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[arkhamguy123]

There is lots to like here. I went softer on graphics last year while everyone here gave me shit for finding star wars, ff16, starfield and spiderman 2 impressive and next gen at times. I just think that we all expected Sony studios to blow away ubisoft's efforts with AC shadows and Star wars outlaws, but it seems to be roughly on par with both games. With some strengths and weakness, no big Matrix Awakens, Wukong, Hellblade 2 or Marvel's 1943 leap we were expecting from sony studios.

This is next gen enough for me, but not awe-inspiring which is unfair to sony studios, but frankly those are my expectations to manage since i put them on a pedestal for so long. Turns out they dont have a secret sauce and the industry has caught up to them, while Epic has completely exceeded them.

Or just… blow away anyone at all would’ve been nice. I think ghost of Yotei looks gorgeous buuut if I’m keeping it 100% real with you guys, and this is a true story, I saw on Twitter there was some kind of ghost of Tsushima reveal and scrambled to watch the live stream, I was able to tune in RIGHT at the end when it showed the snippets of gameplay with her shooting the gun to the hard 2025 cut

And I legit thought it was some kinda Tsushima dlc they were doing. I went to PlayStations official YouTube channel after and went “oh huh it’s a full PS5 sequel”. The scene of her doing the water stance triangle attack (same animation as Tsushima) looked so crossgen it makes my head spin. And her walking through the blue flower field. I think our good ol GymWolf clowned on that particular shot as well. It looked pretty PS4 esque. Basically just like the first game. The rest of the trailer is alright though. Looks appropriately PS5 only.

Except that wolfs fur is pretty bad. Bluepoint had dynamic nvidia hair works like fur on their NPC WOLFS in demon souls and this wolf that’s a goddamn star of the trailer almost gets PS3 2D fur

 

[Luipadre]

I hope they will release some crispy 4k videos from DS2 this weekend

 

[Flabagast]

I always wondered what the fuck is the ICE team doing if they don't even share tech between studios.

Epic team must be more than ten times bigger than the ICE team and with much more budget.

Individual studios simply cannot really compete anymore.

 

[GymWolf]

Epic team must be more than ten times bigger than the ICE team and with much more budget.

Individual studios simply cannot really compete anymore.

But the ice team only job is to share tech, it wasn't really a confrontation with how big epic is.

 

[GymWolf]

Or just… blow away anyone at all would’ve been nice. I think ghost of Yotei looks gorgeous buuut if I’m keeping it 100% real with you guys, and this is a true story, I saw on Twitter there was some kind of ghost of Tsushima reveal and scrambled to watch the live stream, I was able to tune in RIGHT at the end when it showed the snippets of gameplay with her shooting the gun to the hard 2025 cut

And I legit thought it was some kinda Tsushima dlc they were doing. I went to PlayStations official YouTube channel after and went “oh huh it’s a full PS5 sequel”. The scene of her doing the water stance triangle attack (same animation as Tsushima) looked so crossgen it makes my head spin. And her walking through the blue flower field. I think our good ol GymWolf clowned on that particular shot as well. It looked pretty PS4 esque. Basically just like the first game. The rest of the trailer is alright though. Looks appropriately PS5 only.

Except that wolfs fur is pretty bad. Bluepoint had dynamic nvidia hair works like fur on their NPC WOLFS in demon souls and this wolf that’s a goddamn star of the trailer almost gets PS3 2D fur

Except for the fur (it didn't looked too bad to me in this pic), the close up on the wolf mouth was probably the only thing that impressed me a bit in the trailer.

But it was also beyond 2:00 am when i watched the video so i was almost asleep so i don't have a strong opinion about it.

edit: yep

The part close to the nose is particularly well made, i can give credit when credit is due.

 

[Xtib81]

So, about that Ghost reveal. It definitely looks better than the original, especially the draw distance. Some shots look incredible but textures still look weak and those last few seconds of actual gameplay look very mid. It actually looks like tsushima so I don't know.

