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Halo: Reach |OT6| There Are Those Who Said This Day Would Never Come

wwm0nkey said:
To say no dedicated servers, no sale is a bit much. Dedicated servers do NOT make the game magically better. Just have a solid netcode and things are all good.

Some of you are forget dedicated servers come with their own share of problems. I want dedicated servers as much as the next guy but I can very easily live without them.

If Halo 4 is going to be sans bloom and quick like ZBS is, it's going to be even more frustrating to play on a not so great to shitty host. And given how Reach is excellent at host migration, I'd just rather have a fixed server.
 

Plywood

NeoGAF's smiling token!
wwm0nkey said:
To say no dedicated servers, no sale is a bit much. Dedicated servers do NOT make the game magically better. Just have a solid netcode and things are all good.

Some of you are forget dedicated servers come with their own share of problems. I want dedicated servers as much as the next guy but I can very easily live without them.
Dedicated servers will beat out P2P the majority of the time providing a much more consistent and smoother experience. All you have to do is look at Gears 3 for proof of that.

Don't act like connection issues don't exist on Reach because they absolutely do.
 

Woorloog

Banned
StalkerUKCG said:
So when you switch from old to new graphics do the collision models change?
No? Didn't watch the interview but this is the impression i got earlier.
Now that i think of this, does CEA use Reach models for Elites? Don't they stand a bit differently? Wouldn't that mean hitboxes at least need to be slightly different?
 
Plywood said:
Dedicated servers will beat out P2P the majority of the time providing a much more consistent and smoother experience.

Not when all the servers end up hosted in the US, thousands of miles away.

*cough* EA *cough*
 

MrBig

Member
Photolysis said:
*cough* EA *cough*
No, EA just has generally terrible servers.

MS however is currently in possession of the best, fastest server farms in the world. I wouldn't mind if they shared a bit of their hardware with 343.
 

Tunavi

Banned
MrBig said:
No, EA just has generally terrible servers.

MS however is currently in possession of the best, fastest server farms in the world. I wouldn't mind if they shared a bit of their hardware with 343.
It would justify the purchase of Xbox live.
 

Slightly Live

Dirty tag dodger
Tunavi said:
It would justify the purchase of Xbox live.

Is Live's price not already justified? If not, why have you been paying for it up to now? Millions of folks have had the price justified for them. Dedicated servers for one game wouldn't change anything.

The whole dedicated server thing is just funny. Over-entitled Americans crying every time the host doesn't live within walking distance from them.

P2P is just fine the way it is. It's not perfect but it works. No need to change it. Dedicated servers won't fix global latency differences now or in the future nor will they "save" Halo.
 
Dani said:
Is Live's price not already justified? If not, why have you been paying for it up to now? Millions of folks have had the price justified for them. Dedicated servers for one game wouldn't change anything.

The whole dedicated server thing is just funny. Over-entitled Americans crying every time the host doesn't live within walking distance from them.

P2P is just fine the way it is. It's not perfect but it works. No need to change it. Dedicated servers won't fix global latency differences now or in the future nor will they "save" Halo.


Back on Halo: CE PC days we had to lead our sniper shots, no one complained. Lol.

You would just take your ping and their direction of movement, lead the cross hair, and BAM.
 
Dani said:
Is Live's price not already justified? If not, why have you been paying for it up to now? Millions of folks have had the price justified for them. Dedicated servers for one game wouldn't change anything.

The whole dedicated server thing is just funny. Over-entitled Americans crying every time the host doesn't live within walking distance from them.

P2P is just fine the way it is. It's not perfect but it works. No need to change it. Dedicated servers won't fix global latency differences now or in the future nor will they "save" Halo.

As someone who played on the PC for years, Xbox Live is a joke. Couldn't give a fuck less about avatars, demos, or any of the perks involved since I've done so for free on PC for years prior. Call it spoiled, I don't care. Talking over the internet and playing on servers sans lag has been a staple on the PC for years, the fact that it's still unattainable in certain games on console is just sad.
 

Ramirez

Member
Dani said:
Is Live's price not already justified? If not, why have you been paying for it up to now? Millions of folks have had the price justified for them. Dedicated servers for one game wouldn't change anything.

The whole dedicated server thing is just funny. Over-entitled Americans crying every time the host doesn't live within walking distance from them.

P2P is just fine the way it is. It's not perfect but it works. No need to change it. Dedicated servers won't fix global latency differences now or in the future nor will they "save" Halo.

u mad
 
Dani said:
Is Live's price not already justified? If not, why have you been paying for it up to now? Millions of folks have had the price justified for them. Dedicated servers for one game wouldn't change anything.

