Bam Bam Baklava
Member
I wonder what issue that has a personal connection to them the GOP is appealing to.
GOP Primary Debate #3 |CNBC| Burning Bush
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I wonder what issue that has a personal connection to them the GOP is appealing to.
OuterLimits
Member
Of course they do. However, I can't see how anyone can say the kiddie debate wasn't more focused on the economy. In main debate they were asking Huckster if he would support Trump. How is that about economy exactly?
Cold-blooded <3
So their souls did get threatened during the one of the intermissions. A sad state of affairs.
Final time tally
Poor Jeb!
Nah not really, f him - he made his own bed
Seems accurate to me
Yep. I certainly think there are ways in which the government could be a lot more efficient than it currently is but these guys just fucking hate government wholesale.
Also, a lot of these guys seem to have thin skin if they scream "liberal media" whenever they are getting critiqued.
Questions could be more policy driven but even when they were, candidates often sidestepped those sorts of questions too.
Earthstrike
Member
In theory, stasis of the current state of affairs is actually the best possible outcome, if you want to take the whole "radical outsiders leading the party will destroy it" angle
Unknown Soldier
Member
That all-weekend strategy meeting which supposedly happened with the whole Bush family and important donors didn't seem to do anything.
Jeb! will probably drop before December just to save face as his poll numbers flatline. It's embarrassing to his family at this point, he needs to throw in the towel. His brother has probably ruined all Bush political chances for a generation or so, not that Jeb! is a great politician or anything to begin with and he can't blame his brother for being just so bad at politics.
Orbis Tabula
Member
True, I can imagine just about everyone staying where they are, with the exception of Rubio rising at Jeb's expense. Other than that, stasis, as you put it.
Veritigo_X
Member
Rubio's "liberal media" defense might work now, but that shit won't fly in the general election. I wonder how he would handle the same questions as the nominee. There's no way he'd say the same thing during a general election debate.
The audience just wouldn't favour it either. You could tell the moderators were getting shook by the hostile audience.
PlayALLtheGames
Banned
I had to leave half-way through so now I'm catching up.
To Huckabee and Carson's credit: they were CLOSE on the economy. Carson first said we should take subsidies from oil and redirect it to ethanol. Alright, I'll go with that. Now he says he was wrong and there should be no subsidies. Oooh, so close! He also doesn't understand that the concept of "too big too fail" is not "picking winners and losers", but a corrective response to an inherent and demonstrably real problem with certain types of financial institutions.
Meanwhile, Huckabee, in a rare sign of clarity, acknowledged stagnant wages and the ever-increasing wealth gap, reminding us how the middle class has "taken it in the teeth", but went on to blame gubment regulations and the gubment in general. Again, so close!
To Huckabee and Carson's credit: they were CLOSE on the economy. Carson first said we should take subsidies from oil and redirect it to ethanol. Alright, I'll go with that. Now he says he was wrong and there should be no subsidies. Oooh, so close! He also doesn't understand that the concept of "too big too fail" is not "picking winners and losers", but a corrective response to an inherent and demonstrably real problem with certain types of financial institutions.
Meanwhile, Huckabee, in a rare sign of clarity, acknowledged stagnant wages and the ever-increasing wealth gap, reminding us how the middle class has "taken it in the teeth", but went on to blame gubment regulations and the gubment in general. Again, so close!
I dunno. Candy Crowley got shit for representing reality. Why can't Rubio just say "those are discredited attacks from Democrats" again? Who will call him on it? Hillary? Seems like the RDF is strong with his stans.
Crimson_Gold
Member
He'll just use the media's lack of attention on our friend Ben Gazi. If the media had been vigilant, Hillary would have never killed those people. Instead, they're obsessed with his finances. Smh. Liberal media indeed
LegendofJoe
Member
Jeb fucked up when he ignored his Mom's advice against running. She said there were already enough Bush's that lived in the White House. He should have listened to her.
The GOP won't let him within 100 miles of a debate.
OuterLimits
Member
Btw, I could swear I saw a ton of stories saying CNBC wanted the debate to be 3 hours. Carson and Trump complained. Then articles everywhere said CNBC caved and made it 2 hours. Harworth at end said it was always going to be 2 hours. So either every article was wrong or Harworth was telling a fib.
