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Gaming while black: Casual racism to cautious optimism

Trey

Member
The oreo thing is bothersome. By any measure is it the mark of an idiot when someone invokes that "you don't talk/sound/act black."
 

KennyKen

Member
Dope article. I use to hear the "whitest black guy" from time to time too. It made me wonder tho What does it actually mean to "black" and what do people think it means.
 
Every word of it is true.

I'll also say that I've seen noticeably less racism online in PC gaming over the years.

Also, the death of people (black or otherwise) talking on consoles is, in my opinion, less about racism and more about the birth of party chat. It killed the social experience that made Xbox Live what it was for most of the last decade. XBL was like walking into an arcade; everyone talking, meeting new people playing the games you wanted to play waiting in line (those old enough to have been standing in arcades on Saturday Mornings in the 90s and early 2000s know what I'm talking about). Party chat took that away; not racism. As such I think that point is marginally flawed, though still has real bits of truth in it. There are definitely times I don't feel like talking precisely because I don't want to have yet another conversation that goes something like,

"are you black? black people play this game?!!?"

"yes, we do. enjoying getting carried by the first black guy you've met?"

It's not that it's exhausting so much as you just don't always feel like having that sort of conversation. It tends to overshadow whatever is supposed to be happening in the game itself.

CSGo might be a different experience; I've only played that game for the first time last month, and only a little.

I have no critique of any other point made, however.
 

galvatron

Member
Whelp. As a non-American whose experience is mostly based on television, do you feel this has gotten worse over the years? I noticed in my surroundings in the nineties that the number of black people wearing ghetto outfits (typical 'jail chic') went from zero to almost hundred percent; mimicking rappers and I guess at some point it becoming a pervasive identity, like being black meant looking like a jailbird. That always struck me as odd. I'm not saying there wasn't widespread racism before but surely that mustn't have helped in perception.

It's a bit odd that you think that television is indicative of real life, but I'll give you an honest answer to your question and say this is as good as it has gotten in this country with the incidents described in this thread only serving to show that racism still exists.

Typical shows not explicitly targeted at blacks usually go out of their way to make sure the black supporting cast or even extras are portrayed positively. For every black criminal arrested on a tv show there's typically an upstanding black citizen portrayed elsewhere in the show. It's honestly a bit distracting seeing this balancing act constantly at work, but its better than the alternative.
 
The oreo thing is bothersome. By any measure is it the mark of an idiot when someone invokes that "you don't talk/sound/act black."

Lol I hear that all the time online and otherwise. I'm guessing it's because I skated for like 15 years and surf every now and then so I picked up the lingo of my friends. It's funny to me now, but I used to have to fight other black kids walking home from school just because I was "different"
 

mikesuszek

Neo Member
Hey folks, thanks for the kind words. I'm thrilled with how Jess' article turned out, it took a long time for her to research and conduct all the interviews. I appreciate seeing the notes here and further stories from y'all!
 
I've noticed this trend when playing online in a talkative lobby that ends up with multiple people saying the n-word over and over where it usually starts with just one dude to 'break the barrier' so to speak and open the floodgates, then all the rest of them want to get in on the action and get in their racial slurs to be one of the cool kids. It's totally disgusting and makes it blatantly obvious how much of online voice chat racism is made up of white kids who know they would get their asses kicked if they said it in real life now suddenly having the freedom to say it without consequence and so just letting it all out.

Really the worst part of the 'unfiltered' anonymity of internet/voice chat in general is making you suspect that this is how people have been all along just behind closed doors where you never had access to. In hushed whispers and interpersonal jokes. If you are a minority that was considered 'one of the good ones' in order to fit in to the crowd around you, you may have been sheltered from unfiltered opinions the majority has on your people. Then you come to the internet and are met with such huge amounts of garbage that it breaks the facade and makes you suspect everything.
 

SerTapTap

Member
Going back to the comments on the articles, its almost how scary the reactions of people who don't want to think about this are. You can tell just from looking at a few comments that people only looked at the title or maybe the first paragraph. Maybe it would have been more helpful if that article was prefaced with that experiment where you try to view things from someone else's view. I guess ignorance is bliss.

