plagiarize
Banned
wait a year. both formats aren't going anywhere any time soon.JCBossman said:
Hi-Def Media Lovefest: The war is over and we can all go home.
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Ignatz Mouse
Banned
Van, sorry I must have missed this in the flood.
As far as the losing money thing goes, again, it was the HD-DVD bots taking cues from avsforum who kept going on about how the PS3 was loosing money and players as cheap or cheaper could not be made. A while ago, but sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander. Can't talk up "long term viability" and then herald $99 players the format's savior. This is the hardware equivilent of the b1g1 deal, an attempt to make noise and temporarily skew the numbers. In the case of the B1G1, it was to cover a moment of weakness (the week of Transformers), in this case, it's an attempt to fight off that ever-closing "standalone" gap and the still-dominating PS3.
As far as the losing money thing goes, again, it was the HD-DVD bots taking cues from avsforum who kept going on about how the PS3 was loosing money and players as cheap or cheaper could not be made. A while ago, but sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander. Can't talk up "long term viability" and then herald $99 players the format's savior. This is the hardware equivilent of the b1g1 deal, an attempt to make noise and temporarily skew the numbers. In the case of the B1G1, it was to cover a moment of weakness (the week of Transformers), in this case, it's an attempt to fight off that ever-closing "standalone" gap and the still-dominating PS3.
JCBossman said:
Huh?
You just purchased a non-stand alone add on for your 360, yet you don't want a PS3 which is essentially the same thing as a stand alone player and only has added functionality built in (and isn't marred by being an 'add on').
I don't understand your reasoning here at all. It seems like you're just trying to troll the PS3 by slighting it's "GAME CONSOLE" functionality.
Moreover, you already spent $400 + for your HD-DVD player, so how can you complain about the PS3's price?
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
JCBossman reminds me of that skinny nerdy kid who'd act stupid to get attention of any kind.
AstroLad said:
I think the public's awareness of HD content will grow with the sale of HDTVs in general, and I think in the next few years you will definitely see a huge push for HDTV and HD content in general.
I also don't think 299 is a 'mainstream price', but it's getting there. The 360 did reasonably well with the price of 399 for quite a while, and that's WITHOUT the added functionality of Blu-Ray. I certainly think this Holiday season should bode well for the PS3 and Blu-Ray in general. HD-DVD will also make gains, but the gains relative to the Blu-Ray side will either be negligible or actually regress.
plagiarize
Banned
not that i want to side with JC on any of this, but he didn't spend $400 + for his HD-DVD player. he just happened to own a console that offered a $200 add on.Snah said:
claiming otherwise is just as bad as trolling the PS3's "GAME CONSOLE" functionality.
plagiarize said:
I'm sorry but the price of ADMISSION for an HD-DVD player that he purchased IS $400+ and that's a conservative estimate. The fact that he already owned a 360 is irrelevant.
It's not as though the drive itself handles any bit of the processing. The console is very much an important aspect to the player as a whole, and at retail value he spent $600 for the entire package to play HD-DVDs (though, he says he 'got a good deal').
So, truth be told, I can't help but laugh when he complains of the price for the PS3.
Kung Fu Jedi
Member
I'm beginning to remember why I've mostly avoided this thread.
plagiarize
Banned
see? SEE?Snah said:
this is the kind of two faced logic that consipiracy theorists get mocked for over in the other thread.
how dare he slight the PS3's game playing abilities... BUT HE ABSOLUTELY PAID $600 JUST TO BE ABLE TO PLAY HD-DVDs. what bullshit.
i can't speak for him, but i bought an xbox 360 when it first came out. i had no idea that an HD-DVD add on was ever going to come out. i paid $400 to be able to play games, and then i later paid $200 to be able to play HD-DVDs. if he bought his 360 and the drive at the same time just to play HD-DVDs you'd have a fair point.
but you don't.
he doesn't either, but that doesn't make you any less wrong than him.
There is NO "Standalone" gap between the formats, No one buys a Blu-Ray standalone period.And this "Straw Man" argument that says because EVERY PS3 has a Bu-Ray Player, it means EVERYONE will get around to buying TONS of movie discs is Bullshit.The PS3 has FREE online, you would think it would KILL Live seeing as how you have to PAY for Live, But Live Kicks it's ASS, in fact I read less than 25% of PS3's were EVER online.Don't forget the PS3 ONLY sold a COUPLE million units, a CHEAP HD-DVD player in two or three of the BIGGEST retailers in the USA could sell a few million units in a MONTH
fatty
Member
Ignatz Mouse said:
Maybe that is the case for you but I think many are pro Blu-ray because they decided to buy the PS3 as a game system first. Being a game forum I think it applies to both formats.