The whole dedicated server thing is just funny. Over-entitled Americans crying every time the host doesn't live within walking distance from them.

P2P is just fine the way it is. It's not perfect but it works. No need to change it. Dedicated servers won't fix global latency differences now or in the future nor will they "save" Halo.
Have you not played PC shooters? P2P is so far removed from dedicated servers.
 

Judderman

drawer by drawer
Dani said:
Is Live's price not already justified? If not, why have you been paying for it up to now? Millions of folks have had the price justified for them. Dedicated servers for one game wouldn't change anything.

The whole dedicated server thing is just funny. Over-entitled Americans crying every time the host doesn't live within walking distance from them.

P2P is just fine the way it is. It's not perfect but it works. No need to change it. Dedicated servers won't fix global latency differences now or in the future nor will they "save" Halo.

So much wrong in one post.
 

Tunavi

Banned
Dani said:
Over-entitled Americans crying every time the host doesn't live within walking distance from them.
DTlXy.jpg
 
Dani said:
Is Live's price not already justified? If not, why have you been paying for it up to now? Millions of folks have had the price justified for them. Dedicated servers for one game wouldn't change anything.

The whole dedicated server thing is just funny. Over-entitled Americans crying every time the host doesn't live within walking distance from them.

P2P is just fine the way it is. It's not perfect but it works. No need to change it. Dedicated servers won't fix global latency differences now or in the future nor will they "save" Halo.

You know what i kinda have to agree with this. Dedi's would be nice but the p2p system isnt as bad as the majority make out, it has flaws dont get me wrong. But most of the time it works.

Dedi's introduce the problem of people who live closer having a better connection. Which considering they would most likely be US only means its great for the US but crappy for everyone else.
 
Dani said:
Is Live's price not already justified? If not, why have you been paying for it up to now? Millions of folks have had the price justified for them. Dedicated servers for one game wouldn't change anything.

The whole dedicated server thing is just funny. Over-entitled Americans crying every time the host doesn't live within walking distance from them.

P2P is just fine the way it is. It's not perfect but it works. No need to change it. Dedicated servers won't fix global latency differences now or in the future nor will they "save" Halo.
Man, I haven't been happy with P2P since I moved on to real servers in PC games in 1998! The fact that it's P2P, let alone a paid service, is ridiculous. Some people (myself) take it to play a game they can't play anywhere else, even under less than ideal circumstances, but saying everything's "fine the way it is" and there's "no need to change it" when there's massive room for improvement across the board is silly.
 

MrBig

Member
Dani said:
Is Live's price not already justified? If not, why have you been paying for it up to now? Millions of folks have had the price justified for them. Dedicated servers for one game wouldn't change anything.

The whole dedicated server thing is just funny. Over-entitled Americans crying every time the host doesn't live within walking distance from them.

P2P is just fine the way it is. It's not perfect but it works. No need to change it. Dedicated servers won't fix global latency differences now or in the future nor will they "save" Halo.
I don't believe that dropping $60 to play games that I already payed for is justified. I don't care about or use the extraneous fluff that MS offers. I've held off on renewing my live sub for over a month because I'm playing all my PC games for free, the way it should be, since MS isn't even hosting the game servers, just my profile data and updates. Like Steam does. For free. Offering dedicated server hosting to first party developers is the least they could do.

If it weren't for Halo and a few other exclusives (and I absolutely abhor the thought of exclusives) I would not own a console.
 

Slightly Live

Dirty tag dodger
Devolution said:
As someone who played on the PC for years, Xbox Live is a joke. Couldn't give a fuck less about avatars, demos, or any of the perks involved since I've done so for free on PC for years prior. Call it spoiled, I don't care. Talking over the internet and playing on servers sans lag has been a staple on the PC for years, the fact that it's still unattainable in certain games on console is just sad.

If PC gaming is so fantastic, why not stick it and forego console gaming? They are two different platforms serving distinct demographics with very little crossover.

It's ignorant to assume that consoles simply need to catch up the PC platform in terms of online infrastructures.

If you want dedicated servers and if you want play your games at sub-30 ping all the time just bail out of console gaming altogether. It's not going to happen and bitching about it won't make a single bit of difference.

Microsoft has some of the best networking engineers in the industry working on Live and developing P2P technologies. There has been close to a decade worth of continuous investment and development in this particular model and it won't be abandoned any time soon.
 