I didn't read the comments (because I value my sanity), but thats why it's important to be aware of these things, read people's real experiences. I guarantee people posting in the comments aren't aware, and don't WANT to be aware, of what really happens. It's also easier to ignore slurs that don't apply to you, or that aren't directed at you--what's the big deal, am I right? But the people who need to understand the most won't seek to learn. So there's no easy way out. Best you can do is do your best not to shit up someone else's day by being aware of this stuff.
 
haven't you guys heard? the fighting game community has a certain percentage of black folks involved in it, so racism is over with forever in all things video game related
 
It's a bit odd that you think that television is indicative of real life, but I'll give you an honest answer to your question and say this is as good as it has gotten in this country with the incidents described in this thread only serving to show that racism still exists.

Typical shows not explicitly targeted at blacks usually go out of their way to make sure the black supporting cast or even extras are portrayed positively. For every black criminal arrested on a tv show there's typically an upstanding black citizen portrayed elsewhere in the show. It's honestly a bit distracting seeing this balancing act constantly at work, but its better than the alternative.
What show would that be? Generally, I am more likely to see a negative stereotypes than a positive one, but it could be bias.

I have heard of causes where foreigners hate blacks solely due to watching all the negative portray of blacks on TV and movies.
 
It's a bit odd that you think that television is indicative of real life, but I'll give you an honest answer to your question and say this is as good as it has gotten in this country with the incidents described in this thread only serving to show that racism still exists.

Typical shows not explicitly targeted at blacks usually go out of their way to make sure the black supporting cast or even extras are portrayed positively. For every black criminal arrested on a tv show there's typically an upstanding black citizen portrayed elsewhere in the show. It's honestly a bit distracting seeing this balancing act constantly at work, but its better than the alternative.
Uhm...you'd be surprised at how influential the media is on more impressionable (i.e the vast majority) parts of the population. It reinforces their preconceived notions and beliefs, affirms them, and creates a feedback loop.

For weaker-minded individuals, media is a very crucial component and it is extremely lopsided in representation of whites vs. non-whites. There's no mistaking that.

Back on topic, sometimes I get the feeling the gaming community is more discriminatory than others. Kind of get the feeling the immaturity of the medium as a whole (in comparison to others) plays a part in that however, so naturally it should get better over time. But another bigger factor to that depends on more minorities joining the development field and featuring minority characters as the draw of their works. Yeah you'll lose some people but if they can't see the bigger picture in why this is happening they weren't worth fighting for in the first place, it's their loss.

Those who can see the bigger picture, and are willing to give those games a chance (hopefully they're also good games) will have that much more neat stuff to pass away their leisurely time with.
 

SerTapTap

Member
Back on topic, sometimes I get the feeling the gaming community is more discriminatory than others. Kind of get the feeling the immaturity of the medium as a whole (in comparison to others) plays a part in that however, so naturally it should get better over time. But another bigger factor to that depends on more minorities joining the development field and featuring minority characters as the draw of their works. Yeah you'll lose some people but if they can't see the bigger picture in why this is happening they weren't worth fighting for in the first place, it's their loss.

Well, it's a cultural thing, and there are mini-cultures within gaming, as all other things. The FPS culture seems to have particularly high levels of tolerance, even encouragement, for slurs of all kinds, and racist ones are some of the most popular. The FGC seems to have a fairly diverse playerbase, though it still has a slur problem. Speedrunning does not have that same diversity, mostly white and asian. I'm afraid FGC and speedrunning are the only two big visible groups that show in "real life" for me to personally judge, if I had to guess though, I would assume more spheres of gaming skew towards white/asian than other races.

"Legitimacy" and role models have a big affect though. When up at Evo or AGDQ, people behave. There's some swears at AGDQ on accident but they've gotten quite professional for the most part and what's on stream at Evo and such is usually pretty calm and professional(to a reasonable degree. Not like everyone's in suits but there's no heckling and swearing on stream)

I kinda wonder if eSports + good role models couldn't help reverse some of the trends. On the other hand there was a video of a bunch of COD pros that were absurdly foul mouthed so it depends how good your role models are.
 

