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Graphical Fidelity I Expect This Gen
- Thread starter ResetEraVetVIP
- Start date
mrqs
Member
This looks a lot like the infiltrator Unreal Engine demo from back in the day. Glad we're finally there.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Nah i called out rofif for posting bad screenshots of forspoken with terrible draw distance, fog and asset quality. Which one of my screenshots are like that? I have no problem admitting the game got a massive downgrade outdoors where its now covered in fog and poor series s quality geometry and terrain, but credit where credit is due and the interiors look absolutely mad. Musilla posted a gif of Callisto above that looks great, but Starfield interiors just have this insane level of detail you didnt see last gen in even Naughty Dog games. The order is the closest but it doesnt have this lighting.
Chiefdada is seeing a massive upgrade in spidey2 from Spider-Man 1 when it doesn’t exist. I’m saying Starfield got a massive upgrade over fallout 4 which is true. Do any comparison between their last gen game be it character models or lighting or asset quality, and you will see a massive upgrade where Spiderman literally looks like spiderman DLC.
Actually, the cities or hubworld or whatever you want to call them have also received a major boost over last gen.
Fallout 4:
Starfield:
Besides, im not the only one saying starfield can look amazing indoors. Ive seen a very hard to please gymwolf praise it, even jaded old FeelsLikeIm42 is giving it props. had they not downgraded the open world levels at the very end, this wouldve been the best looking game of the gen.
winjer
Member
rofif
Can’t Git Gud
Ok sherlock ? so what?
There is compiled demo you can download.
PeteBull
Member
Looks amazing and trully next gen, but lets wait for launch to be sure no downgrades happened, u know how it is with such games
Just a reminder anyone that doesn't have this in "the big 4" is out to fucking lunch. Im stanning hard for this game.
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winjer
Member
You asked where is that water and I just told you it's part of UE.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Its just actual water simulation and not the fake textures and other tricks we've seen in games all gen. this is very CPU heavy so expect 30 fps console games if someone does bother implementing it.
Did you see the Ass Creed rumors? Its apparently got environments that are fully destructible. FINALLY a next gen game. Ubisoft stays winning.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
textures are great, but i hope they bring back the geometry that was downgraded since the 2022 and even the 2023 trailers.
draw distance as well. give me a mod that gets rid of the fog please.
GymWolf
Gold Member
Better but still meh.
Alex11
Member
Played at last some Starfield, and I gotta say that it looks better than I expected. After all the talks about downgrade here and next gen there, it looks in places quite gorgeous. The interiors look a bit better than the exteriors, but nothing major.
That being said, it doesn't blow me away, it's still below Cyberpunk 2077 for me.
That being said, it doesn't blow me away, it's still below Cyberpunk 2077 for me.
arkhamguy123
Member
You guys see those new Spider-Man 2 open world screenshots? This game continues to blow my mind with how bad it looks. Looks like crysis 2’s New York or worse maybe.
They are phoning it in so hard because normies love Spider-Man and don’t care about graphics at all. I’m telling you guys they’re gimping these PS exclusives now to run on low spec PCs down the line too. The Jim Ryan endeavor has proven to be deleterious
They are phoning it in so hard because normies love Spider-Man and don’t care about graphics at all. I’m telling you guys they’re gimping these PS exclusives now to run on low spec PCs down the line too. The Jim Ryan endeavor has proven to be deleterious
arkhamguy123
Member
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
This is amazing. 10,000 milk cartons.
Toilet paper rolls!
Look at those physics, and that lighting. I dont care if skyrim was doing this 10 years ago, it was definitely not doing it at this level of fidelity.
Toilet paper rolls!
Look at those physics, and that lighting. I dont care if skyrim was doing this 10 years ago, it was definitely not doing it at this level of fidelity.
ChiefDada
Gold Member
Just saw it. You kidding me. First these are low res screens, byt more importantly look at the number of different car models and the geometry on the vehicles. Look at the pick up truck and the cargo van. And they're casting RT reflections - cars on right side. this is amazing.
rofif
Can’t Git Gud
I doubt it's actually 10k. There is probably spawn limit.This is amazing. 10,000 milk cartons.
Toilet paper rolls!
Look at those physics, and that lighting. I dont care if skyrim was doing this 10 years ago, it was definitely not doing it at this level of fidelity.
