• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

GIBiz: After 200 unsuccessful pitches in 2 years, Deliver Us Mars dev Keoken Interactive says the way games are funded is "failing"

Thick Thighs Save Lives

NeoGAF's Physical Games Advocate Extraordinaire
It's been well established by now that things are tough in the games industry at the moment. Rather than future growth, many business leaders are focused on ensuring their business simply survives through 2024, with the ongoing wave of mass layoffs and closures a sign of how many are struggling.

For developers, that survival often relies on securing funding but, as investors have already told us, the bar for success when pitching has been raised much higher. Studios around the world are having trouble landing the capital they need to continue their current projects – and for some, including Deliver Us The Moon developer Keoken Interactive, time is running out.

Co-founder Koen Deetman tells GamesIndustry.biz that his studio has made an estimated 200 pitches for five games in the last two years, and none have resulted in a deal. The company has pitched for funding on both high and low budget projects, as well as publishing deals, and has gauged interest in acquisitions for both its IP and the studio itself.

In addition to expanding on its Deliver Us series, Keoken is trying to get new IP We Are Human off the ground, but this too has struggled. Realising the game isn't the right fit for certain publishers, it has adapted its prototypes but these efforts have been in vain.

"We understand some games don’t get signed or shouldn’t be made," Deetman tells us. "But to craft, adapt, and re-pitch five different games with more than 40 publishers and continuously be rejected because it’s too unique, it’s not unique enough, the budget is too high, the budget is too low, it’s too commercial, it’s not commercial enough – you start to wonder if it’s really just us that have to look in the mirror again, or that different issues are at play here."
He continues: "The model of how games were made is failing, and it desperately needs a more efficient and durable way of how we create these experiences. Combined with a post-COVID correction, signs of recession and inflation, the resulting massive wave of layoffs affecting most companies, it causes a tremendous downward spiral of unintuitive pessimism.

"People are worried about their jobs, and because of that, decide to save money for the company rather than spending it in order to improve their personal chances of survival. This results in an even more locked-up market."
Keoken has tried to balance things out by diversifying its revenue streams. It has negotiated for multiple work-for-hire contracts, and attempted to gain some co-development work, but none of this has born fruit. It even developed and published eight maps in Unreal Engine for Fortnite, but these have failed to generate much in the way of income. Management has even had to scale the company down from 45 people to 20 , while Koen and his fellow co-founder Paul Deetman have gone months without salary. But this still hasn't been enough.

"Game development is hard and very expensive," Koen Deetman explains. "When there is quite some money required to make a game, it’s understandable that mitigating risks is important, or that investing parties at least should have a way back to their money. However, this model seems to be very hard to make profitable for a developer, as I think most (good) games take a long time to recoup (if at all), meaning developers are locked out of a large portion of their potential earnings.
"This sends developers into a neverending cycle of finding connecting projects or deals to survive as a studio at all. This causes all sorts of problems, as we are running companies and bear responsibilities for people’s livelihoods. Something Paul and I have always recognised from the beginning. Having to let go of them is the worst and last thing you want to do.

"Game development needs to become far more durable and efficient; I think studios that have proven track records should be encouraged and helped to become more sustainable businesses without the need to make unnecessary decisions and constantly think about their immediate survival."
Keoken Interactive has proven its development chops in the past; Deliver Us The Moon and its sequel were received well by critics, and while Deetman doesn't share specific sales figures, he says the first title has been played by millions of people and continues selling to this day. Meanwhile, Deliver Us Mars followed a similar 'sleeper hit' cadence to the original but at a much quicker pace. Deetman observes that had Koeken been the sole benefactor from these games, the studio would "probably be quite steady and healthier financially," but the nature of the games' publishing deals means this is not the case.

As a result, Keoken is relying on what Koen Deetman refers to as its "last resort"; ahead of GDC, the company is publishing a video in which Koen and Paul present the prototypes for all five of its games, calling on the community to help raise awareness before they spend the week in San Francisco trying to land a deal.
Koen says if they are unsuccessful, the studio will scale down to zero, management will help former team members find new roles, and they would need to wait for a better time to revive the company. Keoken is far from alone in this – Saltsea Chronicles creator Die Gute Fabrik and Australian developer Torus Games have both been compelled to halt production and put their businesses on hiatus.

"I think this would be an extremely unnecessary waste when you have a team with over 15 years of experience working together. Especially since the industry keeps breaking revenue records and keeps gaining more players," Koen adds.

Despite the dire straits Keoken and so many other studios face, Deetman remains optimistic overall for the games industry, providing it can endure these challenging times.
"The industry is changing and we’re in a rough patch," he says. "Probably one we have been underestimating in its severity. However, it doesn’t mean the end. If you look at what developers can create and how rich our industry has become with the sheer diversity of games you can play daily, we are looking towards a super bright future of creatives making massively interesting game experiences.

"Keoken aims to be among those creators... because if there is anything we love to do, it’s making games."
 

Thick Thighs Save Lives

NeoGAF's Physical Games Advocate Extraordinaire
I'll say that I've enjoyed both Deliver Us games so his news that they're not getting funding from any publishers even though they have 5 interesting prototypes, including a sequel to Deliver Us Mars, is a bit upsetting.

Really wish the platform holders would start funding more of these AA independent studios instead of tripling down on AAA titles and acquisitions...
 

jroc74

Phone reception is more important to me than human rights
Damn that sounds bleak as hell.

Best of luck to them. I liked both Deliver games.
 

HL3.exe

Banned
Know a friend who worked there. Let's just say the separation procedure didn't go all that smoothly and there is still a severance battle going on. They didn't really handle things all that fairly, and things seem poorly managed. I'll keep it at that.