Teknoman

Member
Yep thats the sad part, it isn't even just us minorities either. I cannot even count the number of times I have heard someone with an american southern accent just minding their own business only to be called white slurs and insulted because of it. Voice chat in gaming is a hive of scum and villainy.

At its best, its great. At its worst, its horrible. But yeah, even White people with certain accents will catch hell online every now and again.
 

Steel

Banned
I didn't read the comments (because I value my sanity), but thats why it's important to be aware of these things, read people's real experiences. I guarantee people posting in the comments aren't aware, and don't WANT to be aware, of what really happens. It's also easier to ignore slurs that don't apply to you, or that aren't directed at you--what's the big deal, am I right? But the people who need to understand the most won't seek to learn. So there's no easy way out. Best you can do is do your best not to shit up someone else's day by being aware of this stuff.

It's odd, because when the slurs were being spun out before party chat became a thing and everyone abandoned public chat, you'd hear everyone, regardless of race get trash-talked to some degree like this:

I get called the N word ( even tho I am not black), gay etc etc on FIFA more then any other game.

So it's not like they're ignoring something that doesn't apply to them. If you either did extremely well or extremely bad in a game you'd likely hear plenty of unpleasant things. So I'm not sure how they can pretend it doesn't exist, unless, of course, they're the ones dishing it out.
 
Very revealing stats, I speak in ebonics so it isn't hard to tell me apart when playing online games. I like to attribute these prevailing attitudes to relative anonymity, or rather if you something disrespectful that person can't retaliate. In terms of the statistics, it is an issue but as I've stated many times the issue traces back to a strong lack of resources and backing. Statistically minorities (Blacks and Latinos in particular) gets it hella rough when it comes to funding. We'll have to wait for the barriers to entry to come down meaning a much higher access to middleware and/or a rise in freeware development that can be easily accessible as well as a centralized free educational resource for Game Development, Networking and Support initiatives. The barrier to entry for making games is lower, but there are still many barriers holding back minority gamers from attempting serious game development. I remain optimistic that we'll get there eventually.
 
That was a great article and this thread is really eye opening. As a white guy I don't have anything useful to say but it's good to hear other people's perspectives.
My only black friends are an accountant and a historian, and I know they get really pissed at the assumption that they aren't 'really' black.
 

Kade

Member
I'm 24, it's 2015 and I still get that oreo shit sometimes. It's dumb as hell.

I missed that one. What happened there? Was it another black speed runner?

Black runner, his black friends and some other black people get on camera, Twitch chat spams every black emoticon, N words and the many variations of it, etc. All this despite the fact that this dude was doing really good almost non-stop commentary and explanation while playing a game in a manner that requires extreme concentration and dexterity. There were one or two "HOW IS HE TALKING LIKE THIS/THIS MUCH AND NOT FUCKING UP?!" comments but it was mostly racist garbage. It was pretty bad.
 

zeldablue

Member
Hmm...I'm a very "white" black female nerd. I basically only play Nintendo games though, so I can't identify with the slurs online.

I played Halo Reach with a mic once, but I don't sound "black." Instead people would either assume I was a 10 year old boy or a really hot lady. :\

Heh.

"Gaming culture is a direct reflection of our society," she said. "The only reason racism and sexism run rampant in gaming is because racism and sexism run rampant in society. But in physical spaces, mostly, it's not overt. It's subtle. It's covert. So, yes, these issues manifest in a similar manner in gaming, but I contend that they present themselves worse. It's not subtle. It's in-your-face racism. A black person may not be called a nigger to their face, but they can almost guarantee it will happen in virtuality."

This does make me sad. I think a lot of people play games to live a more idealized life. One where black people and women who act like real humans are nonexistent.
 

Coolade

Member
Instantly muting other players and only putting on a headset when with a private party has been second nature for over 7 years now. The will to respond or react to racial slurs online quickly dies and you just learn to ignore and evade it as much as possible.

Black representation in videogames is a rare thing, the happiest I've been with all around inclusion when it comes to race and gender has been playing Dragon Age Inquisition. I wish more games would follow suit. You don't have to exaggerate stereotypes to appeal to a wide or specific group of people.
 
It's an interesting article but clearly very America-centric. Not saying that that's a bad thing, just that there's such much perspective their that myself, as a British born-and-bred black guy of African ethnicity, generally fails to relate to...

