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[StoOgE]

I smashed my HDDVD player with a hammer under the weight of these waterproof logical arguements. I was so enjoying watching those movies to, but it turns out that enjoyment was just me hating sony

HD-A2 at $200, I see this mentioned alot. I going have to presume then it does satisfactory 1080p to make worth mentioning so much, otherwise would just be stop gap.

or a great solution for the (majority) of existing HDTV owners who dont have a 1080p TV. I wouldnt recommend it for people with a 1080p TV, but then again, people with 1080p TVs can probably afford the 300 bucks for the A30.

 

[Ponn]

or a great solution for the (majority) of existing HDTV owners who dont have a 1080p TV. I wouldnt recommend it for people with a 1080p TV, but then again, people with 1080p TVs can probably afford the 300 bucks for the A30.

I'm actually eyeing one for a friend of mind for christmas who doesn't have a 1080p TV but wants HD movies. It still falls in the 5 free movies deal right?

 

[VanMardigan]

Lastly and this goes out to mana, van, thaivo, stooge lets just turn in our jackets and end this format war "right away" for the good of blah... blah... blah...

No dice. And hyperion blaming Sony haters for HD DVD being alive has to rank amongst the most inane comments in this thread's existence. And that's quite a feat considering all the crap that's been posted here. Which is fitting, I guess, since he started this "takeover" thread.

I'm actually eyeing one for a friend of mind for christmas who doesn't have a 1080p TV but wants HD movies. It still falls in the 5 free movies deal right?

Yes. I'm actually considering one for my 1080i-only CRT in the bedroon.

 

[StoOgE]

I'm actually eyeing one for a friend of mind for christmas who doesn't have a 1080p TV but wants HD movies. It still falls in the 5 free movies deal right?

yepp, I just bought one for my living room (720p set in there) recently and it qualifies. Its even got a decent little scaler in there.

 

[MCD]

About the cookies, you can disable that i believe (X360 player).

 

[Ponn]

yepp, I just bought one for my living room (720p set in there) recently and it qualifies. Its even got a decent little scaler in there.

Cool. I almost wish I didn't get the HD DVD addon for the 360 and this instead. Oh well. I guess i'm doing my part in keeping the format war going for another year. I already have a bag of christmas gifts with a mix of HD-DVD movies and Blu-ray movies for people:lol Between the HD BOGO sale and the TRU B2G1 sale my christmas shopping is done.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

Won't buying a second player mess up those oh-so-important attach rates?

 

[VanMardigan]

About the cookies, you can disable that i believe (X360 player).

yeah, you can disable the network features on the HD DVD add-on by going into the settings menu.

You can also find the saved info (like bookmarks, favorite scenes, etc.) in the System Blade of the 360, under HD DVD memory.

This definitely isn't an issue with every web-enabled HD DVD (I own 300, Freedom, and rented Heroes), nor does it happen every time with every add-on, but it's still something that should never happen. I'm getting two movies in the mail this week that some people have had issues with (Transformers, Knocked Up), but I know how to take care of the issue, so I'm not worried. I'll let you guys know if I have any issue with the discs.

Won't buying a second player mess up those oh-so-important attach rates?

No, NOTHING we do here in this thread, whether its going format neutral or buying three Blu Ray players, will have ANY impact on the format war. Feel free to do whatever the hell will make you a happy man.

Spoiler

like watching Mystery Men in HD

And yeah, I know you were kidding. Sort of.

 

[dankir]

I can only speak for myself (non- Transformers fan), but the designs for everyone outside Prime and Bumblebee were so same-y that I honestly had a hard time telling the difference between robots. Especially the final action scene. There were like 10 robots, but only 2-3 were unique enough/developed enough for me to know who they were and what side they were on. So no, I wouldnt have that reaction in TF2, as I dont have a clue what robots were even in the first film.

Really cuz I watched my HD DVD copy this week and its even clearer to me than it was before. The battle scenes that were hard to follow in the movie theater aren't too bad this time around. At least to me its easy to tell whose who. But I'm a transformers fan.

Having finally watched The Transformers movie...I don't think the BR camp needs to worry over losing that one. Blargh.

I know a lot of people who are buying the HD DVD drive just for Transformers, the movie is selling extremely well and the HD DVD should be doing well.

 

[MCD]

I heard the problem with Knocked Up is that the cookie is huge, 10mb or something.

i don't see it as an issue myself, i watch my HD movies without signing into my profile most of the time (as in, no internet connection).

 

[djkimothy]

The Rock is coming out January 8th!

http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/s...ck_Ready_to_Roll_on_Blu-ray_This_January/1081

 

[Dot50Cal]

The Rock is coming out January 8th!

http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/s...ck_Ready_to_Roll_on_Blu-ray_This_January/1081

About damn time! Its Disney too, so I expect great PQ and AQ

 

[StoOgE]

I own knocked up but haven't tried it on my HDDVD players yet (watching it this weekend probably).

