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Halo: Reach |OT6| There Are Those Who Said This Day Would Never Come

ElRenoRaven

ElRenoRaven

Member
GhaleonEB said:
In the days before Kinect, the feature would be built and you would press a button to activate the scan. Now, you have to buy a $150 piece of hardware to activate that feature.

It's a great feature, but there's no reason on earth to wall it off to Kinect other than as a lever to try and sell some Kinects. When Microsoft said they were going to develop Kinect content for the core gamer, I did not anticipate that it would be accomplished by slicing features from the game and walling them off as Kinect-only, rather that developing interesting and compelling content that utilizes the hardware. It's a disturbing precedent.
Click to expand...

And it's only going to get worse. I can see it coming back for Halo 4 along with other features that could again easily be done without Kinect but will require it. I'll shut up though. It just pisses me off. As it stands I really don't know if I'm going to buy the game now. I really don't. With that said I'll shut up now.
 
S

senador

Banned
GhaleonEB said:
In the days before Kinect, the feature would be built and you would press a button to activate the scan. Now, you have to buy a $150 piece of hardware to activate that feature.

It's a great feature, but there's no reason on earth to wall it off to Kinect other than as a lever to try and sell some Kinects. When Microsoft said they were going to develop Kinect content for the core gamer, I did not anticipate that it would be accomplished by slicing features from the game and walling them off as Kinect-only, rather that developing interesting and compelling content that utilizes the hardware. It's a disturbing precedent.
Click to expand...

Right. Its not a feature that relies on having Kinect. The new Zelda requires a Wii Motion Plus controller as the gameplay relies on 1:1 motion sword play. That makes sense. This feature could be done with a button, but instead its voice, but the voice doesn't make it work any differently or better than it would have with a button press. I'd rather it have some new motion feature that you could only do with Kinect. I don't have any great ideas off the top of my head, but maybe a mode that lets you "play" the Chief. Aim and shoot and such. As it is, it really feels like a money gate of sorts.

I will say it sounds like a cool feature and I am glad 343 decided to do something like that (the scanning and 3D library, not the Kinect tie-in). I'll also say the technology of the Kinect is pretty awesome, its just not for me.
 
K

kittens

Unconfirmed Member
GhaleonEB said:
It's a disturbing precedent.
Click to expand...
Yup. It feels inevitable that we'll see this shit in Halo 4, too.

I feel bad for the folks at 343. Honestly, there's no solid justification for this, and I can't imagine they were happy about the decision to make the new content Kinect-only. Like Senador pointed out, it's a pretty big slap in the face to core Halo fans, most of whom couldn't care less about Kinect.
 
F

feel

Member
kylej said:
Kinetic is a big deal for Microsoft, and Anniversary is a 'new' Halo game developed and published by a wholly-owned subsidiary. It's just business.
Click to expand...
Ding.

It's not the greatest practice, but it's how these things go. Almost sure the feature wasn't in the plans before MS demanded something exclusive to Kinect. It was either this little extra, or something way more substantial.

ncsuDuncan said:
Joystiq has off-screen footage of the Kinect BTS video.
Click to expand...
Game looks amazing!! The lightning seems very improved, and dat AOTCR snow...

Analyze effect looks sweet. Looking forward to the direct feed.


Model viewing seems motion controlled
1zuq90.jpg

that's nice as long as it works smoothly while sitting down
 
R

Ramirez

Member
Kinect thing seems pretty silly, really nothing to get pissed about...

Going off that pic, Elites have never felt like they were 8 foot to me in the game, lol. I realize the Spartans are like 7 foot, but even when they're standing next to Marines I don't get that sense of height from them...
 
Deputy Moonman

Deputy Moonman

Member
xxjuicesxx said:
Thats not a joke post. Those kids are douchebags, and they all post they love Halo 1 and shit like " H2 was a total dissapointment"
Click to expand...
Well to be fair, Halo2 was a disappointment for a lot of die hard Halo:CE fans including myself. I can remember trying to do a Halo2 LAN with friends not long after it came out and the magic was gone. All my friends were like, "what is this?" It was such a drastic change from Halo:CE. And for people who didn't like Halo2, they couldn't go back to having Halo:CE LANs with their friends, because everyone else was doing Halo2 on xboxlive. It wasn't like when people could go back to Halo2 after Halo3 had come out. Or where people could go back to Halo3 after Reach came out. You were SoL unless you were willing to suffer through XBconnect.