I agree though that there's relatively poor representation of most minorities within the industry.

Having spent 6 years working as a software developer in games myself, I've only ever met two other black people: one was an artist, another (female) a QA tester and I've never ever met another programmer like myself.

It's not just restricted to video games though, as I left the industry about 2 years ago and have been doing software engineering in the financial services sector, and again there are generally fewer black people than most other ethnicities around.

Back to the article though, I personally find the concept of "racial identity" a weird one. I guess it's because in the UK we don't have the same bonkers societal racial divide you get over there, where American culture is split almost entirely into segregated racial subsets that are radically different and don't intermix easily.

Over here you still get racism from the odd, backwards individuals but it really is few and far between and isn't something that affects your opportunities, your freedoms, your social standing or anything else in a general sense.

That's why for me, my "identity" is defined purely by how I see myself, in terms of value system and cultural orientations, none of which are sub-divided along racial lines generally speaking...

I would generally identify myself as "British" first (by character, by culture, by nationality), then "African" (by heritage, by blood, also by nationality) but certainly not "black", since in the context of British life, it's kinda meaningless to me at least...
 
I rarely play online games with voice chat, but for the games that do play (like Dota 2), others can't tell that I'm black. I'm not African American so that might have to do with me not having that kind of voice people can immediately pick up as being from a black guy. Didn't encounter much targeted racism online as a result.

I lived in a neighbourhood of first generation immigrants from all over the world so that contributed to how I speak as well. English is my first and only language, though.

I had online friends completely stumped at what race I was until I spilled the beans. In two different occasions, I had strangers online tell me I sounded like 2 different Breaking Bad characters lol.
 
It's an interesting article but clearly very America-centric. Not saying that that's a bad thing, just that there's such much perspective their that myself, as a British born-and-bred black guy of African ethnicity, generally fails to relate to...

I agree though that there's relatively poor representation of most minorities within the industry.

Having spent 6 years working as a software developer in games myself, I've only ever met two other black people: one was an artist, another (female) a QA tester and I've never ever met another programmer like myself.

It's not just restricted to video games though, as I left the industry about 2 years ago and have been doing software engineering in the financial services sector, and again there are generally fewer black people than most other ethnicities around.

Back to the article though, I personally find the concept of "racial identity" a weird one. I guess it's because in the UK we don't have the same bonkers societal racial divide you get over there, where American culture is split almost entirely into segregated racial subsets that are radically different and don't intermix easily.

Over here you still get racism from the odd, backwards individuals but it really is few and far between and isn't something that affects your opportunities, your freedoms, your social standing or anything else in a general sense.

That's why for me, my "identity" is defined purely by how I see myself, in terms of value system and cultural orientations, none of which are sub-divided along racial lines generally speaking...

I would generally identify myself as "British" first (by character, by culture, by nationality), then "African" (by heritage, by blood, also by nationality) but certainly not "black", since in the context of British life, it's kinda meaningless to me at least...

One of the first things I saw when I visited London was a pissed off white dude yelling at a black dude to go back to his country in front of his family while everyone was lined up for the train. I was in line too and clearly from out of the country and he wasn't yelling at me; I can only assume because I'm white. I don't see that kinda shit where I'm from in the U.S.
 
One of the first things I saw when I visited London was a pissed off white dude yelling at a black dude to go back to his country in front of his family while everyone was lined up for the train. I was in line too and clearly from out of the country and he wasn't yelling at me; I can only assume because I'm white. I don't see that kinda shit where I'm from in the U.S.

Been in London now for over 8 years and I've never seen it either...
 

Daingurse

Member
Nigger, nigger, nigger. Just a fucking constant online. Aggravating the way it's casually thrown around on chat and voice. I just have to deal with it.
 

Hubbl3

Unconfirmed Member
I identify with the "Black Nerd" comment. I get some flak from my black friends, but even from my white friends. I'm now the whitest black guy they know. As if being educated, and liking intelligent topics, somehow makes me less black.

I had to tell my friends to stop calling me that. They thought it was a compliment and were actually shocked when I told them it comes off as more of an insult. They've since stopped saying it, but when I meet new people it's still one of the first things they say to me.

