Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
Dirtbag said:
They even have light sources in Forge! True, it's the inferior non-destructible kind but you can eyes close your eyes after shooting them and imagine!
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Halo Reach Reveal Thread - Matchmaking/Multiplayer Details Revealed
- Thread starter Slightly Live
- Start date
They even have light sources in Forge! True, it's the inferior non-destructible kind but you can eyes close your eyes after shooting them and imagine!
CrazedArabMan
Member
Totally OT, but I just watched District 9 for the first time and WOW!!! Man what the Halo movie could of been. 
godhandiscen
There are millions of whiny 5-year olds on Earth, and I AM THEIR KING.
Even in MP?JaggedSac said:
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
Dirtbag said:
You totally can! Although if you use the default name, the filter will change it to Blam!yard. :lol
Foxy Fox 39
Banned
JaggedSac said:
Where has this been said?
Dirtbag said:
With a raging blizzard?
It was cool seeing different variants of old maps. I recall seeing a snow filled Valhalla, snow filled Coagulation, a grassy, sand covered planes of Containment. A frigid Relic would be awesome, I think. Leave some parts grassy, such as around the hilly areas and slopes, but the rest snow. Have the water be a darker blue with mist coming off it.Dirtbag said:
That ties to the weather in sorts. They mentioned different variations from campaign/MP. Maybe we'll see darker lit maps in MP.
It got tirelessly boring as well. They would need to heavily spice things up for it to be entertaining. I hope we don't get a separate game mode just for the sake of having another option. Make it fun, make it enjoyable, and set options. I would love a vastly expanded Forge, but who knows if we even get that. Map creations like Foundry and Sandbox were great because it wasn't a simple remove/add weapon here or change spawn there, but allowed users to build. Hoping they just allowed Forge expand upon that and allow for changes to be made for the scenery aspect. Having those said items cast shadows would also be nice.Church RvB said:
Foxy Fox 39 said:
http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/9894/reachm10evironment.jpg
They said they had a new dynamic weather system in one of the early previews.
And no, I doubt they will have weather in MP. They seem to try and stay away from doing things that hinder the player from having an easy time of pin pointing other players in MP.
Firefight did get boring after a certain amount of waves..
One thing that I am hoping for in Reach is a Forge editor that allows us to create firefight maps. To take it another step further, not only could we edit the geometry, but perhaps the waves themselves and the types of skulls that are activated (if any). Once a map is complete we could then post it on our file share and have players browse and rate various maps. Man.... that would be..... awesome!
This would provide an endless supply of varied and interesting battlefields to fight on. In order to gain Cr we should still have to play on Bungie made Firefight maps.
Cmon Lars!
You ken doo it!!
One thing that I am hoping for in Reach is a Forge editor that allows us to create firefight maps. To take it another step further, not only could we edit the geometry, but perhaps the waves themselves and the types of skulls that are activated (if any). Once a map is complete we could then post it on our file share and have players browse and rate various maps. Man.... that would be..... awesome!
This would provide an endless supply of varied and interesting battlefields to fight on. In order to gain Cr we should still have to play on Bungie made Firefight maps.
Cmon Lars!
You ken doo it!!
People are bad at making firefight maps that are what one would call balanced. "YOU THINK WE NEED ANOTHER ROCKET LAUNCHER?" "NAH, WE ALREADY HAVE FOUR. HOW ABOUT YOU PUT SOME MORE SCORPIONS ON THE HILL OVERLOOKING THE ENEMY SPAWNS?" "SOUNDS GOOD. LEADERBOARDS, HERE WE COME!"Leotarius said:Firefight did get boring after a certain amount of waves..
One thing that I am hoping for in Reach is a Forge editor that allows us to create firefight maps. To take it another step further, not only could we edit the geometry, but perhaps the waves themselves and the types of skulls that are activated (if any). Once a map is complete we could then post it on our file share and have players browse and rate various maps. Man.... that would be..... awesome!
This would provide an endless supply of varied and interesting battlefields to fight on. In order to gain Cr we should still have to play on Bungie made Firefight maps.
Cmon Lars!
You ken doo it!!
Subtervotion
Member
I haven't played Firefight enough for it to become boring. But Horde mode in Gears 2 became boring as hell fast. I think Firefight is more chaotic.
CrazedArabMan
Member
Pennybags said:
Yep, it was just all around good.
dslgunstar
Banned
Ugh, just had my worst night of Halo 3 in a long time in Social Slayer.
