ViewtifulJC
Banned
I think everybody here just wants a fun Halo game.
Sadly, 343's idea of a fun Halo game seems to be more and more diametrically opposed to mine and many others.
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Halo |OT7| You may leave, Juices. And take Team Downer with you.
- Thread starter GhaleonEB
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I think everybody here just wants a fun Halo game.
Sadly, 343's idea of a fun Halo game seems to be more and more diametrically opposed to mine and many others.
Haha, this was funny http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upqgQh3cluU&list=UUfmczNPRH0MOQbLv5Mw8KMw&index=1&feature=plcp U4iX was slicing people up with a sword.
Then he ran out of sword, so he beat people down with an empty sword and killed at least another 6 people with an empty sword, and got the Cutting Crew medal, haha.
Then he ran out of sword, so he beat people down with an empty sword and killed at least another 6 people with an empty sword, and got the Cutting Crew medal, haha.
What if there was a free pack of 5 specializations that also brought new armors with them? An expansion. That would be so cool
I mean ones that haven't even been thought of or developed yet. Totally new.
I'm just starting to wrap my head around the tactical and support packages myself. And I run a fucking podcast with people who have played the game a bunch lol
I don't want another Halo 2 or Halo 3.
We've gotten confirmation of separate playlists with more restricted settings it sounds like.
And Frank keeps saying that it feels like Halo...who knows. Maybe he's on to something. I just can't wait to play it at PAX and hope it is a newer build that has specializations for us to try.
oh god oops
oh well. just further confirming that halogaf is the most attractive group on neogaf
edit: something halo related something something
specializations are neat, but I know I'm going to shed tears over them. it's so frustrating to get into a battle with someone, only to have them pull some ridiculous trump card. ghaleon's post like 20 pages ago was really spot on. they're neat and all, but for me they're just frustrating to play against.
edit 2:
Well, hello there.
Where am I gonna keep all dem dot maps?
StalkerUKCG
Banned
ViewtifulJC
Banned
"Definitive Halo from the people who brought you Halo". Yeah, I heard that song and dance before.
I can't fuckin' wait to play this game so it can either confirm all my fears or they were for nothing. At least we won't be in this annoying, confusing, drip feed of media we've had so far.
NullPointer
Member
This is a good point. Neither do I.
But all of this stuff does make me wonder what the philosophy is behind these additions to Halo 4. Because it sure seems like an attempt to copycat COD systems, by design.
Like Ghaleon wrote earlier, I don't see how any of this stuff makes the game better.
I hope you got something bigger than a 20GB HDD. ;-)
Deadly Cyclone
Pride of Iowa State
+1
Frank likes Halo folks. Yes, he's also selling it, but I take his word that he likes core Halo. When he says it feels like Halo, I'll take his word until I play for myself (2 weeks!).
Mister Negative
Member
The nice part about being Team Downer is that if you're wrong, you get an awesome game to play.
It's Juices's Wager.
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
Instead of taking a series of pot shots at discussion, you could contribute to it.
I'm curious what you think about the new information.
Hey, that gif represents my best gif work.
I'm refraining from directly commenting on the Specialisations any more than the little I have until the Bulletin is up. Not only do I want to jump to any conclusions but there might be additional information we're not getting to balance the picture out a little and I want to give 343 the chance to put it out there.
To be honest, I think we've waist high in something that isn't "traditional Halo" in terms of competitive multiplayer. Over the years I have fallen in love with proper traditional Halo multiplayer and what's coming with Halo 4 isn't it.
That's not to say I won't come to love to playing it. It's just even at the early stages I was expecting it to be something different, and it is.
I don't like what I have heard thus far for Specialisations and I'll happily explain why when 343 have said all they have to say about them.
Ah I see what you're saying - so handle it like BF3 does with game updates that go along side the content packs that are up for sale. This could be cool - especially because it could also add new armor and skins while they're at it.
ViewtifulJC
Banned
"A pessimist is never disappointed"
nillapuddin
Member
Fixed Proportions, looks badass!
(from waypoint)
Ultimately I think it will be a mostly balanced product, though a couple of elements -- namely Promethean Vision and Specializations -- could irk people here.
I think the casual players will love Halo 4. The group seemed to love Halo: Reach.
They literally pulled off something that was impossible to do.
^^ What a comeback!
I have a 60 but its full from goddamned Battlefield. Hoping my 360 dies so I can get a slim to hold me over til the next one. Maybe I'll put some blankets on it.
I have a 60 but its full from goddamned Battlefield. Hoping my 360 dies so I can get a slim to hold me over til the next one. Maybe I'll put some blankets on it.