 

[GymWolf]

I need a rewatch because i don't even remember any gameplay

(except for the ridins horse part)

SlimySnake i don't see any death, just her hitting a dude 2 times, there is still the smallest hope that they ditch the precanned animation in favour of something more dynamic (but who i'm kidding )

 

[Kaiserstark]

I'm really interested to see Guerrilla next games because they seem to really want to push the Pro in the DF video about their Hand-On for the console, the Guerrilla's developers said to them if the console had launched closer to HFW, they will had bring more ambitious improvements to the game like that additional GPU power being leveraged for other purposes or possibly the additional ray tracing power being leveraged for other purposes ect...

 

[Xtib81]

I'm really interested to see Guerrilla next games because they seem to really want to push the Pro in the DF video about their Hand-On for the console, the Guerrilla's developers said to them if the console had launched closer to HFW, they will had bring more ambitious improvements to the game like that additional GPU power being leveraged for other purposes or possibly the additional ray tracing power being leveraged for other purposes ect...

They're Sony's best studio when it comes to visuals. I even put them above ND.

 

[GymWolf]

They're Sony's best studio when it comes to visuals. I even put them above ND.

I would still put ND in an higher tier because they just have straight up better animations and digital acting.

But they never had the guts to lower their overall detail to make an open world like guerrilla did.

 

[Xtib81]

I would still put ND in an higher tier because they just have straight up better animations and digital acting.

But they never had the guts to lower their overall detail to make an open world like guerrilla did.

I agree that they're second to none regarding facial animations and overall cinematography but in terms of texturing, lighting etc.. I think what GG achieves is more impressive. Horizon games' only big weakness is draw distance/Lod. The day they fix that, it's game over.

 

[SlimySnake]

Or just… blow away anyone at all would’ve been nice. I think ghost of Yotei looks gorgeous buuut if I’m keeping it 100% real with you guys, and this is a true story, I saw on Twitter there was some kind of ghost of Tsushima reveal and scrambled to watch the live stream, I was able to tune in RIGHT at the end when it showed the snippets of gameplay with her shooting the gun to the hard 2025 cut

And I legit thought it was some kinda Tsushima dlc they were doing. I went to PlayStations official YouTube channel after and went “oh huh it’s a full PS5 sequel”. The scene of her doing the water stance triangle attack (same animation as Tsushima) looked so crossgen it makes my head spin. And her walking through the blue flower field. I think our good ol GymWolf clowned on that particular shot as well. It looked pretty PS4 esque. Basically just like the first game. The rest of the trailer is alright though. Looks appropriately PS5 only.

Except that wolfs fur is pretty bad. Bluepoint had dynamic nvidia hair works like fur on their NPC WOLFS in demon souls and this wolf that’s a goddamn star of the trailer almost gets PS3 2D fur

You are not the only one. A couple of my friends on discord thought this was DLC.

I'm really interested to see Guerrilla next games because they seem to really want to push the Pro in the DF video about their Hand-On for the console, the Guerrilla's developers said to them if the console had launched closer to HFW, they will had bring more ambitious improvements to the game like that additional GPU power being leveraged for other purposes or possibly the additional ray tracing power being leveraged for other purposes ect...

its been 4 years since the console came out and they have done fuck all to leverage the PS5 power. its all just excuses. They are a first party studio who received devkits way back in 2018. Other third party studios received their devkits a few weeks after April 2019 when cerny revealed the ps5 to wired knowing those third parties will leak the ps5. this console has been around for 6+ years now and these first party studios refuse to push it.

No reason for HZD to look only as good as HFW which is a fucking last gen title.

 

[SlimySnake]

Watching the GT7 Pro preview from DF just confirms how the mighty have fallen. The ray traced reflections apply only to cars. There are no track reflections. no buildings on the track. This is almost as limiting as forza's shitty RT implementation.

