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Halo |OT| HaloGAF Evolved
- Thread starter GhaleonEB
- Start date
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Im going to play through Halo 3 and then go to bed a bit early just to wake up to Halo 4 news lol
Gabotron ES
Member
That's some great plan. Hype reaching astronomical levels!
Yep when I wake up their shall be Halo 4 news all over and it shall be glorious.
Gabotron ES
Member
more like 12 hours and 15 minutes
*fingers crossed*
I've already posted this but I get more hyped each time I watch it, loving the last part when the big gate is opening.
Hypertrooper
Member
Are you really talking about the Art trailer? I don't see any Didact symbols in it. I think you meant the Maw Anniversary terminal.
I can't be the only one who sees a big problem here? Seriously I don't care that Boneyard and Spire work good as Invasion maps. (And I disagree in this point too) but they suck in other gametypes. Console games or video games in general don't have the luxury to have maps specific designed for one gametype. For the whole work that got into Boneyard or Spire, you could get another two or more decent maps which works for more gametypes. Especially since Boneyard and Spire are the only real non-Forge World BTB maps.
bobs...onGaf
Member
Yeah dude that is pretty good. When it was first revealed I was really skewed by seeing Reach multiplayer infest the Halo 1 remake, I was too annoyed to enjoy it.
You can really see the new armour in that video.
Gabotron ES
Member
A group of more than 200 people working for three years on one of the most famous Xbox 360 titles... yeah, I see some BIG problems there.
The Librarian
Banned
I've said my piece on Invasion. Summary: Drains resources from BTB. Give me a good BTB map over a good invasion map any day.
Gabotron ES
Member
I wouldn't have meant if Invasion was DW only like Grifball is but eww... FW looks like shit and you can't ever keep a decent framerate while playing invasion on FW maps.
I'm pretty exited as Invasion will be getting new maps and the ones I've seen so far look very promising.
Hopefully H4 delivers a real map editor.
I also don't see 343 killing an entire gametype given how many people love the gametype :/
bobs...onGaf
Member
Thats the thing, is Invasion really that popular? Ancedotal evidence but your the one and only person I know who ever plays it lol. Matchmaking numbers never seemed that impressive. If Invasion did come back I would hope that its undergone a pretty dramatic overhaul. Personally I would want it to be cut and the focus to be on BTB and 4v4 maps, its just a simple fact that with limited resources and time you cant polish everything. I would rather Invasion got cut than let it affect the quality of the other modes.
I really hope Halo 4 trims the fat. Halo has built up a lot of baggage over the years, I hope 343 refines rather than tries to make 4 a jack of all trades.
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
Derp. I did.
Tha Robbertster
Member
Invasion always has numbers around the 2000 to 3000 players, so I'd say it's pretty popular. I agree with you that Invasion needs an overhaul. There are too many exploits in the system right now to have it work properly.
bobs...onGaf
Member
My mistake, those numbers are certainly higher than I thought they were.
Shake Appeal
Member
Invasion needs nothing other than to be buried in a quiet, shallow grave somewhere, and not resurrected for Halo 4.
Hypertrooper
Member
If other playlists have to suffer again because of Invasion, I'm going to doubt 343i's multiplayer team and their decision for Halo 5.
Gabotron ES
Member
Invasion's playlist have kept a healthy population since launch, always outnumbering MLG, Squad and other playlists.
Invasion: Breakpoint was voted A LOT when the Premium Battle existed because you know, people liked it.
343 has built a huge team, hopefully they don't use Invasion maps to throw crappy BTB maps into us.
Give me an invasion DLC map pack and a decent map editor and I'll be happy.
Rand0m TAG
Member
unless they are going to supply more maps with halo 4 and dlc, i say scrap it.
the game coming with only 2 invasion maps is dumb. then also trying to fit regular maps into invasion maps is dumb and vice versa.
the game coming with only 2 invasion maps is dumb. then also trying to fit regular maps into invasion maps is dumb and vice versa.
Brolic Gaoler
formerly Alienshogun
I also really like invasion, but it does need some work.
The Librarian
Banned
Shake speaks the truth.
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
Invasion was the nail in the coffin for Reach's BTB. It took away resources from a proven, popular gametype and and gave us nothing but digitised poop in return. Together with Reach's horrible vehicle changes and a sandbox that lets you snipe people from one base to another with ease, and ugh.
Invasion as a concept sounds awesome. I think they were originally planning to have larger teams overall with more players per fireteam and increased specialised roles and objectives. Invasion obviously didn't pan out to whatever original vision that they had in mind.