RustyNails
Member
Yea, I think the moderator got caught with his pants down on that one.
CNN's next GOP debate is going to be co-moderated by fucking Salem Radio
Manmademan
Member
the next debate absolutely has to cull some of the third tier candidates.
paul, christie, huckabee, kasich, and jeb! (lol) have no business on that stage.
paul, christie, huckabee, kasich, and jeb! (lol) have no business on that stage.
T
thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
She got shit from the right for sure, and yet that moment is still generally considered a big win for Obama.
It didn't really work out for Romney or Fox to do that though IIRC. The narrative was very much Obama won that second debate and Romney bungled the Benghazi attack.
benjipwns
Banned
Both the media and the candidates would fear an actual debate rather than these joint press conferences.
RustyNails
Member
Grizzlyjin
Supersonic, idiotic, disconnecting, not respecting, who would really ever wanna go and top that
The really weird thing is that the circus atmosphere during the debates plays in Carson, Trump, and Fiorina's favor. If they were on a smaller stage, the questions would be more specific and the answers would have to be more elaborate. Right now you can only fuck up your response so badly when you have 30 seconds. And even with that sometimes they get caught up.
Of course this type of debate doesn't do well for guys like Jeb. They're use to the old rules. He's trying to learn how to out-Trump Trump, which isn't possible. They need attention to survive.
I've grown tired of it now. I know that everybody is hoping that they can stay in the game if the just hold out until the next debate and capitalize, but we can only have people polling around 5% in this game for so long.
Of course this type of debate doesn't do well for guys like Jeb. They're use to the old rules. He's trying to learn how to out-Trump Trump, which isn't possible. They need attention to survive.
I've grown tired of it now. I know that everybody is hoping that they can stay in the game if the just hold out until the next debate and capitalize, but we can only have people polling around 5% in this game for so long.
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thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
I suppose Hillary did get a big boost on her email thing from a united democrat attack against the media for that as well.
Still, I think the Benghazi hearings going so well for Hillary give Democrats a lot of reason to suspect she'd do well even without having to attack the media. I'm not so confident Rubio will find a better line of defense for his problems.
Still, I think the Benghazi hearings going so well for Hillary give Democrats a lot of reason to suspect she'd do well even without having to attack the media. I'm not so confident Rubio will find a better line of defense for his problems.
FOX Business is somehow even dumber than regular FOX, that's gonna be a shit show. I'm going to be busy next week, taking requests. Might use them.
Veritigo_X
Member
It was such a small audience too. They helped empower some of the candidates to call out the moderators.
Ideally the moderator would defend their own question instead of backing down. Crowley was only called out by the right wing but they would discredit any question that painted the republican candidate in a less than positive light. I don't think undecided voters would view Rubio as a strong candidate if he answered a question like that.
It's impossible to have a good debate with this many candidates. Ideally, each candidate would get questions about similar topics so we can see how they differ from one another. This was all over the place.
RustyNails
Member
Remember only Trump had the balls to go after Fox News...other candidates wouldn't dare bring the good name of Fox News into disrepute. It will be interesting.
Avon Barksdale
Member
They must've scorched the Earth to find them.
shadowsdarknes
Member
The conservatives I know are eating it up, too.
Ted Cruz was just waiting to go off in the debate regardless of the question.
It's really remarkable how stupid that Jeb attack was the more you think about it.
A liberal newspaper slamming Rubio already wasn't going to go over well with the GOP crowd. Jeb decides to basically slink in and back them up and call out Rubio.
Not only does this further the "LIBERAL JEB" belief but it allows Rubio to smack him down with an easy and quick soundbite, which Rubio did perfectly.
A liberal newspaper slamming Rubio already wasn't going to go over well with the GOP crowd. Jeb decides to basically slink in and back them up and call out Rubio.
Not only does this further the "LIBERAL JEB" belief but it allows Rubio to smack him down with an easy and quick soundbite, which Rubio did perfectly.
BoboBrazil
Member
Nah, they just went to Florida.