But they improved the physics performance A LOT. If you spawned this much in oblivon, it killed the game
ChiefDada
Gold Member
This is amazing. 10,000 milk cartons.
Toilet paper rolls!
Look at those physics, and that lighting. I dont care if skyrim was doing this 10 years ago, it was definitely not doing it at this level of fidelity.
Wait this is Starfield??? Ok yes that is next gen.
arkhamguy123
Member
Not even trying to be snarky or mean, but I genuinely don’t know if this reply is sincere or if you’re fucking with meJust saw it. You kidding me. First these are low res screens, byt more importantly look at the number of different car models and the geometry on the vehicles. Look at the pick up truck and the cargo van. And they're casting RT reflections - cars on right side. this is amazing.
GymWolf
Gold Member
Lol of course now they handle that shit better, hardware are order of magnitudes more powerful so simple havok with many object on screen doens't make your pc explode, arnold no shit.gif
i have no idea why you people are impressed other than the nice graphic effect because we are so not used to physics in videogames, that gif is not even a thing that happen naturally in the game, it is created artificially with an editor or cheat engine or whatever it is.
this is nextgen stuff, not havok and object persistency that we had 15 years ago (no shit with less fidelity, it was 15 years ago)
i have no idea why you people are impressed other than the nice graphic effect because we are so not used to physics in videogames, that gif is not even a thing that happen naturally in the game, it is created artificially with an editor or cheat engine or whatever it is.
this is nextgen stuff, not havok and object persistency that we had 15 years ago (no shit with less fidelity, it was 15 years ago)
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ChiefDada
Gold Member
Lol I'm not kidding. Don't focus on the shitty picture quality; yes it's awful and idk why they released in poor quality. Look at the geometry and reflections/lighting on the cars. Look at the PBR and reddish-pink evening sky light bouncing off of the sculpture sitting atop the walkway.
arkhamguy123
Member
I don’t really see any great lighting going on in the day time pic brotha
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Lol of course now they handle that shit better, hardware are order of magnitudes more powerful so simple havok with many object on screen doens't make your pc explode, arnold no shit.gif
i have no idea why you people are impressed other than the nice graphic effect because we are so not used to physics in videogames, that gif is not even a thing that happen naturally in the game, it is created artificially with an editor or cheat engine or whatever it is.
this is nextgen stuff, not havok and object persistency that we had 15 years ago (no shit with less fidelity, it was 15 years ago)
lol you will never be happy and they said i have unrealistic expecations for next gen.
I am curious to see what ubisoft manages to do with destruction. I honestly did not expect Ass creed to implement destruction out of all the different studios and franchises, but im glad at least someone is utilizing the CPU this time around. Lets hope ND and other first party studios are thinking along the same lines even if they havent shown their cards yet.
ChiefDada
Gold Member
No no I'm not talking about lighting in the scene, I'm talking about PBR and light interaction of the vehicles. Again I dont know why they released this low res photo with obscene film grain and CA.
GymWolf
Gold Member
geary
Member
They get a lot of hate, but people forget they are not mocapedNPCs get hate too but some of them look amazing. From era.
The screenshots look better than you are making them out to be. Your Starfield looks like ass especially outdoors and I didn’t see one criticism coming Starfield’s way from you. I think you are being a bit disingenuous man. And no I don’t think Spidey 2 looks good at all!
arkhamguy123
Member
“Your” starfield?
arkhamguy123
Member
Also I feel like you’re trying to instigate a discourse
Nah, that ain’t it, son!
arkhamguy123
Member
Alright
ChiefDada
Gold Member
A
arkhamguy123
I didn't even see the time square photo... yeah now I understand you better. Bad tone mapping on top of a capture that already includes generous film grain and CA is a recipe for disaster SMH. No worries, we're definitely getting more stuff this coming week.
E-Cat
Member
Lol of course now they handle that shit better, hardware are order of magnitudes more powerful so simple havok with many object on screen doens't make your pc explode, arnold no shit.gif
i have no idea why you people are impressed other than the nice graphic effect because we are so not used to physics in videogames, that gif is not even a thing that happen naturally in the game, it is created artificially with an editor or cheat engine or whatever it is.
this is nextgen stuff, not havok and object persistency that we had 15 years ago (no shit with less fidelity, it was 15 years ago)
More like next-next-next-gen
CamHostage
Member
Wait, hold up, hold up...
