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[Steelyuhas]

Steely, pls.

Are you comparing the quality of Halo 2 maps with Reach's? Imagine BTB in Reach without Forge World maps :[ - The role they fill should be left for later once we can determine what we're lacking from the developer maps, so the point is that they do fill a role. It would also be disappointing if these slick spaces were created for not at least one of each to appear in matchmaking.. That wouldn't be fair to the devs or to fans who would agree.

Okay, I'll give you the BTB in Reach scenario, but that is a rare exception because Bungie LITERALLY didn't make maps for BTB in Reach. How that actually happened we'll never know, but that certainly doesn't look to be the case for Halo 4, so that "role" doesn't need to be filled.

Bottom line for me is that Forge maps significant impact my matchmaking experience in an absolutely negative way. I go into a one of 12 slayer playlists in Reach, and I can't even get a game on a map that the developer made because it's all a steaming pile of grey.

Yes, I'm very salty about Forge in MM. Heckfudealwithit.gif

 

[Der Flatulator]

For what? Just to get rid of gimbal lock? Not worth it. Most people don't even know what it is and just get used to working around it as a quirk of Forge's.

I like your thinking though.

Not just to to get rid of gimbal lock. Euler angles are horrible to work with. Say I want an object to point up (+y), forward (+z), with a quaternion you just set N_x to zero, and use Rotation to rotate about that axis. I'd have to toy with it, but it sounds like it could be a easier way to adjust objects precisely.

I am talking about the edit co-ordinates menu here, not general rotations, that should be aligned relative to the player, unless axis-snaps are on.

 

[MrBig]

We need the SDK to iterate and optimize maps to the same caliber of maps 343 will launch the game with, there is hardly a point in comparing them in any reasonable debate. If the core design is good though you can still make a solid base for a map with forge and iterate on it to some degree.

Something seems off about that game in the videos, just doesn't seem the fun for some reason. But the people seem to be loving it and I love the games its gameplay style is inspired by (Deus Ex, Thief) so I put it on my Steam Wishlist, I'll be giving it a buy when it hits $20 in some crazy Amazon/GMG sale in a few weeks. Heard there's an HQ textures pack coming too.

Only game besides H4 I've bought this year. Amazing game, more than worth $60.

 

[ArchedThunder]

Okay, I'll give you the BTB in Reach scenario, but that is a rare exception because Bungie LITERALLY didn't make maps for BTB in Reach. How that actually happened we'll never know, but that certainly doesn't look to be the case for Halo 4, so that "role" doesn't need to be filled.

Bottom line for me is that Forge maps significant impact my matchmaking experience in an absolutely negative way. I go into a one of 12 slayer playlists in Reach, and I can't even get a game on a map that the developer made because it's all a steaming pile of grey.

Yes, I'm very salty about Forge in MM. Heckfudealwithit.gif

That is the problem of them putting too many in. It wouldn't be a problem if it only showed one forge map at a time in the voting. Sadly a lot of times it will show 3.

 

[Bregmann Roche]

I was saying that some are equal in terms of actual map design, as a whole package (Forge and map design), they are still an inferior experience. You simply don't get the same immersive and visual experience in a Forge map.
Play a key role in matchmaking? Why? They don't need to. There weren't any Forge maps in Halo 2, and I think many would agree it had the most complete set of quality maps.

If Halo 4 ships with Halo 2 quality maps and if the map packs contain as many quality maps as the Halo 2 map packs did, I will agree that forge in Halo 4 was a waste of time for the mainstream MP population.

In order to meet the needs of the various sub-communities that play Halo, the game needs more maps than Microsoft is willing to finance. That is the role that Forge fills: it allows the community to make maps for free that fill gaps across multiple playlists.

Bottom line for me is that Forge maps significant impact my matchmaking experience in an absolutely negative way. I go into a one of 12 slayer playlists in Reach, and I can't even get a game on a map that the developer made because it's all a steaming pile of grey.

Again, I agree that there are WAY too many forge maps in several Reach playlists, but to say there should be none in Halo 4 is extreme.

 

[bobs...onGaf]

Except that we know they do.

They do the best with what they are given.

Its not good enough.

I have said it a few times but I really hope the CC's have a shake up in how they operate before Halo 4 - either through there own internal processes, or are given more tools by 343. The last 2 years of Reach has shown that they dont really help as much as hinder matchmaking (in my opinion of course).

I think a base forge variant from the 3 forge world environments should be in standard multiplayer - but any community maps should be restricted to a community playlist. Allowing those maps to mix into general matchmaking has been tried in Halo 3 and Reach and I think for me at least the results have been far from desirable.

No offence to Fyre, but I remember him getting back into the CC's by pretty much demanding he got his place back after the switch over - I just don't think 343 has enough of a plan with what they want out of the CC's - it seems to have been a Bungie thing that didnt quite work out so well. Try something new 343!

