• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Halo |OT7| You may leave, Juices. And take Team Downer with you.

Status
Not open for further replies.
Portugeezer

Portugeezer

Member
Can't wait to get stuck with the sticky detonator the thruster pack my way to the shooter and make him suicide... or I wonder if I would get the kill for that.
 
R

Rand0m TAG

Member
Mister Negative said:
This, this right here, is exactly how I feel. It sums up why I enjoy playing AR gametypes occasionally. Haters gonna hate.

Question to the staunch Anti-AR crew: What would you do to change the weapon to increase the skill gap?
Click to expand...
Remove it? I don't know I just find the ar a boring gun to use. I prefered the smg and the saw looks pretty bad ass
 
O

Overdoziz

Banned
Myyke said:
You mean there is a discussion past how the AR should win at close range and DMR/BR should win at longer ranges?
Click to expand...
You could argue that because the DMR/BR is harder to use up close it should also be more effective in that range. You could argue back and forth about that though. I dislike the idea starting weapons that are effective at only a certain range anyway. It results in people winning in certain situations just because they chose a certain weapon at spawn. (I hate the loadout system so much for that reason) Personally I'd rather see only one starting weapon that's good at any range but is outclassed by pick-up weapons at certain ranges (Shotgun at close range, Sniper at long range etc.).

At least I won't have to spawn with the damn thing anymore.
 
T

TheOddOne

Member
ElzarTheBam said:
The saw looks saw nice.

Lolololololol. (sorry).
Click to expand...
burn.gif
 
H

Hydranockz

Member
Overdoz1z said:
You could argue that because the DMR/BR is harder to use up close it should also be more effective in that range. You could argue back and forth about that though. I dislike the idea starting weapons that are effective at only a certain range anyway. It results in people winning in certain situations just because they chose a certain weapon at spawn. (I hate the loadout system so much for that reason) Personally I'd rather see only one starting weapon that's good at any range but is outclassed by pick-up weapons at certain ranges (Shotgun at close range, Sniper at long range etc.).

At least I won't have to spawn with the damn thing anymore.
Click to expand...

Bolded: Wut? That's like saying the sniper should be really effective at close range or that because the Spiker is so hard to use, it should be really effective at long ranges.

Underlined: So wouldn't increasing the range on the AR be a good thing if it is outclassed by every other gun pretty much?
 
Portugeezer

Portugeezer

Member
Overdoz1z said:
You could argue that because the DMR/BR is harder to use up close it should also be more effective in that range. You could argue back and forth about that though. I dislike the idea starting weapons that are effective at only a certain range anyway. It results in people winning in certain situations just because they chose a certain weapon at spawn. (I hate the loadout system so much for that reason) Personally I'd rather see only one starting weapon that's good at any range but is outclassed by pick-up weapons at certain ranges (Shotgun at close range, Sniper at long range etc.).

At least I won't have to spawn with the damn thing anymore.
Click to expand...

The argument is that AR sucks anywhere else, whereas BR/DMR are just as good at close range as they are at medium/long (damage wise).

If the AR doesn't do well at close range then it wouldn't do well at all. If you have the AR then don't run out in the open or into big battlefields, use it where it's best.
 
Genesis Knight

Genesis Knight

Member
I'm pumped about the new weapons (SAW and Railgun), but then again I was pumped about the new Reach weapons (Plasma Cannon, Focus Rifle...) and they ended up being nerfed into oblivion.

I'll keep my hopes from getting too high this time until I actually try these out.
 
S

Swarmerr

Member
EuropeOG said:
The argument is that AR sucks anywhere else, whereas BR/DMR are just as good at close range as they are at medium/long (damage wise).

If the AR doesn't do well at close range then it wouldn't do well at all. If you have the AR then don't run out in the open or into big battlefields, use it where it's best.
Click to expand...

Bolded is true.

The only thing is the AR is one of the easiest guns to use in the halo sandbox compared to weapons like the br and dmr. While everyone complains about the 3 shot pistol in halo ce they always seem to forget that it was extremely hard to get a 3 shot kill.