It's so damn aggravating.
 

zeldablue

Member
I've noticed this trend when playing online in a talkative lobby that ends up with multiple people saying the n-word over and over where it usually starts with just one dude to 'break the barrier' so to speak and open the floodgates, then all the rest of them want to get in on the action and get in their racial slurs to be one of the cool kids. It's totally disgusting and makes it blatantly obvious how much of online voice chat racism is made up of white kids who know they would get their asses kicked if they said it in real life now suddenly having the freedom to say it without consequence and so just letting it all out.

It's the other way around for me. I've never experienced personal racism online. But I've faced it plenty of times in real life. I'm a pretty passive person though, so I suppose there's less of a risk for bullies.

Really the worst part of the 'unfiltered' anonymity of internet/voice chat in general is making you suspect that this is how people have been all along just behind closed doors where you never had access to. In hushed whispers and interpersonal jokes. If you are a minority that was considered 'one of the good ones' in order to fit in to the crowd around you, you may have been sheltered from unfiltered opinions the majority has on your people. Then you come to the internet and are met with such huge amounts of garbage that it breaks the facade and makes you suspect everything.
This has happened to me very recently. With both race and gender. I had a rather idealistic view that we were pretty much past this, but now I feel as though a lot of people are just more discreet about their feelings and try to play nice to keep their clean social standing.
 

Teknoman

Member
I've seen alot of people mention Nintendo online games as a way of not having to experience stuff like this. I didnt see/hear any of it in Pokemon X/Y or Pokemon Battle Revolution, but with a competitive shooter like Splatoon giving you lots of different skin tone options, I really hope it doesnt rear its ugly head there.
 

zeldablue

Member
I've seen alot of people mention Nintendo online games as a way of not having to experience stuff like this. I didnt see/hear any of it in Pokemon X/Y or Pokemon Battle Revolution, but with a competitive shooter like Splatoon giving you lots of different skin tone options, I really hope it doesnt rear its ugly head there.

I mean...everyone's really young. And the miis have plenty of skin tones. I've never seen racist comments on miiverse.
 
I avoid most multiplayer games with tons of voice chat for these very reasons. Most games I play generally have almost no online chat unless its people I know. Also why I never subscribed to XBL when I used my 360 sadly. First time I tried Forza 2 online... and then CoD4, nothing but racist and more comments spewed all over the chat. A few people were just in it to play and have fun and chat with their teammates but the majority I came across hurt the experience.

Thankfully fighting games came back in full swing and most people are too salty to chat after or during a match haha,
 

Inuhanyou

Believes Dragon Quest is a franchise managed by Sony
It's an interesting article but clearly very America-centric. Not saying that that's a bad thing, just that there's such much perspective their that myself, as a British born-and-bred black guy of African ethnicity, generally fails to relate to...

I agree though that there's relatively poor representation of most minorities within the industry.

Having spent 6 years working as a software developer in games myself, I've only ever met two other black people: one was an artist, another (female) a QA tester and I've never ever met another programmer like myself.

It's not just restricted to video games though, as I left the industry about 2 years ago and have been doing software engineering in the financial services sector, and again there are generally fewer black people than most other ethnicities around.

Back to the article though, I personally find the concept of "racial identity" a weird one. I guess it's because in the UK we don't have the same bonkers societal racial divide you get over there, where American culture is split almost entirely into segregated racial subsets that are radically different and don't intermix easily.

Over here you still get racism from the odd, backwards individuals but it really is few and far between and isn't something that affects your opportunities, your freedoms, your social standing or anything else in a general sense.

That's why for me, my "identity" is defined purely by how I see myself, in terms of value system and cultural orientations, none of which are sub-divided along racial lines generally speaking...

I would generally identify myself as "British" first (by character, by culture, by nationality), then "African" (by heritage, by blood, also by nationality) but certainly not "black", since in the context of British life, it's kinda meaningless to me at least...