When you cant even plug in proper RT support in a game that looks last gen as fuck, on a $700 pro machine, you should probably just quit making video games and go sell burgers. This is pathetic.

 

[Rain432]

Watching the GT7 Pro preview from DF just confirms how the mighty have fallen. The ray traced reflections apply only to cars. There are no track reflections. no buildings on the track. This is almost as limiting as forza's shitty RT implementation.

When you cant even plug in proper RT support in a game that looks last gen as fuck, on a $700 pro machine, you should probably just quit making video games and go sell burgers. This is pathetic.

relax sir

 

[alloush]

PC modders are crazy:

 

[GymWolf]

I agree that they're second to none regarding facial animations and overall cinematography but in terms of texturing, lighting etc.. I think what GG achieves is more impressive. Horizon games' only big weakness is draw distance/Lod. The day they fix that, it's game over.

I'm not an expert on lighs but i always thought tlou2 had more realistic lights than horizon tbh.

And texture wise, i don't see one clearly winning, you have to consider that we saw nothing from ND in the past years, i don't even consider tlou1 remake a thing, it was a cheap ass project.

 

[Msamy]

I really hope they can keep the graphics quality of the ghost 2 trailer in final game, and I really think it's gonna be hard for them.

 

[JCreasy]

GoT confirms my suspicions about sony studios just kind of phoning in this gen. It looks like a HZD to HFW and spiderman 1 to spiderman 2 esque leap. No UE5 caliber leap here.

Pros
- Great draw distance. finally.
- Gorgeous snow effects
- Lots of horses
- Decent fur effects on horses and wolves
- same great cinematography

Cons
- Same plastic character models. i swear Delsin in Infamous Second son had better face shaders
- Fairly similar lighting to the first
- Same janky animations
- Same cartoony art style.
- same last gen esque NPC models
- same last gen geometry

Sony studios shouldve adopted UE5. They have been clearly left behind. This wasnt just Insomniac being insomniac or ND phoning in the remake or astrobot devs not giving a shit about graphics. this is clearly the standard to expect from sony this gen.

FUCK! I hate when Slimy is right about shit like this.

 

[GymWolf]

I really hope they can keep the graphics quality of the ghost 2 trailer in final game, and I really think it's gonna be hard for them.

You think the trailer look too good to be impossible on a ps5?

 

[Flabagast]

I really hope they can keep the graphics quality of the ghost 2 trailer in final game, and I really think it's gonna be hard for them.

On a technical front nothing looks particularly advanced in the trailer (except maybe for lighting). Perfectly achievable imho

 

[GymWolf]

yeah, better lighting, skin shaders, hair rendering compared to the first.

No i was talking compared to forbidden west, of course they look better than ds1.

Also, when you say incredible snow effects in ghost 2, what do you mean? when he walk in the snow it looks like the bog standard tech snow that pretty much everyone use unless i missed something, i think horizon still has the best snow out of all sony studios, gow ragnarock snow was pretty meh.

 

[SlimySnake]

No i was talking compared to forbidden west, of course they look better than ds1.

Also, when you say incredible snow effects in ghost 2, what do you mean? when he walk in the snow it looks like the bog standard tech snow that pretty much everyone use, i think horizon still has the best out of all sony studios snow, gow ragnarock snow was pretty meh.

the very first color shot of the trailer with the blood splattered on the snow.

 

[Represent.]

Sigh.

 

[Msamy]

You think the trailer look too good to be impossible on a ps5?

Not all aspects of the trailer but mainly the lighting for me it's better than anything done in ps5 until now

 

[Edder1]

Regarding the Sony graphics debacle. It's pretty obvious the reason why Sony fell behind in graphics technology is because their studios were using their own proprietary engines, which needed massive investments in order to take advantage of current gen console tech. It's also obvious that Sony chose not to invest too heavily in these engines, except in case of maybe Decima, which may gave got the funding because it's used by more than one studio.

