I owned a Dreamcast when this came out and Shenmue never looked like something worth playing and the endurance run has confirmed what I thought as a kid. It's really entertaining to see how bad everything is, though.
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Giant Bomb are bringing back the Endurance Run... and it's Shenmue.
- Thread starter MassiveNights
- Start date
Ine-san could be his step-mom.
Count of Monte Sawed-Off
un33dab@dpu$$y
Nah, I don't think it's clear enough there. The problem is that they're not going to the dojo any and so they're going to miss the hot Ryo and Fuku loving scene which explicitly spells it out.
Brianimaniac
Banned
Bullshit. I played Shenmue when it came out and it was a joke then. I don't know why people are acting like 2000 was caveman times and we didn't know what writing and voice acting were. This is not a case of something aging poorly, it's a case of something not being good in the first place. The only excuse for not realizing it at the time is if you were a very young child who couldn't be expected to know any better.
No, seriously. I love the endurance run but they are absolutely not playing the game "properly". They're missing so many clues, still haven't figured out you can press X to go right to the notepad at any time, or how to use a different save system to save anywhere. They really should have flicked through the manual.
There's no real concentration happening, because they have to concentrate on talking/making it entertaining, and it means they're running in circles a lot more than you would on a solo playthrough. The game is highly based in absorbing the information around you, and there's too much chatter in the endurance run style to do that.
This format is really the worst way to learn about Shenmue, it's better played on your own time. It works best when you get really immersed into a trance-like state, kind of like when you kind of tune out when playing, I dunno, an Elder Scrolls game.
The forklifting can get menial if you don't advance the plot properly, but wtf is this shit about the fighting being a low? It's a crazy versatile, omni-directional Virtua Fighter-lite with proto-Batman counters. You have to learn it to get the most out of it, but when you do it's superb.
If/when they play Shenmue II, you will understand why. The original Shenmue is a prologue chapter with its content stretched a little too far at SEGA's behest. Shenmue II is the martial arts epic the series was always meant to be.
If '88 is your birth year, I'm not surprised. You were too young. Nice for you that you can feel smug now that you were right all this time. But that's just your opinion. Other people have differing ones ("how everything is held together remains quite exquisite, under the closest scrutiny, even by 2014 standards").
She could also be his grandmother (she does look quite a bit older than his dad). Or a time-travelling robot...
Kenzodielocke
Banned
Was the QTE chase in this or the sequel?
It's really not THAT much of an uncommon opinion.
Are we watching the same game? It's awful.
There isn't even any charm to make up for the rest of the game being bad (like Deadly Premonition).
It's in this one. I don't think the first chase is until the end of disk 2 though, II does a better job of introducing the concept by making it part of the arm wrestling/QTE chase/FREE battle gauntlet in the first quest.
Again, the endurance run format (despite this one being fun) is not very conducive to playing Shenmue properly. It's also better actually played rather than watched, because you'll avoid frustrations like Vinny/Dan/Alex running past the next story location over and over and over and over-
Count of Monte Sawed-Off
un33dab@dpu$$y
You'll have to be specific, there are several in both.
The charm really comes through in the games atmosphere which is amazing. But I don't think that it has come through well in the endurance run, at least not yet, but it's still really early. It doesn't help that it's too dark and they're playing the game pretty poorly though. Three people trying to navigate through the town offering different suggestions and talking about completely random things all the while isn't the optimal way to play this game.
hosannainexcelsis
Member
I can agree that Shenmue II is a much better game than Shenmue I. I think the first Shenmue was a little too concerned with creating a virtual world at the expense of giving you interesting things to do in that world. Shenmue II handles this much better, as well as having a more interesting story and characters.
TharpDaddy
Member
Based on what i've seen, i'd do even worse than Vinny and co at playing this game. I'd probably miss the story location too, this gameplay also doesn't seem like something i'd enjoy. I'm pretty confident saying that i'd enjoy watching Shenmue more than i'd enjoy playing Shenmue.
Yeah. I really hope the do play Shenmue II, because the overall shift in pace will probably blow their goddamn minds.
Them running past locations has no effect on the horrible voice acting and laughable dialogue. Having direct control won't change the issues people have.
Count of Monte Sawed-Off
un33dab@dpu$$y
But there's more to it than that, and it sucks that people get caught up on those things and won't get passed them. The voice acting is certainly shit, it was shit when it came out and it's shit now. But there's still a lot to like in the game.