One of those nights where that last BR headshot just never seemed to land. I went negative as often as I went positive, and in most of the matches I had the most assists by at least 7 (and usually assists doubled kills).
It got me thinking about The Arena and matchmaking though, particularly the bit about Bungie using more than k/d and win/loss to establish true-skill.
Hopefully they factor assists in. One of the reasons I actually like the AR is because its such a great assist weapon. If you see a teammate in a BR duel with an enemy, just shower the enemy with AR fire to shred his shields and serve your buddy a free kill on a silver platter.
One of those nights where that last BR headshot just never seemed to land. I went negative as often as I went positive, and in most of the matches I had the most assists by at least 7 (and usually assists doubled kills).
It got me thinking about The Arena and matchmaking though, particularly the bit about Bungie using more than k/d and win/loss to establish true-skill.
Hopefully they factor assists in. One of the reasons I actually like the AR is because its such a great assist weapon. If you see a teammate in a BR duel with an enemy, just shower the enemy with AR fire to shred his shields and serve your buddy a free kill on a silver platter.
Captain Blood
Member
Firefight lasted longer for me than horde mode, but the biggest problem for me is the length of firefight matches. I think the sweet spot for a match is anywhere from 20-40 minutes, anything longer and I am ready for a change of scenery. I know I could turn on skulls and do all kinds of stuff to up the difficulty, but the challenging skulls just seem to suck out the fun more than anything.Church RvB said:
JaggedSac said:
Backwash 2.0 Confirmed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
please no
Also about the Jet pack not being used by experienced players. It seems like it would only be used by experienced players. It almost sounds really cheap actually, I'll wait until I try it though. I would just play Halo as I normally do and use the jet pack to get up on high ledges fast and in 1 on 1 fights I would just achieve the instant high ground where the player can't even shoot my head. Must be great for escapes too. I guess it all depends on the loadouts given to us by Bungie. Can't wait for the beta!!!!!!!!!
If they had removed the Invisibility, it would be OK. Fog didn't have much to do with it, as far as I knew. I recall a game of Ninja CTF (where the flag carrier becomes invisible the moment he grabs the flag) on Colossus and there was subtle frame-rate hitches in that. It was all about the Invisibility/Xbox/360 issue than Backwash itself.Tashi0106 said:
dslgunstar
Banned
Disagree. I think the layout, visibility and aesthetic of Backwash are what make it one of the worst Halo maps ever.
What are you disagreeing about?dslgunstar said:
Assuming that I said "it would be OK" part, then whatever. I was merely stating the primary issue with Backwash and why it was removed from Matchmaking. I'll still take Backwash any day of the week over Orbital or default Foundry/Sandbox.
The movie was only done with $3m, picture what his Halo movie would look like with the amount of money he was getting before MS pulled the plug.CrazedArabMan said:
Also speaking of his work, I loved District 9, but before he does District 10 he needs to make a movie out of his short film Yellow.
dslgunstar
Banned
Striker said:
Yeah, it was the 'then it would be Ok' part. I just think there were so many things wrong with that map that it was beyond saving. I applaud Bungie for trying to be creative as far as art direction, but the map just did not provide good gameplay.
I would would put it on the same level as Orbital, but far far far worse than default Sandbox/Foundry.
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
Urgh, randoms. >_<*
Anyone up for some MM right now? Fed up with betrayal happy xxBigGamer92xx clones.
Anyone up for some MM right now? Fed up with betrayal happy xxBigGamer92xx clones.
dilatedmuscle
Member
some SSAO would do wonders in Reach....
Anywho... am i the only one who is anxious to see the Glassed map/level? there is so much potential there!
Anywho... am i the only one who is anxious to see the Glassed map/level? there is so much potential there!
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
dilatedmuscle said:
Doubt we'll see it, if it makes it in the game or if it's a level at all, for a good few months at the least.
The small glimpse via the released concept art is very atmospheric and grim - can't wait to see how they translate that into the game.
godhandiscen
There are millions of whiny 5-year olds on Earth, and I AM THEIR KING.
When I think glassed, I think of lava and burning like an inferno. The only next gen game that had a lava/inferno level that I remember of is Gears Of War 2, and its horrible. I am really not in the mood to play in another level like that again. I don't think it would fit in MP. Maybe for the epic conclusion of the SP, sort of like the end of Halo 3 when everything is on fire, that did make sense.dilatedmuscle said:
metareferential
Member
fin said:
There have been a few statements that this time firefight would use matchmaking just like everything else in multiplayer.
