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[Hitmonchan107]

Uh, why are people happy that bleedthrough is gone? It was one of the fundamental changes in the TU to make gun/melee combat more like previous Halos and now we're going back to the inconsistent method.

I'm happy Evade is gone, but why the bleedthrough, too?

If anything, bleedthrough is inconsistent. I love knowing where I stand in a battle. If I have my shields, people won't be able to land a killing headshot.

 

[bobs...onGaf]

Wasn't this because each bullet in a BR burst did individual damage? 11th bullet popped shields, 12th for the headshot?

That kinda stuff just feels janky for single shot weapons. No comment on the CE Pistol since I never really played CE MP.


My thoughts exactly. That's how the BR worked right? Fyrewulff, come drop some fancy technobabble.

For all intents and purposes it wouldnt make a difference to gameplay even if this was true. You cant possibly seriously say that bleedthrough is ok for burst weapons but not for single shot weapons on that kind of technicality. You should base that kind of stuff on gameplay.

I know bleedthrough in Reach is the root of some bugs, and so I understand its removal, but I really am hoping its intergrated into Halo 4 from the start.

 

[ElzarTheBam]

If anything, bleedthrough is inconsistent. I love knowing where I stand in a battle. If I have my shields, people won't be able to land a killing headshot.

This, bleedthrough is frustrating as fuck.

 

[Domino Theory]

Because it was frustrating getting killed instantly with no warning when you had full health and some shields. The Reach sandbox and UI were not designed for bleedthrough; it was a nice idea but it just didn't work without larger (out of scope) changes.

Hasn't it always been like that? I'm really not seeing the problem with that: get a person's shields low enough so the last shot causes death if aimed at the head.

I guess I'm more upset that a person who shoots a few times then melees is once again on equal footing with someone who simply melees without any shots. :/

 

[Tashi]

Ahh ok. I stand corrected.

 

[VivaciousJazzy]

This, bleedthrough is frustrating as fuck.

So someone shooting you in the head through a sliver of shields left that is beeping loudly is more frustrating than someone sprinting up to you and trading even though you put 3 shots in them before they managed to beat you down? Okay.

 

[ElzarTheBam]

So someone shooting you in the head through a sliver of shields left that is beeping loudly is more frustrating than someone sprinting up to you and trading even though you put 3 shots in them before they managed to beat you down? Okay.

Did I say it was more frustrating? No, don't put words into my mouth.

I said frustrating as fuck but I did not compare it to another frustrating element of the game. Okay.

 

[Zeouterlimits]

Did I say it was more frustrating? No, don't put words into my mouth.

I said frustrating as fuck but I did not compare it to another frustrating element of the game. Okay.

Spoiler

No seriously, that was a good response.

 

[bobs...onGaf]

Did I say it was more frustrating? No, don't put words into my mouth.

I said frustrating as fuck but I did not compare it to another frustrating element of the game. Okay.

Bleedthrough can be the cure to frustrating elements in the rest of the sandbox. Its a necessary evil some would say.

 

[ElzarTheBam]

Spoiler

No seriously, that was a good response.

I love my avatar, I'm also in love with my avatar.

Bleedthrough can be the cure to frustrating elements in the rest of the sandbox. Its a necessary evil some would say.

You're a necessary evil.

 

[Hydranockz]

Bleedthrough was odd. It felt like two dmr shots and a melee would kill me or a tiny burst from the AR and a melee.

 

[HigherLevel]

I'm good either way when it comes to bleedthrough. In some ways it's nice and in some ways it's not, at least in Reach anyway. I do hope it's in Halo 4 and that the game is designed around it.

 

[Overdoziz]

So someone shooting you in the head through a sliver of shields left that is beeping loudly is more frustrating than someone sprinting up to you and trading even though you put 3 shots in them before they managed to beat you down? Okay.

People blow that double melee stuff out of proportions. I encountered it maybe a handful of times in thousands of matches. It doesn't bother me at all. Maybe I'm just awesome.

 

[HiredN00bs]

The issue is not that the design concept of damage bleedthrough is inherently flawed, it's that it doesn't work as well in Reach as the default setting. A feedback system could be devised that is clear and suited to the concept. In my opinion, Halo 3 did a better job with feedback and bleedthrough than the TU gametypes in Reach.

Also, Zelda Williams (daughter of acclaimed comedian and actor Robin Williams) apparently plays Reach and is okay with Armor Lock: http://www.g4tv.com/thefeed/blog/po...s-enters-pro-gaming-world-in-the-noobz-movie/

 

[VivaciousJazzy]

Spoiler

I think

the reason people think bleed through with the DMR was weird is because they're used to a burst fire weapon that didnt kill you through shields with 1 bullet in a normal situation. MLG changed that in their damage settings though.

People blow that double melee stuff out of proportions. I encountered it maybe a handful of times in thousands of matches. It doesn't bother me at all. Maybe I'm just awesome.

Probably too much awesome.