I got used to Halo2 and had good times with it, but there wasn't a day that went by that I wasn't butt-hurt that Halo:CE never got a chance on xbox live. I would have jumped ship immediately and went back to Halo:CE if it had. And I can say that without even having to exaggerate or fib the tiniest little bit. I loved Halo:CE multiplayer.
 
D

daedalius

Member
I'm not sure how I manage to make myself play in btb considering everyone votes for hemorrhage every time its available and every game you have at least 3 quitters... ugh

Wow 7 quitters between the 2 teams... nope 8. What is wrong with people
 
F

FyreWulff

Member
Ramirez said:
Kinect thing seems pretty silly, really nothing to get pissed about...

Going off that pic, Elites have never felt like they were 8 foot to me in the game, lol. I realize the Spartans are like 7 foot, but even when they're standing next to Marines I don't get that sense of height from them...
Click to expand...

Halo 1's scale is.. off. Hunters are like midgets compared to the later games.

But then they hunched the Elites for 2 and 3 so they'd be similiar to spartan players for multiplayer.
 
F

feel

Member
senador said:
I must also express my disappointment for the analyze/library stuff. That seems like a feature for the more hardcore fan, yet it's the more causal fans that will have Kinects (no offense Letters, you are the exception). I can't see that many casual fans scanning things in a Halo game so to me it seems that many will miss out on this feature and only a very small subset will get to enjoy it.
Click to expand...
To be fair, all the hardcore fans already know all the info about every item/character and it's available in the wikis right now if they need a reminder, it's the casuals who could probably need to have some fun learning a thing or two about the pew pew aliens they've been shooting.
 
D

Devolution

Member
Ramirez said:
Kinect thing seems pretty silly, really nothing to get pissed about...

Going off that pic, Elites have never felt like they were 8 foot to me in the game, lol. I realize the Spartans are like 7 foot, but even when they're standing next to Marines I don't get that sense of height from them...
Click to expand...

It's because all of the marines are like 6'.
 
S

Slightly Live

Dirty tag dodger
I'm annoyed that two of today's announcements - ATLAS and Analyse/Library modes will mean nothing to me because I just happen not to have either a WP7 or a Kinect.

I am not going to spend hundreds to change the situation, even if today's announcements are pretty awesome things I'd like to have and use.

Ramirez said:
Kinect thing seems pretty silly, really nothing to get pissed about..
Click to expand...

Doubt anyone is pissed, just disappointed. Kinect is touted as being a real game-changer allowing you to interact with games in new and immersive ways and the the big ticket Kinect feature they decide to add to a Halo product is something that could have been done with a single button press on the d-pad or something.

The implementation, but certainly not the content (the models and additional lore are sweet), comes across as lazy and half hearted. It's similar to Wii games where they forced players to furiously jerk off the motion controller for no discernible purpose when a simple button press could have done the job.

Imagine tomorrow they added a second patch for Reach that enabled voice control for Armour Ability activation. Would you rush out and buy a Kinect? Hardly.

You could say it's additional content on the disk that I can't use unless I buy a physical $150 unlock key.

Anniversary's Kinect implementation is making me wary of how Kinect will be implemented into Halo 4. Kinect isn't going away any time soon and I would love for Microsoft to make me want to buy it. It hasn't happened yet and Anniversary won't make me do it it either. If Halo 4 offers a similar, limp Kinect experience I'll probably never bother with the device.

I hope Anniversary's hurried development is the reason why the Kinect support is the way it is and similarly hope that Kinect in Halo 4 won't feel so... gimmicky.

Ultimately I'm disappointed. I would like to have the Analyse mode and the Library mode but how it's implemented makes me not want to buy a Kinect when I imagine the goal is to try to get "core" gamers such as ourselves to go out and get one.
 
S

Steelyuhas

Member
Slightly Live said:
I'm annoyed that two of today's announcements - ATLAS and Analyse/Library modes will mean nothing to me because I just happen not to have either a WP7 or a Kinect.

I am not going to spend hundreds to change the situation, even if today's announcements are pretty awesome things I'd like to have and use.



Doubt anyone is pissed, just disappointed. Kinect is touted as being a real game-changer allowing you to interact with games in new and immersive ways and the the big ticket Kinect feature they decide to add to a Halo product is something that could have been done with a single button press on the d-pad or something.

The implementation, but certainly not the content (the models and additional lore are sweet), comes across as lazy and half hearted. It's similar to Wii games where they forced players to furiously jerk off the motion controller for no discernible purpose when a simple button press could have done the job.