Deadly Cyclone
Pride of Iowa State
PLYWOOD IN THE HOUSE.
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
It would have been if they had been confident and bold enough to fully implement a proper Title Update across the entire game, instead of in certain playlists only - and they only did so because they were trying too hard to please everyone.
They should have taken ownership and implemented the TU across the board day one when the TU went live. No exceptions, no splitting the userbase between 20 more unneeded playlist options. All the mollycoddling they did only fuelled the self-entitled whining that followed from certain segments of the community and exposed promises that, in hindsight, 343 maybe should not have made.
StalkerUKCG
Banned
Me like. What is the top weapon? Promethean AR?
Mister Negative
Member
I think that's the light rifle.
NobleGundam
Banned
"Let The Gifs Begin!" - Banewood
nillapuddin
Member
Looks a little more "beefy" I wouldnt be surprised if it was an AR type weapon
Demoncarnotaur
Member
So I know we have seen these before, but the press site has them up officially now in High Res:
So, Halo 4 2-disc confirmed? Hopefully we will get details soon.
Wheres this from?
So, Halo 4 2-disc confirmed? Hopefully we will get details soon.
Well, that's news. Not a bad deal either, but Ill stick with the LE (well in my head I will since I haven't pre-ordered it yet and don't have the money to spare yet). Anyways, is that thread worthy?
messed up proportions lol
Wheres this from?
Shake Appeal
Member
I think if 343 have some sense of what the 'classic'/stripped-down options in Halo 4 will be, or what their competitive or ranked offering is, they need to get that information out sooner rather than later. Could prove a timely salve to a lot of our butthurt.
Some might even argue that that's the stuff that should have been out there first, to get the hardcore/early adopters on board, instead of showing a bunch of things that freak those same people out and meanwhile aren't reaching the wider audience you're hoping to entice with them.
(For sake of optimism, I will not complain about there multiple experiences/'flavours' of Halo within one game being both confusing to players and indicative of confusion in the design, because you could just turn on Reach right now and fret about that yourself.)
Some might even argue that that's the stuff that should have been out there first, to get the hardcore/early adopters on board, instead of showing a bunch of things that freak those same people out and meanwhile aren't reaching the wider audience you're hoping to entice with them.
(For sake of optimism, I will not complain about there multiple experiences/'flavours' of Halo within one game being both confusing to players and indicative of confusion in the design, because you could just turn on Reach right now and fret about that yourself.)
nillapuddin
Member
The top of the specializations page
http://halo.xbox.com/halo4/en-US?#!halo-evolved/specializations/c907f20c-89c4-4849-9f58-d32b31d05e77
StalkerUKCG
Banned
Zeouterlimits
Member
Basically what I've been saying for months. Don't put this info out in this manner and not expect these reactions. People here want to be sold on H4, we want to love it.
messed up proportions lol
For some stupid reason, this bothers me more than Specializations.
Jaime Griesemer's design blog, Tip of the Sphere, is excellent. One of my favorite posts of his was about ensuring elements that are fun in a game retain them, rather than getting tweaked to death.
I'm going to post some of those excerpts, and then contrast them with the Halo 4 perks.
A side note, I can't load the Halo Waypoint Halo 4 page on my work computer - it flashes up for a second, then disappears, leaving the page black. So I'm going off of descriptions posted in the thread.
Jaime in bullets, Halo 4 not.
Stealth: Decreased visibilty vs PromVision
Wheelman: Lessend EMP effect, Vehicle Health buff
These perks have features that do nothing but counter other perks or features. In the case of the EMP, players can now spawn with Plasma Pistols. So, drivers had better pick the Wheelman, so as to counter it; likewise with Promethean Vision and the Stealth perk.
This describes the entire perk suite, but in particular, things like:
Shielding: Shield Recharge Rate buff
AA Efficiency: AA Recharge Rate buff
Stability: Lessened knock out of scope
Sensor Upgrade: Increased Motion Tracker Range
Awareness: Use radar while scoped
Looking back, Jaime's article there is describing many of the design principles that made Halo fun for me. Beyond things like the two weapon limit, recharging health, etc. was a design philosphy that dictated decisions that kept the combat deep, fun and clear.
343 is of course wanting to make a fun game, but it's clear to me they are not adhering to the same design principles that Bungie was when they made the game. This is not evolving the game forward, it's removing some of the key, defining design elements from the series.
This is why I am so worried. More than any bullet list like this, fear Halo 4 has turned into a game that is fundamentally different from the series I've loved for over a decade.
I'm going to post some of those excerpts, and then contrast them with the Halo 4 perks.
