "Oreo" name a lot as well, and when I was younger and ignorant to it I just went along and said, yup that's me.

Anyways, it doesn't really piss me off being called the "Whitest Black Guy." I usually respond with, "Because I speak intelligently, and carry myself in a positive manner?" That usually hushes people up, and if not I really don't care about their opinion further to pursue the issue with them personally unless they want to debate about it.

Oh, my voice for anyone interested in knowing what I'm talking about. Don't mind the actual "commentary" as I'm still learning how to do that properly for streams, lol.

 

[Mass_Pincup]

I identify with the "Black Nerd" comment. I get some flak from my black friends, but even from my white friends. I'm now the whitest black guy they know. As if being educated, and liking intelligent topics, somehow makes me less black.

This happened to me as well regularly, from both friends (white and black) and family, I usually shrug it off but sometimes it can really piss me off.

 

[Razzorn34]

I wonder what it takes to be considered the "whitest black guy" someone knows. I haven't ever been called that and it would piss me off honestly.

I think some of us (people) confuse other people because we don't easily fit into stereotypes. Others are seen as fitting more closely and are teased or lumped in with them.

I'm college/grad school educated, like games and tech, and art but I also like and follow sports, hip-hop, tats, and sneakers. Too many checkboxes on either side I guess...

That is a large part of it. The other part is how you sound, and carry yourself. Growing up, I was into games, tech, sports, and hip-hop also. But, I've since let sports and hip-hop go. I also grew up in a suburban neighborhood that was predominantly white. Because of that, I didn't have a ton of black friends until I started school. Because of my upbringing, I didn't talk like them, nor act the same. So, the teasing begins.

 

[EventHorizon]

These types of issues tarnish online gaming so much that I'm surprised that console makers haven't done more to shape, or let their players shape, their online communities beyond the simple reputation systems. For example they should offer a "Mute due to language" ability and allow players to select an option that would automatically mute online players that have crossed some threshold for being muted in such a way. Basically they should be building up profiles of the players and give the community tools to shape their interactions with other players based on those profiles.

 

[Asriel]

I identify with the "Black Nerd" comment. I get some flak from my black friends, but even from my white friends. I'm now the whitest black guy they know. As if being educated, and liking intelligent topics, somehow makes me less black.

This is what I went through at high school. It was miserable.

 

[dark10x]

My voice is all people usually need to call me that. I've even had people come into interviews for my job and to my face tell me "Oh... I thought you were white when we spoke on the phone." I speak intelligently, and I sometimes use bigger words as well, so people automatically assume I can't be black. I also used to get the "Oreo" name a lot as well, and when I was younger and ignorant to it I just went along and said, yup that's me.

Anyways, it doesn't really piss me off being called the "Whitest Black Guy." I usually respond with, "Because I speak intelligently, and carry myself in a positive manner?" That usually hushes people up, and if not I really don't care about their opinion further to pursue the issue with them personally unless they want to debate about it.

Oh, my voice for anyone interested in knowing what I'm talking about. Don't mind the actual "commentary" as I'm still learning how to do that properly for streams, lol.

Man, I can't believe I'm reading this stuff in 2015. :\ Rather disheartening to say the least.

 

[fader]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JOY9CbIK9zk

too real, fresh prince

"running the same race and jumping the same hurdles you are"

that quote run deeps.

 

[Dre_G_Writer]

These were good quotes. I definitely will read the whole thing later. That online one struck home with me because I rarely voice chat online unless it's with close friends because I've been often mocked because of my "southern ghetto" accent.

Yea I feel the same way, that part hit home for me because thats my exact reason.
I have what people call "the black man" voice. When I talk, because of my low, deep voice, they automatically know think im black. And with that, comes remarks that i don't wanna hear. Although im black, im very light skinned, like if i cut my head bald, I look hispanic.

I remember back when playing final fantasy 14 last year, a game where I dont even speak with voice, one of our guild members found out i was black, and his whole attitude towards me change. dude became such a dick that the guild leader had to kick the dude because of it, and we've been in the same guild, talking and playing together for like 6-7 months.

 

[Angelus Errare]

This article and the responses in this thread touch on the reason why I rarely voice chat in games, it bothers me to be insulted by someone much dumber than myself in all measured aspects of intelligence, in fact the crazy amount of racism I've experience in life might be the cause of my budding narcissism...I should look into that. In fact the last time I did voice chat was GAF Mumble with the Diablo 3 crew. Cool people they are.

 

[mrjohill]

That "whitest black guy they know" thing is something I really despise. Makes it seem like since you don't fit a predetermined racial mold than you forfeit your racial identity.

 

[ShinMaruku]

I'm Jamaican and most of the comments I get is either people love my accent or how I sound like some wierd Brit/Jamaican hybrid. (Thanksgreat granddad you old Tommy you)

As for the slurs don't say I run into it. I hear teams like "Nigga" a bit because I play fighting games and that crowd is very diverse, but then again I don't play much online games and I only play a select few. But from streams and listening to other chats I can tell in some games it's problem.

As to the dearth of black designers, it's a big 2 part issue, economical and social, is it considered a awesome job oppurtunity to people of colour? Of course not there are much bigger pies out there to get. Game development is a very technical field that needs quite a bit of education, it's something for more upper class people than lower middle class people, also it's a bubble, if you are in the development bubble things are out of sight out of mind.