Transformers took a while (2 minutes?) the first time to set up and log in, and last night had a small update that was released for the film that took about 30 seconds, but other than that its about 5 seconds after I turn it on before the movie starts up. Not bad at all really.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

I was kidding, becuase attach rate is made out to be some huge deal when it isn't, by people who want to distort the truth.

It's only used to somehow counter the fact that BluRay outsells HD-DVD by a significant consistent percentage.

Consider this:

Some PS3 owners buy movies as if they own a dedicated player, some buy an occasional title, some buy none. As long as that first group exists, the PS3 is a factor. Since the PS3 laucnh, BluRay sales took off significantly, either because people bought it as a cheap BluRay player or becuase they bought it as a multiformat machine. It's disingenous (ie, lying) to count the PS3 h/w numbers as the equivilent of dedicated player numbers, but it's also lying to discount them altogther, when they clearly had a huge impact.

Aside:
I wonder how the new $400 model will affect adoption-- that's a very attractive price for an HD movie player *and* a next-gen game system, even if the backwards compatibility is gimped. Could sell in very large numbers comparred to dedicated players even with this year's round of price drops.

 

[Rabid Wolverine]

http://www.smarthouse.com.au/HD/HD_DVD/J8T5Q8M5



How things can change in a matter of months...

http://www.smarthouse.com.au/HD/HD_DVD/C6X4A7H5?page=3

Said Browning" The fact that movie houses like Paramount are behind the HD DVD format along with the like of DreamWorks is key. I believe that more content providers will get behind the format and that the likes of Microsoft who are big supporters of the HD DVD format will bring out an Xbox with a built in HD DVD player. This is a given he said".
"Toshiba is a great Company and next year we look forward to working with them across computing, HD DVD and their LCD TV offerings". He concluded.

 

[jjasper]

My Spiderman pack shipped, first BDs since June I think

 

[Dot50Cal]

From where? Amazon? Are you in the US?

 

[VanMardigan]

So you've basically said nothing new, ignatz, because nobody here is arguing any of your points. I think everybody on the HD DVD side here understands how important the Ps3 is to Blu Ray (its lifeline, really).

If anything, the main arguments from the HD DVD consortium (and that I agree with) are that Ps3 sales cannot sustain a format beyond the niche that they are now and therefore standalone sales are important to true mainstream success of either format. That's why they feel the standalone numbers are the better barometer for determining format strength.

Its obvious the Ps3 was Blu Ray's savior, but moving forward, as the format seeks mainstream adoption, Sony (and their CE partners) will want standalone sales to outpace Ps3 sales. And there is evidence that Blu Ray standalone sales are doing well, so hopefully for them that trend continues.

 

[jjasper]

From where? Amazon? Are you in the US?

DVD pacific, yes I am.

 

[StoOgE]

http://www.smarthouse.com.au/HD/HD_DVD/C6X4A7H5?page=3

Ive long said Toshiba needs to give MS free HDDVD drives to put in the 360. or at least charge MS what they are paying for the current slate of DVD drives, i.e. subsidize the difference.

If they had done that prior to Halo 3s release, this whole war would be turned on its head. I guess MS stands to sell more consoles next year than this, but every missed month is missed oppurtunity.

if this becomes a reality next year (HDDVD in all 360's) it would be absolutely huge. It could also help to explain some things (Paramount).

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

Van, but why would anyone assume that dedicated BluRay players wouldn't become more prevelant on the BluRay side one they become cheaper than the PS3? It's bizarro logic to say that dedicated BluRay sales are not diminished by pople buying the better-value PS3 in some cases. And even given *that*, BluRay dedicated players have outsold dedicated HD-DVD players at various points during the year.

Reference to attach rates and "standalone" sales without the observations I'm making here are attempts at distortion, period.


(For reference, PS3s *are* standalone)

It was Speshal Ed's comments that opened up this discussion-- do you agree that "PS3 means shit"?

 

[VanMardigan]

I think Toshiba already has missed a huge opportunity to boost the format further with MS. The Elite without an HD DVD drive was probably the biggest misstep Toshiba has committed (outside of allowing Warner/Paramount to go neutral in the first place).

I know that MS still has millions of consoles to sell, but I can't help but feel that Toshiba vastly underestimated the impact of gaming consoles to the young HD media market.

Reference to attach rates and "standalone" sales without the observations I'm making here are attempts at distortion, period.

