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Hearthstone |OT3| Preparing for the Ball of Spiders Meta

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mxgt

Banned
Playing control warrior most of the day and Revenge has won me a good 5+ games by itself.

Starting to really love the card.
 

zoukka

Member
My favorite thing about new cards is getting to see top players completely get wrong the potency of cards.

"Man who would ever use Dr Boom over Troggzor! Troggzor is insane!"

TBH nobody gave two shits about Dr. Boom before they spoiled what the bots actually did. Everyone just presumed they would be risky to both players...

gah sorry for the dp
 

Sande

Member
Either I'm horrible at estimating how good a deck is in arena or success is even more reliant on other factors than I thought. The other day I crafted a priest deck that I thought was amazing, "at least 7-8 wins, easy", but it ended up at 1. Today I crafted a mage deck with none of the usual spells that make mage good and way too many 1 and 2 drops. And... it just kept winning. I zerg rushed opponent after opponent. Even a druid that kept dropping ancients of war couldn't stop the aggression. I only struggled against people who drew early board clear.

I guess a lot of it had to do with the fact that I got echo of medivh and a sea giant that obviously worked pretty well with the rest of my deck. I also had some nice combos like mana wyrm and mirror image (which I actually got to do once on turn one), and goblin blastmage with a lot of mechs. Still, I wouldn't have imagined that I'll get to 9 wins with such a low curve. I guess I should give aggressive decks a little more credit in arena.
 

zoukka

Member
Either I'm horrible at estimating how good a deck is in arena or success is even more reliant on other factors than I thought. The other day I crafted a priest deck that I thought was amazing, "at least 7-8 wins, easy", but it ended up at 1. Today I crafted a mage deck with none of the usual spells that make mage good and way too many 1 and 2 drops. And... it just kept winning. I zerg rushed opponent after opponent. Even a druid that kept dropping ancients of war couldn't stop the aggression. I only struggled against people who drew early board clear.

I guess a lot of it had to do with the fact that I got echo of medivh and a sea giant that obviously worked pretty well with the rest of my deck. I also had some nice combos like mana wyrm and mirror image (which I actually got to do once on turn one), and goblin blastmage with a lot of mechs. Still, I wouldn't have imagined that I'll get to 9 wins with such a low curve. I guess I should give aggressive decks a little more credit in arena.

You need a lot of 1-2 drops in arena or some very reliable control cards to stabilize.
 
Even without the rape joke he sounded like a smurf who was high and not in a fun way. Get recktful.

I left before the rape joke anyway. When the casting is that bad, I am just not interested in continuing to watch. I am glad I read that he was replaced because it really is an interesting format and otherwise superb show.
 

JesseZao

Member
It's a Hearthstone tournament that purposefully brought Forsen in. Expecting the utmost in professionalism seems like a stretch. The thing to be irritated by was his bad casting, not his remarks.

Except Forsen is smart enough to leave dank memes to his stream time.
 

iirate

Member
Yeah. It could mirror the wow progression lead up to ICC. This next content would be the Tournament with fighters etc from all races and then the next adventure in the fall/winter would be ICC and introduce the DK.

This is what I suspect/hope for, as well.
 

Natiko

Banned
Except Forsen is smart enough to leave dank memes to his stream time.
I expect it has more to do with him not having a chance to actually do any communication past BMing. Reckful's casting was bad, but being offended by it when they invited Forsen seems weird. It's not like they're different people suddenly. Frodan has made jokes regarding Asian stereotypes during casting before, but there's no outrage there. I think a lot of it is just people hated Reckful's casting and are using these dumb remarks as a way to fuel their outrage. Just call it for what it is, he sucked and doesn't need to be casting anything high stakes.
 

JesseZao

Member
I expect it has more to do with him not having a chance to actually do any communication past BMing. Reckful's casting was bad, but being offended by it when they invited Forsen seems weird. It's not like they're different people suddenly. Frodan has made jokes regarding Asian stereotypes during casting before, but there's no outrage there. I think a lot of it is just people hated Reckful's casting and are using these dumb remarks as a way to fuel their outrage. Just call it for what it is, he sucked and doesn't need to be casting anything high stakes.

Now I'm just confused. I'm not sure I follow your reasoning. What does Forsen have to do with this?

Reckful's rape/asian comments aren't even why he was bad. They're just easier to disseminate.
 

Natiko

Banned
Now I'm just confused. I'm not sure I follow your reasoning. What does Forsen have to do with this?