 

[ElzarTheBam]

People blow that double melee stuff out of proportions. I encountered it maybe a handful of times in thousands of matches. It doesn't bother me at all. Maybe I'm just awesome.

Do you forget the evil that is Myyke?

 

[xxjuicesxx]

Hasn't it always been like that? I'm really not seeing the problem with that: get a person's shields low enough so the last shot causes death if aimed at the head.

I guess I'm more upset that a person who shoots a few times then melees is once again on equal footing with someone who simply melees without any shots. :/

The second sentence is how Halo has always been. Its essentially a slow BXR.

So you want Halo Reach to keep bleedthrough to be more like the older Halos in order to make the Halo Reach less like the older Halos?

I'm just upset that they are mixing the settings of old reach and new reach spread all over MM in different ways. When they can easily peacefully coexist (Vanilla and TU) I forget what playlists are what settings there are so many nuances, and now they change my TO?

Fuckin hire me.

 

[HiredN00bs]

The reason people think bleed through with the DMR was weird is because they're used to a burst fire weapon that didnt kill you through shields with 1 bullet in a normal situation. MLG changed that in their damage settings though.



Probably too much awesome.

That's not the only reason. Even the graphical and sound effects in Reach were specifically designed around the default bleedthrough settings (yes for automatics + grenades/explosives, and no for melees + headshots - Sniper).

 

[Overdoziz]

Probably too much awesome.

Clearly.

 

[B M ARAGON]

• Evade removed from Spartan loadouts.

With the exception of Grifball, Evade has been removed from Spartan loadouts. Elites can continue to bob, weave, and juke to their hearts’ content, however. Wort wort wort.

Yes Yes Yes Yes Yes

 

[Barrow Roll]

For all intents and purposes it wouldnt make a difference to gameplay even if this was true. You cant possibly seriously say that bleedthrough is ok for burst weapons but not for single shot weapons on that kind of technicality. You should base that kind of stuff on gameplay.

I know bleedthrough in Reach is the root of some bugs, and so I understand its removal, but I really am hoping its intergrated into Halo 4 from the start.

Well I asked it as a question since I'm not an expert on all the finer points of bullet damage and such. I just count how many shots or melees or shots+melees it takes to kill somebody.

And I'm not saying bleedthrough is okay on burst vs single shot because my implication is that the BR didn't technically bleedthrough damage to health. Do the other 11 bullets transfer damage to health through shields? Because if they do then that doesn't make any fucking sense, the shields are supposed to protect your health, that's the point of having energy shields. If the 12th shot of your 4th burst misses the head then you don't get the kill but they should still have no shields and full health if my theory is correct. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

Don't get me wrong, the Halo 2 BR was really fun, but for all intents and purposes, it was a single shot gun if all 3 shots in a burst hit their mark every time. If that's the case then why not just have a single shot weapon that pops shields on the 3rd shot and headshots on the 4th? Same amount of shots to kill and clearer damage feedback, best of both worlds.

Reach got the damage feedback thing right even if it does have a lot other problems.

So someone shooting you in the head through a sliver of shields left that is beeping loudly is more frustrating than someone sprinting up to you and trading even though you put 3 shots in them before they managed to beat you down? Okay.

Weaker melee dood.

 

[Hydranockz]

Bleedthrough is only gone from TU right? If so that'll sure as hell confuse players who already 'struggle' to adapt with all the combinations that exist.

No other developer has pre and post patch gameplay available for players as far as I know. It's a weird situation.

 

[HiredN00bs]

And I'm not saying bleedthrough is okay on burst vs single shot because my implication is that the BR didn't technically bleedthrough damage to health. Do the other 11 bullets transfer damage to health through shields? Because if they do then that doesn't make any fucking sense, the shields are supposed to protect your health, that's the point of having energy shields. If the 12th shot of your 4th burst misses the head then you don't get the kill but they should still have no shields and full health if my theory is correct. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

No, Halo 3 definitely has bleedthrough, and it actually counts a headshot if the damage equals the remaining shield points (for example, a Carbine round does 10 damage, and you have 70 shields, 6 rounds to the body, and the 7th in the head kills).

 

[Barrow Roll]

No, Halo 3 definitely has bleedthrough, and it actually counts a headshot if the damage equals the remaining shield points (for example, a Carbine round does 10 damage, and you have 70 shields, 6 rounds to the body, and the 7th in the head kills).

Okay, good to know, thanks. I still like Reach's system better, it's more transparent to the player and actually makes sense with the concept of shields.

 

[Steelyuhas]

The theory is that a lot people don't choose for any specific playlist, but whatever comes up when they mash "A".

I'd love to see if the population is affected, it wouldn't take much and wouldn't change anything substantial. I'd love 343 to give it a try.

They do, 343 switched the Anny Classic and Squad playlists after they have been out for a bit (moving classic to the top), and their populations flopped almost perfectly, at least at first.

People do really just choose the first playlist they see lol.

They should update arena. Remove bloom from it

They should make it zero bloom and then remove the zero bloom playlist. Boom, there I just eliminated a playlist, everyone is happy.

