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Hi-Def Media Lovefest: The war is over and we can all go home.

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J

jjasper

Member
Crayon Shinchan said:
Mr and Mrs Smith is pretty dubious too. :)
Click to expand...

That and From Hell too, but hey what can I say:lol

ManaByte said:
Yea if they are maintaining their current pricing structure...OUCH.
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That's why I said "would buy" $37=no buy (well maybe for Die Hard 1). The most I have paid is $27 at this point for Casino Royale and Kingdom of Heaven, probably won't pay more than that for 1 movie.
 
T

thaivo

Member
Crayon Shinchan said:
Well to be fair, I was expecting the typical retail prices.

If you're going to attack a group people on a broad basis, then you have to at least recognize your circumstances aren't typical for someone that has what you do (i.e. buying 2 wii's making profit off one, then buying with gift cards, etc).

So you're a super thrift. Great; you're overall point doesn't hold steady though - buying a Wii and a HD-DVD player doesn't make you more cost concious then a person that simply buys a PS3. Finding bargains on the stuff does; but then someone after a PS3 would also have similar avenues for finding bargains.
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Not to be contrary for contrary's sake, but why does anyone need a game system & a HDM player together? For many, they will chose one. Therefore the cost of getting a HD player, as compared to a stand a lone BD player is still rather significant to most of the people I know.

Some of the gripes about the PS3 was the inclusion of the BD drive, which drove up prices for gamers, and unnecessarily so. The vast majority of games today run find on one 9.5GB disk, and I'd rather swap discs any day than pay a $200 premium to not get off the couch. :D
 
I

Ignatz Mouse

Banned
thaivo said:
Not to be contrary for contrary's sake, but why does anyone need a game system & a HDM player together? Some of the gripes about the PS3 was the inclusion of the BD drive, which drove up prices for gamers, and unnecessarily so. The vast majority of games today run find on one 9.5GB disk, and I'd rather swap discs any day than pay a $200 premium to not get off the couch. :D
Click to expand...

I certainly didn't need the BD drive in the PS3-- but without it, I'd probably have a 360. The value proposition was high enough to get me to spend $600. The alternative was $600 and no game system(BD), or $500 and no game system(HD-DVD). Or wait altogether. I'm impatient, the PS3 gaming side justified the extra cost and I bought in.
 
C

Crayon Shinchan

Aquafina Fanboy
thaivo said:
Not to be contrary for contrary's sake, but why does anyone need a game system & a HDM player together? For many, they will chose one. Therefore the cost of getting a HD player, as compared to a stand a lone BD player is still rather significant to most of the people I know.

Some of the gripes about the PS3 was the inclusion of the BD drive, which drove up prices for gamers, and unnecessarily so. The vast majority of games today run find on one 9.5GB disk, and I'd rather swap discs any day than pay a $200 premium to not get off the couch. :D
Click to expand...

Now you're just been a jerk.

BTW, the bolded part is such a common tactic; state that's not what they're doing... when it's *exactly* what they're doing.
 
G

ghostmind

Member
Fox is going to have to offer some additional footage or really special extras if they expect me to rebuy any of those titles. I'm trying to stick with new stuff only for my HD purchases, except for a very short list of must-buys for older movies.
 
T

thaivo

Member
Crayon Shinchan said:
Now you're just been a jerk.

BTW, the bolded part is such a common tactic; state that's not what they're doing... when it's *exactly* what they're doing.
Click to expand...

:lol Yes, what I said was very jerk-like. :lol
 
B

BlueTsunami

there is joy in sucking dick
thaivo said:
Not to be contrary for contrary's sake, but why does anyone need a game system & a HDM player together? For many, they will chose one. Therefore the cost of getting a HD player, as compared to a stand a lone BD player is still rather significant to most of the people I know.

Some of the gripes about the PS3 was the inclusion of the BD drive, which drove up prices for gamers, and unnecessarily so. The vast majority of games today run find on one 9.5GB disk, and I'd rather swap discs any day than pay a $200 premium to not get off the couch. :D
Click to expand...

Wow, your either a joke character or really love starting shit. System Wars in the BD vs. HDDVD thread, good times.
 
D

dankir

Member
jjasper said:
Yeah from what I gathered it was already shipped out before the announcement and some people have managed to get a copy.

And:
foxblu3.jpg

foxblu2.jpg

foxblu1.jpg
Click to expand...


I'm buying all three Die Hards and Cast Away. I was an extra in the day after tomorrow, maybe i'll pick that up too.