The best approach to utility weapons is making them very powerful while at the same time making it hard to get that 4 shot, 5 shot or what have you. The thinking goes the harder it is to get a kill, the greater the reward should be.
 
Y

YourExWife

Member
Hydranockz said:
Bolded: Wut? That's like saying the sniper should be really effective at close range or that because the Spiker is so hard to use, it should be really effective at long ranges.

Underlined: So wouldn't increasing the range on the AR be a good thing if it is outclassed by every other gun pretty much?
Click to expand...

I think what he means is that if they want the AR to be a close range specialty gun and super-effective at said range, then it should be a pickup weapon for that purpose.

And the sniper is super effective at close range, but, like he said with br/dmr, it's harder to use at said range. This is where the risk/reward shows up. Technically, ALL high power precision weapons should be at least as effective at close range, if not more so (if we want to bring physics into the mix). Effectiveness is a separate discussion from ease of use.

Just my thoughts.
 
S

squidhands

Member
GhaleonEB said:
My preferred solution:

Anniversary Firefight updated to:

  • Include all Firefight maps.
  • Require Anniversary disc or map pack.
  • Installation 04 always appears as the first (of eight) voting rounds.
  • Player count reduced to two players, per Halo CE and to compensate for the removal of Doubles.

I strongly dislike Installation 04 - pretty sure I've never finished a game on it other than 2x Score Attack - and will never use the current Anniversary playlist.

I don't think it really works well to have a playlist devoted to one map, after a playlist consolidation effort.
Click to expand...
I'm one of the few people that hate the fact that Doubles is getting cut, and don't really understand why it was necessary to cut in the first place, but your list seems completely practical. Why the playlist manager couldn't think it up and implement it really, REALLY bums me out. The standard Firefight playlist is a cesspool of asshats with FRGs; I've been streamlined out of playing my favorite part of Reach. :-(

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The rest of the update was very solid and chock-full of tasty treats, with a few stinkers thrown in. Not really big on the extended range of the AR or the odd-sounding reset of the Sniper, but overall it looks like there will be plenty of sweet weapons to choose from to make our play style more personal. Plus this:

Stinkles' Update Sonata said:
And as I've hinted before, we're going to do something with and beyond the OST for music fans that will really have an impact, at least on your commute. More on that soon.
Click to expand...
It's like he was talking right at me! :-D
 
A

Akai__

Member
According to Major Nelson, BO2's Mp is playable and will be presented at gamescom.

credit goes to Jumper Jumpzz
 
T

Trey

Member
kylej said:
Comparing the responses the community had to each not their effect in game. This is extraordinarily obvious. Thanks.
Click to expand...

A bit disingenuous considering one was a significant mechanics change and another is a simple text overlay. While I too want the text gone, the reactions the text received relative to bloom will obviously have more merit.
 
O

Overdoziz

Banned
Personally I'd like 343 to do one of these things:
-Make the AR more powerful but make it a pick-up/power weapon (They've done this with the SAW, but sadly the AR still exists)
-Redesign the weapon so that it has a bigger skill-gap (This would basically turn the weapon into something entirely different though)
-Make it a secondary weapon which is a lot less powerful (Similar to the Halo 4 Pistol)
 
K

kylej

Banned
Trey said:
A bit disingenuous considering one was a significant mechanics change and another is a simple text overlay. While I too want the text gone, the reactions the text received relative to bloom will obviously have more merit.
Click to expand...

Yes, but at the time it wasn't hailed as a significant mechanics change. Regardless, you understand my point so I'm not going to argue semantics.

Make the text an option. That is all.
 
H

Hydranockz

Member
Overdoz1z said:
Personally I'd like 343 to do one of these things:
-Make the AR more powerful but make it a pick-up/power weapon (They've done this with the SAW, but sadly the AR still exists)
-Redesign the weapon so that it has a bigger skill-gap (this would basically turn the weapon into something entirely different though)
-Make it a secondary weapon which is a lot less powerful (similar to the Halo 4 Pistol)
Click to expand...