 

[kylej]

so I just read that weekly thing for the first time. Squad Slayer was removed? What? That was the only good playlist outside MLG.

 

[Rand0m TAG]

I never had any of these issues with bleedthrough. It was pretty obvious to me who was weak and who wasn't.

Arena was implemented horribly. No way to quickly check peoples ranks and you have to play 4 days before even getting your division.

 

[Devolution]

Any specific time (or timezone) on Monday?

.

 

[Kibbles]

^ Umph, thanks.

 

[Demoncarnotaur]

Cool. =)

 

[HiredN00bs]

Can't wait for Monday.

 

[Tashi]

I like Halo

 

[Risen]

If anything, bleedthrough is inconsistent. I love knowing where I stand in a battle. If I have my shields, people won't be able to land a killing headshot.

If 343 were to say "Bleed through was removed due to a glitch causing inconsistent results" I'd be fine with that. I wouldn't want bleed through gone, but I would accept that it's not working in the consistent manner intended.

Or even if 343 said they had polled the community and an overwhelming majority of players don't want it in the game. I'd respect that as well as a developer listening to the masses that play their game.

I wouldn't like either scenario, but I'd understand it. I wouldn't think it's better for the game style most my friends list likes to play, but it would make sense.

I still want bleed through. I think it adds a layer of skill (in awareness) and provides an additional option in CQC when dealing with melee rushers. It also meant people were more likely to get penalized when being out of position. Now there will be extra milliseconds for people to correct their mistakes (which are compounded online), will be back to more limited options when dealing with melee rushers, and will have the game handling their lack of awareness for them.

I hope that in H4 it is something that can be addressed and balanced appropriately.

 

[bobs...onGaf]

Would posting a ranking scale actually be breaking embargo? Its not like its giving away any information? If I was a press person or simply invited to the event I would keep my mouth 100% shut just to be safe, but I was just curious. Im sure people in the past have said, "its great!" and left it at that. Would that break embargo or not? Probably best not to say anything at all!

 

[Rand0m TAG]

They shouldn't release any halo 4 info. Don't even tell us the release date. Just one day we wake up and it'll just be there in stores

 

[ElzarTheBam]

Elzar is the best.

I was walking in the park one day...

 

[GhaleonEB]

Hope I didn't cross any boundaries there.

BS Angel specifically declined to say when the embargo was up in the update because she couldn't, so I'm guessing it wasn't supposed to be out there. That's the time I was assuming, though, since it's been used often in the past with Halo embargos.

 

[Devolution]

BS Angel specifically declined to say when the embargo was up in the update because she couldn't, so I'm guessing it wasn't supposed to be out there. That's the time I was assuming, though, since it's been used often in the past with Halo embargos.

Well fuck. I'm making it quote only. OH wait it's been quoted a bunch. They have a bunch of weird info embargos that I just don't understand.

 

[Slightly Live]

Well fuck. I'm making it quote only. OH wait it's been quoted a bunch. They have a bunch of weird info embargos that I just don't understand.

Sorry for asking. =/

 

[Devolution]

Sorry for asking. =/

It's my fault. I should have stayed away from the thread but I didn't think it would be a "thing" since it's when to expect the news and nothing more. Obviously I'm not cut out for the biz if they have all these weird information locks.

 

[zap]

Anyone want to play Reach? GT: nzapster

 

[bobs...onGaf]

Well fuck. I'm making it quote only. OH wait it's been quoted a bunch. They have a bunch of weird info embargos that I just don't understand.

I deleted the quote and it probably wouldn't be too hard for the others to do so too, but why would the exact time be that secret. An embargo is an embargo though

 

[feel]

Getting killed without a clear warning sometimes and double melee rushers both suck. I personally dislike double melee rushers far more, I feel like I can adapt more easily to the lack of warning (it's not in evey death anyways, just when I'm hit with a grenade or my shield is recharging is that it becomes a posibility), so I'm not a fan of the change. But I can understand people liking the decision if they feel they hate the surprisive deaths more. Shame melee and bullet bleedthrough were not separated.

 

[CyReN]

Thank you so much.

 

[FyreWulff]

I deleted the quote and it probably wouldn't be too hard for the others to do so too, but why would the exact time be that secret. An embargo is an embargo though

It's fairly obvious too since that's when MS updates Live. I'm assuming that's when the dash ads are going to appear.

 

[Devolution]

I deleted the quote and it probably wouldn't be too hard for the others to do so too, but why would the exact time be that secret. An embargo is an embargo though

I don't know why the end date of the embargo would be something they can't talk about.

 

[Blinding]

Thank you so much.

Delete the quote you fuck. D:

 

[Hydranockz]

When I was over on Waypoint, apparently one of the AC3 guys let it slip that the embargo lifts 3 hours later than these unconfirmed times.

 

[feel]

Just remove it from your posts everyone. Do it quick.

 

[Overdoziz]

I can't imagine them caring that much about someone saying the time at which the embargo is gone.