Read.

The maps you see in MM are chosen by 343, not the CCs. The 'great' forge maps we had in MM were a direct result of decisions made by 343. While the CCs could very well have shown 343 some of those maps, it's never been their choice what gets published. Even if CC doesn't think the map is any good, the map could still get put on a playlist.

lets be honest - how many maps do 343 'find' themselves, that number has to be pretty tiny considering the other work they do. They might have the final say on what gets in - but how vigorously do they playtest the submissions?

 

[Steelyuhas]

If Halo 4 ships with Halo 2 quality maps and if the map packs contain as many quality maps as the Halo 2 map packs did, I will agree that forge in Halo 4 was a waste of time for the mainstream MP population.

In order to meet the needs of the various sub-communities that play Halo, the game needs more maps than Microsoft is willing to finance. That is the role that Forge fills: it allows the community to make maps for free that fill gaps across multiple playlists.

Yes, it's great for sub-communities to play their stuff like Grifball, competition leagues like MLG, Forge creations of new gametypes, etc.

Nowhere do I see the need for the core experience to be infiltrated with Forge variants.

Again, I agree that there are WAY too many forge maps in several Reach playlists, but to say there should be none in Halo 4 is extreme.

How is it extreme to not want something that's bad? We should have a little bit of bad forged maps and that's okay?


This is the last I'll say on this subject for the time being. I obviously simply disagree with some other members' opinions of Forge in MM.

 

[FyreWulff]

No offence to Fyre, but I remember him getting back into the CC's by pretty much demanding he got his place back after the switch over - I just don't think 343 has enough of a plan with what they want out of the CC's - it seems to have been a Bungie thing that didnt quite work out so well. Try something new 343!

You're operating under the assumption that I was ever 'fired' in the first place.

343's old forums were based off your gamertag when you first used them. So I posted on Waypoint, my account showed up as 'FyreWulff Rex' even though my gamertag was now 'FyreWulff'. When they switched over to YaFF, they re-generated everyone's accounts and I ended up with a "new" account of FyreWulff with FyreWulff Rex left in limbo, which screwed up the transition since people were trying to send PMs to an account I could no longer access.

Since I kept getting sent in circles on who to talk to get it fixed, I stopped wasting my time and just posted publically so the maximum amount of eyes (and whomever was in charge of fixing it would fix it) would see it, and the problem was fixed. Strategery.

 

[The Librarian]

This is the last I'll say on this subject for the time being. I obviously simply disagree with some other members' opinions of Forge in MM.

Question for Mr. Steelyuhas: Would you prefer a couple of Forge maps in matchmaking or Avalanche?

 

[FUNKNOWN iXi]

This is the last I'll say on this subject for the time being. I obviously simply disagree with some other members' opinions of Forge in MM.

But Steely that skybox/environment:

Wouldn't be fair to deny fans of at least one map of that in matchmaking.. I mean I thought Complex might've been a Forge environment:

And some here were even speculating that Abandon might've been a Forge environment:

I think it's safe to say the potential for Forge diversity has come a long way since Reach:

Same goes to the rest of you naysayers! <3

Now mind you, each environment has its own pieces with its own theme instead of one big grassy futstercluck of gray grey gray grey græy.

 

[FyreWulff]

I think it should be noted that Relay is probably made with 4-split performance in mind. I expect maps that cater to 2-split to be more complex and have some varied scenery objects in it.

Those tube objects alone should save tons of budget, Reach was missing a true tube object and Halo 3's tubes were very short and small. So instead of 4 objects to make a hallway, you only need one now..

either way, there should always be at least one developer option in the top slot on the voting screen.

Needs more light bloom

 

[Steelyuhas]

Question for Mr. Steelyuhas: Would you prefer a couple of Forge maps in matchmaking or Avalanche?

Spoiler

Avalanche

 

[ElzarTheBam]

At least that&#8217;s what David Fincher, the acclaimed director of The Social Network, seems to think. According to two Microsoft executives who have spoken exclusively to The Daily Beast, the auteur&#8217;s next big project isn&#8217;t a movie, or even a trailer for one. Instead, Fincher has flown to Prague to direct a mysterious, two-minute teaser for a videogame: Halo 4, the long-awaited sequel to Xbox&#8217;s blockbuster action trilogy.

When Fincher&#8217;s trailer premieres on Late Night With Jimmy Fallon on Oct. 18

From here.

Read the article, MS are going all out.

 

[TheOddOne]

HOLY FUCKING SHIT DAVID FINCHER. OMG WTF, MY PANTS, MY LIFE, I JUST CAME.

 

[El_Chino]

From here.

Read the article, MS are going all out.

Shit JUST got real.