Reckful's rape/asian comments aren't even why he was bad. They're just easier to disseminate.
Because people got up in arms about Reckful making these "appalling" comments, but it's a tournament featuring Forsen who's entire persona is built on this stuff and his inclusion is solely for the views and attracting those people. My main point is the outrage over Reckful's comments is asinine given the context of everything and that people should be focusing on him just being awful at casting in general.
 

zoukka

Member
Because people got up in arms about Reckful making these "appalling" comments, but it's a tournament featuring Forsen who's entire persona is built on this stuff and his inclusion is solely for the views and attracting those people. My main point is the outrage over Reckful's comments is asinine given the context of everything and that people should be focusing on him just being awful at casting in general.

Forsen and other clowns keep it cool when they are representing tourneys and stuff. Nobody cares what you do in your own stream.
 

Natiko

Banned
Forsen and other clowns keep it cool when they are representing tourneys and stuff. Nobody cares what you do in your own stream.
But what makes that any better? It's not like one is behind closed doors. There's no separation here like there might be in other real world examples. They both take place on Twitch in full view of anyone that chooses to look.
 

JesseZao

Member
But what makes that any better? It's not like one is behind closed doors. There's no separation here like there might be in other real world examples. They both take place on Twitch in full view of anyone that chooses to look.

Except that they are separate. You're not getting anywhere with this axe. Reckful was unprofessional and was removed. There is no further issue to discuss.
 

Natiko

Banned
Except that they are separate. You're not getting anywhere with this axe. Reckful was unprofessional and was removed. There is no further issue to discuss.
Reckful deserved to be removed because he was awful. We're not even really disagreeing here, you yourself said the comments weren't the issue.
 

Sande

Member
You need a lot of 1-2 drops in arena or some very reliable control cards to stabilize.
Well yeah but it was pretty absurd. Like 15/30 cards I got offered nothing but 1-2 drops. The 2 mana slot was easily overcapped on the curve viewer thing. I'm pretty sure it would have been a trainwreck without the giant and echo of medivh. That said, I think I've been picking maybe too few small minions earlier.
 
It's a Hearthstone tournament that purposefully brought Forsen in. Expecting the utmost in professionalism seems like a stretch. The thing to be irritated by was his bad casting, not his remarks.

Personal stream is way different than a high profile event like a 250k tournament. They've got to think about sponsors and viewership numbers. Even just for the sake of esports in general, if you want esports to be taken seriously by other people in the world you want to improve perception not drag it in the mud.
 

Natiko

Banned
Personal stream is way different than a high profile event like a 250k tournament. They've got to think about sponsors and viewership numbers. Even just for the sake of esports in general, if you want esports to be taken seriously by other people in the world you want to improve perception not drag it in the mud.
Then they shouldn't in the same turn invite Forsen under the banner "Bringing the Cancer" and give him ringers for teammates to justify his inclusion. His spot could've gone to plenty of other more qualified players.
 
Sometimes I really wonder why Leeroy was ever nerfed when you still have shit like Malygos Warlock, Patron Warrior and Freeze Mage that are just as bad if not worse than Leeroy ever was.

Blizzard's just never consistent in what they do.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
Malylock is a new deck, it's a bit too early to talk about nerfs. Miracle dominated for a few months before it was touched, and it was the double whammy of Miracle and Handlock playing the Leeroy finisher that pushed them over the edge.

Freeze is freeze. It comes in and out of fashion depending on what cards are available and what the meta is like.

They're probably looking closely at Patron but, again, it's a relatively young deck, high skill floor, and not that popular because it's much less braindead than Miracle Rogue was. The mulligans alone are enough to drive people crazy, with each matchup requiring a slightly different mulligan.
 

JesseZao

Member
Then they shouldn't in the same turn invite Forsen under the banner "Bringing the Cancer" and give him ringers for teammates to justify his inclusion. His spot could've gone to plenty of other more qualified players.

What did Forsen ever do to you? :lol
 

Natiko

Banned
What did Forsen ever do to you? :lol
Nothing, he's far more entertaining than Reckful at the very least. I'm just annoyed by the double standard. It's not directed at anyone here either, just the amount of outrage in general seemed unnecessary. Reckful sucked, good on them for getting rid of him. All the outrage was unjustified though.
 
I feel like Leeroy was always going to be on the chopping block. With EMP T it would be even worse if he was still a four cost card. Then again, it feels like any combo that uses EMP T as a card isn't considered an OTK by Blizzard's definition.


Thinking about it now, I wonder how much EMP T influences new card design.
 

_DrMario_

Member
Bought 7 packs since I was missing 200 dust to craft Ysera. Got golden Hogger and golden doomsayer. Cha ching.

Crafted Thalnos with the unexpected bonus dust.