No they're not. The difficulties in culling attach rates when including Ps3 owners is difficult enough that its easier to count just standalones. Also, separating non-Blu Ray Ps3 buyers from avid Blu Ray buying Ps3 owners is just as difficult if not impossible.

It's not like the we (or the HD DVD consortium) has these numbers readily available so that they can make an apples to apples comparison.


It was Speshal Ed's comments that opened up this discussion-- do you agree that "PS3 means shit"?[

Who's Ed? I missed that. And yeah, that statement is crap. But I will say that the Ps3 will become less and less relevant to the format wars as time passes and the formats grow. Unless they stay niche, in which case Ps3 will continue to be the determining factor.

 

[jjasper]

If MS had included a HD DVD drive I would most likely own a 360 now and not a PS3. HD DVD sales would be 2-3x what they are now and this format war would be over.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

If MS had included a HD DVD drive I would most likely own a 360 now and not a PS3. HD DVD sales would be 2-3x what they are now and this format war would be over.

Ditto. And I'd probably have purchased it before the PS3 even launched. I was chomping at the bit for HD media but couldn't (quite) justify the HD-DVD dedicated player price.

As is stands, I kinda wish I had a 360 and may get one still. I knew the PS3 would be lagging it in support but since movies were my prime concern, I got one anyway.

 

[xS1TH L0RDx]

If MS had included a HD DVD drive I would most likely own a 360 now and not a PS3. HD DVD sales would be 2-3x what they are now and this format war would be over.

Agreed 100%

At the very least, Blu-Ray would have less studio exclusives in their camp.

 

[Costanza]

From where? Amazon? Are you in the US?

http://www.dvdpacific.com/item.asp?ID=841647 Says it's preorder but they're shipping anyway.

 

[OokieSpookie]

http://www.smarthouse.com.au/HD/HD_DVD/C6X4A7H5?page=3

:lol
It will never happen, Microsoft has given up on the format and are moving into downloadable media full steam.
The only value in HD for them now is to keep Sony tied up.
With consoles being hammered for being expensive they will not be adding an hd drive.

 

[OokieSpookie]

If MS had included a HD DVD drive I would most likely own a 360 now and not a PS3. HD DVD sales would be 2-3x what they are now and this format war would be over.

But they didn't...
The world is full of what ifs and should have beens.
It is a mistake that Microsoft will never admit to but it is a valid one.

 

[jjasper]

Ditto. And I'd probably have purchased it before the PS3 even launched. I was chomping at the bit for HD media but couldn't (quite) justify the HD-DVD dedicated player price.

I was too, I had a thousand dollar TV and all I could get was OTA because fucking direct tv can't get a damn signal in the middle of a city.

 

[VanMardigan]

:lol
It will never happen, Microsoft has given up on the format and are moving into downloadable media full steam.

What is it with you Blu Ray folks and FUD all of a sudden? Why the need to make patently false statements? If anything, I'd expect the HD DVD folks to make up lies about Sony and Fox and stuff since we're the ones "losing".

Are you serious? They just recently added the 5 free movie deal, they still have HD DVD ads and live "events" centered around the biggest HD DVD hits. They're still releasing firmware updates from the MS HD DVD team for the add-on.

The fact that they have downloadable content does not negate their commitment to HD DVD. I hope you don't make similarly moronic statements when Sony offers up their catalog for download on a similar service.

 

[OokieSpookie]

What is it with you Blu Ray folks and FUD?

Are you serious? They just recently added the 5 free movie deal, they still have HD DVD ads and live "events" centered around the biggest HD DVD hits. They're still releasing firmware updates from the MS HD DVD team for the add-on.

The fact that they have downloadable content does not negate their commitment to HD DVD. I hope you don't make similarly moronic statements when Sony offers up their catalog for download on a similar service.

Microsoft has nothing to do with the five free movie deal just like Sony really has nothing directly to do with the BR deals.
For christ's sake stop taking the shit so personally.

 

[VanMardigan]

Microsoft has nothing to do with the five free movie deal just like Sony really has nothing directly to do with the BR deals.
For christ's sake stop taking the shit so personally.

Microsoft petitioned to get the 5 free movie deal, which was only available on the Toshiba HDA series of players. Why wasn't the add-on included in the first place on the deal otherwise?

STOP.MAKING.STUFF.UP

 

[thaivo]

Lastly and this goes out to mana, van, thaivo, stooge lets just turn in our jackets and end this format war "right away" for the good of blah... blah... blah...

HyperionX's words have made me see the light... he's bitter that HD has Transformers. :lol

 

[CajoleJuice]

if this becomes a reality next year (HDDVD in all 360's) it would be absolutely huge. It could also help to explain some things (Paramount).

