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Halo: Reach |OT6| There Are Those Who Said This Day Would Never Come

H

Havok

Member
The Real Napsta said:
Yet you still play it.
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It's the only place to reliably get any sort of vehicle combat in the game, which really sucks for people that loved it in previous games. Premium is too hit or miss with the map selection.
Ramirez said:
I guess, but I suppose this falls in line with my thought process. If I complete a challenge ok, but if I don't, then whatever. I never change my playstyle to try and get a 1000 cR. I don't even look at the challengs half the time...
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It'd be awesome if every matchmaking random had that same philosophy, but they don't. Seeing people pump 3 shots into people and then lay off, or evade + throw stickies all game is depressingly common on days like this.
 
T

The Henery

Member
The Real Napsta said:
Yet you still play it.
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Exactly. With BTB I voted with my feet and chose to simply not play the playlist because it's so bad. What I find baffling is that it has quite a steady and fairly high population.

The message of it's awful decline would hit hardest with no population. Maybe then 343 would have dedicated resources to fixing things like the Banshee/Revenent, sniper destroying vehicles, 1 FLAG ON BONEYARD, Hemorrhage...
 
R

Ramirez

Member
Havok said:
It'd be awesome if every matchmaking random had that same philosophy, but they don't. Seeing people pump 3 shots into people and then lay off, or evade + throw stickies all game is depressingly common on days like this.
Click to expand...

Randoms are retarded no matter what the challenges are, the risk you take playing with them.
 
T

The Real Napsta

Member
reggie said:
The maps that don't have the Banshee play fine. It's a major problem that needs to be fixed. Are you suggesting this game is immune to criticism simply because I play it? I play this game because currently it's really the only multiplayer game to play on the 360 apart from Call of Duty (which is terrible).

I do know one thing though, come the 20th this game is going to be graveyard.
Click to expand...

What happens on the 20th?
 
N

ncsuDuncan

Member
Ramirez said:
Yea, never reward people for playing as a team, wait what?
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If "rewarding people for playing as a team" means "punishing players that don't get assists" then yes, you should never do that.

If you are trying to win and work as a team, you will probably get assists.

If you're just trying to get assists, you aren't necessarily trying to win at all.

You quoted the post where I said "assists should NEVER be encouraged or rewarded" but I clarified that statement in a later post.

Duncan's Law
Rewarding assists is only okay when the total perceived reward for Assisted Kill + Assist is equal to or less than the reward for an Unassisted Kill.

Example:
No 'I' in Team - 2000cR - Earn 8 assists in a multiplayer Matchmaking game.

Reward for Assisted Kill = 0 cR
Reward for Assist = (2000/8) = 250 cR
Reward for Unassisted Kill = 0 cR

Not okay.
 
R

Ramirez

Member
It's not even possible to get an assist unless the guy is killed, how is an assisted kill different from an assist?

Your system makes no sense to me.

Really, all I see are problems invented by playing with a bunch of randoms. There's no solution to the actions of randoms, and it's not exclusive to assists.
 
G

GhaleonEB

Member
Homeboyd said:
Zero Bloom 2x Score Attack

Any word (or hint) on whether the TU will span across FF/Campaign?
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The TU is accomplished via Megalo modifications, which is the Multiplayer game type editor. It's not applicable to Firefight or Campaign, and they haven't mentioned any changes to those modes.
 
F

FyreWulff

Member
Homeboyd said:
Zero Bloom 2x Score Attack

Any word (or hint) on whether the TU will span across FF/Campaign?
Click to expand...

That's the question I asked at the TU panel. 100% confirmed to not touch campaign at all, they kinda skipped over the Firefight part, but if they're just doing it with new Megalo hooks, it won't touch Firefight either.

edit: Ghaleon'd
 
H

Homeboyd

Member
thezerofire said:
why make it mutually exclusive? shots then gears
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Sounds good.