We were left with a boring, repetitive and limited janky joke of a game mode, a hollow shell of whatever pipe dream originally envisioned for it and two of the best examples of how not to create fun, multi-purpose multiplayer spaces.
Invasion in Reach is a joke. It consumed a wildly inflated proportion of precious and limited development time and resources and the end result is an embarrassment when contrasted with the high standards set by the introduction of game modes in previous games.
I can see it was designed with the best intentions. Maybe they really did think they were creating some hot stuff that was going to make a serious and lasting impact on the Halo multiplayer landscape. They believed in this vision enough to not only devote time and man hours to making it, but at the cost of BTB. Besides handful of small fans, all ten or eleven of them, and maybe that guy from Bungie.net that likes to roleplay his forum posts as if were an actual Elite warrior, the fanbase and online population just ignores it.
Players would rather play Zombies on Swordbase than play Invasion and Zombies took some guy five minutes to create by tweaking some settings. Those three or four minutes of that developer's time actually contributed more to the playtime of the active playerbase than Invasion ever did or will.
So yeah, fuck Invasion.
Invasion as a concept sounds awesome. I think they were originally planning to have larger teams overall with more players per fireteam and increased specialised roles and objectives. Invasion obviously didn't pan out to whatever original vision that they had in mind.
We were left with a boring, repetitive and limited janky joke of a game mode, a hollow shell of whatever pipe dream originally envisioned for it and two of the best examples of how not to create fun, multi-purpose multiplayer spaces.
Invasion in Reach is a joke. It consumed a wildly inflated proportion of precious and limited development time and resources and the end result is an embarrassment when contrasted with the high standards set by the introduction of game modes in previous games.
I can see it was designed with the best intentions. Maybe they really did think they were creating some hot stuff that was going to make a serious and lasting impact on the Halo multiplayer landscape. They believed in this vision enough to not only devote time and man hours to making it, but at the cost of BTB. Besides handful of small fans, all ten or eleven of them, and maybe that guy from Bungie.net that likes to roleplay his forum posts as if were an actual Elite warrior, the fanbase and online population just ignores it.
Players would rather play Zombies on Swordbase than play Invasion and Zombies took some guy five minutes to create by tweaking some settings. Those three or four minutes of that developer's time actually contributed more to the playtime of the active playerbase than Invasion ever did or will.
So yeah, fuck Invasion.
slowclap.gif
It's a terrible game mode. It's one of those things where at this point it feels like the game would have too many modes to supprt. This guy wants more Firefight DLC. That guy wants more Invasion DLC. Some other guys wants some kind of Forgeworld specific DLC. And it all comes at the expense of classic Halo modes. Midsize/BTB/etc... I still haven't played the Defiance or Anniversary FF maps despite owning the DLC since they were released. It feels like a wasted slot for me although I understand that it's for other people.
That totally explains why previous Halos without Invasion had just about as many BTB maps. Bigger maps will always be more of a resource drain in terms of man hours, because they require more finishing work. From the same perspective, vehicle maps were a waste of time in Halo 1 because there was only two of them, and they took resources away from more 4v4 maps.
It was the first time around for the gametype, just like the vehicle maps in Halo 1. Invasion is complicated to set up and have it be fun. Bungie supported Invasion with a new map for it in their DLC, 343 never attempted an Invasion map in either of their two DLC packs after Bungie handed it off, which is a shame since now Invasion is a known factor, it should have had at least one map in one of the packs. Especially with Headlong, which essentially was an Invasion map before Invasion was a retail gametype.
What we end up with is a single DLC map that really showcased what Invasion was capable of, then no effort by 343 to follow up on that.
DLC for Invasion:
Breakpoint
DLC for BTB:
Tempest, Breakpoint, Highlands, Ridgeline, Headlong, High Noon
Yeah, Invasion really choked out the support for BTB there. :rolleyes People forget that Halo 3's BTB was extremely limited until BTB got a bunch of maps in DLC. Halo's bread and butter will always be 4v4, maps for other modes will always be smaller in number.
Gabotron ES
Member
By that rule all playlists should be erradicated :/
We're getting a bit dramatic in here.
Edit: wouldn't it be funny if the first H4 gameplay we get tomorrow is from an invasion match?
HiredN00bs
Member
Based on the low population of ZB Slayer and Squad DLC playlists, we can confirm bloom will be back in H4 and there will be no DLC.
ElzarTheBam
Member
Please people no fighting, we will be united tomorrow.
