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Graphical Fidelity I Expect This Gen

GymWolf

Gold Member
There is pvp and replayable pve coop missions after campaign. But i agree that the game looks pretty shallow in terms of gameplay. Basically all you do is fighting againts hordes the whole time. Its a well made game and probably 40k fans dream, but i'll wait for sale and the pro to play it
Yep, it looks mindless, messy and kinda clunky, and even if the combat looks meaty, my sixth sense tells me that is nowhere near the precise meatiness of darktide (to remain in warhammer universe) especially the shooting, darktide has some of the best feeling weapons in gaming history, not even an exageration.

I saw the bolt gun here and it looks like a peashoter in comparison.

People were just dying for a gears shooter with testosterone after so many dei feminized shit, and this game came out at the perfect time.

Happy to be disproved if i buy it and it turns out better than i think, but i've always been skepticle about this game since the reveal, not really caring about gears games or warhammer probably make me a bit biased.

(I do think that warhammer is cool as fuck but i just don't know anything about it).
 
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H . R . 2

Member
if you're looking for an isometric game with nice visuals and proper destruction, you will probably find this game interesting:
I love how UE5 and the creativity of these AA studios are turning them into rock stars [pun intended]



P.S. for some reason, I find Isometric games extremely pleasing in terms of graphics.
the last one whose visuals fascinated me and I absolutely enjoyed was The Ascent
top-notch visuals and unique art direction made that game so memorable for me

Also, REPLACED, is another visually amazing game I am looking forward to

 
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SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
if you're looking for an isometric game with nice visuals and proper destruction, you will probably find this game interesting:
I love how UE5 and the creativity of these AA studios are turning them into rock stars [pun intended]



P.S. for some reason, I find Isometric games extremely pleasing in terms of graphics.
the last one whose visuals fascinated me and I absolutely enjoyed was The Ascent
top-notch visuals and unique art direction made that game so memorable for me

Also, REPLACED, is another visually amazing game I am looking forward to


This looks amazing. Wow. Why couldn’t astrobot look like this
 

Bitstream

Member
9 to 6 hours is stupidly low for a 70 euros game.

And tbh, the more gameplay i watch of this thing, the less convinced i am about buying it, i feel like being a warhammer fanboy is more than 50% of the appeal of this game, like it was with hogwarts legacy.
I'm all for a game that can be beaten in less than the typical 30 hour open world slogs, but 9 hours is just a bit too short for $70 if there aren't going to be epic set pieces and boundary pushing gameplay
 

Toots

Gold Member
they actually had only 20-30 devs when they made the first demo. they expanded to 130 devs after 2020.

Still, $300 million and 5 years for spiderman 2 and they didnt even bother changing the city assets. Crazy. $200 million for GOW and HFW and they are both last gen game recycling the same tech.

Pretty sure Sony is running a money laundering scheme because these numbers dont make much sense. Especially when Dutch sources put HFW at 110 euros, but Sony told FTC that it cost $200 million before marketing dollars. Either they are fudging the numbers for tax purposes or someone at these studios is scamming them blind.
Those are cazy numbers !

Have you any idea of the difference of salary between eastern and western devs ?

I don't know shit but i'd suspect that western devs have grossly inflated salaries compared to the eastern ones, and maybe also a lot of redundancies in jobs.
Does that explain the discrepency ?
Because i cannot believe sony execs blindly throwing money at studios, and as much as i hate hulst i can't see him running a money laudering scheme :messenger_grinning_sweat:

There's also the dei effect, where you can substract a few millions from a game budget that goes directly in the woke mob pockets.
If we add all that can we justify a 200$M budget ?
(Justify accountwise of course, it's still money thrown directly in the trash but you get my point)

How do western devs justify their budgets ???
 

Darsxx82

Member
if you're looking for an isometric game with nice visuals and proper destruction, you will probably find this game interesting:
I love how UE5 and the creativity of these AA studios are turning them into rock stars [pun intended]



P.S. for some reason, I find Isometric games extremely pleasing in terms of graphics.
the last one whose visuals fascinated me and I absolutely enjoyed was The Ascent
top-notch visuals and unique art direction made that game so memorable for me

Also, REPLACED, is another visually amazing game I am looking forward to


There really are AA or indi games on the market with a great technical and artistic level. Those two you mention are on my radar.


