-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Graphical Fidelity I Expect This Gen
- Thread starter ResetEraVetVIP
- Start date
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
While i agree with the sentiment that ps studios should be sharing their resources, this is all on insomniac. They have more employees than GG and ND. 550 compared to around 400 for more ND and GG. SSM is around 200. They dont need any help.
What they needed to do was make one game. Not waste 2 years on ratchet. Not waste 2 years on Miles. Not split off a third team on Wolverine after Miles. They chose to keep the same buildings and simply didnt have enough time to polish up the character models in cutscenes. I am sorry, but thats not an excuse when you are a first party studio making THE biggest exclusive for Sony. They took shortcuts and thought we wouldnt notice the same buildings as long as they improved the lighting. And you dont take shortcuts. Cutscenes they put in the effort, but clearly didnt have enough time. MJ had the best character model upgrade coming off the trailers but they butchered her in the final game because she clearly looks unfinished.
Again, insomniac had really great cutscenes and modeling in the first game. I dont think I saw any flaws in skin shading and facial animations in the first game's cutscenes. They simply ran out of time here. And that should not be an excuse. I love this game, but im glad they are getting destroyed on twitter and on forums. They thought they could get away with it and with the critics rating it a 91 and fans buying 2.5 million copies in a day, they kind of did get away with it, but the internet doesnt forget. All the hard work their artists have done, is now being ignored and their shortcomings are being memed. Cant feel too good if you are the tech director.
Hopefully next time, this guy realizes that when you have a spiderman game where you spend 90% of the time flying between buildings, and when you are telling a narrative driven cutscene heavy story, you should have upgraded buildings and spent more time polishing cutscenes.
Just give it a rest man. Not even close to impressed ONCE? Ridiculous.
arkhamguy123
Member
Ew no. I agree with him on this but he’s some Gen z college kid. He actually used to be a poster here. Thought you’d remember.You mean you're right? This twitter account sounds a lot like you.
But yeah no fucking way in hell this is me because he doesn’t think the Arkham games are good and he thinks Everything Everywhere all at Once is a terrible movie. His takes outside of a select few things couldn’t be further from me
arkhamguy123
Member
Unironically not even trying to be snarky, looks like white shrek. Feminist Frequency really did irreparable irrevocable damage to this industry didn’t it?This is the last pic from me. I'm not going subject myself to taking more pictures of MJ in that game, YouTube it if you really interested.
PlayStation should better share their resources and talent across studios. The disparity between Horizon and Spider-Man is staggering.
arkhamguy123
Member
Phew. Oh boy. Yeah dm me whatever sequence that wasMy jaw just dropped 5 times in a row. HOLY SHIT INSOMNIAC!!!! Fidelity i thought might not be possible this gen even with cutscenes, INSOMNIAC DID THAT SHIT IN GAMEPLAY.
Bullshit because if you did you wouldn't have said Sandman is the most impressive. What I just saw is hands down the best looking gameplay sequence ever. Period. No real time cutscene on any fucking platform is matching what insomniac just did. This the typr of shit that lethal claimed would only be possible on PS10. I can show you my personal recording via dm.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
I am pretty sure I mentioned this when people were shitting on Starfield's loadings when entering interiors. I specifically pointed out Spiderman has one of the games that did this.
Another thing I remember that I got a lot of flack for saying Spiderman Miles wont have seamless interior transitions because it was a PS4 game. Then someone posted a one off gif of Spiderman shooting out of a warehouse airduct in the cat rescue mission to prove me wrong. turns out, the ps4 version was the same and the game loaded interiors every time after that. And apparently still does it in a PS5 only game. Time does prove me right every time.
Its a bit of a disingenious comparison because thats not how uncharted 4's interiors look. Thats from the prologue which is not a real level. Its just one house and a beach outside. They put in a lot of effort into that one house and it shows. The rest of the interiors didnt look as good.
Spiderman 1 already had some amazing looking interiors that truly came alive after the ray tracing patch. I am shocked at how poor Peter's house looks in this game. Especially after seeing Starfield's interiors. No Sony game should be getting destroyed by Bethesda game in ANY department. I get that spiderman 2 looks better overall, but the graphics in Peter's house are simply inexcusable for a next gen only game.
MidGenRefresh
*Refreshes biennially
Venom suit is... eeeh, okay? Kind of muddy and low-resolution. I'll put it in a spoiler tag:
Last edited:
arkhamguy123
Member
wrong. It’s from the epilogue and it is a real level. You can even select it in the level replayer. And there’s interactable items galore found in it. It’s pretty much 1:1 the aunt mays house game design. There’s nothing disingenuous about it other than it make SM2 look especially like shit.I am pretty sure I mentioned this when people were shitting on Starfield's loadings when entering interiors. I specifically pointed out Spiderman has one of the games that did this.