Ramirez

Member
Dani said:
If PC gaming is so fantastic, why not stick it and forego console gaming? They are two different platforms serving distinct demographics with very little crossover.

It's ignorant to assume that consoles simply need to catch up the PC platform in terms of online infrastructures.

If you want dedicated servers and if you want play your games at sub-30 ping all the time just bail out of console gaming altogether. It's not going to happen and bitching about it won't make a single bit of difference.

Microsoft has some of the best networking engineers in the industry working on Live and developing P2P technologies. There has been close to a decade worth of continuous investment and development in this particular model and it won't be abandoned any time soon.

If people just shutup and took it, Gears 3 would be just as miserable as the first two, dumb logic really.
 
MrBig said:
I don't believe that dropping $60 to play games that I already payed for is justified. I don't care about or use the extraneous fluff that MS offers. I've held off on renewing my live sub for over a month because I'm playing all my PC games for free, the way it should be, since MS isn't even hosting the game servers, just my profile data and updates. Like Steam does. For free. Offering dedicated server hosting to first party developers is the least they could do.

If it weren't for Halo and a few other exclusives (and I absolutely abhor the thought of exclusives) I would not own a console.


Especially with the new update coming out you get a lot more out of a gold membership.

Netflix
Facebook
Twitter
Lastfm
ESPN
LOTS OF TELEVISION.
Games On Demand
XBL Arcade

A unified UI for everyone playing XBL, I don't need another extra program to party chat with my friend for example.

The 60 dollar cost is becoming more and more justified.
 
Hydranockz said:
It's ok Dani, they'll talk shit about playing with us cuz of our hosts and we'll never hear kylej complain about the devo host either :p

Kyle tells me to move to the East Coast every time we play.


A27_StarWolf said:
Especially with the new update coming out you get a lot more out of a gold membership.

Netflix
Facebook
Twitter
Lastfm
ESPN
LOTS OF TELEVISION.
Games On Demand
XBL Arcade

A unified UI for everyone playing XBL, I don't need another extra program to party chat with my friend for example.

The 60 dollar cost is becoming more and more justified.

Justified if and when you use those things. They're honestly going to need a tiered system. I already have Uverse, so a bunch of those things are just redundant to me.
 

Thermite

Member
Dani said:
If PC gaming is so fantastic, why not stick it and forego console gaming? They are two different platforms serving distinct demographics with very little crossover.

It's ignorant to assume that consoles simply need to catch up the PC platform in terms of online infrastructures.

If you want dedicated servers and if you want play your games at sub-30 ping all the time just bail out of console gaming altogether. It's not going to happen and bitching about it won't make a single bit of difference.

Microsoft has some of the best networking engineers in the industry working on Live and developing P2P technologies. There has been close to a decade worth of continuous investment and development in this particular model and it won't be abandoned any time soon.

Microsoft is single greatest company in the world, with the greatest bosses (particularly Mr. Don Mattrick), greatest working environment, with the smartest, most brilliant people in the whole wide world. How dare you plebeians speak up against such magnificence!

PLZ HIRE ME
 

kylej

Banned
Ramirez said:
If people just shutup and took it, Gears 3 would be just as miserable as the first two, dumb logic really.

Dani's still hoping to pull a Cocop/Voc. Dude's gonna fluff the Bungie/Microsoft teat until he can land a job.
 
Xbox live cost is justified.
Dedi's would be nice.
P2P isnt as bad as everyone makes out.
Im eating grapes.

In other news, When do we get to see the hang 'em high remake.
 

Havok

Member
A27_StarWolf said:
Especially with the new update coming out you get a lot more out of a gold membership.

Netflix - which you pay an existing subscription for, which is free on other platforms.
Facebook - which is a free service.
Twitter - which is a free service.
Lastfm - which is a free service.
ESPN
LOTS OF TELEVISION. - which you pay an existing subscription for per channel.
Games On Demand - available to silver members.
XBL Arcade - available to silver members.

A unified UI for everyone playing XBL, I don't need another extra program to party chat with my friend for example.

The 60 dollar cost is becoming more and more justified.
So only ESPN is even remotely justified. That's hardly the addition of services to justify a price tag, it's gating off things that should be free.

I pay for it because I'm generally happy with the way it performs, but that extraneous paygating isn't a reasonable excuse for me.
 