First off, we should point out that this is called Fluid Flux (and it has squat to do with GTA6, that shared YT clip is pretty egregiously misleading and uninformative, I'm linking to a different vid.) ImaginaryBlend created it as a water simulation blueprint toolset for Unreal Engine developers. It has been around something like three years and works in either UE4 or UE5, but realistically teams would in all likelihood be working in UE5 by now if they were adapting this tool into their production. (That said, UE5's instability has affected the project since Epic has a habit of deprecating or changing aspects of UE5 between version updates, not just making "improvements".)
We should also be clear that it's not "just actual water simulation". (Also, putting "just" and "water simulation" in the same sentence is out there.) Fluid Flux is a set of water replication techniques* packed into one tool package, and together they reproduce a lot of natural happenings of a body of water, but it's still a lot of "tricks" or solutions brought together, not a complete water simulation. (Even Avatar uses tricks and a variety of different water approaches depending on the scene, so there is no one unified "water simulation. ") From what I've read and understand about Flex Fluid, many of us techniques are familiar from what we have seen in other games; not as complete or dynamic in any one game I can think of, but common approaches to make a surface of water (and what happens above and underneath) seem real enough to the player.
So, what happens when you hit the water surface? What happens when you go under it? How buoyant and turbulent are objects floating on its surface? How fast does its current run when transitioning from one height to another? What happens when you raise the surface above its confines. All of that is accounted for in different aspects of the blueprint set, and then it mostly works in harmony depending on your parameters and use.
It's still primarily a surface with a variety of textures and spray effects, not actually a complete liquid simulation of "water". You can't dunk a bucket in and pull up some of the water. (Or rather if you did, you would conceivably have a second surface in the bucket and a displacement calculation of if the difference affects the level of the first surface.) You can't tip this water out, or shake it up and make big ripples and waves. It can run down to form a river or waterfall, but it's an extension of the surface (or a series of surfaces tied to the main? I'm nowhere near able to understand the Shallow Water Equations solver, but you can essentially see the geometry get recalculated in the Breakable Dam demo video of Fluid Flux. The water is in one state, something changes about the confines or where the water level is within its confines, and it changes the state to match the terrain over time and distance.) Everything about Fluid Flux is a series of different challenges of placing water in a realtime environment, approached mathematically and/or practically, and solved for the need of the tool. You're buying the complete "bag of tricks", and they all work together.
A very cool package. You haven't seen it it games because it's new, but also because, as even the developer has said, "The Fluid Flux system is overhyped". It does some important things really well, it looks super cool in demos, there are probably some great things it could do in games, but it has its limitations and it doesn't exactly do what everybody thinks it does when you look at it and go, "Holy shit, that's water!"
For one thing, it doesn't work in multiplayer; it cannot be synchronized. Game maps using this must be limited, and it is not really built for open-world game projects. It has issues with flat surfaces; rock-shaped objects or surfaces would seem to be more complicated to calculate than a square, but the way this works is helped by there not being hard edges. It doesn't work in enclosed indoor spaces like caves (at least, not without some redefinition of the surfaces.) And the terrain cannot be (or should not be) modifiable, as the tool relies on knowing the heightmap of a map to remain efficient.
Another reason you haven't seen it in games is because lots of other tools for managing water are out there, and few are as complete as this, but even the features of Fluid Flux have specific use which you may not get everything out of. (Has anybody played a lot of games where a river fills up to an make an ocean?) There are other ocean and wave and underwater and river flow tools out there, and developers who build water features into levels already have a lot of their own approaches (albeit one of the reasons Fluid Flux looks so awesome is because it's so complete, whereas usually developers just add the parameters needed to get the scene done and it breaks if a gamer tries to do something outside the norm.) Fluid Flux is the coolest-looking one in demos, and it holds promise for some wild (or wildly functional) use in games, but as is sometimes pointed out in this thread, holding up a demo as a perfect tool which shames all other developers for what looks cool in a demo isn't fair to other developers or even the demo maker.