You confuse me. I know you said you only want one of those things but it makes me feel as though you have this really weird issue with the idea of an AR. Like you said, the SAW is exactly what your first point was.
 
K

Karl2177

Member
Overdoz1z said:
Personally I'd like 343 to do one of these things:
-Make the AR more powerful but make it a pick-up/power weapon (They've done this with the SAW, but sadly the AR still exists)
-Redesign the weapon so that it has a bigger skill-gap (This would basically turn the weapon into something entirely different though)
-Make it a secondary weapon which is a lot less powerful (Similar to the Halo 4 Pistol)
Click to expand...
Make the AR function more like the ODST SMG and have the Saw function like it sounds like it does. It's not like I've been saying that for a long time...
 
O

Overdoziz

Banned
Hydranockz said:
You confuse me. I know you said you only want one of those things but it makes me feel as though you have this really weird issue with the idea of an AR. Like you said, the SAW is exactly what your first point was.
Click to expand...
What confuses you? I said I'm fine with a more powerful (or equally powerful) AR if it's a pick-up weapon. There are already power weapons that have a fairly small skill-gap like the Rocket Launcher.
I would also be fine if it was still a starting weapon but as a secondary one which is used to finish off kills like the Halo 4 pistol. A weapon which is fairly useless on its own but can be used the moment you run out of ammo for your primary weapon while you're in the middle of a fight.

And yes, I have a problem the idea of most automatic rifles if that is what you mean. I'm fine with the Needler because that gun still requires you to have some skill to get kills. Plus, it's more interesting to use. The AR (and some other automatic rifles) and just boring to use and often boil down to who starts holding down their trigger first. I think that precision weapons are a lot more interesting overall.
 
S

squidhands

Member
Overdoz1z said:
Personally I'd like 343 to do one of these things:
-Make the AR more powerful but make it a pick-up/power weapon (They've done this with the SAW, but sadly the AR still exists)
-Redesign the weapon so that it has a bigger skill-gap (This would basically turn the weapon into something entirely different though)
-Make it a secondary weapon which is a lot less powerful (Similar to the Halo 4 Pistol)
Click to expand...
Or just keep it as it stands in H4, but make it canonically a cheap knockoff from a different manufacturer than Misriah Armory (Hairsim Gunnz?), where the gun jams on you if you just hold the trigger down.
 
H

Hydranockz

Member
Overdoz1z said:
What confuses you? I said I'm fine with a more powerful (or equally powerful) AR if it's a pick-up weapon. There are already power weapons that have a fairly small skill-gap like the Rocket Launcher.
I would also be fine if it was still a starting weapon but as a secondary one which is used to finish off kills like the Halo 4 pistol. A weapon which is farrly useless on its own but can be used the moment you run out of ammo for your primary weapon while you're in the middle of a fight.
Click to expand...

But why is it a problem in Halo 4 being a primary? I just don't see why it can't co-exist along the other weapon roles you describe. The SAW is there. The pistol is there. I really can't see how having the AR primary as an option is a bad thing.

Edit: So it just ultimately boils down to being a boring weapon? Well shit, hold the phone. It's role as the weapon people know they can use is very much needed. It's far from the most versatile weapon. It's far from the best weapon. It is very approachable and as boring as that may be, I don't think it existing is a problem. Especially seeing as you can seemingly avoid using it (almost completely).
 
B

Brolic Gaoler

formerly Alienshogun
Overdoz1z said:
Personally I'd like 343 to do one of these things:
-Make the AR more powerful but make it a pick-up/power weapon (They've done this with the SAW, but sadly the AR still exists)
-Redesign the weapon so that it has a bigger skill-gap (This would basically turn the weapon into something entirely different though)
-Make it a secondary weapon which is a lot less powerful (Similar to the Halo 4 Pistol)
Click to expand...

Do we know that the SAW isn't a starting weapon? (not sharpshooting, just seeking clarification)
 
S

StalkerUKCG

Banned
kylej said:
Make the text an option. That is all.
Click to expand...