RustyNails
Member
Yeah especially after Rubio name dropped Kerry, any intelligent republican wouldn't have walked into that trap. But oh jeb...Not really the brightest bulb out there.
It could mean a return to form for Trump, which gives me an idea...TO THE BAT-CAVE!
I don't even understand why Rubio was his target. It's not like he's the reason the Bush campaign is in free-fall.
LegendofJoe
Member
Rubio is his target because the power structure of the GoP is moving away from him and coalescing around Rubio.
benjipwns
Banned
It's not impossible. Dig up ones from say 1988, both parties handled it just fine with eight plus candidates.
What you do is pose one question to all candidates, let them all briefly answer, and then they can bat it back and forth a bit with the moderator directing or move on if they all agree/some allotment of minutes is up.
Instead what they're doing here is shit like:
Mr. Trump: "why did you go bankrupt?"
Senator Rubio: "why did you have to get a loan for your house?"
Mrs. Fiorinia: "did you destroy HP just to watch it burn?"
Governor Jeb!: "should we regulate fantasy football?"
Governor Huckabee: "is Donald Trump worse than Hitler?"
Governor Kasich: "why is Ohio better than Florida?"
and then trying to shut down any other candidates (except the ones they want to) responding.
They were even doing this in the JV debate.
CarpeDeezNutz
Member
Anything up on YouTube with highlights I missed it all.
Bush, Rubio, and (when he was running) Walker were all basically counting on the Republican establishment eventually determining the nominee. That's why they've outperformed the polls in prediction markets, for example. In the last few weeks there's been a feeling that maybe Rubio is actually a stronger candidate than Bush, and Bush is worried that he's going to lose his establishment support.
That makes sense. Well the plan definitely backfired, because Rubio came out looking a lot more presidential.
I'm guessing Jeb's initial plan was to bring up the article himself, but then he got fucked by CNBC bringing it up early. Any smart candidate would have seen how Rubio easily handled the question from CNBC and threw away any plan of attack. Jeb stuck to his plan and paid for it.
Raptor2155
Member
Marco Rubio did well. I think he will play as a better establishment candidate than either Scott Walker or Jeb Bush. It's seems like the Waterboy has gotten more confident over the years.
Ted Cruz did well too. He spat out his bullshit with such conviction that I could see him rallying the base.
Christie might get a bump.
And despite his terrible performance, I think Carson is gonna stay front runner. That is until he accidentally takes an extra sleeping pill and falls asleep at a debate.
Ted Cruz did well too. He spat out his bullshit with such conviction that I could see him rallying the base.
Christie might get a bump.
And despite his terrible performance, I think Carson is gonna stay front runner. That is until he accidentally takes an extra sleeping pill and falls asleep at a debate.
RustyNails
Member
Agreed completely...tailored questions get thrown aside anyway. I don't think anyone answered any specifics of the personally tailored questions.
The media persecution angle has been a Republican card to play in the same way that "vast right wing conspiracy" is a card used by the Democrats. Both are shitty cards that sometimes work as a wild card for some stupid, stupid reason.
But I found myself agreeing with part of the first 60 seconds or so of Cruz's belligerent rant. These debates shouldn't be "cage matches" that are full of leading questions trying to extract a sound bite out of each candidate attacking the other. When he went down the "blah blah liberal media blah blah" hole, though, he lost me.
And in all fairness to the Republicans, CNBC really did pick an ignorant shitbag to be one of the moderators.
I think he'll make it to the next debate since it's so soon but the only way he will make it further is for Marco Rubio to pull an R. Budd Dwyer.
Manmademan
Member
simple. Bush isn't really competing for the trump/carson audience. THAT crew is highly anti establishment and doesn't want more of the same. He's never going to make traction there.
Bush and Rubio (and to a lesser extent fiorina, cruz, and the bottom tier) are all splitting the establishment vote. One gains at the expense of another, and Rubio has been rising as Jeb! falls. By attacking Rubio successfully Bush would consolidate the "establishment" vote around himself.
unfortunately Jeb! is completely inept and got bodied on stage tonight. Rubio is going to gain this week and it WILL be at Jeb!'s expense.
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