I'm fortunate enough to have a opportunity to get a foot in the door (But I declined to work in Molecular Biology) but I know my background is different being from the Caribbean where things are a bit different and having a college educated parent and what not.

But I know the hurdles we need to clear to get participation up. However it's gonna be a lot of work.

 

[Cipherr]

I hear nigger and faggot almost every Counter Strike match I play. I also change my accent. Being called a dumb redneck through the whole match sucks.

Yep thats the sad part, it isn't even just us minorities either. I cannot even count the number of times I have heard someone with an american southern accent just minding their own business only to be called white slurs and insulted because of it. Voice chat in gaming is a hive of scum and villainy.

 

[spekkeh]

I identify with the "Black Nerd" comment. I get some flak from my black friends, but even from my white friends. I'm now the whitest black guy they know. As if being educated, and liking intelligent topics, somehow makes me less black.

This is my life, everyday.

captmcblack
God-Tier ghetto pass

Whelp. As a non-American whose experience is mostly based on television, do you feel this has gotten worse over the years? I noticed in my surroundings in the nineties that the number of black people wearing ghetto outfits (typical 'jail chic') went from zero to almost hundred percent; mimicking rappers and I guess at some point it becoming a pervasive identity, like being black meant looking like a jailbird. That always struck me as odd. I'm not saying there wasn't widespread racism before but surely that mustn't have helped in perception.

 

[Acorn]

Sorta related but the lack of a block everyone's mic but friends on psn(I assume xone still has this from 360 times? )is infuriating. Especially on FIFA that has no mute option in game.

You need to make a fake party to avoid hearing idiots.

 

[RedSwirl]

And people wonder why Nintendo enforced friend codes and was late on the voice chat train. Stupid execution but the aim was always clear to me: to avoid harassment like this on what was essentially a family-oriented platform.

People still need to figure out how to curtail internet etiquette, even if it is just an extension of society.

 

["D"]

I havent freely chatted in a lobby since Call of Duty Modern Warfare 3. I got thick skin but hearing the same racist nonsense all the time gets old. I just stick to chatting with friends and family. Voice chat is pretty much useless to me outside of that.

A friend of mine absolutely wrecks people in Battlefield/Call of Duty games and he's had more than his fair share of "nigger" and hate mail in his messages inbox.

He and I just....laugh..

 

[Jeronimo Jones]

.

.

Yeah, I was getting at the point that even though one is black and intelligent, other factors including your friends, where you live, and the way you speak or carry yourself will influence the way you're perceived.

Not to imply that that's something anyone should have to concern themselves with, but that it is a factor.

Also not to derail the thread, but I just got an idea inspired by this discussion and dark10x's post... if any of you (GAF folks in general, not just black people) want to add me and play online sometime my PSN info is in my profile.

We don't have to talk (I'm not often that social anyway) and I play for fun.

 

[AbortedWalrusFetus]

When Jason Richardson won Philly Geek of the Year

I'm not going to lie, when I saw this I thought they meant the 76ers point guard. Then I remembered that Geekadelphia has a geek of the year thing.

 

[SarcasticD]

Heard every term in the book thrown my way over the years of playing online

It is funny that 99% of the time they keep using outdated stereotypes against me.

 

[chaobreaker]

I remember a black guy appearing on AGDQ and the Twitch chat went to racial epithets almost immediately. The mods cleaned it up, but it was just so damn sad.

This is also the reason I don't play MP FPSes.

And then the Sonic Heroes run started and all hell broke loose on that chat.

 

[Infinite]

I seldom play games online at all due in part because of this shit. I also close twitch stream chats.

 

[Razzorn34]

Whelp. As a non-American whose experience is mostly based on television, do you feel this has gotten worse over the years? I noticed in my surroundings in the nineties that the number of black people wearing ghetto outfits (typical 'jail chic') went from zero to almost hundred percent; mimicking rappers and I guess at some point it becoming a pervasive identity, like being black meant looking like a jailbird. That always struck me as odd. I'm not saying there wasn't widespread racism before but surely that mustn't have helped in perception.

Yes, and no.

Yes, in the sense that there are more intelligent influences to pull from today, than ever before. I mean, we currently have a black president, and guys like Neil deGrasse Tyson for positive influences.

No, in the sense that hip-hop and jail culture is still being glorified in the media. If you only looked at the media from afar, you would think that blacks are only prevalent in music, and athletics.

 

[TheHollowNight]

I think this is one of the only times I've seen complete unanimous agreement in the thread over the article and issue at hand. And It's great people are becoming more open to sharing their personal (albeit predominantly negative) experiences because importantly, this needs to be discussed more.

its incredibly depressing and concerning that so many even here have experienced such racist vitriol first hand...or witnessed such toxicity directed to others; to the point that the default response is to mute everyone, only play with friends or even more concerning, change the way you speak so you don't get targeted. This behaviour and the attitudes perpetuated by the assholes in the community have gone unchallenged for far too long. It's time to stamp this out.

I need to read the whole article in detail before I engage further in the discussion, but this is a great find Lime. Thanks for posting.

 

[vypek]

Going back to the comments on the articles, its almost how scary the reactions of people who don't want to think about this are. You can tell just from looking at a few comments that people only looked at the title or maybe the first paragraph. Maybe it would have been more helpful if that article was prefaced with that experiment where you try to view things from someone else's view. I guess ignorance is bliss.