Imagine tomorrow they added a second patch for Reach that enabled voice control for Armour Ability activation. Would you rush out and buy a Kinect? Hardly.

You could say it's additional content on the disk that I can't use unless I buy a physical $150 unlock key.

Anniversary's Kinect implementation is making me wary of how Kinect will be implemented into Halo 4. Kinect isn't going away any time soon and I would love for Microsoft to make me want to buy it. It hasn't happened yet and Anniversary won't make me do it it either. If Halo 4 offers a similar, limp Kinect experience I'll probably never bother with the device.

I hope Anniversary's hurried development is the reason why the Kinect support is the way it is and similarly hope that Kinect in Halo 4 won't feel so... gimmicky.

Ultimately I'm disappointed. I would like to have the Analyse mode and the Library mode but how it's implemented makes me not want to buy a Kinect when I imagine the goal is to try to get "core" gamers such as ourselves to go out and get one.
Click to expand...
Agreed on Kinect. I see it as a very cool piece of tech with a ton of potential, but we haven't seen devs use it in interesting ways very much to this point, and that certainly includes CEA.

Kinect has been out for about a year and the best part about having one is voice commands for when watching media.
 
Z

Zeouterlimits

Member
GhaleonEB said:
In the days before Kinect, the feature would be built and you would press a button to activate the scan. Now, you have to buy a $150 piece of hardware to activate that feature.

It's a great feature, but there's no reason on earth to wall it off to Kinect other than as a lever to try and sell some Kinects. When Microsoft said they were going to develop Kinect content for the core gamer, I did not anticipate that it would be accomplished by slicing features from the game and walling them off as Kinect-only, rather that developing interesting and compelling content that utilizes the hardware. It's a disturbing precedent.
Click to expand...
Came to post this.

As a Kinect Owner, I really like the device.
Child of Eden & Dance Central are fantastic games that benefit from the device.

However this wall-ing off seems really nonsensical to me, to the point where I can only assume it's a benefit for the project financially (use Kinect, get an extra 500,000 for your budget) Or brownie points with the management above 343i (allowing 343i to spend resources in places they might not have been let otherwise). This is just me hypothesising/attempting to reason out.

I can't imagine people didn't ask during meetings "Is it fair or right that we make this Kinect-only?"

We all knew there would be Kinect functionality, but Kinect-exclusive functionality? No, I can't support that, that cuts off that feature as big or small as you may think it to be for a huge amount of your fanbase.
The other weird aspect of it is that it doesn't seem to hugely benefit from Kinect. So as if its Kinect-only just to get the Hardcore players to buy it, even if it isn't a particularly interesting use of the device.

It's so bizarre to me I almost want to ask if we're missing something?

---------
As for the W7 Atlas. Interesting. Don't want to over think it until I see some footage.
 
W

wwm0nkey

Member
I have a Windows Phone 7 and the new map feature sounds awesome. Though this is why I also wish all companies would copy off the WiiU for the next system so stuff like this could just be built in.
 
H

Hypertrooper

Member
Don't get the hate for the kinect feature. 343i did say, that kinect is only just a small thing. And it is a small thing now. If they really try to do something creative, we are going to cry and blame them, what they did with our beloved Halo.

About the Atlas thing: I think it isn't possible on other Mobile Platforms like iOS or Android, because it needs real-time Xbox Live data. And this is only doable with the in-built Xbox live connection in the WP7. But that's just theory.

Video of Hang'em High:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hR4xmp2h0Y

Btw. Where is the hate, that Hang'em High isn't the new ForgeUniverse some of you wished for?
 
Z

Zeouterlimits

Member
Hypertrooper said:
Don't get the hate for the kinect feature. 343i did say, that kinect is only just a small thing. And it is a small thing now.
Click to expand...
Small thing. Perhaps. Doesn't burn fiction lovers any less e.g. Dan--- er Slightly Live.
The point is Hyper :
-Is there a good reason for it to be Kinect Only?
 
W

wwm0nkey

Member
Hypertrooper said:
Don't get the hate for the kinect feature. 343i did say, that kinect is only just a small thing. And it is a small thing now. If they really try to do something creative, we are going to cry and blame them, what they did with our beloved Halo.

About the Atlas thing: I think it isn't possible on other Mobile Platforms like iOS or Android, because it needs real-time Xbox Live data. And this is only doable with the in-built Xbox live connection in the WP7. But that's just theory.

Video of Hang'em High:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hR4xmp2h0Y

Btw. Where is the hate, that Hang'em High isn't the new ForgeUniverse some of you wished for?
Click to expand...
Meh I mean it would have been nice but its nothing to get worked up about, we still get one of the best Halo maps.
 