GhaleonEB said:
The TU is accomplished via Megalo modifications, which is the Multiplayer game type editor. It's not applicable to Firefight or Campaign, and they haven't mentioned any changes to those modes.
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Ahh ok thanks.

Demoncarnotaur said:
Has this been posted yet?

Offscreen footage of Firefight on CEA at Game trailers.

They suck at halo, but its still decent footage of the map.
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What's the deal with the Elite being another player with the enemy tag? Is this a versus mode?
 
T

Tashi

343i Lead Esports Producer
The problem with assists is just the recognition. Who the fuck cares about challenges? It's about games where you go negative, played a good game, assisted many kills but never got recognized for it. And I don't mean it in a way of not looking like a scrubby player in MM, I mean it in a self improvement manner. Something positive to take away from a seemingly bad game or to get a better reading on your performance in general. Regardless of opinion on assists, they're broken, and that's a fact.
 
B

BigShow36

Member
Ramirez said:
It's not even possible to get an assist unless the guy is killed, how is an assisted kill different from an assist?
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He's saying you kill someone and somebody else assisted you in that kill.
 
N

ncsuDuncan

Member
Ramirez said:
It's not even possible to get an assist unless the guy is killed, how is an assisted kill different from an assist?

Your system makes no sense to me.

Really, all I see are problems invented by playing with a bunch of randoms. There's no solution to the actions of randoms, and it's not exclusive to assists.
Click to expand...

It makes no difference whether the random actually gets the assist or not. The mere act of trying to get an assist (instead of a kill) is the negative behavior caused by Reach's assist challenges.

There might not be a solution for terrible random players ("don't play with randoms" is not a solution), but you can at least stop encouraging bad behavior.

-------
And don't be sidetracked by the Assisted Kill stat I made up. Reach just lumps Assisted Kills and Unassisted kills together as Kills. (An Assisted Kill is just when another player gets an Assist for helping you get that kill, as BigShow pointed out.)

Tashi, I can agree that the actual formula (% damage, timing) could be adjusted, but one of my arguments is that it's useless to see a stat for "how many times did I assist other kills" without also seeing a stat for "how many times were my kills assisted". Right now you can only reliably deduce that from the stats of a 2v2 match.
 
S

Slightly Live

Dirty tag dodger
kylej said:
I got the assist challenge in one game of doubles. They're not a big deal.
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You're a better than average player. I think the lower down the skill ladder you go, the harder it would be. Plus, Doubles is probably the best place to get assists outside of Multi-Team.
 
S

Slightly Live

Dirty tag dodger
Homeboyd said:
There's Premium Battle and Premium Condemned.

I can't escape the map. 3 times in a row so far. It's a good map but good God.
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And yet some folks complain that they can never play on any DLC map. C'est la vie.
 
K

kittens

Unconfirmed Member
Homeboyd said:
There's Premium Battle and Premium Condemned.

I can't escape the map. 3 times in a row so far. It's a good map but good God.
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I had that problem for a long time. I fortunately haven't played it in a week or so. Definitely my least favorite DLC map.
 
T

Tunavi

Banned
Tashi0106 said:
The problem with assists is just the recognition. Who the fuck cares about challenges? It's about games where you go negative, played a good game, assisted many kills but never got recognized for it. And I don't mean it in a way of not looking like a scrubby player in MM, I mean it in a self improvement manner. Something positive to take away from a seemingly bad game or to get a better reading on your performance in general. Regardless of opinion on assists, they're broken, and that's a fact.
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Yeah a lot of times on Zealot squad slayer, I'll be putting shots into everybody from the middle of the map, and I'll end up with a KD of like 6 and 2 without many assists, when everyone else on my team is 16 and 10.
 
B

BackdoorBeauty

Member
Tashi0106 said:
The problem with assists is just the recognition. Who the fuck cares about challenges? It's about games where you go negative, played a good game, assisted many kills but never got recognized for it. And I don't mean it in a way of not looking like a scrubby player in MM, I mean it in a self improvement manner. Something positive to take away from a seemingly bad game or to get a better reading on your performance in general. Regardless of opinion on assists, they're broken, and that's a fact.
Click to expand...