Also finally got Harrison from a pack bought with gold today. Feeling lucky.
 
Nothing, he's far more entertaining than Reckful at the very least. I'm just annoyed by the double standard. It's not directed at anyone here either, just the amount of outrage in general seemed unnecessary. Reckful sucked, good on them for getting rid of him. All the outrage was unjustified though.

Im pretty sure Forsen didn't make them make the banner, so I don't really see the comparison.
 
Then they shouldn't in the same turn invite Forsen under the banner "Bringing the Cancer" and give him ringers for teammates to justify his inclusion. His spot could've gone to plenty of other more qualified players.

I see a big difference between rape jokes and using cancer, a word that is only used to describe natural phenomenons (and not necessarily the disease) as opposed to a word that describes a violent despicable act. I do think there is a difference here.

I actually don't mind people using the word cancer to describe something and I think people are a little to gun ho when they are. Do we need to ban people using words of bad diseases to describe something? I think that is a bit overbearing and I'm not entirely sure why people get so upset about that (I understand people die from these diseases, but people die from all sorts of things and jokes are perfectly accepted about all sorts of things but once it comes to cancer people seem to lose their minds). But rape, I could see people getting very upset about that. As the article points out there was a time of people trying to justify rape or downplay what it actually is. I'm sure he didn't mean any harm but it is pretty damn unprofessional to be making rape jokes while you're on that kind of stage.

I don't think this makes it a double standard, because one is clearly worse than the other that it isn't even close. It's like questioning why someone would hire an ex-con who was convicted of burglary but nor an ex-con convicted of aggravated assault. That isn't a double standard.

And he was certainly taken off for several good reasons besides the rape joke, although that was likely just the thing that broke the camel's back. He was turning a top notch show into something really cringe worthy.
 

Natiko

Banned
Im pretty sure Forsen didn't make them make the banner, so I don't really see the comparison.
The source doesn't matter. The point is if you're up in arms about one you should be up in arms about the other. Personally, given the context of both I don't see the point in getting offended. If anything the off kilter race remarks are the one thing that could be seen as bad as it was actually aimed towards people of that ethnicity.
I see a big difference between rape jokes and using cancer, a word that is only used to describe natural phenomenons (and not necessarily the disease) as opposed to a word that describes a violent despicable act. I do think there is a difference here.

I actually don't mind people using the word cancer to describe something and I think people are a little to gun ho when they are. Do we need to ban people using words of bad diseases to describe something? I think that is a bit overbearing and I'm not entirely sure why people get so upset about that (I understand people die from these diseases, but people die from all sorts of things and jokes are perfectly accepted about all sorts of things but once it comes to cancer people seem to lose their minds). But rape, I could see people getting very upset about that. As the article points out there was a time of people trying to justify rape or downplay what it actually is. I'm sure he didn't mean any harm but it is pretty damn unprofessional to be making rape jokes while you're on that kind of stage.

I don't think this makes it a double standard, because one is clearly worse than the other that it isn't even close. It's like questioning why someone would hire an ex-con who was convicted of burglary but nor an ex-con convicted of aggravated assault. That isn't a double standard.

And he was certainly taken off for several good reasons besides the rape joke, although that was likely just the thing that broke the camel's back. He was turning a top notch show into something really cringe worthy.
I'm sure people slowly dying from cancer undergo plenty of mental anguish, why is it fair to downplay that compared to rape? You could of course argue that the context shows they don't mean it in that context. You could also argue the same for Reckful's comment.

Neither is classy, and if one is viewed as offensive they both should be. Personally, I find neither offensive, just dumb. I know that's just an opinion and everyone is entitled to their own. I think everyone can agree it's best he's gone though. I simply think he needed to go due to being an awful caster that put no thought or effort into it. I really didn't intend to cause such strife for saying he mainly needed to be kicked due to sucking.
 

ViviOggi

Member
What the fuck is this supposed to be?

lS4mr9o.png
 

zoukka

Member
I see a big difference between rape jokes and using cancer, a word that is only used to describe natural phenomenons (and not necessarily the disease) as opposed to a word that describes a violent despicable act. I do think there is a difference here.

Nah both are idiotic use of terms that carry heavy baggage. None of the twitch slang is appropriate when removed from the context of the (abysmal) chat.
 

ViviOggi

Member
Have to give Mage a Shredder (but kill it with my weapon the same turn) - he gets Millhouse, I get Pagle

FUCK rng deathrattles what an unbelievably stupid mechanic

Flamewaker Coin Frostbolt every single hit goes into my board for a perfect clear with ping, literally perfect results on every single roll

Fuck Tempo Mage as well
 
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