(*Some of what i posted is straight from the FAQ/docs, but anybody experienced with such tech and plugins, please correct and school me on any errors i made. )
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arkhamguy123
Member
I appreciate ya saying that actually! Rare in online discussion
Robbinhood
Banned
If "90%" of the game didn't get a downgrade it would be the best looking game? ok.Nah i called out rofif for posting bad screenshots of forspoken with terrible draw distance, fog and asset quality. Which one of my screenshots are like that? I have no problem admitting the game got a massive downgrade outdoors where its now covered in fog and poor series s quality geometry and terrain, but credit where credit is due and the interiors look absolutely mad. Musilla posted a gif of Callisto above that looks great, but Starfield interiors just have this insane level of detail you didnt see last gen in even Naughty Dog games. The order is the closest but it doesnt have this lighting.
Chiefdada is seeing a massive upgrade in spidey2 from Spider-Man 1 when it doesn’t exist. I’m saying Starfield got a massive upgrade over fallout 4 which is true. Do any comparison between their last gen game be it character models or lighting or asset quality, and you will see a massive upgrade where Spiderman literally looks like spiderman DLC.
Actually, the cities or hubworld or whatever you want to call them have also received a major boost over last gen.
Fallout 4:
Starfield:
Besides, im not the only one saying starfield can look amazing indoors. Ive seen a very hard to please gymwolf praise it, even jaded old FeelsLikeIm42 is giving it props. had they not downgraded the open world levels at the very end, this wouldve been the best looking game of the gen.
Interiors look fine, but the game is massively uneven. People are so contradictory. I played yesterday and was underwhelmed by almost everything. And the motion blur is atrocious.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Maybe it’s 90% but so far in my 15 hours or so I’ve only explored three planets and was sent into an interior section almost immediately upon landing 90% of the time.
maybe that changes later on, but for me it’s been 90% interiors.
ChiefDada
Gold Member
I'm really sorry guys but Dada is going to have to be a pain in the ass on this one. I hate that insomniac decided to push out ultra bs quality screenshots with disgusting CA and color transfer but that doesn't take away from the amazing geometry and lighting on these RANDOM cars! That's what's most striking. These are random vehicles with great modeling. And the far off distance! This looks like it was taken from a city street cam.
Crispy Gamer
Member
Screenshots from the other thread look way better than what's posted here and yes I agree it looks fantasticI'm really sorry guys but Dada is going to have to be a pain in the ass on this one. I hate that insomniac decided to push out ultra bs quality screenshots with disgusting CA and color transfer but that doesn't take away from the amazing geometry and lighting on these RANDOM cars! That's what's most striking. These are random vehicles with great modeling. And the far off distance! This looks like it was taken from a city street cam.
ChiefDada
Gold Member
Oh thank God I was worried you put your heart and soul into that long and thoughtful write-up for the benefit of a thread full of tech illiterates who can't be bothered to read it.
Represent.
Represent(ative) of bad opinions
This is why I appreciate Space Marine II so much. It seems to be the only game actually trying to attempt large scale warfare and enemies on screen with fidelity to match.
Everything else is just status quo, pathetic.
Isnt that on PC though?This is amazing. 10,000 milk cartons.
Toilet paper rolls!
Look at those physics, and that lighting. I dont care if skyrim was doing this 10 years ago, it was definitely not doing it at this level of fidelity.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
The physics system is the same. My guess is that the Xbox version would have framerate issues but not at 10k. Jackfrsgs did whole video on this. He spawned 10k watermelons thenkept adding potatoes, tomatoes and more watermelons in their thousands until he lost count. With each batch, the framerate tanked. But it took a while.
Hard to say what the xsx cpu can do but it’s definitely over 10k.
Ok i get what your saying about XBX being "able" to handle it but its not like its part of the acutal gameplay. With such a niche adhoc implementation its a borderline tech demo demonstration at best. It doesnt make the game itself anymore next gen.
Have we seen actual large army "interactive" gameplay yet? The first 360 game had you up againgst armies of 45. I havent seen footage from this that showed you even fighting that much although there is alot of hinting at huge scale fights. Mostly Ive only seen background "swarms" which earlier gens have already rendered done at a distance like this. I am optimistic but just saying they have yet to prove the scale of the fights as far as the footage i have seen.
Punished Miku
Human Rights Subscription Service