And yes, I also enjoy The ASCENT very much and its graphics help with that.
 

GymWolf

Gold Member
if you're looking for an isometric game with nice visuals and proper destruction, you will probably find this game interesting:
I love how UE5 and the creativity of these AA studios are turning them into rock stars [pun intended]



P.S. for some reason, I find Isometric games extremely pleasing in terms of graphics.
the last one whose visuals fascinated me and I absolutely enjoyed was The Ascent
top-notch visuals and unique art direction made that game so memorable for me

Also, REPLACED, is another visually amazing game I am looking forward to


I love isometric games but the focus on driving is a huge turn off.

But it is definitely pleasant to look at.

If you like the genre, this one is coming soon
 
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JCreasy

Member
The texture surfaces I'm seeing in Astro Bot are absolutely nailed. I feel like the hedging about the visuals are completely unfounded. It's worth noting that I'm playing on a 77 inch OLED, so it really has an opportunity to shine. Exquisite HDR.

I'm curious about how insight from Insomniac could help Asobi go further. Perhaps better implementation of bouncing lighting. But that is so minor. I find the game stunning, honestly.
 

DanielG165

Member
9 to 6 hours is stupidly low for a 70 euros game.

And tbh, the more gameplay i watch of this thing, the less convinced i am about buying it, i feel like being a warhammer fanboy is more than 50% of the appeal of this game, like it was with hogwarts legacy.
I know absolutely zero about the Warhammer universe, but I personally love the game so far due to the enjoyment factor. I couldn’t tell you a damn thing about this franchise, and barely anything about Harry Potter, yet both are really fun for me lol.

The actual FEEL of the game is properly chunky/meaty. You feel like a walking tank mixed with a meat grinder, but with a ton of response and fluidity.
 
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Represent.

Represent(ative) of bad opinions
Wukong continues to impress. What a fucking game. This may go down as one of my fav character action game ever, right below the likes of GOW 2018 and NG Black.

The animations are fucking GOOD. I feel like the animations here arent getting enough praise.

The best thing about the game is it makes me hate FROM even more.
 
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zeroluck

Member
SW outlaw rendering tech is fantastic, the best I have seen in years.

CiqDoPQ.jpeg
 
Finally got to play and see Space Marine 2 running in person....(PC 4k everything maxed out)
It's a last gen game with some current gen material rendering and models sprinkled in here and there. It looks ...okay for an AA game nothing more. Geometric detail, textures etc are all just okay and a lot of the animationwork is rather janky due to the horde system. The lighting is the worst offender with most dynamic elements having that terribly wrong probe lighting or downright glowing look...
In the end this game's visuals look like they didn't have a lot of budget and mainly live from the game's great staging/scene scripting which however also results in basically 1 route corridor levels...

I personally don't get the high praise this game got from the reviewers. Especially not at this price point.
The gameplay is as one dimensional as it gets and doesn't come close to the meatyness or the fluidity of Darktide, which also often looks better, too.
 
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RyanEvans21

Member
they actually had only 20-30 devs when they made the first demo. they expanded to 130 devs after 2020.

Still, $300 million and 5 years for spiderman 2 and they didnt even bother changing the city assets. Crazy. $200 million for GOW and HFW and they are both last gen game recycling the same tech.

Pretty sure Sony is running a money laundering scheme because these numbers dont make much sense. Especially when Dutch sources put HFW at 110 euros, but Sony told FTC that it cost $200 million before marketing dollars. Either they are fudging the numbers for tax purposes or someone at these studios is scamming them blind.
You forgot to add Western Game developers salary. Probably, Most of them earning 100k yearly. Plus monthly rent where their work. etc.....
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
You forgot to add Western Game developers salary. Probably, Most of them earning 100k yearly. Plus monthly rent where their work. etc.....
Last i checked, ND on glassdoor had an average salary of $75k. this includes executives and directors who likely make millions. i am sure its higher than a no name chinese studio but there is absolutely no reason a DLC game like Miles should cost $155 million or a short 10 hour game 2 years in the making like ratchet should cost $82 million when wukong is 5x the size.

