Has Nintendo lost its mojo?
- Thread starter LakeOf9
- Start date
Midway-AGNC-
Member
I agree with you — those smaller, experimental, "DS-era spirit" projects were a huge part of what made Nintendo special, and I think there is room (and even a real need) for them to return. Low-risk, creative ideas thrive best in small teams, and Nintendo used to excel at exactly that.
But the issue is that Nintendo often carries that same small-team, experimental-first mentality even into their large, flagship productions, and that's where things start to fall apart. There has to be a clear separation of scale and intention. You can make quirky, compact titles with lean teams — absolutely — but you can't expect to build the system-sellers, the generational benchmarks, with the mindset of a mid-2000s handheld studio or a small indie.
That's the core problem: the approach that works beautifully for a weird, creative side project does not work for Mario Kart, Pokémon, Zelda, or whatever is meant to carry the console for years. And when Nintendo tries to apply the same philosophy across the board, the big tentpole games end up feeling undercooked, under-resourced, or stretched too thin for how important they are. So yes — bring back the smaller projects, encourage experimentation, let teams take risks without betting the whole farm. But at the same time, they need to acknowledge that the flagship productions must be treated as such. Big IP requires big production models, and the audience expects those games to reflect the scale of the company behind them.
It's not about abandoning experimentation — it's about knowing where it belongs.
Last edited:
OuterLimits
Member
Hyrule Warriors games are made by Tecmo Koei and usually score in the high 70s/low 80s. Musuo games in general never have super high scores.(i personally love them though)
Kirby games typically don't score 90+ also.
Pokémon games are obviously very popular but usually score in 70s/80s.
So Metroid is the only "disappointment" really but low 80s isn't disaster territory obviously.
If 3D Mario or Zelda games start scoring in the 70s, you would have a better point.
Kirby games typically don't score 90+ also.
Pokémon games are obviously very popular but usually score in 70s/80s.
So Metroid is the only "disappointment" really but low 80s isn't disaster territory obviously.
If 3D Mario or Zelda games start scoring in the 70s, you would have a better point.
Last edited:
Horseganador
Member
Lately it seems they're lowering the bar with so many 7X scores on their latest games. Nobody expected Metroid Prime 4 to struggle to reach an 80; it was a series that consistently scored 90+ and now...
Hero_Select
Member
This is factually wrong. Go play Ranked and try to just mash button and see how that goes. Or against any NPC really and see how much damage you do.
Pokemon Let's Go and Legends Arceus also didn't have Abilities, they didn't even have online components. They're different from the main games on purpose.
Z-A has it's fair share of issues but you are completely misrepresenting the game.
Comandr
Member
I agree that people with grievances tend to bark the loudest... But let me just put this here.
In a vacuum, with no other considerations, both critics and players preferred the previous game, and that stings after such a long wait, and then the new game is next-gen exclusive. Imagine years of hype and excitement, dumping over $500 bucks into a new console and accessories etc, and then one of the only games on launch day is not even as fun as the old ass previous entry. That sucks. And that burn will not be easily forgotten by those people. That's why we've seen waves of buyer's remorse this generation. After all this time, Nintendo chased a gimmick that absolutely did not need to be shoe horned into a kart racer, and people are mad about spending their money on it.
And then you have goofy shit like this with matchmaking that gets under peoples' skin. I mean, imagine just trying to play this game with your friends?
Then you have stuff like locking mega evolutions behind NSW online. Announcing $30 dlc for their $70 game before the game is even out. So to tally it up, if you want all of the pokemon in this game, you're going to spend AT LEAST $120. Some of this shit could be excusable if the games were fucking amazing, but that has not been the response from players.
This is why this thread exists. This is why people have the underlying feeling that Nintendo has lost the plot. No amount of nostalgia is enough to mask the game key cards, the high prices, and poor releases.
Pokopia is fucking $70?
Mownoc
Member
Pokémon hasn't been good in a decade and Metroid went through development hell.
Donkey Kong Bonanza was a critical success as was Mario Kart.
No one should have been expecting a high score for hyrule warriors.
Hypereides
Member
Not sure what your gripe is, hombre. Clearly, its the undisputed monolithic source of gaming truth.
Last edited:
MacReady13
Member
Fuck me drunk. Honestly, I cannot believe some of you people sometimes... It's almost as if Prime 4 reviewed around the 60% average. FFS it's sitting at 81% for a very troubled game production (how well did Vampire The Masquerade Bloodlines 2 go after such a troubled production or Duke Nukem for that matter???)
Most people I see talk about Prime 3 being a shocking game yet it scored 90% average! Pokemon has never really scored well outside of the initial game boy games to be honest and Huyrle Warriors was made by Nintendo? In fact, of all the games mentioned by the OP, were any made exclusively by Nintendo themselves?