After all the polarizing views I can't see any reason to now have something like this. Its not like Bloom or Aim Assist where its going to directly impact gameplay.

I'd Love halo to feature a more customizable HUD, Allowing players to disable everything if they want so the only thing on screen is the gun.

Alienshogun said:
Do we know that the SAW isn't a starting weapon? (not sharpshooting, just seeking clarification)
Click to expand...

Confirmed as a OD weapon, It would be crazy OP as a starting weapon. 72 round clip and it looks like its kills in less time than anything we have seen bar Laser/Rocket/Railgun.
 
H

Hydranockz

Member
StalkerUKCG said:
After all the polarizing views I can't see any reason to now have something like this. Its not like Bloom or Aim Assist where its going to directly impact gameplay.

I'd Love halo to feature a more customizable HUD, Allowing players to disable everything if they want so the only thing on screen is the gun.
Click to expand...

Yup. Armored Core 4 let you change HUD colours and even though it wasn't getting rid of HUD elements, it certainly was cool to personalise it in the most trivial manner.
 
O

Overdoziz

Banned
Hydranockz said:
But why is it a problem in Halo 4 being a primary? I just don't see why it can't co-exist along the other weapon roles you describe. The SAW is there. The pistol is there. I really can't see how having the AR primary as an option is a bad thing.
Click to expand...
Because I think it's too powerful for its ease of use as a starting weapon (assuming it's similar to the variants in previous Halos). And making it less powerful as a primary would only make people stop using it while having it as a secondary would still make it useful as a clean-up gun even if it's less powerful.
 
S

Swarmerr

Member
Overdoz1z said:
Because I think it's too powerful for its ease of use as a starting weapon (assuming it's similar to the variants in previous Halos). And making it less powerful as a primary would only make people stop using it while having it as a secondary would still make it useful as a clean-up gun even if it's less powerful.
Click to expand...


The bolded.
 
B

Brolic Gaoler

formerly Alienshogun
StalkerUKCG said:
After all the polarizing views I can't see any reason to now have something like this. Its not like Bloom or Aim Assist where its going to directly impact gameplay.

I'd Love halo to feature a more customizable HUD, Allowing players to disable everything if they want so the only thing on screen is the gun.



Confirmed as a OD weapon, It would be crazy OP as a starting weapon. 72 round clip and it looks like its kills in less time than anything we have seen bar Laser/Rocket/Railgun.
Click to expand...

Thanks bud, I didn't wanna wade through the thread to find that.
 
H

HiredN00bs

Member
kylej said:
I heard the same crap about bloom. There must've been 20 people in the Reach beta thread arguing with me about how bloom is a natural evolution of Halo gunplay and it'll only add a subliminal layer of skill to the game and saying I was crazy for worrying about it.
Click to expand...
The funny part is that you think you were proven right in the end.

I'll play the kylej/juices card:

Buh buh buh but Call of Duty doesn't let you turn off the text!
 
H

Hydranockz

Member
Overdoz1z said:
Because I think it's too powerful for its ease of use as a starting weapon (assuming it's similar to the variants in previous Halos). And making it less powerful as a primary would only make people stop using it while having it as a secondary would still make it useful as a clean-up gun even if it's less powerful.
Click to expand...

I guess I just never found the AR to be a powerful gun... ever. Except in that very close range against BR users. Oh well.
 
M

Myyke

Neo Member
Hydranockz said:
I guess I just never found the AR to be a powerful gun... ever. Except in that very close range against BR users. Oh well.
Click to expand...

Same here, I find particularly in Reach that there is just no point in using the AR, I've got less than 500 kills with it in "competitive" playlists.

I found it more enjoyable to use in Halo 3 but most of the time it was just used as a door opener to trade melees.
 
N

Not a Jellyfish

but I am a sheep
Only time the AR feels useful in MP for me is in just silly things like Multi-team King of The Hill.

When there is a mass of people in a single area that isn't very large.
 