Speaking of firefight: it does get boring if you play with the wrong players and in a passive way. I mean, endlessly waiting for the new wave to rush you is frankly annoying other than boring. And having people randomly wandering through the level isn't helping either.
Firefight (not all maps, though) has its ways to be dynamic and a truly enjoyable and lasting experience. I am referring to maps such as Rally Point, for example: great structure with plenty of cover to allow squad movements and all.
On the other hand maps like crater tend to be more challenging, in a bad way, because of the inevitable covenant-conveing bottleneck the maps becomes further along the match.
I have played a lot of Firefight (76 matches, which is a lot of time given the average length, heroic difficulty most of the times, sometimes legendary) and I think that it's a great mode, even with blackeye and drones (the two combined are a real pain in the neck).
When you learn the skull sequence, you learn how to manage all of the encounter's different phases and it feels less random and more focused, progressing.
That said, it is obvious that there are enormous growth possibilities and a lot of ways in which this sandbox element can be expanded and perfectioned. Matchmaking is one of them.
I think that FF would greatly benefit from having spartans instead of odst's; add to that the elites, brutes, the new weaponry, the abilities, the new - and more thoughtful - map design and the new twists that modes like nt1 and invasion could instill, and we have a package that could stand on its own.
I think (and hope) that GhaleonEB was right when speculating that invasion could be sharing the same set of maps with the new firefight.
Matty McDee
Neo Member
Do you really want people to grief?fin said:
I mean, the whole lobby won't all go to the lobby when someone quits. Its drop in drop out (Is what I heard somewhere) that doesn't mean you won't get a bunch of dicks joining your game and dying nine times to drain your pool.
Mizzou Gaming
Member
Dani said:
What the hell does "glassed" mean?
←←←← NOOB
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
Mizzou Gaming said:
The Covenant use their high powered Plasma based energy projector weapons from their capital ships to bombard a planet's surface from orbit or in the upper atmosphere. The Plasma melts the crust, rock and and anything else in the way. It's a tactic used by the Covenant on numerous occasions through out the Covenant-UNSC war.
For Reach, they systematically "glassed" the majority of the planet's surface, flattening mountains, boiling away seas and turning a fertile environment into a hostile, deathly, twisted glass nightmare.
You can see an example of glassing happen during Halo 3 when the Separatists helps the UNSC quarantine the Flood on Earth by glassing Africa.
Try Halopedia for a more in depth description.
Captain Blood said:
Yeah, it was the choice of skulls that made me quit regularly playing Firefight much earlier than I had anticipated to pre-ODST launch. Blackeye and Tilt were the worst. I dreaded continuing to play every time they'd come on, and unfortunately, both were turned on fairly early into the game every time.
If there is a Firefight mode for Reach, hopefully they change up some of the skulls that get turned on as you progress, and the order in which they appear is always randomized.
Monocle
Member
Now seems as good a time as any to get some gripes off my chest.
- The jet pack sounds like total balls now. I like the idea that it's noisy because that seems to be a sensible trade-off for its ambush potential, much like active camo's promising new nuances, radar jamming and speed-based cloak modulation. I'm not so thrilled by the idea that the jet pack is a needle magnet. If the needler and needle rifle are effective counters to flying players, doesn't it follow that every accurate weapon in the game would be an equally if not more potent foil in steady hands? Throw in fall stuns and fall damage and there seems to materialize an airtight argument against confronting ground-based players head-on while airborne. If this is an accurate assessment, I implore Bungie to rebalance the jet pack so it's viable in a juicy wedge of combat scenarios. I will be bitterly disappointed if its role in Reach's sandbox is anywhere close to as limited as the grav lift's in Halo 3.
- For me one of the most attractive things about the Halo series is its alien environments. Even most of the Earth-based locations have a heightened quality, which I find to be a refreshing departure from the realistic military shooter look. With this in mind I viewed the latest screenshots of Reach's beta maps and felt the same uncomfortable twinge that I get from the COD series' graphics. I'm sold on the map layouts, and Reach's gameplay will be great no matter how the backgrounds look, but in most of the screens there are only faint traces of the Halo I love. I understand why Bungie doesn't want to let the cat out of the bag too soon about Covenant- and possibly even Forerunner-based locations
. Nevertheless, the four Beta maps are all I have to go on for now, other than the brief glimpses of the campaign from the first ViDoc (which do look better, I admit, so that's something). I hope the full version of Reach has more than a ghost of the otherworldly atmosphere and distinctive art style that make Halo special.