I know lot of people champion the cause of proprietary engines, but maintaining and upgrading them requires massive funding going forward. Epic can obviously afford to invest heavily in UE5, but expecting a single studio that makes maximum of two games a generation to do the same is somewhat unrealistic. This isn't an excuse in case of Sony, they have enough funding for this, but it's obvious they chose to cut costs and increase profit.

 

[Msamy]

On a technical front nothing looks particularly advanced in the trailer (except maybe for lighting). Perfectly achievable imho

The lighting is the most important thing and have biggest load in current gen consules gpu specially when it uses rtgi

 

[SlimySnake]

Regarding the Sony graphics debacle. It's pretty obvious the reason why Sony fell behind in graphics technology is because their studios were using their own engines, which needed massive investments in order to take advantage of current gen console tech. It's also obvious that Sony chose not to invest too heavily in these engines, except in case of Decima, which may gave got the funding because it's used by more than one studio.

I know lot of people champion the cause of proprietary engines, but maintaining ans upgrading them requires massive funding going forward. Epic can obviously afford to invest heavily in UE5, but expecting a single studio that makes maximum of two games a generation to do the same is somewhat unrealistic.

Shouldve pooled in resources and adopted one engine as the base engine for every studio like EA did for frostbite. yes, it had its issues in the beginning but now its a great engine. bioware made the awesome looking Anthem on it. Dragon Age looks like shit but they are using hair tech made by the fifa team and it looks amazing.

Sony studios are lacking leadership and it shows in the final product. this is technically a late gen game releasing in the 5th year of the console life cycle and simply doesnt look as big of an upgrade as it should.

 

[Msamy]

Shouldve pooled in resources and adopted one engine as the base engine for every studio like EA did for frostbite. yes, it had its issues in the beginning but now its a great engine. bioware made the awesome looking Anthem on it. Dragon Age looks like shit but they are using hair tech made by the fifa team and it looks amazing.

Sony studios are lacking leadership and it shows in the final product. this is technically a late gen game releasing in the 5th year of the console life cycle and simply doesnt look as big of an upgrade as it should.

The biggest problem with sony this gen is forcing their studios to make failure gaas titles and don't accept any game without 60fps mode (for those 75% M. F.) and now even they forced it to be the standard mode, also right now many studios prove to me that implementing ray tracing and better geometry in other engines than ue5 is not that hard with current gen gpus

 

[Edder1]

Shouldve pooled in resources and adopted one engine as the base engine for every studio like EA did for frostbite. yes, it had its issues in the beginning but now its a great engine. bioware made the awesome looking Anthem on it. Dragon Age looks like shit but they are using hair tech made by the fifa team and it looks amazing.

Sony studios are lacking leadership and it shows in the final product. this is technically a late gen game releasing in the 5th year of the console life cycle and simply doesnt look as big of an upgrade as it should.

Sony's strategy this gen has been a very safe and conservative one, making remasteres and cost saving where they can. It's a very strange strategy since what got them so big last gen was making blockbuster titles that blew everyone away with their tech. I guess they looked at the numbers and saw what it would cost them to properly upgrade their engines and got scared so they played it safe. I think moving towards a single engine or two or three like what Ubisoft does would be the best option if they wanna cost save, but this would require new vision and radical change, something that Sony leadership doesn't seem to be capable of at the moment as you mentioned.

 

[alloush]

Sony's strategy this gen has been a very safe and conservative one, making remasteres and cost saving where they can. It's a very strange strategy since what got them so big last gen was making blockbuster titles that blew everyone away with their tech. I guess they looked at the numbers and saw what it would cost them to properly upgrade their engines and got scared so they played it safe. I think moving towards a single engine or two or three of them like what Ubisoft does would be the best option if they wanna cost save, but this would require new vision and radical change, something that Sony leadership doesn't seem to be capable of at the moment as you mentioned.

Which is weird considering the hundreds of millions of dollars they have poured into their games including the gaas trash and the abomination called Concord.