And at its heart it's basically a cheesy 80s action adventure, which the shitty acting sort of fits in with. Sort of.
Maybe not. Shenmue isn't for everyone. ¯\_(ツ
_/¯Heartbeats isn't that hard to find though, if you're actually paying attention. It's a pretty conspicuous alleyway, and I'm so surprised it didn't click with them earlier. It's actually lit up.
Bullshit yourself, buddy. I don't think the writing is bad at all. The English voice acting is quirky, but other games from that era didn't exactly do it better. Not being a native English speaker helps me overlook some of that.
I was well into adulthood when I first played the game in 2001, and I enjoyed it a lot.
PS: I don't take anyone seriously who says about a popular game that "it was never good in the first place". Such a trite phrase.
And? I never said anything about these and you'll be hard pressed to find someone who will go to bat for the uneven translation and bad voice acting.
You do get used to it though, like an accent. GBEast don't even really seem to care about it much now.
There are QTE chases with;
-The scrawny travel agent in Dobuita.
-Wong in Pigeon park
-Ren in the construction yard
-Tons away from Yuan and Niu
-Wong in Pigeon park
-Ren in the construction yard
-Tons away from Yuan and Niu
Brianimaniac
Banned
A string of people telling you to go talk to someone else over and over again is your idea of good writing? I am embarrassed for you. I can't imagine what your idea of bad writing is if you think Shenmue is good.
For people dismayed at why people want Shenmue 3, all I can say is that the game even on release was pretty divisive but it really resonated with people who did like it. Maybe it's how unique it was at the time and with the adventure and the characters itself. It's why when Shenmue 3 was announced you have reactions like this or this or famously, this. It's ok if you don't like it, just don't dimiss it outright considering you've only really seen the GB crew get fairly distracted playing it for the first few hours.
Love Shenmue 1 and 2, have no problem if the GB guys dislike or even hate certain parts of it, some aspects of the game have aged well, some have not. I think both games are a great example of an open world game where there's not necessarily value in having a massive open world, but one that's packed with detail to make the world really feel alive, the same way people laud the Yakuza games.
Love Shenmue 1 and 2, have no problem if the GB guys dislike or even hate certain parts of it, some aspects of the game have aged well, some have not. I think both games are a great example of an open world game where there's not necessarily value in having a massive open world, but one that's packed with detail to make the world really feel alive, the same way people laud the Yakuza games.
Your writing is much worse, that's for sure.
Also, people only tell you the same thing "over and over" if you're too dumb to get where you're supposed to go, so it's your fault.
Had I trashed every foreign movie with bad dubbed VA, I would have missed a lot of good movies actually.
I totally get that you dislike the voice acting, it's understandable and there are reasons why the english voice acting is not as good as it should be. Same for the dialogues/writing. It's fair to say that the translation from Japanese wasn't stellar.
Brianimaniac
Banned
You can't even comprehend basic message board posts, so I'm not surprised that you mistake Shenmue for quality writing.
You liking the writing in Shenmue says more about you than it does Shenmue.
That would be plotting not writing.
The plotting of Shenmue is left up to circumstance and player choice, as such there is many natural ways to progress through the game, so yes Shenmue does have good plotting.
As for the writing, it is often poorly translated and much of it comes off as odd, but the main through line narrative has quite good writing that fits with the martial arts drama influence.
Compare Shenmue's writing to Bruce Lee films to see how much better it is then it needed to be.
All I remember the teller doing is showing darkly lit models of characters, no real GPS style assistance.
Says the guy who jumps from me saying "I don't think the writing is bad at all" to "lol, you like the writing in Shenmue and think it's quality".
Did it ever cross your mind that I might be indifferent towards the writing, and think that it's neither good nor bad, just average? Of course not, because haters gonna hate.
Give War A Chance
Member
I didn't want a Persona 5 Endurance Run... But I am totally with you on the Yakuza part. That game is lengthy with a lot of extra fun stuff to do, and anime AF.
Would have made a great run! This isn't bad though, especially considering I never played Shenmue. Now I get to see what the hype is all about.