I know weve discussed this a long time ago in this thread and you said that DVD player prices have dropped about the same rate as the high definition players but look whats going on here. There is no way DVD players dropped in price like this, I still remember getting a steal when I picked up my Apex for as cheap as I did ($149) way back then.
I dont know what to think about this whole situation. These players are already to the point where they are more popular than their HD Audio format cousins yet neither one is really going to take off. Eh, I dont know who I want to win or what could be the best scenario going forward from this point. Itd be nice to have one format that had media priced about the same as DVD but it isnt going to happen now. Either way, DVD is staying here for a long time.
plagiarize
Banned
i'd skip Evil Dead 2. the picture is really agressively processed... skin tones look waxy and lose some detail compared to the THX branded Anchor Bay DVD of the same film, and there's weird static grain patterns that certainly aren't natural. it's an upgrade... but not much of one, and it certainly could look a lot better than it does, even considering the source material.jjasper said:
Dawn and Day though, come recommended and are probably as good as they're going to get.
plagiarize said:
1. Thanks for introducing an irrelevant tangent. I suggest you discuss that in a separate thread if you want to have your level of scientific understanding challenged.
2. It's not two faced logic: The price of entry for him -- and you -- was $600. Again, the fact that you also happened to own a 360 is irrelevant. Again; he's complaining about the price of a $400 PS3 when he probably paid close to $600 for a similar item of functionality. I also purchased a 360 at launch and did not buy an HD-DVD player because I realized I was getting a PS3 and felt that Blu-Ray was going to win the format war.
I just find his 'qualms' to be completely unfounded. You disagree, and that's fine.
plagiarize
Banned
now you get to be an idiot.JCBossman said:
you didn't just highlight a straw man argument. you just used one.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
Hey Bossman, the weekly sales domination would like to have a word with you re: who's buying software. Maybe that's PS3, and maybe it's not, but a lot more Blu discs are being sold. And given how many here are just upgrading to standalone from 360-add on, I don't think software numbers for HD-DVD are going to catch up anytime soon. 
OokieSpookie
Banned
WULFER said:
Ookie is MIA because Ookie is pretty hung over
(Edit : not to mention that for the last 24 hours this thread has looked exactly like a random gaming forum thread)
plagiarize
Banned
as an owner of an xbox 360, how much did i have to spend to be able to watch HD-DVDs?Snah said:
if i didn't own one, it would be different. but i did. if bought one to be able to watch HD-DVDs, it would be different, but i didn't.
again... i do not agree with him. but him being stupid, doesn't mean you aren't. it's not an either or situation.
laceystorm
Member
wow. they're selling HD-DVD players for a dollar more at Best Buy = $99.
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage...hd-a2&lp=1&type=product&cp=1&id=1158323325814
92% of customers would recommend this product to a friend (44 of 48).
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage...hd-a2&lp=1&type=product&cp=1&id=1158323325814
92% of customers would recommend this product to a friend (44 of 48).
plagiarize said:
Let me rephrase that question: As an owner of a PS3, how much did I have to spend to be able to watch Blu-Ray movies? $0
I don't even see what you're arguing about anymore. He's complaining about price when a PS3 exists for much cheaper (~$200) than what he paid to be able to watch HD-DVDs.
I also can't fathom how any person who enjoys videogames in general -- as evidenced by the fact that he owns a 360 -- would find the 'PS3 GAME CONSOLE functionality' to be a NEGATIVE point. His 'qualms' in general seem to stem from his apparent console bias.
plagiarize
Banned
since you obviously like horror, I'd recommend The Thing too. the HD-DVD is a huge upgrade over the DVD.DustinC said:
OokieSpookie
Banned
jjasper said:
I actually kind of like Evil Dead 2 on BD, though I will confess it had been a while since I pulled out the normal dvd to watch
plagiarize
Banned
that's 100% correct. we're getting somewhere.Snah said:
everyone's price of entry differs. if you own a PS3 cause you wanted the games, your price of entry to Blu-Ray is nothing. if you just own an xbox 360, your price of entry to HD-DVD is less than your price of entry to Blu-Ray. if you own neither your price of entry to Blu-Ray is higher.
so he's not wrong to say that the price of entry of HD-DVD was less than $200 for him, because it was.
just the same as the price of entry for HD movies for someone that owns a PS3 without an HDTV is HIGHER than the price of entry of someone who owns an HDTV and an Xbox 360.