Another thing I remember that I got a lot of flack for saying Spiderman Miles wont have seamless interior transitions because it was a PS4 game. Then someone posted a one off gif of Spiderman shooting out of a warehouse airduct in the cat rescue mission to prove me wrong. turns out, the ps4 version was the same and the game loaded interiors every time after that. And apparently still does it in a PS5 only game. Time does prove me right every time.
Its a bit of a disingenious comparison because thats not how uncharted 4's interiors look. Thats from the prologue which is not a real level. Its just one house and a beach outside. They put in a lot of effort into that one house and it shows. The rest of the interiors didnt look as good.
Spiderman 1 already had some amazing looking interiors that truly came alive after the ray tracing patch. I am shocked at how poor Peter's house looks in this game. Especially after seeing Starfield's interiors. No Sony game should be getting destroyed by Bethesda game in ANY department. I get that spiderman 2 looks better overall, but the graphics in Peter's house are simply inexcusable for a next gen only game.
As in, here’s an interior with big narrative significance you play around in in this 7 year old PS4 game, here’s an interior with big narrative significance you play around in in this 2023 PS5 game. No way to spin that my friend. If anything it’s even worse for SM2 because that’s a set you revisit many times and can go to at any point. UC4 it’s a one off in the epilogue to not be revisited. Also those subpar pics you posted of more UC4 interiors still look as good if not better than aunt mays house in SM2
Last edited:
ChiefDada
Gold Member
Completed the main story. Wow. Insomniac set a new benchmark for visuals during the last couple hours or so. All of their cutscene budget went into the final act setpieces. One after another, after another. A lot of next gen attributes y'all asked for, they delivered in the final act.
Like i said visually unmatched but judging the setpieces - it was good not mindblowigly great. It didn't give me the same level of wonder like Uncharted 4. I think once the other studios like ND, SSM take a whack at it, it'll end up being run of the mill. Which is a good thing!
Like i said visually unmatched but judging the setpieces - it was good not mindblowigly great. It didn't give me the same level of wonder like Uncharted 4. I think once the other studios like ND, SSM take a whack at it, it'll end up being run of the mill. Which is a good thing!
yamaci17
Member
let's hope ray reconstruction does not create sharpened posterized look on character faces
Last edited:
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
yeah, i meant to say epilogue, not prologue. But there is no spinning here. I am literally shitting on the graphics in Peter's house. I dont know how much more critical i can be than this:
or why you got the impression i am spinning here. Just pointing out that the uncharted 4 comparison is a bit disingenious.
And no, that one house in the epilogue looks a generation ahead of interiors in the rest of the game. The level of detail, asset quality, GI is light years ahead of anything in the game. Even TLOU2 has shitty looking interiors that dont come close and thats mostly because of the lighting as you can see below. Go to Joel's house. It's a one off level like the epilogue in Uncharted 4. It doesnt have the insane lighting that makes everything in that Uncharted 4 beach house pop. The level of detail is a also paired back. Point is that it was a one off and a not indicative of the overall game. TLOU2 has some stunning looking interiors but a lot of them dont look too hot either. I can play this game all day.
Slothbeing1209
Member
This looks really good.
arkhamguy123
Member
But that still leaves the matter of even the less visually impressive interiors from this 7 year old PS4 game look about on par or better than aunt mays houseyeah, i meant to say epilogue, not prologue. But there is no spinning here. I am literally shitting on the graphics in Peter's house. I dont know how much more critical i can be than this:
or why you got the impression i am spinning here. Just pointing out that the uncharted 4 comparison is a bit disingenious.
And no, that one house in the epilogue looks a generation ahead of interiors in the rest of the game. The level of detail, asset quality, GI is light years ahead of anything in the game. Even TLOU2 has shitty looking interiors that dont come close and thats mostly because of the lighting as you can see below. Go to Joel's house. It's a one off level like the epilogue in Uncharted 4. It doesnt have the insane lighting that makes everything in that Uncharted 4 beach house pop. The level of detail is a also paired back. Point is that it was a one off and a not indicative of the overall game. TLOU2 has some stunning looking interiors but a lot of them dont look too hot either. I can play this game all day.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
GymWolf
If this doesnt look next gen to you, Im requesting you be threadbanned from this thread for having unrealistic standards.Faces in the trailer, even the guy sitting in the back of the shop seem ok so fingers crossed.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
No, I agree thats why i said its inexcusable for a next gen only game to look like that. I brought up starfield because its interiors to me look next gen as fuck and even better than the uncharted 4 epilogue. Thats another game shat on and dismissed just last month because it had some poor outdoor levels.
Maybe now that we have Spiderman 2, we can truly appreciate how next gen Starfield is.