ND used to make games for just $20 million up until around 2013 when they launched TLOU. 7 years later, TLOU2 cost $200 million? i doubt it. I mentioned the inconsistent reporting for HFW as well. HZD cost $47 million in 2017, 5 years later, the sequel cost $200 million? inflation has gone up by 20-25%. Not 300%.
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
Wukong's fifth level is all rocks and not gonna lie, im slightly disappointed. the texture quality simply isnt that great. its better than say GOW's musphelheim levels but not even remotely close to the PS5 demo or even its own Chapter 2 rocks. I dont understand why because this level is barely hitting 60% on my gpu when literally the forest level in chapter 4 forced me to drop from dlss quality to dlss performance just to hold 30 fps.

it's clear that forests not being nanite is why those levels are taxing, but its clear these rocks can either have better geometry or better textures or both. the vram is low, the gpu usage is low. so why not use the highest quality assets and textures? i would love to know the reasoning behind this.

Still, my mind pretty much stopped working during this cutscene, especially the cloth physics in this shot. I had to turn on my MSI afterburner to see cpu and gpu usage both of which were running at peak clocks. so definitely realtime.

9B6ukxm.gif


The hair tech in this game, the cloth physics, the material work on the armor is all just sublime. There is a scene with like 5 asian girls each with long flowy hair with perfect shading. I dont think ive seen hair like this. not even in Fifa.

OT1XchW.gif


I am surprised that this game has just an 82 on metacritic. i suppose the story is trash so maybe people held that against it but then again it didnt matter for elden ring and ff7 rebirth so not sure why all of a sudden the story matters.

Regardless, this is my goty not just because the gameplay is fun, but because its a fantastic action adventure game that isnt brutally hard like souls and is simply a fun game with exceptional visuals, animations, boss encounters and stunning art direction. its what gow, hfw and elden ring shouldve been.

tUA6HqM.gif
 
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RyanEvans21

Member
Last i checked, ND on glassdoor had an average salary of $75k. this includes executives and directors who likely make millions. i am sure its higher than a no name chinese studio but there is absolutely no reason a DLC game like Miles should cost $155 million or a short 10 hour game 2 years in the making like ratchet should cost $82 million when wukong is 5x the size.

ND used to make games for just $20 million up until around 2013 when they launched TLOU. 7 years later, TLOU2 cost $200 million? i doubt it. I mentioned the inconsistent reporting for HFW as well. HZD cost $47 million in 2017, 5 years later, the sequel cost $200 million? inflation has gone up by 20-25%. Not 300%.

Based on experiences... Probably most of them like working their for 3 or more years...

Back to topic:

I think Wukong has the best graphics for this year... Astro Bot is good looking game too.
 

Bitstream

Member
Still, my mind pretty much stopped working during this cutscene, especially the cloth physics in this shot. I had to turn on my MSI afterburner to see cpu and gpu usage both of which were running at peak clocks. so definitely realtime.
That is some ridiculously fluid cloth physics, incredible attention to detail! What are you running it on? Don't think I've seen any cloth simulation on that level in realtime before
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
That is some ridiculously fluid cloth physics, incredible attention to detail! What are you running it on? Don't think I've seen any cloth simulation on that level in realtime before
rtx 3080 but the gpu was hovering around 65% (peak clocks for both gpu 1950 mhz and cpu 4900 mhz) though. which is why im assuming its realtime. i dont think any of the cutscenes in this game are pre-rendered because they have dropped to the mid 20s in some occassions.

i dont have Path tracing enabled, just running everything at cinematic settings.
 