that's why your post trying to correct what he said was stupid.
the mistake you keep making is to say that he spent $600 to play HD-DVDs. he didn't... just as you didn't spend $600 to be able to play Blu-Rays.
plagiarize
Banned
OokieSpookie said:
^ THX DVD
^ Book of the Dead DVD
compare that scene to the blu-ray you have and you'll see they used the book of the dead transfer, and added artificial grain to it for some reason.
the blu-ray is an upgrade over the THX DVD (just not much of one), and there is additional detail in some areas, but in others theres less, and like i said, it just goes to show that this is not the best the film will ever look.
plagiarize said:
There's no use arguing with you about this. I did purchase my PS3 as a blu-ray player and a gameplay mix. There's no quantifiable 'price point' that I could attribute to the blu-ray functionality. The price of entry for me was $500, and felt the price was justified by the combination of functionality that the PS3 provides.
You're also missing the core of my complaint: He's complaining about the price, yet the PS3 was a much less expensive cost than his total combination (by $200). He then goes on to complain about the 'GAME FUNCTIONALITY' as if that's something NEGATIVE about the PS3. It's the combination of these two statements that strikes me as odd, especially when he already owns an Xbox 360.
My cousin and I just watched this a few weeks ago. Being a teenager, this was his first time to see it and he was absolutely blown away. Now he wants to rent more Carpenter flicks, but I've warned him that he's already reached the mountaintop and has nowhere else to go but a rapid plummet into the abyss.plagiarize said:
Well I'll be damned. Karakland is even quicker to the punch than Afflalo to the NBA.jjasper said:
OokieSpookie
Banned
Kolgar said:
I honestly wouldn't be surprised to see it this holiday season.
I think Toshiba kind of forced their hand.
plagiarize
Banned
you won't hear me say this much, but there's no arguing with what i'm saying about price of entry not because i'm stubborn, but because i'm right.Snah said:
Days like these...
Have a Blessed Day
Also hd dvd is stop gap format. Why are you guys even bothering with him?Snah said:
Ignatz that closing stand alone gap just went back up to 60/40 sorry I cant be bothered to find the link its somwhere in here a few pages back.
plagiarize
Banned
in your instance? less than 500 and more than 0.Snah said:
if someone already owns an xbox 360... it's disingenuous to say it will only cost them $179 to buy the add on? obviously not.
price of entry is how much you have to spend to get something. you don't include things you already have in that. that'd be like including the price of your house when working out how much it would cost you to get a fireplace.
JCBossman is an idiot. you don't need to resort to equally crazy things to make that apparent... just let him write his crazy stuff and it'll shine through just as clearly as your stuff shines through.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
Poor plagerize, arguing with two irrational people at once!
Days... I'm talking the long view. One PR blip notwithstanding, Blu as been encroaching (and occasionally catching) HD-DVD all year. The $500 player made a big leap to closing it, and the upcoming $400 model will, too.
Those are 1080p players, btw.
Edit: snah's arguments remind me of the "was there a price drop or not?" for the PS3. Not a good thing to be compared to, btw.
Days... I'm talking the long view. One PR blip notwithstanding, Blu as been encroaching (and occasionally catching) HD-DVD all year. The $500 player made a big leap to closing it, and the upcoming $400 model will, too.
Those are 1080p players, btw.
Edit: snah's arguments remind me of the "was there a price drop or not?" for the PS3. Not a good thing to be compared to, btw.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
I vote plagerize. And I agree with him that Snah is resortign to goofy logic to battle goofy logic, especially since Bossman's original point was a) personal, not general (ie, he already had the 360, and perhaps he prefers the games and the PS3-game ability is of lesser value to him thusly) and b) only trolling in the first place.
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
I don't know... I think it's perfectly fair to include the cost of each and every thing you need to get an HD disc up and running.
In the 360s case, getting HD-DVD up and running certainly does include the cost of the 360 unit... no way around that.
In the 360s case, getting HD-DVD up and running certainly does include the cost of the 360 unit... no way around that.
plagiarize
Banned
yeah. i know you guys often wonder why i bother.Ignatz Mouse said:
i wonder that myself sometimes.
$400 PS3 is obviously going to help Blu-Ray sales. sub $200 player is going to help HD-DVD sales too though.
i think the test is what state HD-DVD is in when the price difference becomes irrelevant, which it obviously isn't at the moment. right now, HD-DVD would be on its way out against an equally priced Blu-Ray player. they need to get at least Warner or one of the Blu-Ray exclusive studios to make a move before that happens in order to keep competing once both are 'affordable'.
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