Slightly Live

Dirty tag dodger
Rickenslacker said:
Man, I haven't been happy with P2P since I moved on to real servers in PC games in 1998! The fact that it's P2P, let alone a paid service, is ridiculous. Some people (myself) take it to play a game they can't play anywhere else, even under less than ideal circumstances, but saying everything's "fine the way it is" and there's "no need to change it" when there's massive room for improvement across the board is silly.

When I say "it's fine the way it is", I mean it in terms of where PSP and console gaming is right now and the progress that mas been made in the past few years. P2P on consoles is in a constant state of improvement and growth.

Ultimately geographical limitations and physical connections will always present unavoidable complications and not even dedicated servers can solve those issues.

Would dedicated serves improve the current Reach environment? Maybe. Maybe some people would have a better experience. Most people wouldn't notice and then there's the number of folks whose experiences would be worsened. There would be additional costs to introduce and maintain the system and I think it would be difficult to justify it.

I heard Gears 3's use of dedicated servers being used here as a shining example. I rented the game out and tried some multiplayer and honestly couldn't tell if they were using dedicated servers or not. Made little to no difference to me. I suspect most players would be similarly ignorant.
 
Tunavi said:
Not sure why Dani is arguing against the improvement of a product for the customer. Fucking rediculous


Tunavi think of it like this, lots of things could help a customer, but from an economic perspective, or a infrastructure perspective, is it worth it?

XBL Is mad successful, if it was profitable to do more dedicated servers, it would happen. Otherwise people seem to be dealing with P2P just fine. Halo GAF might be complaining, but in reality how much percent of the market share are we?
 

MrBig

Member
A27_StarWolf said:
Especially with the new update coming out you get a lot more out of a gold membership.

Netflix
Facebook
Twitter
Lastfm
ESPN
LOTS OF TELEVISION.
Games On Demand
XBL Arcade

A unified UI for everyone playing XBL, I don't need another extra program to party chat with my friend for example.

The 60 dollar cost is becoming more and more justified.
I don't care about or use the extraneous fluff that MS offers
I do not and use any of those things you listed. I use it to play games that have been restricted to the device and nothing more.

Steam, the PC equivalent of the XBL dashboard offers chat services and more game content than XBL.

Not to mention just about everything on that list is free.
 

Tunavi

Banned
A27_StarWolf said:
Especially with the new update coming out you get a lot more out of a gold membership.

Netflix
Facebook
Twitter
Lastfm
ESPN
LOTS OF TELEVISION.
Games On Demand
XBL Arcade

A unified UI for everyone playing XBL, I don't need another extra program to party chat with my friend for example.

The 60 dollar cost is becoming more and more justified.

half of those are free programs on my computer and half require another the purchase of another membership to something else

and seriously Starwolf, who the fuck would ever look at twitter on their xbox? lololol the thing was designed for mobile phones
 
Havok said:
So only ESPN is even remotely justified. That's hardly the addition of services to justify a price tag, it's gating off things that should be free.

I got cable, so no. Not interested in FB/Twitter integration. etc etc. I realize though that I am fast becoming a minority since I'm not a self-absorbed gamer and stick to few games. I'm not currently on the PC because look at the thread title, I thought it was obvious. I got Skyrim on PC though.
 
Dani said:
When I say "it's fine the way it is", I mean it in terms of where PSP and console gaming is right now and the progress that mas been made in the past few years. P2P on consoles is in a constant state of improvement and growth.

Ultimately geographical limitations and physical connections will always present unavoidable complications and not even dedicated servers can solve those issues.

Would dedicated serves improve the current Reach environment? Maybe. Maybe some people would have a better experience. Most people wouldn't notice and then there's the number of folks whose experiences would be worsened. There would be additional costs to introduce and maintain the system and I think it would be difficult to justify it.

I heard Gears 3's use of dedicated servers being used here as a shining example. I rented the game out and tried some multiplayer and honestly couldn't tell if they were using dedicated servers or not. Made little to no difference to me. I suspect most players would be similarly ignorant.
Did you play Gears 1 and 2 online?
 
MrBig said:
I do not and use any of those things you listed. I use it to play games that have been restricted to the device and nothing more.

Steam, the PC equivalent of the XBL dashboard offers chat services and more game content than XBL.

You dont, i do so do many others. A tiered system would be great

Free = Silver = Marketplace/Chat/Updates
$30-£20 = Gold = Silver + Online
$60-£40 = Platinum = Current Gold + some type of PSN+ type feature.
 

Kujo

Member
Dani said:
So is Australia.
Woo

As an Australian I pay more for XBL Gold and get the least amount of features lol. I don't think it's worth it, but it's the only way to play Halo online, qq
 
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