Nintendo has lost none of its luster in my eyes. Mario Kart World looks, plays and controls brilliantly with great tracks and an awesome soundtrack. Not too bad for a launch game. FFS Banaza was released not too long ago. How did that go over??? People just need to calm the farm a little and maybe play Metroid Prime 4 before having a fucking meltdown over what other people are saying.
Most people I see talk about Prime 3 being a shocking game yet it scored 90% average! Pokemon has never really scored well outside of the initial game boy games to be honest and Huyrle Warriors was made by Nintendo? In fact, of all the games mentioned by the OP, were any made exclusively by Nintendo themselves?
Nintendo has lost none of its luster in my eyes. Mario Kart World looks, plays and controls brilliantly with great tracks and an awesome soundtrack. Not too bad for a launch game. FFS Banaza was released not too long ago. How did that go over??? People just need to calm the farm a little and maybe play Metroid Prime 4 before having a fucking meltdown over what other people are saying.
lol the scores actually show a slight improvement overall to the past.
The 4 previous versions of these games scored 311 on Metacritic. The current 4 scored 313.
Pokemon Legends Arceus 83. New one 78.
Hyrlue WArriors Calamity 78. New one 79,
Kirby Air Ride 60. New one 78.
MP3 90. New one 78.
The score worshippers need to ask a different question.
The 4 previous versions of these games scored 311 on Metacritic. The current 4 scored 313.
Pokemon Legends Arceus 83. New one 78.
Hyrlue WArriors Calamity 78. New one 79,
Kirby Air Ride 60. New one 78.
MP3 90. New one 78.
The score worshippers need to ask a different question.
Last edited:
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
81 aggregate review average is bad now ?
Last edited:
CentralScrutinizer
Member
All this over a few reviews whining about "but muh isolation" and tanking the meta score?
First time?
First time?
nnytk
Member
Critics have changed too tbh. And indie games aren't making it any easier for Nintendo tbh. I mean that games like Hades, Silksong, Expedition 33 and Balatro, compete with premium Nintendo games in a very competitive and weird attention economy.
In 2025 Nintendo needs Pokémon to push the envelope. Graphically and gameplay-wise. Nintendo needs more experimental hits like Splatoon and Bayonetta 2. They needs AA type games that lose with identity, soul and polish.
Donkey Kong Bananza brings that, sorta. Air Riders too, Metroid eh not really, and Hyrule Warriors is too conservative.
I love Nintendo and my Switch 2 but I do agree here, the system lacks some unique Nintendo first party slam dunk goodness and there's too many incredible alternatives these days.
Last edited:
Crayon
Member
I think when twilight princess came out, and the whole world was swooning over 'nintendo magic', and I didn't think it was all that, things changed.
The games are quality but I'm just over it. You'd have to rufie me to play a new Mario kart game. Bought mk8 dx, which was getting glowing praise, and it bored me to tears.
So I'm highly skeptical when everyone is raving about tropical freeze or Mario maker etc.
That's just me, though. Look at the sales and that many people can't be wrong.
Gotta say botw is genius, though. There's some legit magic.
The games are quality but I'm just over it. You'd have to rufie me to play a new Mario kart game. Bought mk8 dx, which was getting glowing praise, and it bored me to tears.
So I'm highly skeptical when everyone is raving about tropical freeze or Mario maker etc.
That's just me, though. Look at the sales and that many people can't be wrong.
Gotta say botw is genius, though. There's some legit magic.
Last edited:
Comandr
Member
You're right. It's worse. Who ever slowly jogs to and picks the red power up will probably one shot anyone else, assuming they didn't use their mega evolution to dodge the attack. I suppose that is a strategy. That is assuming you haven't been inundated with cheaters that have completely removed their cooldowns.
But for my prime argument, I wasn't talking about online. Playing the game through the story, which is, you know, the primary content, you literally just button mash, because you might as well. There is nothing else to do with your time while you wait while your actual super effective attacks are on CD. Pokemon games have always been easy, but this is just insulting. Even if its piss easy, the game should at least be satisfying to choose the correct attack against a given enemy. You'd at the very least have to manage how much PP you have. Now it just like... doesn't even matter. Being able to use items freely every ten seconds.. If you fail a rogue battle, you can just restart the fight with your current progress? Bruh. You literally cannot lose. You don't even have to attack since there's always a partner with you. There's a video of a guy floating around beating the entire end game tournament by pressing a single button over and over. That sucks.
In Arceus, even without abilities, you could at least choose strong or fast attacks, you still had to manage resources, turn orders, etc. There was still a lot of critical decision making that went into playing the game. Sure, maybe those decisions were pedestrian to a megamind like yourself, but they existed.