E

ElzarTheBam

Member
Myyke said:
Same here, I find particularly in Reach that there is just no point in using the AR, I've got less than 500 kills with it in "competitive" playlists.

I found it more enjoyable to use in Halo 3 but most of the time it was just used as a door opener to trade melees.
Click to expand...

Well nowadays, you skip the shooting and go straight to the melees!
 
O

Orochinagis

Member
After seeing the no wubwub version I noticed some stuff

Melee lunge is still in the game
DMR still have bloom?(shot to the neck counts as a head shot)
Love how the spider ant the other preorder skins passed inadverted
Big Explosions are small
Rocket trails are small and now are white, maybe for saving resources?
Shotgun spread is smaller
Sniper looks like it had big bullets, to avoid lag or inconsistencies?
SAW is a beast and actually it didnt have recoil at all.
Rail gun can stop enemies and vehicles movements like the concussion Rifle still no powerfull enough to destroy a vehicle?
the clean enviroment sounds very silent even with the weapons sounds

Just my opinion anyway
 
N

Not a Jellyfish

but I am a sheep
Orochinagis said:
After seeing the no wubwub version I noticed some stuff

Melee lunge is still in the game
DMR still have bloom?(shot to the neck counts as a head shot)
Love how the spider ant the other preorder skins passed inadverted
Big Explosions are small
Rocket trails are small and now are white, maybe for saving resources?
Shotgun spread is smaller
Sniper looks like it had big bullets, to avoid lag or inconsistencies?
SAW is a beast and actually it didnt have recoil at all.
Railg gun can stop enemies and vehicles movements like the concussion Rifle still no powerfull enought to destroy a vehicle?
the clean enviroment sounds very silent even with the weapons sounds

Just my opinion anyway
Click to expand...

I wouldn't be so sure about that one, odds are they put clips of someone using the weapon effectively. Put that gun in less capable hands and it probably goes all over the screen.
 
A

AllIsOneIsNone

Banned
So I haven't commented on the new video yet, so I figured I'd share some of my thoughts. It looked good as halo always does, but I would be lying if I said there wasn't more to be desired.

Its been a bit of a inner battle with the past couple halos; I like to see things evolve, innovate, but I also understand the need for those things that are tried and true. I still can't escape the feeling that there were a lot of creative limitations in this game's development. I see some great new stuff, but I also see a lot of constraints here. I feel like the developers of 343 may have these conflicting feelings as a whole as well, and it worries me that the end product may reflect a bit of this identity crisis.

Trying to appeal to call of duty-type fans is only part of it, its also trying too hard to appease other casuals, halo fans, and trying to bring something new to the table at the same time. I think this is why sequels are so damn hard to make, you have a lot of people who expect a lot of different things, and if you don't have a vision of your own you can end up with a final product that doesn't completely satisfy anybody.

Personally, I wanted more unknown territory, a bit more new life injected into the series (I'm mainly talking about multiplayer), however talking with you guys I know that's not what everyone wants. I'm still damn excited about the game, but 2 new human weapons both ordinance drops? I may be jumping ahead of myself as the Promethean weapons are all new. However, I'm beginning to realize more and more that Halo is going to remain what it has been, with a little extra flare, hopefully a little extra refinement, and hopefully not too much callofduty-ization. Maybe my expectations are just too damn high.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Halo Infinite and Trolli candy team up to give out rewards, and chance to win a custom controller, Series S, PC, and other prizes.
15
2K
Andodalf replied
The State of Xbox Game Studios and Bethesda Softworks: A breakdown of all the Confirmed Projects, Leaks, and Rumors
Opinion News Rumor 2
84
11K
Ozriel replied
Halo Infinite | Tech Preview Two | Sept 24-27 | Oct 1-3
22 23 24 25 26
1K
76K
Naked Lunch replied
  • Locked
Community Forum Index
Community
19
4K
Sidney Prescott replied
  • Sticky
Forum Index of Community Threads
Community
34
23K
Grieves replied
Top Bottom