 

[GymWolf]

the very first color shot of the trailer with the blood splattered on the snow.

Isn't that a cutscene?

 

[GymWolf]

The lighting is the most important thing and have biggest load in current gen consules gpu specially when it uses rtgi

Doesn't metro exodus use full rtgi or some shit?
Doesn't starfield use rtgi (or some shit)?

I'm really not an expert.

 

[TaterPop1980]

Best looking shot in the game. Reminded me of a similar shot in the wukong intro.

Wukong isnt open world so probably not a fair comparison. I would love to see some star wars outlaws and ac shadows comparisons.

I’m so old that when I saw beautiful cinematic in the trailer it immediately reminded me of a similar one in Ninja. Giaden II on the NES. It took me back and the nostalgia kicked in. My gosh how far graphics have come. Outstanding.

 

[Msamy]

Doesn't metro exodus use full rtgi or some shit?
Doesn't starfield use rtgi (or some shit)?

I'm really not an expert.

Not all rtgi implementation are same there levels to that you can see games that use ue5 lumen but have difference in it's quality between differences games and differences between it's console quality and pc quality, and I am sure ghost 2 trailer have high quality rtgi.

 

[Feel Like I'm On 42]

Can't wait to see how the rtx shadows are gonna cover for those ps4 launch line up tier textures.

To quote the official reveal topic, "it looks like cgi"

(From 15 years ago maybe)

Those rocks on the ground on the stone path she's walking on have the exact same low detail texture that the first game has. Many people are already confusing Yotei's great art with the improvement to graphics which is frustrating. More frustrating though? That we're here AGAIN with a top tier Sony current gen exclusive like we were with Spiderman 2 and LoU1 remake!

Here are the improvements I see in the trailer: -character models, lighting (not by much but the fact that we're asking our selves if it's rt gi is a good thing), and draw distance/lod looks better ...

The problem is it's the assets, textures, and world geometry needed the most improvement and it sure doesn't look like they did much on that front. Compare this with Hellblade 2, Fable, Death Stranding 2, and GTA6 for contrast ...and remember, this trailer uses cutscene/ideal conditions for every scene ..

Another strange decision from Sony is not to show these heavy hitters on the PS5 Pro ...Sony has no problem showing games running on PC when it suits them but don't want to piss off PS5 base owners now?

The handling of the Pro has been so strange. Btw, what do people think about the previews that dropped today of the Pro? I saw GT7 and as I predicted nobody will be able to see the RT reflections on our car while we're in thr middle of race. Then I saw Horizon which they said might be the best example they saw and yet Olliver also said the Pro mode was a "little soft" which is not the words I want to hear associated with PSSR ...he also said the Pro version of gt7 was more aliased than base ps5's resolution mode ...

PSSR honestly is not sounding that grear guys ....finally, no mention of Cyberpunk, Red Dead 2, Black Myth, SW outlaws, Space Marine 2, LoU1 Remake, gow ragnarok, Control, Lies of P, Banishers, Baulders Gate 3, Dying Light 2, Final Fantasy 16 just some off the top of my head thar could all really use a Pro update

It's $800! all Sony games should be updated and many 3rd party in particular NEED updates.

 

[SlimySnake]

Doesn't metro exodus use full rtgi or some shit?
Doesn't starfield use rtgi (or some shit)?

I'm really not an expert.

exodus uses full rtgi
starfield uses realtime dyanmic GI thats more like software lumen
matrix awakens uses hardware lumen which is more like rtgi used in metro.

no game other than fortnite uses hardware lumen despite ps5 and xsx having hardware rt built into them because there is a big cost to performance. not even wukong which uses software lumen. not on pc or consoles.

software GI is good enough. its still dynamic, has better light bounce, and allows devs to change things on the fly which reduces dev time. It's not as good looking as hardware lumen, you can see alex's city sample video where he does some on/off comparisons and it mostly comes down to shadows and AO not being as high quality in software lumen.

hellblade, wukong, and 1943 all use software lumen and look amazing. Having realtime has its benefits but you can still get great looking next gen games without dynamic gi or rtgi. the art direction, lighting choices, and cinematography all have a say in it. its why tlou2 still looks so much more photorealistic than spiderman 2 and horizon fw.