 

[Shadders]

With FUD I had assumed we wouldn't be getting a live action trailer, I'm very glad to hear I assumed wrong.

The live action trailers do have a pretty high bar though. The pressure is on, Mr. Fincher.

 

[Shadders]

Halo 4 Limited Edition UNSC Controller Unboxing.

If you go to original video, without the English dub and leave a comment you can win one of the controllers: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nXmm4oO5rRo

 

[Hypertrooper]

Ad by David Fincher, launch event in Berlin, this flight has an USB port. Omg.

 

[zap]

Oh wow. I've got to say, once 343 started opening the floodgates, the build up for Halo 4 has been insane. I almost forgive them for the GI article...

 

[Gabotron ES]

From a spaniard web.

 

[Falifax]

First Deliver Hope and now Halo 4 live action is directed in Prague. Damn, how I always miss that?

 

[El_Chino]

From a spaniard web.

I'm calling fake on this one. One could easily paste those images over.

 

[aj1467]

Have we officially gotten a clear look at the disk art yet?

 

[FyreWulff]

From a spaniard web.

You had a good run, DVD

 

[Gabotron ES]

I'm calling fake on this one. One could easily paste those images over.

Spaniard is the new french.

 

[bobs...onGaf]

You're operating under the assumption that I was ever 'fired' in the first place.

343's old forums were based off your gamertag when you first used them. So I posted on Waypoint, my account showed up as 'FyreWulff Rex' even though my gamertag was now 'FyreWulff'. When they switched over to YaFF, they re-generated everyone's accounts and I ended up with a "new" account of FyreWulff with FyreWulff Rex left in limbo, which screwed up the transition since people were trying to send PMs to an account I could no longer access.

Since I kept getting sent in circles on who to talk to get it fixed, I stopped wasting my time and just posted publically so the maximum amount of eyes (and whomever was in charge of fixing it would fix it) would see it, and the problem was fixed. Strategery.

In a strange way that kind of proves my point that the cc's are a tool from the bungie days that 343 didn't really know how to use effectively.

 

[TheOddOne]

Not the French, not the Dutch, but the Spaniards. Viva La Revolución.

 

[Deputy Moonman]

That is the problem of them putting too many in. It wouldn't be a problem if it only showed one forge map at a time in the voting. Sadly a lot of times it will show 3.

I think map voting needs to be trimmed down to just two maps, with the "none of the above" option removed. If we're getting forge maps in matchmaking,which you know it will happen, they might as well have a standard developer-made map on top, and one forge map below. That makes the choices simple and you know that you are going to get the base maps as often as you get a forge map, if not more. And the default map if no one votes, or if there is a tie, always goes to the developer-made map. Or perhaps offer two developer made maps and one forge map?

I think it should be noted that Relay is probably made with 4-split performance in mind. I expect maps that cater to 2-split to be more complex and have some varied scenery objects in it.

Those tube objects alone should save tons of budget, Reach was missing a true tube object and Halo 3's tubes were very short and small. So instead of 4 objects to make a hallway, you only need one now..

either way, there should always be at least one developer option in the top slot on the voting screen.



Needs more light bloom

If you're saying that user created forge maps should never be the top option so that they're never chosen by default, I agree.

Oh wow. I've got to say, once 343 started opening the floodgates, the build up for Halo 4 has been insane. I almost forgive them for the GI article...

Which makes me wonder why this OT is called the "Calm Before the Storm." Nothing is calm about the few months right before a big game is released. Change it!

Spoiler

<3 Ghaleon

 

[aj1467]

Spaniard is the new french.

 

[Noricart]

Spaniard is the new french.

bailout.gif

 

[ElzarTheBam]

Spaniard is the new french.

Oh shit, I'm bailing.

See you guys November 6th.

 

[Navidson REC]

Ad by David Fincher, launch event in Berlin, this flight has an USB port. Omg.

What, I'm out of the loop. Do you have any details on this?

 

[Pop]

Spaniard is the new french.

And so it begins.

Spoiler

Please plzz please release Theater, Forge, MP maps and if possible Rank info . Just not campaign :/

 

[FyreWulff]

If you're saying that user created forge maps should never be the top option so that they're never chosen by default, I agree.

Yes. There's supposed to be some playlists in Reach set up this way. Not all of them though.

 

[bobs...onGaf]

Oh shit, I'm bailing.

See you guys Novemeber 6th.

Yeah im tempted to say I am also out.

I will probably try and catch up every so often, so if someone does spoil something please edit the thread title or go back and edit before his posts to warn people.

I guess as long as im not up to date with the current posts, im less likely to be spoiled!

 

[Deputy Moonman]

Yes. There's supposed to be some playlists in Reach set up this way. Not all of them though.