W

Woorloog

Banned
Analyze system using Kinect only? Real-time MP map for WPs?
Fuck that. Seriously. It seems that i won't be playing Reach MP anymore, not as long as ATLAS app exist. So, never again. Say all you want about it's rarity or not being easy to use while playing or that it won't show respawns, i don't care. Some will have and some will exploit it. So i'm stuck with Battlefield 3 until SWTOR and Mass Effect 3.

And that Kinect thing... i'd love the analyze system being a Halo fiction fan. The thing is, i don't have Kinect and until Kinect will have proper games, i won't be getting it (mere support in some games is not enough). So i'm locked out of interesting content. Yeah, yeah, they are read once and then forgotten and you can see them from Youtube later on probably but that's no the point. Besides, how is it that the system requires Kinect?
I'm really starting to wonder if i should even get Halo CEA... It's value for price ration suddenly fell.

I have a feeling Halo 4 will have similar features...
 
W

wwm0nkey

Member
Woorloog said:
Analyze system using Kinect only? Real-time MP map for WPs?
Fuck that. Seriously. It seems that i won't be playing Reach MP anymore, not as long as ATLAS app exist. So, never again. Say all you want about it's rarity or not being easy to use while playing or that it won't show respawns, i don't care. Some will have and some will exploit it.

And that Kinect thing... i'd love the analyze system being a Halo fiction fan. The thing is, i don't have Kinect and until Kinect will have proper games, i won't be getting it (mere support in some games is not enough). So i'm locked out of interesting content. Yeah, yeah, they are read once and then forgotten and you can see them from Youtube later on probably but that's no the point. Besides, how is it that the system requires Kinect?
I'm really starting to wonder if i should even get Halo CEA... It's value for price ration suddenly fell.

I have a feeling Halo 4 will have similar features...
Click to expand...
The live map feature does not show enemies, I mean yes it will give a slight advantage to those that have it due to it showing the weapon layout (that is if the weapons are updated live too) but its not like it makes someone magically good at the game.
 
H

Hypertrooper

Member
Zeouterlimits said:
Small thing. Perhaps. Doesn't burn fiction lovers any less e.g. Dan--- er Slightly Live.
The point is Hyper :
-Is there a good reason for it to be Kinect Only?
Click to expand...
Mmh. Yeah there is. People have another reason to buy kinect now. I just missed the line, if you buy Kinect now. Please buy a copy of Child Of Eden with it.

Woorloog said:
Analyze system using Kinect only? Real-time MP map for WPs?
Fuck that. Seriously. It seems that i won't be playing Reach MP anymore, not as long as ATLAS app exist. So, never again. Say all you want about it's rarity or not being easy to use while playing or that it won't show respawns, i don't care. Some will have and some will exploit it. So i'm stuck with Battlefield 3 until SWTOR and Mass Effect 3.

And that Kinect thing... i'd love the analyze system being a Halo fiction fan. The thing is, i don't have Kinect and until Kinect will have proper games, i won't be getting it (mere support in some games is not enough). So i'm locked out of interesting content. Yeah, yeah, they are read once and then forgotten and you can see them from Youtube later on probably but that's no the point. Besides, how is it that the system requires Kinect?
I'm really starting to wonder if i should even get Halo CEA... It's value for price ration suddenly fell.

I have a feeling Halo 4 will have similar features...
Click to expand...
Overreaction. Yeah overreaction. lol. Man wtf? You first heard about this Kinect feature since yesterday. And now you're considering not buying it? Really? And about that Atlas thing. Do you really think people are using these Atlas thing during gaming? It only gives you information, you already know(Weapon spawn etc.)
 
W

Woorloog

Banned
wwm0nkey said:
The live map feature does not show enemies, I mean yes it will give a slight advantage to those that have it due to it showing the weapon layout (that is if the weapons are updated live too) but its not like it makes someone magically good at the game.
Click to expand...
And that is enough. I know it doesn't show enemies but showing team mates and other activity OUTSIDE THE FUCKING GAME. It requires a third party item and a third party app. Despite being official, i do not see much difference in using the app or cheating (wallhacks, maphacks, whatever).
I really don't care if it doesn't give a real advantage, it sets precedent for other apps. How long till $100 app that shows the enemy positions, what weapons they're using etc in addition to stuff show in ATLAS?
And i really doubt Halo 4 wouldn't have a similar app...
 