Alex11

Member
Finally got to play and see Space Marine 2 running in person....(PC 4k everything maxed out)
It's a last gen game with some current gen material rendering and models sprinkled in here and there. It looks ...okay for an AA game nothing more. Geometric detail, textures etc are all just okay and a lot of the animationwork is rather janky due to the horde system. The lighting is the worst offender with most dynamic elements having that terribly wrong probe lighting or downright glowing look...
In the end this game's visuals look like they didn't have a lot of budget and mainly live from the game's great staging/scene scripting which however also results in basically 1 route corridor levels...

I personally don't get the high praise this game got from the reviewers. Especially not at this price point.
The gameplay is as one dimensional as it gets and doesn't come close to the meatyness or the fluidity of Darktide, which also often looks better, too.
Completely agree, and I was a bit surprised as it isn't that open, the levels aren't that big, it's a false sense of scale, with all kinds of stuff happening in the background.

The gameplay is one dimensional, but there are two systems here that a bit contradict one another, I really don't like it and gave up on it as I died on the 2nd mission to a QTE.
 

i_mean

Banned
Last i checked, ND on glassdoor had an average salary of $75k. this includes executives and directors who likely make millions. i am sure its higher than a no name chinese studio but there is absolutely no reason a DLC game like Miles should cost $155 million or a short 10 hour game 2 years in the making like ratchet should cost $82 million when wukong is 5x the size.

ND used to make games for just $20 million up until around 2013 when they launched TLOU. 7 years later, TLOU2 cost $200 million? i doubt it. I mentioned the inconsistent reporting for HFW as well. HZD cost $47 million in 2017, 5 years later, the sequel cost $200 million? inflation has gone up by 20-25%. Not 300%.
The only reason why thats the average is because of QA...Animators, vfx artist. technical artists, programmers, Game design..etc are making at minimum 130-140k...maxing out at 200-250k sometimes more for programmers and engineers. Now how many of those do you think there are on an animation heavy game like TLOU..plus a tonne of outsourcing and you easily get up to 200M
 
Wukong's fifth level is all rocks and not gonna lie, im slightly disappointed. the texture quality simply isnt that great. its better than say GOW's musphelheim levels but not even remotely close to the PS5 demo or even its own Chapter 2 rocks. I dont understand why because this level is barely hitting 60% on my gpu when literally the forest level in chapter 4 forced me to drop from dlss quality to dlss performance just to hold 30 fps.

it's clear that forests not being nanite is why those levels are taxing, but its clear these rocks can either have better geometry or better textures or both. the vram is low, the gpu usage is low. so why not use the highest quality assets and textures? i would love to know the reasoning behind this.

Still, my mind pretty much stopped working during this cutscene, especially the cloth physics in this shot. I had to turn on my MSI afterburner to see cpu and gpu usage both of which were running at peak clocks. so definitely realtime.

9B6ukxm.gif


The hair tech in this game, the cloth physics, the material work on the armor is all just sublime. There is a scene with like 5 asian girls each with long flowy hair with perfect shading. I dont think ive seen hair like this. not even in Fifa.

OT1XchW.gif


I am surprised that this game has just an 82 on metacritic. i suppose the story is trash so maybe people held that against it but then again it didnt matter for elden ring and ff7 rebirth so not sure why all of a sudden the story matters.

Regardless, this is my goty not just because the gameplay is fun, but because its a fantastic action adventure game that isnt brutally hard like souls and is simply a fun game with exceptional visuals, animations, boss encounters and stunning art direction. its what gow, hfw and elden ring shouldve been.

tUA6HqM.gif
Does the hair move like this in gameplay?
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
I visited my first Imperial base and as I suspected, the game looks great there. Fantastic RT reflections, great lighting and some excellent metallic surfaces. I am honestly not sure whats going on in the slums but maybe they were trying to give it a dirty slum look and just fucked it up.