Assists are completely broken, I hate not getting credit for doing the good work.

They had it perfectly fine in the Beta, I have no idea why they changed it.
 
T

Tashi

343i Lead Esports Producer
I don't agree with that Duncan. I don't think it's very important to know how many of your kills were assisted when the majority of kills are assisted. Does anyone strive to try to get as many unassisted kills as possible? You just try to get the kills anyway that you can. IMO someone who can go around cleaning kids up and getting assists for his teammates is a valuable member of the team. Most weak or one shot players are hiding and recharging their shields, it takes a good listener and smart players and honestly a little bit of luck to be able to do that.
 
H

Homeboyd

Member
omg.kittens said:
I had that problem for a long time. I fortunately haven't played it in a week or so. Definitely my least favorite DLC map.
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The weighting is just huge for it. It's not uncommon for all 3 choices on the voting screen to be 3 different variations of condemned with slayer or DMR slayer. Even on the second voting screen it'll show up again!
 
H

Homeboyd

Member
thezerofire said:
I don't mind Condemned that much. Decent for flag or bomb it seems. I just get really lost on it
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I like it too.. But 3 times in a row? It almost always appears on the top choice(s) of the first voting screen. It has to be the most played map of that playlist by 2 or 3x.
 
T

thezerofire

Banned
Homeboyd said:
I like it too.. But 3 times in a row? It almost always appears on the top choice(s) of the first voting screen. It has to be the most played map of that playlist by 2 or 3x.
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reminds me of Halo 3 social slayer lol. Boundless or Last Resort again?
 
K

Karl2177

Member
Tashi0106 said:
I don't agree with that Duncan. I don't think it's very important to know how many of your kills were assisted when the majority of kills are assisted. Does anyone strive to try to get as many unassisted kills as possible? You just try to get the kills anyway that you can. IMO someone who can go around cleaning kids up and getting assists for his teammates is a valuable member of the team. Most weak or one shot players are hiding and recharging their shields, it takes a good listener and smart players and honestly a little bit of luck to be able to do that.
Click to expand...
He does bring up a very good point. He just knows how to bring it to words more eloquently than I do. Why include assists even if you aren't going to show the rest of the damage stats?
 
T

The Henery

Member
Homeboyd said:
The weighting is just huge for it. It's not uncommon for all 3 choices on the voting screen to be 3 different variations of condemned with slayer or DMR slayer. Even on the second voting screen it'll show up again!
Click to expand...

What would you prefer? Not being stern, genuinely interested. Condemned is one of the best maps for that playlist. I'd be happy to only play that and Tempest with the occasional sprinkling of Anchor 9 (all DMR starts of course). Highlands simply isn't suited to anything other than 8v8 (which I still haven't had the opportunity to play). Uplink is a disgrace; shotty/sword paradise. Then there's the problem of playing horseshit like Countdown and Reflection in a list that is supposed to be DLC (with the added bloody nose of armour lock in there).
 
R

Ramirez

Member
BigShow36 said:
He's saying you kill someone and somebody else assisted you in that kill.
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Seems like a meaningless stat to me, unless someone wants to dick wave that they killed a bunch of people without any help, lol.

I don't think there's THAT big of a deal with assists in Reach, there are times where I feel like I hit someone a bunch of times and get nothing for it, but it's not that frequent. I feel like some of you want an assist for shooting someone one or two times, if you don't do major damage that led to his kill within a timely manner, you shouldn't be awarded an assist.

What are everyone's assist stats looking like anyways?

I have 12,331 in like 3,500 games, which is pretty good when you consider the fact that probably over 1,000 of those games have been filled with quitters and didn't last more than 5 minutes or so, lol.
 