Edit: I actually pitched a design-doc there:
Deus Ex/Hitman Freelance (gameplay) - meets Returnal (structure). meets NORCO/Disco Elysium (World/tone/scale)
 
Last edited:

Trogdor1123

Member
I'll say that I've enjoyed both Deliver Us games so his news that they're not getting funding from any publishers even though they have 5 interesting prototypes, including a sequel to Deliver Us Mars, is a bit upsetting.

Really wish the platform holders would start funding more of these AA independent studios instead of tripling down on AAA titles and acquisitions...
God yes. My faves this generation include a bunch of aa games. It’s a shame as I suspect they cost way less to make
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
Looks like the dot.com phase for making games is over. For those of you who didn’t live through the 2000 dot bomb phase you woulda been wowed at how easy it was to get money back then only for tons of .com sites bombing a year or two later.

As for this dev pitching games, why are they pitching 5?

It’s like watching Shark Tank and any time an entrepreneur pivots away from their core product every Shark says you’re all over the place and not really serious and just saying anything to get a deal hoping one of the last ditch proposals works.

When all the investor and partnership money disappears you’re left with bank loans. Good luck surviving on those. Those sound a lot more strict that investors money. This will weed out the fringe companies.
 
Last edited:

ProtoByte

Weeb Underling
Keoken Interactive has proven its development chops in the past; Deliver Us The Moon and its sequel were received well by critics
Dubiously put at best imo. The first game has a 77 on Metacritic on PS4 (cruising at 68 on PC) and a 6.5 with users; second is sub 70 across the board and at a 5.something with users. Steam reviews average a couple points higher on both counts, but still.

Really wish the platform holders would start funding more of these AA independent studios instead of tripling down on AAA titles and acquisitions...
I mean Sony bought Housemarque, might buy Arrowhead, funded Kena and helped out with Stray and Sifu.

Microsoft bought Double Fine, Obsidian and Compulsion, and have so far put out Hi-Fi Rush, Pentiment and Pscyhonauts 2. All games that were not widely played at all. I doubt Compulsion's next game is going to capture much attention either.

They can't save every little studio on the planet looking for funding. The truth is that there are too many games coming out and too many studios. A contraction to less is natural and necessary.

These guys are obviously personally invested (going months without salary is above and beyond), and I can empathize with that, but looking at the prototypes they've got going, I'm not seeing stuff that has much chance of capturing significant attention.

AA games were never the driver of the industry, and they, like AAA, cost more money and time to make than they ever did before. The ceiling for success has not increased with that proportionally. So when investors/publishers are looking at titles to fund, they're thinking about where their money and time is best spent. It's not on stuff like this.
 

OmegaSupreme

advanced basic bitch
care to elaborate?

stop GIF


Haven't you been paying attention to his 20 threads evangelizing gaas games?
 

Magic Carpet

Gold Member
I enjoyed Deliver us the Moon, but I bailed during Deliver Us Mars, around the point I actually got to Mars. :(
Remove the personal Family Drama in your story and I might have stuck around.
I want to explore a mystery on Mars not what was offered.

This reminded me of the Disney movie 'Brave' Advertised as one thing and then the reveal of the Mother Bear, I actually sank into my movie seat with a 'Ohhhhh' This is what the movie is about.
I feel betrayed.

But still- I like this type of game. And want more
 
Last edited:
Seems like if they had a loyal fanbase they can just go kickerstarter or something. If they can't get that going, maybe the publishers are right to reject because there isn't much demand for their work.
 

Men_in_Boxes

Snake Oil Salesman
care to elaborate?
They specialize in making a game type that is growing less and less popular by the year. Single player + puzzles + story based and they don't seem particularly great at them OR successful with them either.

If they're pitching more of that, I have an idea why they're getting a bunch of nos.
 
They specialize in making a game type that is growing less and less popular by the year. Single player + puzzles + story based and they don't seem particularly great at them OR successful with them either.

If they're pitching more of that, I have an idea why they're getting a bunch of nos.
but what else can they do?
 

midnightAI

Banned
There are several avenues in regards to funding (more than ever in fact), publishers may be a bit more cautious at the moment but I wouldnt say its a failing of the game industry because none of your pitches havent paid off. There could be loads of reasons for that, from uninteresting games to successful pitches not being agreed to by the terms put forth (I bet this has happened several times)

Unfortunately we don't know the full story here (and may never), but what tends to happen is developers set their sights too high and then try and get unrealistic amounts of money from publishers (or if the money is high they expect a return from that usually as a high percentage of the sales as they have every right to). Not saying that is what is going on here of course, this could simply be publishers not liking what they see (although their games are interesting so I doubt it?)
 
Last edited:
Some expensive (and also trash) games should never have been made, while some games that would have found fans and at least broke even, are never made. Unfair world.

ahead of GDC, the company is publishing a video in which Koen and Paul present the prototypes for all five of its games, calling on the community to help raise awareness before they spend the week in San Francisco trying to land a deal.
seems like a reasonable apporach. If people hate it, they have to forget these specific ideas and stop putting more effort in those, if the echo is fine, and still no one talks more in depth it would be a bit weird. But even positive response is still no guarantee.
Luck, connections, and sometimes wealthy parents are certainly required like with other writers, musicians, f1 driver and whatnot too.

The comment about publishing deals...and that not much of the revenues trickles down to the actual devs. Outside of physical releases, why do you even need a publishing deal nowadays? Isn't self publishing quite easy on all digital storefronts?
 
Top Bottom