I think it should be without saying that due to the history of the US, we are completely different in circumstances. The African descendant of America is completely different from the African descendent of other places as much as the British descendant of America or Britain or Australia are different from each other and Africa's British descendants. Its not a concept that is uncommon
 

Azriell

Member
I'm a white guy with no noticeable accent. I stick to party chat or forgo the mic because most people with a mic in online games are ass holes. Even without racism and sexism there will always be some dumb thing to shoot of at the mouth about because these people are ignorant. It really is a shame that a technology which should allow new friendships and enrich gameplay through team work and communication are instead about altogether because of this dumb shit.
 
The comments on joystiq are about as vile as expected it seems. Lots of 'it's just words! I get called them too!' and 'don't call us racist because we use racist slurs!' and the ever classic 'Stop reminding us that racism is still a thing, I don't like hearing that!' and so on.
 

Mononoke

Banned
Every word of it is true.

I'll also say that I've seen noticeably less racism online in PC gaming over the years.

Also, the death of people (black or otherwise) talking on consoles is, in my opinion, less about racism and more about the birth of party chat. It killed the social experience that made Xbox Live what it was for most of the last decade. XBL was like walking into an arcade; everyone talking, meeting new people playing the games you wanted to play waiting in line (those old enough to have been standing in arcades on Saturday Mornings in the 90s and early 2000s know what I'm talking about). Party chat took that away; not racism. As such I think that point is marginally flawed, though still has real bits of truth in it. There are definitely times I don't feel like talking precisely because I don't want to have yet another conversation that goes something like,

"are you black? black people play this game?!!?"

"yes, we do. enjoying getting carried by the first black guy you've met?"

It's not that it's exhausting so much as you just don't always feel like having that sort of conversation. It tends to overshadow whatever is supposed to be happening in the game itself.

CSGo might be a different experience; I've only played that game for the first time last month, and only a little.

I have no critique of any other point made, however.

Yeah I agree this is the main reason. But I have no doubt it was the kind of racist/sexist name calling and general abusive language that drove some people away. So as you said there are truths.
 

IKizzLE

Member
Yup. Nigger is very common in literally every game I play.
Funny enough, I talk pretty "white" so when people find out I'm black they are literally in shock over the mic and then when the relationships with these acquaintances begin to fall apart, I get called nigger all the time.

Pretty used to it after a decade of online multiplayer.
 

Usobuko

Banned
Is it me or does it seem like the acronym ' SJW' or 'social justice warrior' is often used to casually dismiss these topics?
 
Is it me or does it seem like the acronym ' SJW' or 'social justice warrior' is often used to casually dismiss these topics?

I noticed it too. It's seems to be a popular dog-whistle word for bigots to let go of their inhibitions and attract more of their kind in not-so explicity racist online communities. Actual shameless bigots basically use it for anyone who isn't a bigot like them. I think only NeoGAF is the only big community that doesn't let that shitty term float.
 
This has happened to me very recently. With both race and gender. I had a rather idealistic view that we were pretty much past this, but now I feel as though a lot of people are just more discreet about their feelings and try to play nice to keep their clean social standing.

Yup, it's like the internet has exposed us to the attitudes normally reserved for invite only country clubs and golf courses.
 
Is it me or does it seem like the acronym ' SJW' or 'social justice warrior' is often used to casually dismiss these topics?

That, and people claiming that the article is 'clickbait' aka, only written to make money. Comes back to the idea you see from a lot of GG types that 'no one actually cares about this stuff, it's all about money' as a way to further dismiss the topic.
 

ExVicis

Member
I guess I don't understand or have no idea but as a Black Man I have never really ever been identified online by voice, being identified as black that way in fact seems so weird to me. But then again I have been told I don't sound black? Something I didn't think was possible but...well I guess I don't. I mean my father who was black also speaks like me so I guess I never understood that black people apparently talk a certain way?

Am I the only one like this?
 

zeldablue

Member
I guess I don't understand or have no idea but as a Black Man I have never really ever been identified online by voice, being identified as black that way in fact seems so weird to me. But then again I have been told I don't sound black? Something I didn't think was possible but...well I guess I don't. I mean my father who was black also speaks like me so I guess I never understood that black people apparently talk a certain way?

Am I the only one like this?

There are plenty of people like that.

I was, like, the only black student in all my classes and my parents sounded just like everyone else. So naturally, I would also sound like those around me. You learn to talk by being around and listening to others, so that would be why certain people have different accents.
 
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