7Hn7tjT.gif


iFUdMBL.gif


hI4PgmK.gif
 
Haha you need to go back to school or something...or better yet google is your friend and see the many uses of a rethorical question..you goof..good luck
A rethorical question is one you don't need to answer, because it's obvious and everyone is supposed to agree on it.
Now let me ask you a rethorical question.
You cannot help but miss everytime, can you ?
Let’s not derail the thread, take it to PM.
 

hlm666

Member
if you're looking for an isometric game with nice visuals and proper destruction, you will probably find this game interesting:
I love how UE5 and the creativity of these AA studios are turning them into rock stars [pun intended]



P.S. for some reason, I find Isometric games extremely pleasing in terms of graphics.
the last one whose visuals fascinated me and I absolutely enjoyed was The Ascent
top-notch visuals and unique art direction made that game so memorable for me

Also, REPLACED, is another visually amazing game I am looking forward to


As someone who loved zombie driver that looks great fun, thanks for the heads up. On a side note there's another cheap game on steam called maniac which is similar but with mobile levels visuals, still a bit of fun though.

I've been waiting for replaced since announcement though and i'm worried i may be in aged care before it releases lol /joking.

bugger it, i'll link the maniac trailer it's cheap as shit and the physics are slightly above average.

 
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CGNoire

Member
This is disappointing. They downgraded the volumetric lighting in Space Marine even on PC.



I really dont understand this. Just add it as a toggle on PC. It adds so much to the game. Without these volumetric effects, i dont think Callisto looks as good as it does, and yet time and time again, devs simply take this effect out.

The rest of the level is fairly similar so no further downgrades to lighting and asset quality, but those thick volumetric effects are gone from the forest level too. What a shame.

Wtf? Seriously fucking retarded decision. Even consoles should have no problem with it. The baseline is 10 fucking TFs for heavens sakes.
 

Lethal01

Member

Black Myth: Wukong Cost $70 Million And Over 6 Years of Development, 18 million units sold in 2 weeks

They will be a force to be reckoned with next gen. And I guarantee you they will NEVER take 7 years to make a game, I will put money on them shortening dev times.

Better hope they don't get more ambitious with the next one if it takes a single year more you will become a liar. :messenger_winking:
 

CGNoire

Member
I will do a comparison with the reveal trailer tomorrow. That area used to look great. Now it seems like you are in a disco with all different neon lights just filling the screen making it ugly.
Thats more of an Aesthetic Opinion than a Technical Observation.
 

CGNoire

Member
I'm not an Alex from DF basher but I really do not understand his praise for character models in that game, like at all.
Hes not the sharpest tool......someone who posts enviroment shots to show off dynamic RTGI.

Its like.."Show characters "Moving" through Indirect Lit Enviroments you fucking baffoon."
 

CGNoire

Member
Yeah, Downsampling adds a lot to the image quality. I remember playing a bunch of PS4 Pro games on my 1080p tv getting downsampled from 1620p or 4kcb and I was blown away by how pristine the image quality was. I was kind of disappointed when i bought an expensive 4k tv and the same games didnt look as clean because now they were half res instead of double res.

I was watching an interview with Ridley Scott from back in 1982 when he was on a press tour for Blade Runner and the interviewer asked him if he felt pressured into making movie look even better than Alien and Star Wars. And not just in terms of special effects. he said yes, just as much as having a good script. This is back when Hollywood was first starting out with pushing special effects and the directors knew they had to keep pushing. The 90s werent an accident, guys like Ridley, Spielberg, Robert Zemeckis, and James Cameron kept pushing the tech as much as possible that led to the CGi boom in the 90s.

Video Games were the same until the first half of this gen when the Spielberg's and Ridleys of our industry just decided to phone it in. Just shocking.


Hopefully, this makes you understand why we dislike him despite his expertise in other areas. He's simply not consistent and has a literal blind spot for games/devs he has a soft spot for.

I like a lot of the tech here. I am a big Avatar fan, but they fucked up the cutscenes in that game and are doing the same here. They need to invest in better cutscene directors and tech.
So true on that first point. Still using a 1080p Plasma with my 4090....no regrets
 

geary

Member
if you're looking for an isometric game with nice visuals and proper destruction, you will probably find this game interesting:
I love how UE5 and the creativity of these AA studios are turning them into rock stars [pun intended]



P.S. for some reason, I find Isometric games extremely pleasing in terms of graphics.
the last one whose visuals fascinated me and I absolutely enjoyed was The Ascent
top-notch visuals and unique art direction made that game so memorable for me

Also, REPLACED, is another visually amazing game I am looking forward to


Another isometric game which look phenomenal is No rest for the wicked. I cant wait for full release to see what improvements they do on the graphics aide.
 

