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[Annoying Old Party Man]

Wait, in greece? You are about to default but can afford it to get paid in advance?

The company is offloading cash. It is better to pay us now than having a massive haircut in a few days and not being able to pays then.

We don't really have access to the money anyway, unless we buy something - and that's for TODAY only, I'm not sure the banks will be operational in a couple of days.

 

[Theonik]

The company is offloading cash. It is better to pay us now than having a massive haircut in a few days and not being able to pays then.

We don't really have access to the money anyway, unless we buy something - and that's for TODAY only, I'm not sure the banks will be operational in a couple of days.

YOU can SAVE the Vita. Put all your money into Vitas.

 

[PdotMichael]

Would China step in and help Greece back on their feet if indeed Greece is kicked out?
Are there any pros for China to do so?

Why should China help Greece in the first place? There is nothing to gain for them.

The same story with Russia even if being closer to Russia is the wet dream of some left wing radicals.

 

[oti]

YOU can SAVE the Vita. Put all your money into Vitas.

#OXI

 

[Rektash]

Why should China help Greece in the first place? There is nothing to gain for them.

The same story with Russia even if being closer to Russia is the wet dream of some left wing radicals.

Geopolitical influence. Fracturing the EU is Russias wet dream and China has interest in the mediterran.

 

[Theonik]

#OXI

Yes to the Vita. Yes to Life.

 

[PdotMichael]

Geopolitical influence.

What kind of geopolitical influence would China gain? They are an export nation sof they have general a neutral position and don't really care about anything outside of China.

 

[michaelius]

When you put it that way, i can see the problems now. A good strategy to appropriately repay the loan is needed to keep enough minimum living expense for the people.

Don't listen to them because they are selling you greek bullshit.

The reality is as follows

Old man was poor but he had wealthy cousin Adolf who shared his surname. So creditors lended him money thinking he will be as solid in repaying them as Adolf.

Old man didn't use those money to start his own bussiness or improve his working competences no he spent in on leisure and luxurious food living above his means for years.

After that there was small crisis in the world and people wanted their money back but it became obvious old man won't be able to pay them back - so he was given additional money to improve at the cost of cutting his spendings on luxury in hope that it will help old man repay his debts over time.

Did old man do anything to invest those money? No he spent it on slightly less luxurious food.

But the time has runned out and people came to get that new credit back - the man said he won't pay them and needs another credit to repay the older ones. So they said ok but you need to cut your spendings again and the old man started screeming that they are murdering him and they are cruel hearless terrorists.

 

[Negotiator]

What kind of geopolitical influence would China gain? They are an export nation sof they have general a neutral position and don't really care about anything outside of China.

The Piraeus port is very enticing for China's exports.

 

[Rektash]

What kind of geopolitical influence would China gain? They are an export nation sof they have general a neutral position and don't really care about anything outside of China.

Sorry, just a random hit from the first google search list. It gets the point across though.

 

[Chariot]

YOU can SAVE the Vita. Put all your money into Vitas.

Greece is a Legacy country now.

Geopolitical influence. Fracturing the EU is Russias wet dream and China has interest in the mediterran.

But China is playing it safe. They are not really interfering where the west has interest. They are opersting currently in african countries and close to them in southeast asia, right? I don't think they want have a part in eurppaen mess.

 

[Theonik]

stupid shit

lol

 

[EloKa]

...

stupid stuff. Also there's no need to drag Austria into this

 

[PdotMichael]

Sorry, just a random hit from the first google search list. It gets the point across though.

They are doing joint venture stuff with Russia. A year ago they did a maneuver in the South China Sea, does it mean that Russia is somehow interested in some of the islands there?

And why should China do anything that could hurt the trade with the way more important EU room and especially with Germany and France? Two countries which are extemly important to gain engineering knowhow for China - see Airbus in China.

 

[Rektash]

Greece is a Legacy country now.