 

[SlimySnake]

hen I saw Horizon which they said might be the best example they saw and yet Olliver also said the Pro mode was a "little soft" which is not the words I want to hear associated with PSSR ..

I tried to warn everyone of this in the pro speculation threads. Even DLSS is soft when it goes below 4k dlss quality. Almost every dev is applying pssr to performance modes which all run at very low resolutions. dlss 4k performance should look cleaner than a native 1080p presentation and less jaggied than fsr2 but it will still not look as sharp as native 4k or 4k dlss quality which upscales from 1440p.

 

[Portugeezer]

Zelda games will look like this in 15 years.

 

[SlimySnake]

Zelda games will look like this in 15 years.

 

[SlimySnake]

What does gaf think of this? Its no GoT2 but still looks very good in terms of asset quality and environment density.

 

[JCreasy]

If Cyberpunk 2 on PS6 don't look like this, I don't want it.

 

[Bitstream]

What does gaf think of this? Its no GoT2 but still looks very good in terms of asset quality and environment density.

I was really impressed with this one, reminded me of witcher3 with better assets. Someone called it an MMO, wonder how it plays, but so far it looked incredible.

 

[alloush]

If Cyberpunk 2 on PS6 don't look like this, I don't want it.

That’s the one I posted from Twitter yesterday but I guess the tweet was deleted. Thank you for posting it again as I couldn’t find the video again!

When graphics get this good I don’t mind playing in first person.

 

[Nasigil]

Are people really losing minds over GoY trailer for graphic reason? It's gorgeous as hell but that's art direction and cinematography doing the heavy lifting. The actual lighting, textures and details are not that much an improvement from GoT.

Black Myth Wukong had some jaw-dropping scenery and super high fidelity models (a lot are irl 3D scans), but I think the environment is a bit static.

Modded Cyberpunk has some of the craziest urban environment visuals I've seen.

 

[Portugeezer]

If Cyberpunk 2 on PS6 don't look like this, I don't want it.

PS5 was almost there 3 years ago

 

[Represent.]

We are so fucked. Watching this DF PS5 PRO coverage..

Guerilla Games devs straight up saying "Good friends dont let friends play at 30fps"

Sony is done with pushing graphics. Pack it in. Ghosts 2 is as good as it gets.

The 60fps framerate warriors have fucked everything for us.

 

[Lethal01]

Guerilla Games devs straight up saying "Good friends dont let friends play at 30fps"

Good to see Sony devs have their heads on straight.

 

[Represent.]

Good to see Sony devs have their heads on straight.

All the Pro does is make games look like how I already play them. (Quality mode)

Luckily Insomniac said they are going to make a 30fps PRO mode that pushes fidelity even further for their games.

So its up to the devs. The ones with sense will still make 30fps Pro modes and push fidelity.

 

[Senua]

All the Pro does is make games look like how I already play them. (Quality mode)

But now with DOUBLE the smoothness, isn't that rad!?

 

[Kaiserstark]

We are so fucked. Watching this DF PS5 PRO coverage..

Guerilla Games devs straight up saying "Good friends dont let friends play at 30fps"

Sony is done with pushing graphics. Pack it in. Ghosts 2 is as good as it gets.

The 60fps framerate warriors have fucked everything for us.

They also said right after that if the Pro had launched closer to the release of HFW, they will had bring more ambitious improvements to the game with the use of the new GPU power or from the RT.

And in its current state on Pro with HFW, there is practically no reason not to play it at 60 FPS.

It wouldn't be surprising if even on Pro for their next game they had a 30 FPS mode to push certain things more like RT.