BlueManifest
Member
Not 100% starting to feel like it though, when team cherry a small indie team of 3 people makes a better Metroid than Nintendo and for 1/4 price something seems wrong
MacReady13
Member
Console's been out for about 6 months. It has more exclusives in 6 months than most consoles have in a year (or longer)! The fact it even has any exclusives seems rare in this day and age TBH. I'd also say they are catering to a wide demographic with their Switch 2 line up and sales haven't slowed down at all. Graphically they don't need to do anything (although many reviews I saw said Prime 4 was the most beautifully Nintendo game to date) so long as the gameplay is there and it is. In spades. But given enough time the big Nintendo heavy hitters will come like Mario and Zelda. I'm content with my Switch 2 and I'm also happy indie games are making a massive play for our wallets now. My Steam Deck and Switch 2 are getting great usage from me lately!
ShaiKhulud1989
Gold Member
This forum has an odd habit of gaslighting the most successful market leaders for some reason.
Mozza
Member
Again in the case of Z-A..... 3260 prople out of a potential 12-15 million people that will buy the game, and this is just as incoclusive as 4219 out of 70 million that bought the game. Why we are even taking any of these niche core hobby gamers opinions good or bad is beyond me.I agree that people with grievances tend to bark the loudest... But let me just put this here.
In a vacuum, with no other considerations, both critics and players preferred the previous game, and that stings after such a long wait, and then the new game is next-gen exclusive. Imagine years of hype and excitement, dumping over $500 bucks into a new console and accessories etc, and then one of the only games on launch day is not even as fun as the old ass previous entry. That sucks. And that burn will not be easily forgotten by those people. That's why we've seen waves of buyer's remorse this generation. After all this time, Nintendo chased a gimmick that absolutely did not need to be shoe horned into a kart racer, and people are mad about spending their money on it.
And then you have goofy shit like this with matchmaking that gets under peoples' skin. I mean, imagine just trying to play this game with your friends?
Then you have stuff like locking mega evolutions behind NSW online. Announcing $30 dlc for their $70 game before the game is even out. So to tally it up, if you want all of the pokemon in this game, you're going to spend AT LEAST $120. Some of this shit could be excusable if the games were fucking amazing, but that has not been the response from players.
This is why this thread exists. This is why people have the underlying feeling that Nintendo has lost the plot. No amount of nostalgia is enough to mask the game key cards, the high prices, and poor releases.
Pokopia is fucking $70?
S0ULZB0URNE
Member
Mayar
Member
This is Neogaf, how could you write something like that here? There is only adequate and truthful criticism here.
Comandr
Member
So what you're saying is, Nintendo should allow verified purchasers to leave reviews of the game on the store page? Even just a thumb up or down. Wouldn't that be fascinating.
I mean, if they produce the best games that everyone loves, what's the harm? Limit the reviews to players with at least maybe two hours of game time so we know they're at least somewhat legit. Surely these millions of people would only largely have good things to say. After all, its just the loud, cynical few that don't like the games for some reason. And if the reviews for a given game are positive or negative enough, they have the chance to continue doing that or correct with the next game. Isn't that a good thing?
Let us leave reviews, Nintendo.
Mozza
Member
No, I never suggested that at all. I simply stated there are simply not enough reviews based on what these games actually have sold to make a judgement of overall customer satisfaction either way. The user review scores are pointless.
Last edited:
simpatico
Gold Member
Anytime a discussion on MetaCritic comes up, I like for everyone to imagine what the class picture of all these reviewers would looks like. Take just a minute to let yourself imagine it. Then, ask yourself how much weight should be given to that collective opinion. Do they strike you as a rigorous group who goes to great lengths to standardize this testing and do their best to generate objective conclusions about these games? Or, would many of them bomb a product because they reviewed it on a day when the tampon in their rectum was especially dry and irritating? Or maybe they didn't like how one of the characters was written. These reviews have always been tenuous at best, but recently they've become an actual drain on the industry. Mostly because companies are using this bad data to make decision on what is made and how much should be invested etc.
Last edited:
lughnasadh123
Member
IMO a high 70s/low 80s game can still be really good. Nintendo good though? I'm not sure how anyone isn't a little shocked by how low those scores are. Sure, Nintendo will be fine long term and all, but seeing shit like that is that same feeling of seeing your dad cry for the first time. *shiver*
ShadyAcshuns
Member
Why yes, because we all know meta critic determines quality.
Unfortunately its by design. The masses eat up slop, they gobble it up without a thought since it means nothing to them. Just something to be consumed.