MidGenRefresh
*Refreshes biennially
No, I agree thats why i said its inexcusable for a next gen only game to look like that. I brought up starfield because its interiors to me look next gen as fuck and even better than the uncharted 4 epilogue. Thats another game shat on and dismissed just last month because it had some poor outdoor levels.
Maybe now that we have Spiderman 2, we can truly appreciate how next gen Starfield is.
Starfield lows are even lower than Spider-Man's. I even managed to find a PS2 planet:
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
I just did the Coney Island level and the setpiece at the end looked absolutely gorgeous. Shades of ASM2. I honestly couldnt believe how CG like it looked. Wonderfully choreographed, gorgeous lighting, and it just kept getting bigger and bigger. uncharted 4 had maybe one setpiece that had things breaking apart like that and that was the bell tower which lasted maybe 30 seconds and it was just one tower. Without spoiling much, this was much grander in scale and looked way better than Uncharted 4. Like i said, it was like watching ASM2 at times. The immersion only broke when they cut to NPC character models, but spiderman himself looked stunning and as CG as you can get.
This is unrelated but MJ's hair when you are riding the cyclone was next gen as fuck. You only get to see the back of her head through out the ride and it looked phenomenal throughout. Maybe it couldve animated more but i was transfixed. best hair in a game not named Fifa.
arkhamguy123
Member
It seems we’ve found consensus at last.No, I agree thats why i said its inexcusable for a next gen only game to look like that. I brought up starfield because its interiors to me look next gen as fuck and even better than the uncharted 4 epilogue. Thats another game shat on and dismissed just last month because it had some poor outdoor levels.
Maybe now that we have Spiderman 2, we can truly appreciate how next gen Starfield is.
And yeah if they had married starfield to actual good game design we would’ve had an all timer. Shame about that game. Haven’t touched it in a month.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
yeah but they are procedurally generated. You could never expect 1000 planets to look like that.Starfield lows are even lower than Spider-Man's. I even managed to find a PS2 planet:
90% of the game so far (and ive put in 40 hours so far) has been indoors and almost every interior section is immaculately detailed. I honestly dont know why they even bothered with the planets because you almost never explore them even for story missions. They are like an afterthought. This is why I am not too fussed about Spiderman 2's interiors not looking too hot because 90% of the time im flying around and it looks phenomenal there.
MidGenRefresh
*Refreshes biennially
yeah but they are procedurally generated. You could never expect 1000 planets to look like that.
90% of the game so far (and ive put in 40 hours so far) has been indoors and almost every interior section is immaculately detailed. I honestly dont know why they even bothered with the planets because you almost never explore them even for story missions. They are like an afterthought. This is why I am not too fussed about Spiderman 2's interiors not looking too hot because 90% of the time im flying around and it looks phenomenal there.
True. Missions in interiors are my least favourite. Spider-Man feels awkward to control in tight spaces. This game needs time of day change toggle ASAP, WTF Insomniac...
Mortisfacio
Member
Dude, can you wait for a moment so i can find some fucks to give about your opinion about what impress me or not?
Thanks
(I was impressed by the flying speed but i consider that more gameplay than graphic)
I'd be more impressed with flying speed if the buildings weren't just 2d walls stitched together. That speed slinging through the streets while the game also had to load any interiors to these buildings, now that would be impressive. But they're all hollow/empty.
ChiefDada
Gold Member
If you thought the Coney Island section looked good your reaction to the final act will be something else lol.
MidGenRefresh
*Refreshes biennially
One more from Starfield to showcase interiors and real time GI in action. Awesome stuff.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Dude they didnt even ship the game with NG+ when both the first game and miles shipped with it day one. Time of day too, though it was limited to post game. It was clearly rushed out. Very disappointing how Sony is willing to delay Horizon, GOW and GT7 by a year but holds Insomniac to unrealistic standards. The sales prove that this is their biggest IP ever. Insomniac needs to be treated as their biggest and best studio. I was wrong about them being a B team. Now Sony needs to accept that Insomniac that fact as well and give Insomniac more time.True. Missions in interiors are my least favourite. Spider-Man feels awkward to control in tight spaces. This game needs time of day change toggle ASAP, WTF Insomniac...
If only I could go back a 100+ pages to where I disagreed with you when you labeled them a Tier B team. They’ve always been a Tier A studio, man, but they spread themselves too thin with all these projects, which is crazy considering they still delivered. Others are taking years to make one game that isn’t even better than what Insomniac have pushed out.
Senua
Gold Member
Crazy how variable starfields visuals can be lol. That looks amazing, then you can land step off the ship and you're in Fallout 4 landOne more from Starfield to showcase interiors and real time GI in action. Awesome stuff.
GymWolf
Gold Member
The opposite for me, after this one they are behind even sucker punch and bend on my list, i don't give a fuck if they release 4 games every 6 months.