And I'm buying this http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/grope/ha...ray-player-verdict-so-far-the-best-282569.php
 
K

kaching

"GAF's biggest wanker"
thaivo said:
Not to be contrary for contrary's sake, but why does anyone need a game system & a HDM player together? For many, they will chose one.
Click to expand...
"Many", as in most, as in the overwhelming majority, aren't choosing anything right now. Many as in most will not be buying anything for a couple more years when there's a completely different price dynamic in place for all of these products, and they'll still be able to use any Costco gift cards they have then like you are now. So, yes, you are being contrary for contrary's sake.

Get back to us when you're not trying to sell a few hundred thousand worth of lifetime sales for BD and HDDVD "standalone" players combined as "many".
 
T

thaivo

Member
kaching said:
"Many", as in most, as in the overwhelming majority, aren't choosing anything right now. Many as in most will not be buying anything for a couple more years when there's a completely different price dynamic in place for all of these products, and they'll still be able to use any Costco gift cards they have then like you are now. So, yes, you are being contrary for contrary's sake.

Get back to us when you're not trying to sell a few hundred thousand worth of lifetime sales for BD and HDDVD "standalone" players combined as "many".
Click to expand...
Many = Majority? :lol

He asked me how much I paid, I answered. Simple as that.
 
T

thaivo

Member
http://www.betanews.com/article/HD_D...ray/1187630265
By Nate Mook, BetaNews
August 20, 2007, 1:17 PM

As I sat in a Washington, D.C. hotel suite earlier this month demoing and discussing the first network-enabled movie titles with the HD DVD group, one remark struck me: HD DVD says it is not at war with Blu-ray and seemingly has little concern over Sony’s format.

...

But the real competition is with standard-definition DVDs and convincing the masses of the merits of hi-def. And that’s the crux of why HD DVD just doesn’t care that Blu-ray has more studio deals or the PS3: none of this matters yet until more people start upgrading.

Unfortunately, you won’t hear either side say that publicly, because it’s important to make consumers feel like they are missing out by not becoming early adopters. The advantages aren’t as clear as they were with first-generation DVDs, and a format war helps garner critical media attention.

....

In fact, the HD DVD group was open to the idea of working jointly with Blu-ray to help convince more consumers to join the high-definition bandwagon, and welcomed the arrival of hybrid HD DVD/Blu-ray players from LG and Samsung.

Each time BetaNews has met with Microsoft’s Kevin Collins, who heads up the company’s Consumer Media Technology Group and has active duties promoting HD DVD (more on Microsoft’s connection to HD DVD later), he is happy to show off -- and demo -- his collection of every single Blu-ray title as well. The same cannot be said about our meetings with the Blu-ray promotional group.

Blu-ray HD DVDA little confidence can explain why: HD DVD believes its format is simply that much better in terms of features (video and audio quality is identical, as both use the same codecs). When placed side-by-side with Blu-ray versions of films, it will be a no-brainer for buyers to choose HD DVD, the group says, enumerating a number of reasons why.

Foremost is compatibility. All new movie titles from Universal and soon Warner will be combination (or twin-format) discs - HD DVD on one side and standard DVD on the other. This means that HD DVD discs will also play on older DVD players, which is crucial for portability. Collins noted that Blu-ray owners will end up buying two discs to watch the movie on their laptop or in the car on a road trip.

Beyond that are features such as picture-in-picture and network capabilities. For example, both the HD DVD and Blu-ray version of “300” include a “blue screen” extra that allows the viewer to see how the complex battle scenes were actually filmed. But only the HD DVD version lets you watch the blue screen version alongside the actual movie, and the comparison is what makes the extra actually interesting to watch.

HD DVD’s networking (Blu-ray is network capable, but it’s not required) opens the door to quite a few possibilities. On 300, one of the first films with such capability, viewers can set bookmarks and upload their favorite scenes to a central location, where other 300 owners can watch them. Ringtone and wallpaper downloads are available as well, which get sent to a cell phone automatically.

However, the network-enabled features are not all gimmicky; HD DVD owners will eventually be able to download new subtitle languages, trailers, and other extended content for films, keeping them fresh well past their sell date. Downloads are kept on the player's built-in storage, another requirement of HD DVD.

The problem, of course, is how you explain those differences to potential buyers. This is where HD DVD has struggled since day one. Sony is nothing short of a marketing powerhouse, while Toshiba and Microsoft -- the two dominate companies behind HD DVD -- don’t have such experience.

This has enabled Sony to secure exclusive movie studio deals (Sony itself has a studio), as well as recent promotional agreements with Blockbuster and Target. But the HD DVD group has surprisingly little concern about the matter, claiming that when the customers are there, both formats will be supported equally.

So when will those Blu-ray-only studios coming running to HD DVD? The answer, if history is any indicator, is the magic $199 price point. DVD didn’t take off until the Chinese manufacturers were able to bring the cost down to that level, and we’ll likely see that happen with HD DVD players this holiday season.