Saying that I actually enjoyed invasion on Breakpoint. But at the end of the day if it's a choice between BTB and invasion, it's BTB all the way for me.
Saying that I actually enjoyed invasion on Breakpoint. But at the end of the day if it's a choice between BTB and invasion, it's BTB all the way for me.
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
If they had invested a quarter of the resources put into Invasion into Zombies and a Zombies mode maybe one or two small maps, they would have seen an exponentially higher return from that investment.
Invasion just isn't worth the time used to develop it. And 343 should do whatever any other good business should do with a low quality, negative return investment and that's get rid of it and invest in something better or more proven or go back to the drawing board and create something new.
Invasion had it's chance and blew it.
Fuck if anything, they really, really, should create an official Zombies mode this go around. That shit exploded on COD and they've been doing on Halo since Halo 2. Zombies was/is more popular than Team Slayer some of the time.
They'd be foolish to ignore it actually. Slap the term "Zombies" on a DLC release and that shit wouldn't stop selling until they unplug Live.
If there's one thing I detest more than Invasion it's Zombies but heck, I know I'm in a tiny minority with that opinion.
I wouldn't be expecting Invasion to make a return. That mode was fine for the theme of Reach i.e the Covenant invasion. There might be a brand new big team gametype. My money is on boarding action to make an almighty comeback. That map kinda relates to the reveal trailer right?(right?)
Gabotron ES
Member
:lol makes sense.
Yeah to this, we're reaching an infinite loop here.
Tomorrow shall be GLORIOUS.
Shake Appeal
Member
I think I've mentioned this before, but I truly hope 343i don't feel the need to match the feature list of Halo 3 or Reach, which after all represented a slow evolution over a decade.
Just give us the multiplayer basics, honed to a keen finish. Five perfect small arenas, a couple of mid-sized maps, three perfect BTB spaces. Don't fret about Invasion or Arena or Zombies or Grifball or any of that stuff. Get the bones and nerves of multiplayer right, and we'll trust you when you start packing on fat and muscle. If this means Saved Films, Forge, 'Player Investment', whatever have to be trimmed right back, so be it.
All I want are ten maps I can live in for a year or more, and fundamentally fun and fair mechanics that make me never want to leave them.
Just give us the multiplayer basics, honed to a keen finish. Five perfect small arenas, a couple of mid-sized maps, three perfect BTB spaces. Don't fret about Invasion or Arena or Zombies or Grifball or any of that stuff. Get the bones and nerves of multiplayer right, and we'll trust you when you start packing on fat and muscle. If this means Saved Films, Forge, 'Player Investment', whatever have to be trimmed right back, so be it.
All I want are ten maps I can live in for a year or more, and fundamentally fun and fair mechanics that make me never want to leave them.
So depressing, especially when there are two dedicated zombie simulators called 'Left 4 Dead' and 'Left 4 Dead 2' that are among the finest multiplayers games ever made.
Hypertrooper
Member
When I heard about Invasion the first time I thought it were something like the Chromehounds MP.
Sikamikanico
#1 Dad
Despite reading this thread daily...I very rarely post.
Nice to see some exciting Halo 4 news is building...the hype train is ready to pull out the station.
Does anyone fancy jumping on for some Reach? :/ It's been a while since I've played, wouldn't mind jumping on for a few games.
Nice to see some exciting Halo 4 news is building...the hype train is ready to pull out the station.
Does anyone fancy jumping on for some Reach? :/ It's been a while since I've played, wouldn't mind jumping on for a few games.
bobs...onGaf
Member
United in disgust to find that Halo 4 is 100% Invasion AR starts.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hf5FRPfGiC8&feature=related
Alright thats not quite the moment I was looking for, but seriously, 343 people post in here. Dont give them such awful ideas.
Zombies on CoD is only popular because its easy MOABS, and im willing to bet its only popular on Halo because its again, easy. If that mode was actually designed and balanced well it would be a lot better, but ironically probably less populated.Invasion is fun, but it's always much *more* fun when I'm playing with HBO members. Having teams that won't quit on you and are generally a bit better/more even in skill level is pretty much the only real answer to any matchmaking issues
I kind of agree that Halo could go back to basics more, and I'm hoping Halo 4 is the place to do that. If we really are going to be exploring new environments with new enemies, recreating Invasion after the Human-Covenant war is over* seems a waste of resources.
Firefight seems like it could get a lot more love. I'd love a return to a more ODST-flavored endurefest, and if you got proper netcode it could be manageable even in matchmaking. Plus, I was really hyped to have Flood in the CEA Firefight. Having the three or four-way battles of CE would be an awesome space for replay value.