But China is playing it safe. They are not really interfering where the west has interest. They are opersting currently in african countries and close to them in southeast asia, right? I don't think they want have a part in eurppaen mess.

China is opportunistic first and foremost. If they think they can get away with something, they'll do it.

 

[PodcastFips]

Greece is a Tier 3 country now.

Fixed

 

[oti]

What's France's position on debt cut/no debt cut? I'd think they'd be more open to the idea than Germany. Finland and Slovakia sound like no too. How about Italy?

 

[Rektash]

They are doing joint venture stuff with Russia. A year ago they did a maneuver in the South China Sea, does it mean that Russia is somehow interested in some of the islands there?

Like the article indicates, they are not just doing some maneuver to flex muscles. It is part of a bigger strategy to get a foothold in the mediterranean. That strategy includes military presence, investing in ports and more.

And why should China do anything that could hurt the trade with the way more important EU room and especially with Germany and France? Two countries which are extemly important to gain engineering knowhow for China - see Airbus in China.

Why would that hurt trade with Germany and France? It wouldn't.

 

[le-seb]

Ridiculous stuff

You obviously missed the part where he spent tons of this money buying military shit to Adolf and his other cousin Jean.

 

[My words exactly!]

stupid post

says you

What's France's position on debt cut/no debt cut? I'd think they'd be more open to the idea than Germany. Finland and Slovakia sound like no too. How about Italy?

I think that France is indeed more open to a debt cut. Nothern countries? Nope

BTW here's the full Varoufakis message:

Imho, he and Kammenos as minister of Defence are/were the two best things in the uncorrupt but inexperienced Syriza government. He is of great intellect and a great academic, much more than any office clerk with a random diploma (...), but not a politician. Now he will have a field day, he can make statements to the media (something that he obviously likes) without worrying about the repercussions.

I hope this, alongside the referendum risk that Greece took, cuts any excuses for such steep austerity plan (that evidently does NOT work, even IMF admits it ffs) and shows the true reason for disagreement.
Otherwise a Grexit is a much more preferable solution imho, to end this charade and gain back our respect.

 

[Theonik]

You obviously missed the part where he spent tons of this money buying military shit to Adolf and his other cousin Jean.

At the request of their unle Sam.

 

[Ether_Snake]

They are doing joint venture stuff with Russia. A year ago they did a maneuver in the South China Sea, does it mean that Russia is somehow interested in some of the islands there?

And why should China do anything that could hurt the trade with the way more important EU room and especially with Germany and France? Two countries which are extemly important to gain engineering knowhow for China - see Airbus in China.

Someone sure is in denial over this.

 

[Negotiator]

Dijsselbloem and Schäuble should step down as well.

It's not like they're less annoying than Varoufakis...

 

[Ted Striker]

The same story with Russia even if being closer to Russia is the wet dream of some left wing radicals.

You don't know much about greek politics, right?

 

[oti]

Dijsselbloem and Schäuble should step down as well.

It's not like they're less annoying than Varoufakis...

Merkel is the unrivaled Queen but Schäuble is pretty popular in Germany too. People here think he "keeps things together" and I can't blame them for that.

 

[Theonik]

Dijsselbloem and Schäuble should step down as well.

It's not like they're less annoying than Varoufakis...

There are discussions about the former stepping down.

 

[Negotiator]

Merkel is the unrivaled Queen but Schäuble is pretty popular in Germany too. People here think he "keeps things together" and I can't blame them for that.

Schäuble is popular in Germany? Oh gawd...

Merkel should stay though. She's pretty mild compared to him.

 

[PdotMichael]

Like the article indicates, they are not just doing some maneuver to flex muscles. It is part of a bigger strategy to get a foothold in the mediterranean. That strategy includes military presence, investing in ports and more.



Why would that hurt trade with Germany and France? It wouldn't.

Nothing in your linked article supports your claim. Any military presence in and around Europe would hurt the relationship between Europe and China also the article is highly naive with the speculated gunboat policy which would only isolate China and don't give them access to the resources.