B

bobs...onGaf

Member
Karl2177 said:
He does bring up a very good point. He just knows how to bring it to words more eloquently than I do. Why include assists even if you aren't going to show the rest of the damage stats?
Click to expand...


Thats the same reasoning that got multi-user theatre cut simply because they couldnt get film clips to work.

Even if they cant go the full hog its nice to have these stats which work well stand alone.
 
H

Homeboyd

Member
thee henery said:
What would you prefer? Not being stern, genuinely interested. Condemned is one of the best maps for that playlist. I'd be happy to only play that and Tempest with the occasional sprinkling of Anchor 9 (all DMR starts of course). Highlands simply isn't suited to anything other than 8v8 (which I still haven't had the opportunity to play). Uplink is a disgrace; shotty/sword paradise. Then there's the problem of playing horseshit like Countdown and Reflection in a list that is supposed to be DLC (with the added bloody nose of armour lock in there).
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While you have your reasons for hating every other map than Condemned, Tempest and Anchor 9, I have mine for liking some of the others. So, I would prefer a little less weighting on one single map. But hey, whatever people want. If they want Condemned/Uplink, give it to em. And it's more about just playing only the maps that are considered good maps by a few of us here. Playing the same map time after time gets old... and when you put that map at the top of the voting screen the majority of the time... you'll keep getting it.

Oh and when I said "variations of Condemned" that would include Uplink.
 
C

Crucio

Member
Gabotron ES said:
OFFICE OF NAVAL INTELLIGENCE//SECTION 3 - DATA DROP TWO
2/6
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Edit: Its pretty obvious to me that this is leading up to the contents of Glasslands. Especially with the direct mention of the ONI admiral Margaret Parangosky.

The book is set to release on the 25th and there are 6 Data Drops which will end on the 14th. So many we can expect something even more special on the 21st. A new reason to say TGIF!?

omg.kittens said:
So, this is all in reference to the battle at Sigma Octanus IV. But have we heard about Meridian or Arcadia yet? And we know that ONI knew about Onyx pretty early on -- is that a surprise? Did Ghosts of Onyx hint at that at all?

And what's an AAR?
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So Arcadia is a planet visited by The Spirit of Fire in 2531 after having followed the a Covenant fleet. (Halo Wars) Its full of Forerunner tech.

Meridian is familiar but I forget what it was. (Nor can I find the name in the Visual Guide's or Encyclopedia's Indexes.)
EDIT: Ah Meridian was one of the Colonies mentioned in Halsey's journals. Some of the Spartan-II drugs were processed there.
 
L

Louis Wu

Member
Ramirez said:
What are everyone's assist stats looking like anyways?

I have 12,331 in like 3,500 games, which is pretty good when you consider the fact that probably over 1,000 of those games have been filled with quitters and didn't last more than 5 minutes or so, lol.
Click to expand...
If you look just at competitive games (to make comparisons easier), you have 10.7k in 3100 games. (That's 3.4/game.)

You're making Dani's point that better-than-average players will have an easier time with this challenge than the rest of us. ;)

(kylej is also up there - 5100 assists in 1800 games (2.8/game). Me, on the other hand? 3500 in 2000 games (1.74/game). So it's TWICE as hard for me as it is for you to get the standard "X assists in Y games" challenge... and much, much worse than that to get to 8 in a single game.

Which means for folks like me (I'm pretty average), you MUST change your gamestyle to get this challenge.

Eep - dinner
 
S

Stinkles

Clothed, sober, cooperative
Me and Shishka have a long-running Team Slayer rivalry on Headlong which currently stands at me dominating him 2:1. Using zero bloom Custom game.
 
N

ncsuDuncan

Member
OuterWorldVoice said:
Me and Shishka have a long-running Team Slayer rivalry on Headlong which currently stands at me dominating him 2:1. Using zero bloom Custom game.
Click to expand...

Yeah, some people are going to have a hard time adjusting to the armor lock nerf.

*rimshot*
 
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