*Yeah, with caveats, I know.
I kind of agree that Halo could go back to basics more, and I'm hoping Halo 4 is the place to do that. If we really are going to be exploring new environments with new enemies, recreating Invasion after the Human-Covenant war is over* seems a waste of resources.
Firefight seems like it could get a lot more love. I'd love a return to a more ODST-flavored endurefest, and if you got proper netcode it could be manageable even in matchmaking. Plus, I was really hyped to have Flood in the CEA Firefight. Having the three or four-way battles of CE would be an awesome space for replay value.
*Yeah, with caveats, I know.
Which is why it has more population than:
MLG
The Arena
Rumble Pit
Team Objective
Double Team
Multi Team
Squad DLC
TU ZB Slayer (And the TU Beta when it was a playlist)
Action Sack
Grifball
Anniversary Classic
Anniversary BTB
Anniversary FFA
Playlists that are about be deleted omitted. Although I'll agree that it's curious that there hasn't been an official Zombies-optimized multiplayer map yet, considering it's popularity in 2, 3, and Reach. There's interesting things you can only do with access to the map itself (buttons that control doors/traps, etc) that are beyond Forge.
That's the Jorge helmet, isn't it? A lot cheaper than the other helmets for your avatar, in any case..
Gabotron ES
Member
Guyz, guyz... I think I got it right.
People like Invasion *looks at population*
Some people dislike Invasion *looks at thread*
Invasion costs too much resources even when we're talking about three years long development cycle *looks at BTB playlist*
Solution: HIRE MORE PEOPLE.
People like Invasion *looks at population*
Some people dislike Invasion *looks at thread*
Invasion costs too much resources even when we're talking about three years long development cycle *looks at BTB playlist*
Solution: HIRE MORE PEOPLE.
Der Flatulator
Member
This post made me cry...
Invasion was designed around loadouts, progression, and increased depth, breadth and verticality as you progress from phase to phase. No class is any more useful that another, and each class is counterable. Invasions default loadouts are perfect, and I wouldn't touch them even given the opportunity.
(I wish I could say the same about other playlists)
Invasion is one of the only, if not the only game-type that works with Vanilla, unaltered Halo Reach. It hasn't even required a playlist update, ever (excluding the bomb arm-time=disarm-time fix on breakpoint).
If I could be bothered, I would go on the whole 'Competitive' rant, but I need sleep.
The Librarian
Banned
I agree for the most part, but I think saved films and theater are a requirement at this point. Maybe not viewing with your friends, but still.
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
The number of those that had the developmental resources of Invasion: 0.*
*Excluding Arena. Arena is a spectacular failure on it's own weak merits and would easily warrant a separate moody rant. =)
Brolic Gaoler
formerly Alienshogun
Yeah, IMO it's a great concept and even fun at times. If they work the issues out it could be great. There's no reason to kill it off, just work out the shit and fix it.
But I also agree if I had to choose between invasion and BTB, I'd choose BTB.
IMO Invasion should use the battlefield progression.
Classes all unlocked from the start. Vehicles and bases get more elaborate and defensible as you progress.
I hate being stuck with a gimped "loadout." It's not fun.
ElzarTheBam
Member
StalkerUKCG
Banned
You're also not releasing an FPS after CoD4 without a player investment system. Just ain't happening.
*looks at Halo 3 on-disc BTB maps, a game without invasion*
Oh hey, Valhalla and Sandtrap. And uh.. I guess Last Resort. If you can get it to show up and not have it vetoed away for Valhalla.
*looks at Halo 3 BTB support in DLC*
Standoff, Rat's Nest, Avalanche, Sandbox, Longshore, and Citadel. Sure, I'll play BTB now. Especially since everyone has a disc with all the maps on it now.
bobs...onGaf
Member
United in disgust from reading any of your posts on GAF!
United in disgust that im not the only person who posts on Gaf more like. Seriously people keep diluting the best posts on this place.
Less than a day till Halo 4! Thats a nice way of looking at it.
So Corrinne Yu is saying Halo 4 is the best looking game on the Xbox, guess we shall see soon enough
Interesting, where is that?
Shake Appeal
Member
They already have 300 strangers tripping over each other in an air-conditioned hangar somewhere just trying to get the game done at all.
Invasion should not be anyone's priority. It sucks, and its suckiness leaked into Reach's BTB and make everything less fun. Consign it to the flames.
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