Last edited:
Hawk The Slayer
Member
Yes cause the N64 was the last great console from them with the two best Zeldas and Mario Party 3.
Twilight Princess was good but wasn't as good.
They had the chance to go back to the golden age if they were to make a full Zelda game with the Zelda Wii U tech demo but that didn't happen.
However there's a chance the Switch 2 could bring the glory back depending on what else is coming in the next few years. A big Zelda game back to the art style of OoT/MM or the Wii U tech demo and 2 more Metroid Prime games could shake things up and would get me to buy the console again since the last Nintendo console I personally bought was the Gamecube.
Twilight Princess was good but wasn't as good.
They had the chance to go back to the golden age if they were to make a full Zelda game with the Zelda Wii U tech demo but that didn't happen.
However there's a chance the Switch 2 could bring the glory back depending on what else is coming in the next few years. A big Zelda game back to the art style of OoT/MM or the Wii U tech demo and 2 more Metroid Prime games could shake things up and would get me to buy the console again since the last Nintendo console I personally bought was the Gamecube.
Sorcerer
Member
Coasting a bit, coming off The Switch. They are in the "we can do no wrong" sphere at the moment.
Tying the major franchises to movies. Don't think we will ever see a Zelda or Mario again released without a movie tie-in. If DK and Metroid were as successful it would be the same case.
Probably spending a lot of time being utterly paranoid, trying to control every little thing they can, and if they can't, get a patent or go to court and sue.
If Nintendo do not like fans using third-party hardware, they will make sure to brick it. LOL!!!
Tying the major franchises to movies. Don't think we will ever see a Zelda or Mario again released without a movie tie-in. If DK and Metroid were as successful it would be the same case.
Probably spending a lot of time being utterly paranoid, trying to control every little thing they can, and if they can't, get a patent or go to court and sue.
If Nintendo do not like fans using third-party hardware, they will make sure to brick it. LOL!!!
Last edited:
Maybe not directly an answer to OP, but I have noticed:
On the one hand, Switch 2 is projected to sell 19 million units by March 31, in less than 10 months. An insane number. And the games I play have a high quality (at least I find that they have when I play them) whether it is new games such as Donkey Kong Bananza or updated games such as Xenoblade Chronicles X. Re-visiting games such as Animal Crossing, which also soon will get more updates, well, I cannot really complain about that either.
On the other hand, there is a small group of people on the internet (I see a bunch on Youtube, as well as certain threads on forums such as neogaf) which make clickbait titles. Some may be fanboys of other systems. Others are just grifters trying to get to clicks and thereby some money (youtube). Of course, there are also some old Nintendo gamers who complain, which is fair enough.
If it works for them regarding getting some clicks on e.g. youtube, then good for them. But in the end, it is just more internet noise. I just play my games in the end.
On the one hand, Switch 2 is projected to sell 19 million units by March 31, in less than 10 months. An insane number. And the games I play have a high quality (at least I find that they have when I play them) whether it is new games such as Donkey Kong Bananza or updated games such as Xenoblade Chronicles X. Re-visiting games such as Animal Crossing, which also soon will get more updates, well, I cannot really complain about that either.
On the other hand, there is a small group of people on the internet (I see a bunch on Youtube, as well as certain threads on forums such as neogaf) which make clickbait titles. Some may be fanboys of other systems. Others are just grifters trying to get to clicks and thereby some money (youtube). Of course, there are also some old Nintendo gamers who complain, which is fair enough.
If it works for them regarding getting some clicks on e.g. youtube, then good for them. But in the end, it is just more internet noise. I just play my games in the end.
Last edited:
ChorizoPicozo
Member
Rat Rage
Member
They're slowly loosing their "Nintendo Magic". Nintendo was always stubborn, doing their own thing regardless of industry trends, which made them great. Now, that some of their previous franchises have made a ton of money and they now have a "regular dude" as a CEO, they're slowly falling into the trap of trying to appeal to everyone. Mario Kart suddenly needs mechanics like open world and battle royale, dumbing down the whole Mario Kart experience.
Black_Mamba
Member
As a longtime fan, without a doubt, yes, there's not a lot of mojo left. The games have become increasingly casual and shallow, closer to mobile-game design than the sophisticated Nintendo titles from 15 years ago. Besides that, there hasn't been a single successful new IP launched in the past decade (since Splatoon), so there's clear creative decline.
That said, from a commercial perspective, the strategy makes sense and has been successful, despite the low Metacritic averages. Nintendo games simply aren't for me anymore.
That said, from a commercial perspective, the strategy makes sense and has been successful, despite the low Metacritic averages. Nintendo games simply aren't for me anymore.
Yeah, I don't get why people are whining about the game being too empty, isn't it?What metroid is about