Microsoft’s Collins noted that once HD DVD hits 1 million set top players sold, which could happen before the end of the year, none of the exclusivity will matter, because the studios will go where the money is. Currently, sold players total over 500,000 - largely due to recent price drops and free movie deals.

On Monday, both Paramount Pictures and DreamWorks Animation announced support for HD DVD, citing the lower cost and better features available to customers. This decision apparently stemmed from the studios evaluating both formats for a year, and Collins expects more studios to follow this route.

...
Click to expand...
 
M

MechDX

Member
Foremost is compatibility. All new movie titles from Universal and soon Warner will be combination (or twin-format) discs - HD DVD on one side and standard DVD on the other. This means that HD DVD discs will also play on older DVD players, which is crucial for portability. Collins noted that Blu-ray owners will end up buying two discs to watch the movie on their laptop or in the car on a road trip.
Click to expand...

WTF is up with all these vague press releases?

So are all the HD discs just combo or are the only releasing DVD/HD combos? I know it probably wont happen but if they start just releasing DVD/HD combos for MSRP of a DVD this would just decimate BD.
 
T

thaivo

Member
rc213 said:
That's some high quality FUD...
Click to expand...
Especially the part about BD 300 having blue screen PiP...

MechDX said:
WTF is up with all these vague press releases?

So are all the HD discs just combo or are the only releasing DVD/HD combos? I know it probably wont happen but if they start just releasing DVD/HD combos for MSRP of a DVD this would just decimate BD.
Click to expand...

Not a press release, most likely just that all their HD new releases (non catalog) will be combos. This has already been known for a long time.
 
O

Oni Jazar

Member
MechDX said:
WTF is up with all these vague press releases?

So are all the HD discs just combo or are the only releasing DVD/HD combos? I know it probably wont happen but if they start just releasing DVD/HD combos for MSRP of a DVD this would just decimate BD.
Click to expand...

I would love that (even better if it was all on one side), but no way in hell would any combo be released at DVD MSRP. It's waay too expensive. Studios don't want movies to sell that low anyways that's part of the reason they want a new format.
 
K

kaching

"GAF's biggest wanker"
thaivo said:
Many = Majority? :lol

He asked me how much I paid, I answered. Simple as that.
Click to expand...
The conversation went further afield than what he asked you and that's why I jumped in where I did. You certainly weren't talking about how much you paid when you started talking about "many"

If many doesn't refer to the majority then your comments are even less pertinent.
 
S

StoOgE

First tragedy, then farce.
some fool just bought a used HDDVD add on for 155 dollars from me on ebay :lol

30 bucks more and he could have had KK plus 5 free movies.

Now I can buy my HD-A2, get the 5 free movies, Walmart them and exchange them for 5 movies I want.. and I'll break even. :lol
 
ManaByte

ManaByte

Member
StoOgE said:
some fool just bought a used HDDVD add on for 155 dollars from me on ebay :lol

30 bucks more and he could have had KK plus 5 free movies.

Now I can buy my HD-A2, get the 5 free movies, Walmart them and exchange them for 5 movies I want.. and I'll break even. :lol
Click to expand...

Does your Wal-Mart carry HD? Mine doesn't yet, but then again it just opened.
 
R

Raistlin

Post Count: 9999
thaivo said:
http://www.betanews.com/article/HD_D...ray/1187630265


Foremost is compatibility. All new movie titles from Universal and soon Warner will be combination (or twin-format) discs - HD DVD on one side and standard DVD on the other. This means that HD DVD discs will also play on older DVD players, which is crucial for portability. Collins noted that Blu-ray owners will end up buying two discs to watch the movie on their laptop or in the car on a road trip.
Click to expand...


And since quad layer disks do not exist ... that means either the HD DVD, the DVD, or both versions are gimped.

Yeah!!!



Fuck combo disks ... fuck 'em in that ass. Get DRM working so we can burn are own DVD from a non-gimped HD 'master', and then we can talk.
 
S

StoOgE

First tragedy, then farce.
ManaByte said:
Does your Wal-Mart carry HD? Mine doesn't yet, but then again it just opened.
Click to expand...

Yeah, at least one of them does, and their return policy = me getting what I want.

Plus, you get a gift card when you return products, so you can hit up walmart.com too.
 
R

Raistlin

Post Count: 9999
ManaByte said:
Paramount specifically mentioned that feature as one of HD-DVD's strengths.
Click to expand...

Yes ... one that we have seen no examples of.



Its just PR BS at this point. BDJ also supports it in the spec, though neither have finished the implementation to my knowledge ... and no one has stated plans on titles using it.