You're not reading him correctly. He said they were telling you to talk to someone else, over and over. Shenmue is like 2 discs of people telling you to talk to someone else, and then finding said person, who tells you to talk to someone else. I like it though. It could be insufferably mundane but it's heightened by the clumsy VA and writing and surprising amount of non-linearity. Sometimes it gets egregious, like you have an encounter that tells you to come back the following day for the real encounter. And since you can't skip time like you can in the sequel, you get "speed runs" of Shenmue 1 that take 8 hours. The game can be a bitch.
Count of Monte Sawed-Off
un33dab@dpu$$y
Unfortunately Shenmue's translation is a consequence of its size, and SEGA wanting the first game released ASAP. Some real cowboys were brought onto the project to do a lot of the flavour dialogue. The main story stuff is fine though.
Shenmue II's translation is more consistent, even if incredibly literal to the original Japanese.
Ah well. Not like they didn't run past a lit up alleyway over and over. I don't think them not finding Heartbeats is the game's fault.
Dan mentioned on the Bombcast that he might look into doing a Yakuza one after Shenmue 2.
Brianimaniac
Banned
You and some of the other people who like the game keep saying that you need to play it, as if directly controlling the character will change the things that people have said they don't like. The game doesn't look bad just because Vinny missed a building/isn't going back to the dojo/isn't worried about the cat/whatever other thing they aren't doing "right".
OverBlood 3
Banned
Cheers!
Jo Shishido's Cheeks
Member
THE GREATEST GAME OF ALL TIME!
It's not supposed to be played like this though, weird decision.
It's not supposed to be played like this though, weird decision.
The NPC dialog in this game is just that, NPC dialog. It's ineffectual and means nothing to the actual plot of the game. I honestly don't know why you're so hung about a 16 year old game over this aspect. Are you also this critical of FF7's translation, right down to the NPC chatter?
Hot Coldman
Banned
two pips to the right
Count of Monte Sawed-Off
un33dab@dpu$$y
It might not be for you either way, but they are making it look a lot rougher than it should be.
As you have probably noticed, Ryo's notebook has information "holes" because most of the time you have different options in order to find the right person to talk to or the right place to go to.
Again, as far as I remember, no other game back in 1999 gaved me such immersion feeling as Shenmue did.
Yes the game is basically linear, but it's designed smartly enough to give you the feeling it's not.
He's refuting the idea that plotting is separate from writing.
As an English Literature major, I agree with him.
It's like saying outlining isn't a part of the writing process. Plotting a story is like pacing a novel or a screenplay in this instance, and it can also apply to outlines being made for characters, locations, etc.
Granted, he made a typo.
The game is actually pretty good for having multiple NPCs who'll give you the branching clues needed to progress the story. Case in point: they skipped 90% of the three blades quest by visiting Liu Barber first, it's just they kinda futzed around a lot afterwards and didn't realise they progressed the plot.
I've already said the game requires concentration to play in the best possible way. They walked past a lit up alleyway with the next story location over and over. That's a consequence of an endurance run where the concentration focus is on being entertaining (which the ER is, don't get me wrong, I'm loving it), but it's not showing the game in the best light.
So yes, a better representation of the game is to play it yourself, set your own pace, and concentrate, the "right" way.
PandaShake
Member
Shenmue is the game I dreamt of playing when I was a kid. Simulating life, if I could virtually go from my house to a convenience store and shops. Witnessing the game for the first time now and I find it impressive for its time. I'm loving the endurance run so much too.
Dan and Vinny trolling each other should provide quality entertainment for years.
I dunno, that alleyway seems like a reasonable thing to miss and the game doesn't seem to do anything to direct you there. I feel like they were doing their due diligence in double checking the area maps and asking around [basically the only two gameplay mechanics they've encountered outside QTEs] except the location isn't on the map and the NPC dialogue doesn't have anything for asking about bar locations and just stays at asking about sailors [Bar Linda is two buildings down from Heartbeats but the lady out front only says 'no sailors here' but she has no dialogue for 'but they tend to like that place behind the slot house']. The district is also littered with several tiny dead-end alleys with nothing to offer. At some point Vinny started checking specifically for that but none of them even had the potential to hide anything which quickly discouraged the guys from checking them too thoughtfully. Additionally, there were several locations on the map that had lit up signs and other general lighting but were otherwise non-interactable so it's not as if that was a reliable clue, especially because the alley lighting isn't that prominent and basically looks like it could just be ambient light as a result of one of the blindingly light businesses nearby.
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