A side note, I can't load the Halo Waypoint Halo 4 page on my work computer - it flashes up for a second, then disappears, leaving the page black. So I'm going off of descriptions posted in the thread.
Jaime in bullets, Halo 4 not.
- Creating a Counter – Another common way to address an overpowered element is to design a second element whose sole role is to counter the first. Not only is this second element probably not fun on its own merits, but everyone will be saddled with choosing an option that they secretly hope they don’t have to employ, just to prevent everyone else from choosing the fun option they desperately want. I will choose the unenjoyable anti-tank mine so that nobody else can have fun using a tank.
Stealth: Decreased visibilty vs PromVision
Wheelman: Lessend EMP effect, Vehicle Health buff
These perks have features that do nothing but counter other perks or features. In the case of the EMP, players can now spawn with Plasma Pistols. So, drivers had better pick the Wheelman, so as to counter it; likewise with Promethean Vision and the Stealth perk.
- The Old Switch and Bait - Many games, especially those looking for a sense of progression, will initially introduce the player to a hobbled version of an element, and then unlock the truly fun version as a reward. Of course, this ignores the fact that players usually won’t invest in a game that isn’t fun, and even if they do eventually earn the right to have fun, a vast majority of their experience will have been struggling through a crippled, unenjoyable game. If I kill 300 more rats with this blunted shovel maybe I’ll get to use a real sword!… in this game that is ostensibly about swords.
- Death of a Thousand Tweaks – Perhaps the most outwardly reasonable (and therefore the most nefarious) way of shorting fun is to make an endless series of minor changes, each one leaving the element a little less fun than it was. Slightly less accurate, a touch less damage, a little longer reload, a smidge more recoil, a fraction less range, etc. In this parody of the tuning process, the element gets gradually less fun until it is “unfun enough” to be included. The problem is that tuning is more delicate than balance, so the element will lose the qualities that made it fun long before it becomes fair. It will also leave players frustrated; if only this gun had been tuned better it would be really fun!
This describes the entire perk suite, but in particular, things like:
Shielding: Shield Recharge Rate buff
AA Efficiency: AA Recharge Rate buff
Stability: Lessened knock out of scope
Sensor Upgrade: Increased Motion Tracker Range
Awareness: Use radar while scoped
Looking back, Jaime's article there is describing many of the design principles that made Halo fun for me. Beyond things like the two weapon limit, recharging health, etc. was a design philosphy that dictated decisions that kept the combat deep, fun and clear.
343 is of course wanting to make a fun game, but it's clear to me they are not adhering to the same design principles that Bungie was when they made the game. This is not evolving the game forward, it's removing some of the key, defining design elements from the series.
This is why I am so worried. More than any bullet list like this, fear Halo 4 has turned into a game that is fundamentally different from the series I've loved for over a decade.
Mister Negative
Member
It's labelled "Disc 2" though, so I don't think that's the case.
Anyway, I REALLY need to clear some space on my HD. I guess this is the downside of being a 20gb pleb.
Demoncarnotaur
Member
Yeah, I like those weapon skins.. I hope they do some unique stuff like a Classic BR skin, or forerunner skins for UNSC weapons, etc.
Nah, def the "Promethean AR"
From Spartan Ops Pics:
Light Rifle for comparison:
Nah, def the "Promethean AR"
From Spartan Ops Pics:
Light Rifle for comparison:
So, Halo 4 2-disc confirmed? Hopefully we will get details soon.
Yes! I'm excited for that and what it implies if its true. It means they didn't have to cut and hold things back based on what can fit on disc. It means they may be able to optimize each disc better for better performance and loading. Maybe its like BF3 and has a texture pack even? Either way, I like the 2 disc approach.
That would help HaloGAF and hardcore fans, but that'd just muddy up the info even more IMO. Plus, the version of the game they want to sale is the Infinity Slayer stuff. I imagine they want the Classic stuff to take the backburner. I also imagine they'll have some information on it eventually, but it'll be released in a smaller way so as not to be out there for everyone.
Sadly no. It'll be streamable from Waypoint only, and released later and separately on Blu Ray.
Genesis Knight
Member
Forward Unto Dawn will be a download voucher, not on disc.
Tha Robbertster
Member
Am I seriously getting standbyd in Halo 3? in 2012!!?
This is basically the problem with every weapon in Halo now.
squidhands
Member
Unless they secretly hope to be wrong.
I feel like the carrot tied to the stick has been replaced with a shitty candy bar.
messed up proportions lol
I thought the same thing while playing Reach yesterday.
Playing CTF on Asylum, game starts, score 0-0, go to black screen within thirty seconds.
Come back from black screen, whole team is dead, score 3-0, game over.
wat
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