That's cool. I would still love to be surprised with a revelation of some differently textured forge building blocks, but I'm not getting my hopes up. It was interesting that they said there are unique pieces to each of the 3 forge zones. I don't think it means new textures, but I wish it did.

 

[Gabotron ES]

And so it begins.

Spoiler

Please plzz please release Theater, Forge, MP maps and if possible Rank info . Just not campaign :/

He will be posting more pics soon, maybe I can get him to post some forge pics or whatever.

 

[FyreWulff]

That's cool. I would still love to be surprised with a revelation of some differently textured forge building blocks, but I'm not getting my hopes up. It was interesting that they said there are unique pieces to each of the 3 forge zones. I don't think it means new textures, but I wish it did.

I don't know if they did it any other playlists. I can only find it for BTB so far:

BTB voting options updated so that a developer-created map will always show up in slot one. We also rearranged and reweighted voting options (including new DLC).

 

[User 73932]

From a spaniard web.

Goodbye internet!

 

[Duji]

Great post by MLG forum moderator b0b43 regarding Forge:

The main test for the new Forge is how well they have improved its performance. Things like frame rate, making sure dynamic lighting on objects is not causing them to lag (like the bridge pieces used on Asylum, which would cause the Snipe-to-snipe frame rate drops in Reach), fixing split screen issues, how well the lights work, etc.

If all these issues weren't a problem in Reach, then you would be seeing some beautiful 4v4 maps. The issues about colour completely go away when you can use lights and have the freedom to use whatever objects you want. A good example is any of Nexn's maps (Fileshare if anyone is interested) - these things are works of art and play great. The problem is they are designed for 1v1 since that is all you can afford to design for freely, and even still there are frame rate issues on some of these maps.

In terms of new features, Forge is kind of disappointing - it feels like a Forge 2.1 more than anything else. Most of the stuff from Reach plus a few extra features. But if they can improve on the performance side, then this will truly be a Forge 3.0. Unfortunately, this feels like too much to ask and there will be many of the same, disappointing limitations that Reach Forge was plagued with.

I didn't know Reach maps could look that good until he posted that guy's file share.

 

[IHaveIce]

Ad by David Fincher, launch event in Berlin, this flight has an USB port. Omg.

There is a launch event in Berlin?

And a Teaser by Fincher is going to be awesome.

And a retail copy is out there? fuck

 

[Shadders]

New Info on the David Fincher Short: http://www.littleenglishhaloblog.com/2012/10/david-fincher-on-board-for-live-action.html?spref=tw

David Fincher (director of Se7en, Fight Club, The Social Network and Alien 3) and Tim Miller (Scott Pilgrim vs The World, The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo) have been in Prague filming an extended 2 minute live-action trailer for Halo 4.

"Fincher and Miller will help deliver an emotionally-charged look at the backstory of “Halo’s” iconic hero, the Master Chief."

The trailer will première on October 18th on Late Night With Jimmy Fallon, and will be uploaded to the Waypoint Youtube channel immediately after - about 6am BST. I'll post the video as soon as it's up.

"Titled “Scanned,” the trailer is an action-packed cinematic production that offers a captivating look at the backstory of Master Chief, and provides a glimpse of the new threat he will encounter in “Halo 4.” Filmed in Prague, “Scanned” continues the franchise’s tradition of expanding the universe through award-winning live-action stories, adding to the lore and anticipation for the next chapter in the landmark franchise"

 

[Nando13]

He will be posting more pics soon, maybe I can get him to post some forge pics or whatever.

Can you post the link to the web?

 

[Pop]

He will be posting more pics soon, maybe I can get him to post some forge pics or whatever.

That would be great, maybe the forge map we haven't seen yet. And theater would be awesome to see.

 

[Tha Robbertster]

Oh snap, things should get interesting around here.

 

[Gabotron ES]

Can you post the link to the web?

As you wish amigo

 

[Shadders]

The discs look legit, but why is there nowhere in the box for the second disc? The spindle doesn't look like the ones they use for two discs.

Gabo, could you ask him not to leak campaign? It'd be a real shame for it to leak, especially this far out from launch.

 

[Gui_PT]

I know this is late but

All y'all wanted some Forge news, how'd you like them shadows?

Edit: 'Tis a sad day, truly =\

 

[IHaveIce]

The discs look legit, but why is there nowhere in the box for the second disc? The spindle doesn't look like the ones they use for two discs.

Gabo, could you ask him not to leak campaign? It'd be a real shame for it to leak, especially this far out from launch.

you can see that? I would say the spindle looks exactly like my other Games with 2 discs.

I'm also surprised he didn't leak anything special for now(last map, last forge environment)

And yes, please no campaign spoilers, I don't want to be scared to click on any Halo 4 video and will see the ending

 

[Satchel]

Title screen is gorgeous.

David Fincher is directing a trailer? Heavy.