I would RROD my 360 so fast... (I bought a replacement plan from Best Buy)

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

Van: Folks plural? The only other thing I see that could be construed as FUD on this page is Speshal's classic attach-rate FUD. I do happen to believe MS is more interested in D/L content, but only one person is asserting that.

 

[Cosmic Bus]

The three Rambo HD-DVDs (Aussie releases) are on sale for $21 US here, here, and here.

 

[chubigans]

Just bought Day After Tomorrow on BD...I dig the extra fluff on the disc, very cool. Though I can't for the life of me figure out how to use those personal scene selection thingy. :lol

 

[VanMardigan]

Van: Folks plural? The only other thing I see that could be construed as FUD on this page is Speshal's classic attach-rate FUD. I do happen to believe MS is more interested in D/L content, but only one person is asserting that.

Who's speshal? Is that your nickname for someone here???

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

Who's speshal? Is that your nickname for someone here???

He's the guy who brought up the PS3/BluRay attach rate as some sort of signifier of failure. Speshal Ed. That's his username.

Post #16038

 

[The Main Event]

Wait. So HD DVD is dying again?

Oh I get it...it's that time of the year again!

*Marks calendar*

:lol

Welcome to NeoHyperbole forums

That was a big deal back in February for a lot of Blu-ray folks.

 

[DarkJediKnight]

If MS had included a HD DVD drive I would most likely own a 360 now and not a PS3. HD DVD sales would be 2-3x what they are now and this format war would be over.

HD DVD was supposed to launch n fall of 2005. If they had their stuff together and the Premium model had a built in drive, this stupid war never would have happened as HD DVD would have a massive lead by now.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

Wait. So HD DVD is dying again?

Oh I get it...it's that time of the year again!

*Marks calendar*



That was a big deal back in February for a lot of Blu-ray folks.

Yup. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. I didn't make a big deal out of it personally, but it made waves here in this thread. *shrugs*

 

[StoOgE]

:lol
It will never happen, Microsoft has given up on the format and are moving into downloadable media full steam.
The only value in HD for them now is to keep Sony tied up.
With consoles being hammered for being expensive they will not be adding an hd drive.

wait.. what? :lol

By next year the cost of the drives may be to the point where MS can absorb them, or it could be the case that Toshiba will help MS absorb those costs. Its obvious MS isnt willing to eat the cost of the drives at this point (or up the price of the 360 to include them)... but that doesnt mean it will never happen.

 

[Xisiqomelir]

Are we getting fanboys from avsforum or some format war site? I can't imagine this amount of concentrated FUD appearing naturally.

The site's even more of a joke, actually :lol

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

Whether or not HD-DVD drives are ever included in the 360, I thought that HD-DVD supports were saying that non-dedicated players didn't matter/count?

 

[StoOgE]

Whether or not HD-DVD drives are ever included in the 360, I thought that HD-DVD supports were saying that non-dedicated players didn't matter/count?

No one ever said that and you are well aware of that. But hey, arguing against a straw man makes you look smarter, so why not.

The reason dedicated players are preferable is

1) People who buy them buy movies.
2) People who buy non dedicated players may or may not buy movies.

Its not a matter of non-dedicated players being a non factor. Its a matter of non-dedicated players being impossible to account for.

Obviously PS3s are being purchased and used either to a) watch BRD as their primary purpose or b) watch them as a secondary purpose. But there are a slew that arent being used as either, so you cant really tell whats what. Thats why you look at hardware and software sales wholistically to determine what the picture looks like. Obviously PS3 counts for something because Toshiba has more dedicated players out there but sells less software.

Attach rates however are completely uselss simply because there is no way to get an accurate one for BRD. 1) Count all PS3s and they will look horribly deflated (what Toshiba does). 2) Dont count them at all and they look horribly inflated.

 

[drohne]

Thats why you look at hardware and software sales wholistically to determine what the picture looks like.

or you could just look at software sales -- they tell you very simply that the bd userbase buys more movies than the hd-dvd userbase. if the difference between standalones and ps3s ever becomes a decisive factor, the software numbers will reflect that. standalone hardware sales are a piece of trivia.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

Stooge: Actually, Shpeshal and Van both said that.

ANyway, I agree with you completely about attach rates and and the value of an included player, not everyone who's pro-HD-DVD does, however.

dhrone: nicely summed up

 

[VanMardigan]

Actually, Shpeshal and Van both said that.

The f***?

I said that the Ps3 didn't matter/count?? What are you on?

 

[HyperionX]

If MS had included a HD DVD drive I would most likely own a 360 now and not a PS3. HD DVD sales would be 2-3x what they are now and this format war would be over.

Agreed. The announcement that MS would not have a HD-DVD player built-in came as some of a surprise. It will probably be seen as a mistake a few years down the line.