You just went full Tom Clancy.

 

[Rektash]

Merkel is the unrivaled Queen but Schäuble is pretty popular in Germany too. People here think he "keeps things together" and I can't blame them for that.

It would need a gigantic change in the public perception of this crisis. Quite frankly I don't see that happening anytime soon.

 

[oti]

Schäuble is popular in Germany? Oh gawd...

Merkel should stay though. She's pretty mild compared to him.

It would need a gigantic change in the public perception of this crisis. Quite frankly I don't see that happening anytime soon.

I mean, things seem to work in Germany. The mentality here is "we work and we make sacrifices and we deserve our economic strength". Schäuble isn't sugar coating and very direct, he gets things done. I know the Greek stance when it comes to Schäuble but that doesn't matter to the Germans, understandably so.

 

[Rektash]

Nothing in your linked article supports your claim. Any military presence in and around Europe would hurt the relationship between Europe and China also the article is highly naive with the speculated gunboat policy which would only isolate China and don't give them access to the resources.

You just went full Tom Clancy.

Well, the title for one thing does in fact support that:

"China's naval exercises in the Mediterranean are linked to Beijing's ambitious 'New Silk Road' strategy"

I said the article wasn't great, but my time at work is too limited to find anything better. Google "New Silk Road" to get a better picture.

 

[oti]

Dijsselbloem can absolutely go though.

 

[Napalm_Frank]

Yes to the Vita. Yes to Life.

If the money poured into the crisis since 2010 was put into Vita instead the world would be a much better place.

 

[Theonik]

If the money poured into the crisis since 2010 was put into Vita instead the world would be a much better place.

Merkel should bailout Shenmue III.

 

[PdotMichael]

Well, the title for one thing does in fact support that:



I said the article wasn't great, but my time at work is too limited to find anything better. Google "New Silk Road" to get a better picture.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slat...r_russia_bail_out_greece_if_europe_won_t.html

It's great to dream about another superpower that just wait to help Greece but that is just unrealistic and silly.

 

[Osiris]

The only thing in Greece that the Chinese are interested in are assets that might become available due to privatization.

Hell, even the Kremlin has said pretty much the same thing today, they'd be interested in ownership of the ports / airports etc. but that loans were not likely.

 

[SymbiantXenos]

"Fabrizio Goria
‏@FGoria
GREECE PLANS PROPOSAL BASED ON LAST JUNCKER OFFER - GOV OFF'L - MNI"

So the offer that was rejected yesterday is the basis of a new offer put forward by Greece.??

 

[operon]

Russia hasn't got any money to help Greece, oil price still too low and why should China get involved.

I'm no economist so I can't tell which is better for Greece all I can see is a world of hurt either way but reading posts of we have our pride and dignity etc, but pride won't fill your belly if you have no food etc

 

[Rektash]

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slat...r_russia_bail_out_greece_if_europe_won_t.html

It's great to dream about another superpower that just wait to help Greece but that is just unrealistic and silly.

I think you misunderstood me. I quote myself:

I don't know how realistic that is but it certainly would rustle the Eurozones/EUs jimmies quite a bit. This conflict is seen as an internal conflict and inviting geopolitical players into this is more than just frowned upon.
The only way this could play out like this in a default situation where Greece decides to say "Nope, we are done with the Eurozone". Current polls indicate Greece doesn't want to abandon the Eurozone though.

I don't think the scenario is realistic at all - I do however think that Russia and China have a geopolitical interest in this.

 

[Osiris]

"Fabrizio Goria
‏@FGoria
GREECE PLANS PROPOSAL BASED ON LAST JUNCKER OFFER - GOV OFF'L - MNI"

So the offer that was rejected yesterday is the basis of a new offer put forward by Greece.

This was never about getting a better deal, this was about optics and maintaining power after signing the supposedly "toxic deal" because Syriza could not deliver on it's promises.