Maybe with wolverine they are not gonna steal combat and stealth systems from other games and they are gonna deliver graphically and i'm gonna promote them to C+ or a B-, hopefully the A team worked on that one.
Or maybe SP and bend are gonna shit the bed aswell, i'm not sure about anything with sony teams tbh.
Maybe with wolverine they are not gonna steal combat and stealth systems from other games and they are gonna deliver graphically and i'm gonna promote them to C+ or a B-, hopefully the A team worked on that one.
Or maybe SP and bend are gonna shit the bed aswell, i'm not sure about anything with sony teams tbh.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
there was one planet that looked like no mans sky. Fallout 4 never looked this bad. At least it had good art as its saving grace. This level had the worst looking dinosaurs ive ever seen. The foliage looked straight up ps2 quality. like a game made by 20 indie devs like No Mans Sky was.
I think instead of doing 1000 procedurally generated planets, they shouldve done 5 like Mass Effect Andromeda. Each with a distinct biome and focused on making them all fun to explore. I have zero reason to explore any of these planets especially when the main campaign and faction quests are basically talking to people and then getting into firefights indoors 90% of the time.
Some planets you visit for story missions do look decent, but there is zero reason to explore them. I just dont understand why this game was made like this.
Pizza with pineapple on it is that way ->
GymWolf
Gold Member
I beg your pardon?
I know Italians love pineapple on their pizzas
ChiefDada
Gold Member
This looks really good.
I really hope the Insomniac dev discusses the tech behind the last 2 hours of the main story in their upcoming DF tech interview. The leap in quality came out of nowhere . I'm about to make a thread. I am imagining what the next God of War or TLOU 3 can look like. Suddenly those PS CG trailers don't look all that special.
Wait till Lethal sees this post
GymWolf
Gold Member
Pizza with pineapple is like spiderman 2, it looks gross, leaves a bad taste in your mouth, but in the end it's still pizza so we eat it anyway because it's comfort food.I know Italians love pineapple on their pizzas
I thought you guys considered pineapple on Pizza a blasphemy
Last edited:
GymWolf
Gold Member
We do, but i can bend reality a little to land a joke, you know me.
arkhamguy123
Member
Sucker Punch is the most underrated. Ghosts having an 83 meta and SM2 a 90? What a joke. (Days Gone a 71 on meta? Laughable as well)
Sucker Punch has been the most consistent. Never changing the creative director like all other studios. Nate Fox has been creative director since sly cooper and clearly loves his job. They delivered a great sly cooper trilogy with at the time decent graphics and fun gameplay during the PS2 days. Then came out and put their stamp on the superhero game genre in the PS3 days. Not opting for an easy third person shooter but a kinetic super powered combat system with verticality.
Then they came right after the mighty guerilla games KZSF and showed themselves as graphical peers with second son. A GIANT generational leap over their PS3 outings and any PS3 game ever released. As second son looked a Gen ahead of last of us. That particle system at the time? PHEW. Those character models in early 2014? PHEW. Then they innovated yet again under the direction of Nate Fox and released a dope ass samurai game that was baaaasically completely free of any wokeism. Just a respectful story seeped in eastern culture. It had amazing graphics. Amazing combat. And an amazing story that showed a true maturity and step up in writing.
They’ve come so far since sly cooper but they never get mentioned in the same sentence as ND or SSM. All their games since second son are graphical power houses for their time and their gameplay is insomniac level pure video gamey fun without dogshit like MJ sections or “hey walk around slowly as Peter and play carnival mini games for 30 minutes” because they have actual competent imaginative game designers.
Last edited:
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
You are only as good as your last game especially when your games take 5-7 years to make. And sorry but HFW is a 7 at best. Days Gone is better but not by much. GoT is better than both, but doesnt hit the highs of Spiderman 2 and im only a quarter of a way through.
So far id rank: ND> SSM> Insomniac > Sucker Punch> GG > Bend
Not talking graphics. just their overall game developing abilities.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
DF just posted the developer interview a few minutes ago. Not sure if they cover the ending.
GymWolf
Gold Member
Yeah, stealing combat and stealth systems from other games and not making anything original for a decade and shitting the bed graphic wise with their first nextgen only game really push the narrative of outstanding developing abilities.
I'm sorry, i still take santa monica and guerrilla over them, and it's not even close.
(Even if horizon 2 was kinda of a misstep)
At least ratchet looked incredible in some parts and it's in discussion forcbest looking game on console, too bad the game was ok at best.
Last edited:
ChiefDada
Gold Member
GymWolf
Gold Member
Lmao even more shilling, can't wait to read the tldr.
arkhamguy123
Member
*but is a cheerleader for Spider-Man 2*
Last edited:
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Only a few minutes in, but the tech director said the goal wasnt photorealism but they did take reallife NYC shots as points of reference. But then he only mentions fixing the flat buildings in the distance as an improvement. Not the actual building quality.