S

Slightly Live

Dirty tag dodger
Woorloog said:
And that is enough. I know it doesn't show enemies but showing team mates and other activity OUTSIDE THE FUCKING GAME. It requires a third party item and a third party app. Despite being official, i do not see much difference in using the app or cheating (wallhacks, maphacks, whatever).
I really don't care if it doesn't give a real advantage, it sets precedent for other apps. How long till $100 app that shows the enemy positions, what weapons they're using etc in addition to stuff show in ATLAS?
And i really doubt Halo 4 wouldn't have a similar app...
Click to expand...

And that's Grade A hyperbole.
 
W

wwm0nkey

Member
Ok this has actually been botering me for awhile and I dont know why but in the Halo 4 trailer that grey smoke behind John constantly flickers like its clipping through another texture or something, I have NEVER seen that in a CGI film before.

2z7ll6g.png


Halo 4 trailer was real time confirmed? (joking obviously)
 
G

Gabotron ES

Member
No new Forge World? that's pretty sad, atleast High Noon looks damn beautiful. New Waypoint looks really cool too and we don't have to pay for it.

Pretty dissapointed with all the WP7 and Kinect exclusive content, I'm already getting a 3D TV just for Anniversary :/

Some really good ideas 343/Saber got there but I think they were bad executed.
 
T

Tha Robbertster

Member
So is the setting for high noon the portal on earth to the ark? It looks a bit like it but I couldn't hear anything from the video so I don't know if they said anything about it.
 
H

Hypertrooper

Member
Tha Robbertster said:
So is the setting for high noon the portal on earth to the ark? It looks a bit like it but I couldn't hear anything from the video so I don't know if they said anything about it.
Click to expand...
Who said that the portal on Earth is the only portal in the Halo Universe? :^)
 
T

The Librarian

Banned
I, too, would like to voice my disapproval for the Kinect-only feature. I do not have Kinect nor am I interested in getting one. I'm not plopping down $150 for something I'll hardly use.

Someone else brought up a good point. A large majority of those who have Kinect will never bother with something like this. This analyzing system is something only the hardcore fans will appreciate and the vast majority of Kinect users will ignore.
 
B

bobs...onGaf

Member
Slightly Live said:
According to Darkflight,



The Library mode with a model viewer and information about things scanned in Analyse mode - Kinect exclusive.
Click to expand...

Wow that would be ridiculous, that wouldn't be a very hard thing to control with a controller and it wouldnt be very hard to make the controller support it. It does seem like a pretty annoying thing that its kinnect exclusive. At the end of the game they could just scan all the possible items into the library to get out of the voice command thing and then the library itself could easily be navigated by a controller.

Meh, its nothing I cant see on youtube its more the thought process behind it that gets me.


Slightly Live said:
ATLAS



WP7 Phone users get super team radar, essentially.
Click to expand...

Haha wow that is the worst idea ever, I cant believe Frankie justifys it as self balancing. I have just been bitching more and more about Halo since the Reach beta and for a while I was wondering if it was just me. but between the 2 newsposts yesterday im pretty sure its not just me being fussy.

Unless that radar thing comes with a little bit of hardware so that everyone can use it it will throw balance out of the window. Even if EVERYONE could use it it throws gameplay out of the window. I think its more satisfying to have that situational awareness yourself tbh.

Oh well.

In the days before Kinect, the feature would be built and you would press a button to activate the scan. Now, you have to buy a $150 piece of hardware to activate that feature.

It's a great feature, but there's no reason on earth to wall it off to Kinect other than as a lever to try and sell some Kinects. When Microsoft said they were going to develop Kinect content for the core gamer, I did not anticipate that it would be accomplished by slicing features from the game and walling them off as Kinect-only, rather that developing interesting and compelling content that utilizes the hardware. It's a disturbing precedent.
Click to expand...

Well said! I should have just carried on reading the thread before rushing to post. You said it so much better than I just did.
 
B

bobs...onGaf

Member
Technically the Atlas thing is the coolest thing ever. I am in awe of the guys that built it.

But please dont use it on Halo, use it on some other game. Even though it only shows teammates theres going to be a layer of awareness thats going to go out of the window. It will be a gamechanger being able to see a top down view of where your team is on the map. Something that would require pretty hefty communication will now be done for you. Its even worse if it essentially times weapon spawns.

Not a fan at all. Oddly enough if it was part of another game I would be SO desperate to try it out, with Halo im just worried in terms of what its going to do to the gameplay.




As for custom challenges, the CR payout is calculated by the app itself?
 
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