Crap, the actual details of how it will work for either HDi or BDJ have yet to be discussed.




If you actually read the quote, it was simply a thinly veiled ‘dis on the fact not all BD players have Ethernet (though it is mandatory on all upcoming units). They are simply implying that uniform connectivity capabilities make such things possible. It’s a strawman.

Managed Copy—the feature that could allow you to legally make a backup copy—requires connectivity for DRM and transactional purposes. HD DVD's uniform connectivity capabilities would also make it easy to deliver updated or ancillary content, such as bonus scenes, additional language tracks, and commentary. While there is plenty of space on an HD DVD for multiple language tracks, Bell talked of the possibility of retroactively adding additional language support long after a disc had shipped.
Click to expand...
 
T

thaivo

Member
StoOgE said:
Yeah, at least one of them does, and their return policy = me getting what I want.

Plus, you get a gift card when you return products, so you can hit up walmart.com too.
Click to expand...

Hope you chose non Universal titles. All Universal titles have cut UPC's, so they can't be returned to the retail channel.
 
L

Laurent

Member
I wonder if Criterion will get onboard with HD eventually (either HD-DVD or Blu-ray) since this war won't end soon. Will it be possible for them to release a movie from Universal in Blu-ray? Wishfull thinking?
 
C

Christoff Yurievich

Member
StoOgE said:
some fool just bought a used HDDVD add on for 155 dollars from me on ebay :lol

30 bucks more and he could have had KK plus 5 free movies.

Now I can buy my HD-A2, get the 5 free movies, Walmart them and exchange them for 5 movies I want.. and I'll break even. :lol
Click to expand...
I was reading on the HiDefDigest forums that a lot of people are getting the movies and the packaging is tore up around the UPC so you can't do that. It was apparent that it wasn't everyone, but that it has been happening. The good news is that if it happens, you can call the redemption center and get new movies sent to you. The bad news is that it will probably take another 5-6 weeks to get the replacements.
 
C

Crayon Shinchan

Aquafina Fanboy
the whole paramount flip flopping business has left me pretty depressed on the state of HD media

At one point I considered giving it all up together... but eh.

I like movies. And I love them in HD. I still think that HD media is pretty much the only media that's worth paying for nowadays.

And while I still hope to see the dream of a unified media realised, I'm a pragmatic person first and foremost. Who know's what will happen in the next few months ahead? Warner money hatted? No changes? Universal flips? Anything really...

but I can only wait so long in frustration. As it is; I don't exactly have the ideal setup for enjoying HD media, so it's no big deal yet. But I'm planning on setting up a nice projector based home theatre (replete with heavy curtains and comfortable sofas/recliners). If this format war doesn't look to have progressed heavily in favour of Blu-ray by then... say something like 75%+ media sold to BD then, and neither Universal nor Paramount look to be going neutral, I'll definetly be in the market for a combo player at a reasonable price.

Does format portability really matter that much? Probably not; it will become obvious by then if combo players become prevalent such that all future players will more likely than not have it. Even if it's not that prevalent, you'd only want to really enjoy the media in a nice HT setup anyway... which isn't exactly portable!

Besides... in another 15-20 years, we'll be at it all over again, with the new 3D formats.
 
T

TheJesusFactor

Member
I don't know about your guys, but it looks like HD-DVD player will retail around $200 during the Holiday shopping season. Maybe even less with discounts and sales. This is big news, because the HD-DVD player is priced closely to quality upconverting DVD players. If market right, stardard DVD owners will want these upconverting players.
 
D

DarkJediKnight

Member
TheJesusFactor said:
I don't know about your guys, but it looks like HD-DVD player will retail around $200 during the Holiday shopping season. Maybe even less with discounts and sales. This is big news, because the HD-DVD player is priced closely to quality upconverting DVD players. If market right, stardard DVD owners will want these upconverting players.
Click to expand...

The problem is, HD DVD players are still slow, buggy and less reliable than Upconverting players. I don't know about you guys but I've never had a problem playing a DVD. I've had 3 HD DVDs messed up out of package and 1 Blu-ray.

J6P will simply return the player at the 1st sign of dissatisfaction.
 
B

Barnolde

Banned
TheJesusFactor said:
I don't know about your guys, but it looks like HD-DVD player will retail around $200 during the Holiday shopping season. Maybe even less with discounts and sales. This is big news, because the HD-DVD player is priced closely to quality upconverting DVD players. If market right, stardard DVD owners will want these upconverting players.
Click to expand...

Casuals will buy $30 DVD players over HD DVD players any day of the week. Go to Walmart and just LOOK at the people who go there.
 
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