- I have to say it plainly: I hate the idea of multiplayer maps retrofitted as campaign spaces, or vice versa. In ODST's campaign the Firefight areas stick out like a Grunt's frostbitten peener, breaking my immersion. Playing the same maps in Firefight itself, I can't help but cringe when I think about Bungie's contrived cut and paste job. Renowned though they are for recycling level architecture, Bungie should have been above that. I dread discovering the same cheap craftsmanship in Reach. If it must be done, I can only hope it works as well as Assault on the Control Room/Two Betrayals. The last thought I want to have when I walk into a room on my first campaign playthrough is, "Hey, didn't I play this in the Beta?"
- The jet pack sounds like total balls now. I like the idea that it's noisy because that seems to be a sensible trade-off for its ambush potential, much like active camo's promising new nuances, radar jamming and speed-based cloak modulation. I'm not so thrilled by the idea that the jet pack is a needle magnet. If the needler and needle rifle are effective counters to flying players, doesn't it follow that every accurate weapon in the game would be an equally if not more potent foil in steady hands? Throw in fall stuns and fall damage and there seems to materialize an airtight argument against confronting ground-based players head-on while airborne. If this is an accurate assessment, I implore Bungie to rebalance the jet pack so it's viable in a juicy wedge of combat scenarios. I will be bitterly disappointed if its role in Reach's sandbox is anywhere close to as limited as the grav lift's in Halo 3.
- For me one of the most attractive things about the Halo series is its alien environments. Even most of the Earth-based locations have a heightened quality, which I find to be a refreshing departure from the realistic military shooter look. With this in mind I viewed the latest screenshots of Reach's beta maps and felt the same uncomfortable twinge that I get from the COD series' graphics. I'm sold on the map layouts, and Reach's gameplay will be great no matter how the backgrounds look, but in most of the screens there are only faint traces of the Halo I love. I understand why Bungie doesn't want to let the cat out of the bag too soon about Covenant- and possibly even Forerunner-based locations
GODJESUS PLEASE MAKE IT SO
- I have to say it plainly: I hate the idea of multiplayer maps retrofitted as campaign spaces, or vice versa. In ODST's campaign the Firefight areas stick out like a Grunt's frostbitten peener, breaking my immersion. Playing the same maps in Firefight itself, I can't help but cringe when I think about Bungie's contrived cut and paste job. Renowned though they are for recycling level architecture, Bungie should have been above that. I dread discovering the same cheap craftsmanship in Reach. If it must be done, I can only hope it works as well as Assault on the Control Room/Two Betrayals. The last thought I want to have when I walk into a room on my first campaign playthrough is, "Hey, didn't I play this in the Beta?"
Shake Appeal
Member
Reach is a planet.Dirtbag said:
It has poles as well as boneyards.
Not really sure where this change in perception regarding the jetpack is coming from. Unless it really never crossed people's mind that soaring into the air could leave one without cover than nothing should have changed.
One thing I am confused about though, from this quote:
They already said the needle rifle doesn't have any homing capabilities so is Lars just saying that being without cover leaves one vulnerable to taking a whole bunch of needle rifle rounds and it's cool/memorable when you make them explode in the air? It just brings back the fact that I don't know much about that weapon. I know they covered the needle rifle quite bit but I'm still fuzzy on how it works exactly:
- will it blow on a shielded opponent or only after taking the shields down?
- how do the headshots factor into the weapon's damage and explosion?
You fellas remember?
One thing I am confused about though, from this quote:
They already said the needle rifle doesn't have any homing capabilities so is Lars just saying that being without cover leaves one vulnerable to taking a whole bunch of needle rifle rounds and it's cool/memorable when you make them explode in the air? It just brings back the fact that I don't know much about that weapon. I know they covered the needle rifle quite bit but I'm still fuzzy on how it works exactly:
- will it blow on a shielded opponent or only after taking the shields down?
- how do the headshots factor into the weapon's damage and explosion?
You fellas remember?