 

[bigmit3737]

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slat...r_russia_bail_out_greece_if_europe_won_t.html

It's great to dream about another superpower that just wait to help Greece but that is just unrealistic and silly.

But isn't China funding a lot of countries with AIIB and trying to get a lot of countries to become members of it. Japan and America seem to be taking that as a threat and Japan is counter offering by also lending tons of money to some of the same third world countries.

China is also building something that looks like a military base a on some island that the US is also very wary off.

Wouldn't helping out Greece and being able to set up shop, be a great location for manufacturing and allow quick exports as well be a sort of base?

Thanks.

 

[My words exactly!]

Italian PM

"There are two points to be quickly addressed in European capitals and in Brussels.

The first relates to Greece, a country that is in a very difficult economic and social situation. Tomorrow's discussions should show a definitive way of solving the urgency of this issue.

The second, more complex, that can not be delayed anyomore is the construction of Europe. For months we are discussing not only austerity measures, but also for development, infrastructure, common policies on immigration, innovation, the environment.

In one word : Politics, not only parameters. Values, not just numbers.

If you stand still, prisoners of regulations and red tape , then Greece is over.

The rebuilding of Europe will not be easy, after what happened in recent years. But this is the right time to try it all together . Italy will play its part . "

 

[oti]

Italian PM

Summary: Yo Germany come on! Don't be so up tight!

 

[Negotiator]

Btw, why doesn't Germany relocate some of its factories in Greece?

They would get cheap labour force and Greece would be in a better financial position.

 

[Theorry]

Maybe Europe can award itself another peace prize for creating the EU... This basically means Greece is on a way out, and that the EU needs to think long and hard about whether their experiment was sustainable bringing in countries that have vastly different social cultures, etc. Greece is just the start, a lot of EU countries have tons of debt and would be unable to adopt extreme austerity to help reverse it. Gonna be an interesting latter half of century to world, I've been saying.

They need to make two different EU's. or maybe just one with only Northern countries. Because they North is making it work and the South being lazy. But thats a culture thing also.

 

[le-seb]

"Fabrizio Goria
‏@FGoria
GREECE PLANS PROPOSAL BASED ON LAST JUNCKER OFFER - GOV OFF'L - MNI"

So the offer that was rejected yesterday is the basis of a new offer put forward by Greece.

Technically, they've rejected it on the 25th of June, not yesterday.

Their proposal being based on the previous one is a smart option, IMHO, as it doesn't mean that they will take the package as a whole, but will rather pick the sustainable objectives and ask for some adjustments with the ones they feel are not.
Now, wait and see if this will be sufficient to please the reluctant countries.

 

[Rektash]

I mean, things seem to work in Germany. The mentality here is "we work and we make sacrifices and we deserve our economic strength". Schäuble isn't sugar coating and very direct, he gets things done. I know the Greek stance when it comes to Schäuble but that doesn't matter to the Germans, understandably so.

Hmm, I don't think Schäuble is that popular actually. Yes, he has his party behing is back currently but that can change. He has done some controversial stuff like his balanced budget plans for example.

 

[oti]

Btw, why doesn't Germany relocate some of its factories in Greece?

They would get cheap labour force and Greece would be in a better financial position.

Now you're playing Monopoly. Relocating a factory isn't about being nice, it's about money.

 

[PdotMichael]

I think you misunderstood me. I quote myself:



I don't think the scenario is realistic at all - I do however think that Russia and China have a geopolitical interest in this.

Interested in what? None of the two countries showed anything that they would want to change the status quo for Greece. Russia has its pipeline deal and China gets a port most likely. Anything more would be just a waset of money for them.

 

[ElTorro]

Schäuble is popular in Germany? Oh gawd...

Merkel should stay though. She's pretty mild compared to him.

Merkel is playing good-cop-bad-cop with Schäuble. She was always been good at being as uncontroversial as possible while others do the dirty laundry.