PeteBull

Member
Last i checked, ND on glassdoor had an average salary of $75k. this includes executives and directors who likely make millions. i am sure its higher than a no name chinese studio but there is absolutely no reason a DLC game like Miles should cost $155 million or a short 10 hour game 2 years in the making like ratchet should cost $82 million when wukong is 5x the size.

ND used to make games for just $20 million up until around 2013 when they launched TLOU. 7 years later, TLOU2 cost $200 million? i doubt it. I mentioned the inconsistent reporting for HFW as well. HZD cost $47 million in 2017, 5 years later, the sequel cost $200 million? inflation has gone up by 20-25%. Not 300%.
They rise salaries for their devteam, mainly lead devs, by a lot, its stupid of them but they do it out of fear of top "talent" leaving the studio for competitor company or making their own, on top of that especially durning pandemy all dev studios were employing above what was needed, dont know the reasons for it, but basically all big studios did it.

Remember especially in sony western AAA teams they now place huge role on DEI, so both hirings are bloated af with useless and less competent ppl, on top in their games top priority isnt making best quality game anymore, but to push woke agenda, that costs tons more too.

As a contrast (and since im polish;p) i show u robocop rouge city devteam/devtime
From the wiki
Piotr Łatocha, Game Director of RoboCop: Rogue City, revealed in an interview that it took the team a total of 3 years to fully develop the game.[16]
Game only needed 3years of dev time, coz there was 0 DEI hires and all the ppl were simply big fans of the IP, worked enthusiastically on it, polish salaries so roughly 4-5x lower from western dev salaries/
Thats why game made big profit even tho it didnt sell crazy good https://gamesensor.info/news/robocop_rogue_city_sales_first_week_on_steam
And yeh, game is only AA, so not big project, but it was budgeted smartly to achieve profitability, unlike many big western AAA projects.

Now at the same time spiderman's 2 mary jane was big downgrade, and there was reason for it

TLDR lead writer insterted herself(hence terrible mj looks downgrade in the sequel) into the game, on top huge pandering to the "strong independed woman" narrative and terrible actual story of the game, ofc all that with extremly high salary that baloons up game's budget- we didnt get that shit 10-15years ago.
In normal/sane company u would have head of the studio simply catch it and squash that artrocity in the bud, but with DEI/wokeness/pandering they cant/dont wanna say shit and game is made that way.
 

GymWolf

Gold Member
I saw only one cutscene with the ladies in wukong but i didn't noticed hair tech nowhere close to fifa replays tbh, i think wukong still use the 'let's reunite chunks of hairs because we can't animate single hairs" tech.

At least fifa gives the impression of actual hairs even if it's a visual trick and not actual hair physics

quoyetjmemlw4qsxwwqy.gif

udumyauocm4ai8lzxxe5.gif


Only gta6 looks better than this (if real).

Dmc5 also had some neat hair tech for dante.
 
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GymWolf

Gold Member
Btw if you needed another proof that gif make every game look much better, this is what most people in this forum called mid looking remnant 2

SghHdvT.gif


But in gif format it looks more pristine than my clean shaved testicles on a sunday morning.
 
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Giallo Corsa

Gold Member
There is pvp and replayable pve coop missions after campaign. But i agree that the game looks pretty shallow in terms of gameplay. Basically all you do is fighting againts hordes the whole time. Its a well made game and probably 40k fans dream, but i'll wait for sale and the pro to play it

This is me.
Yes, it looks good and everything but...70 Euros seems too steep for what it offers - short-ish campaign and half-baked/tacked on MP, I just don't know, want to get it but...

I think.im.gonna settle for Wukong
 
I am just gonna leave these here





another isometric wonder [time-stamped]


what I wouldn't give to see this kind of simulation in my games again

Same. Astrobot at least seems to be trying to do something with the physics. It’s absolutely insane to me that we’ve barely progressed in this area
 
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