Monocle
Member
The needle rifle's rounds have limited homing capabilities, the last I read. IIRC, three needles to an unshielded opponent = supercombination. I'm not sure if that's for headshots, body shots or both, and I don't remember how many rounds it takes to pop fully charged shields.EazyB said:
I think the quote you cited is quite clear: the jet pack makes you as much of a target as a newbie bunny hopping down a narrow corridor. Or something. "Essentially screwed" isn't exactly ambiguous.
Map Preview was interesting, but the maps really don't look anything special. Nothing really jumps out at me, and the only really interesting one to me is Boneyard.
And the way I see it, if multiplayer maps are being worked into the campaign and vice versa, it means we'll be getting more multiplayer maps at the start.
And the way I see it, if multiplayer maps are being worked into the campaign and vice versa, it means we'll be getting more multiplayer maps at the start.
Still we should actually have the beta in our hands before we "implore" Bungie to make design changes. I think we should trust Bungie's balance and insight ahead of a short interview quip.Monocle said:
Black Eye was such a dumb.. DUMB design decision. Not only does it completely change up gameplay, but that fucking red overlay that covers and distorts the screen was extremely distracting. It got to the point where I'd nearly suicide to melee just to get rid of the HUD effect. And turning it on early in the match... and add that to having drones flying around and you have a recipe for suck. It's the one reason why I don't return to fire fight -- because I know I will have to deal with the Black Eye skull.Thermite said:Yeah, it was the choice of skulls that made me quit regularly playing Firefight much earlier than I had anticipated to pre-ODST launch. Blackeye and Tilt were the worst. I dreaded continuing to play every time they'd come on, and unfortunately, both were turned on fairly early into the game every time.
If there is a Firefight mode for Reach, hopefully they change up some of the skulls that get turned on as you progress, and the order in which they appear is always randomized.
electricpirate
Member
Monocle said:
dilatedmuscle
Member
godhandiscen said:
Did you see the concept art? it looked like one of the coolest/most potentialy awesome scenery.
An entire level of glass art
Monocle
Member
Actually, I think I qualified my complaints pretty well. I never claimed to be sure that the jet pack is broken. Like everyone else, I'm going by what the designers said. If we can't trust Bungie's employees to give accurate info, what's the point of reading their interviews?Kenak said:
Bungie's generally brilliant design sense isn't enough to avoid the occasional slip-up. I would like nothing more than to be proved wrong about the jet pack come May 3rd.
I thought I saw it in a Weekly Update. Or maybe I heard it in one of Bungie's podcasts. It's definitely possible that I'm remembering incorrectly.electricpirate said:
Nice. I'm still fairly sure about the supercombination thing, though.
Don't get me wrong, I'm glad the jetpack will have that kind of strategic application. I just hope it turns out to be more than a platforming tool.
The Librarian
Banned
Fess up!OuterWorldVoice said:
EazyB said:
I'm pretty confused on a lot of aspects about the Needle Rifle, as well. The description about it on B.net, under the Ordnance section, says this:
It appears like it will only explode on unshielded opponents. I'm really curious about there being a detonation effect "several" seconds later. Does that mean after you kill someone, their dead body on the ground will still explode? If so, is there any affect to the players around said dead body?
And I have no idea on how headshot damage will factor into everything..
I'm absolutely sure Bungie said the needle rifle has no homing capabilities. It was one of my big concerns about the weapon but they put that aspect to rest long ago. There's still a lot about the weapon that they haven't gone into detail about in either the BWU or podcast but I don't see why they'd be keeping that info from us now so maybe someone we'll get a DMR/magnum-esque breakdown from one of the Bungie guys.Monocle said:
Anyways, I never really saw the jetpack as a combat tool but instead something like sprint. With sprint you can't even shoot so the jetpack is already more combat-capable but I see it primarily as a way of opening up countless additional routes through a map. Imagine being able to throw down a grave lift whenever you wanted to in Halo 3. I'll toss some examples out: jumping right up to the top of default sandbox's bases, jumping over Highground's walls, from ground to laser or seawall on Last Resort, from ground to top base or top base to skybridge on Longshore. I could go on and on but hopefully now you can envision what uses the jetpack will have. Right now, not having touched Reach, I envision myself ignoring it in slayer games unless I need to flank a team that has a certain elevated spot locked down but it could be incredibly useful in objective games. Of course if you're careless with you flight path you can leave yourself open to caught without cover but that can be said about movement anywhere, only in this case you have to keep potential vertical lines of sight in mind.