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"I need a New PC!" 2012 Thread. 22nm+28nm, Tri-Gate, and reading the OP. [Part 1]

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My brother said he fixed his BSOD problem that he was having whenever he played BF3 by replacing his network card with a new one. I have the same network card and I'm having problems with my PC freezing when I play video. How the hell does a network card interfere with the video/GPU? I need a replacement card but I guess it's worth trying.
 

Citizen K

Member
anyone have a good fan speed profile (using msi afterburner) for a asus direct cu gtx 580. wanna overclock that bad boy! never made a fan profile before.
 

Ledsen

Member
You're going to need it, battery life is terrible. Why they built a high performance mouse that uses only one AA is beyond me.

Mine's plugged in 100% of the time.

Why is the G700 that bad? I haven't switched the battery in my Performance MX even once since I got it (2-3 months ago). I thought they were basically the same mouse.
 

1-D_FTW

Member
Why is the G700 that bad? I haven't switched the battery in my Performance MX even once since I got it (2-3 months ago). I thought they were basically the same mouse.

You mean you never charge it and are going on 3 months?

That's pretty impressive if true.

Not really bothered by G700. The performance is fantastic and if that means I need to throw a load of Eneloops into the charger every couple weeks *shrug*.
 

Ledsen

Member
You mean you never charge it and are going on 3 months?

That's pretty impressive if true.

Not really bothered by G700. The performance is fantastic and if that means I need to throw a load of Eneloops into the charger every couple weeks *shrug*.

Actually I'm a big fat liar, it's only been 1.5 months and I did charge the batteries once (not because they ran out but because I was using the battery for something else and thought I might as well charge it). Never put the cord in though. We'll see how long it lasts.
 

Tonza

Member
Would changing my 5870 to a newer graphics card with around the same performance reduce my power consumption noticeably? If so could anyone recommend a model?
 

DeVeAn

Member
Question: I was thinking of getting an external HDD just for games. Now is this wise? I don;t know much about how fast the game will load and such. Whats the best option?
 

Kintaro

Worships the porcelain goddess
Awesome. My current 60 GB SSD runs Windows great and all, but when I attempt to play games, any games off my "Games" HDD, I get BSoD. This never happened before. Anyone have any experience with this? Starting to regret buying some SSDs since I never, ever had an issue before. =/
 

mkenyon

Banned
Hey guys, so I have already decided on my case


http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811352011

It's a Mini tower so I just had two questions for you guys:

1. Which mATX motherboard do you guys recommend? (There isn't much Mini Tower stuff in the OP)

2. Am I limited, because of space constraints, in what graphics card I can purchase. I was planning on getting a 7870, that would be able to fit in this case no problem right?

The case arrives sometime this week (have to check it out before I buy the other parts) so hopefully this stuff will make more sense once I get it. Thanks in advance for any help.

1. Maximus Gene or Gigabyte Sniper M3 if you aren't planning on heavy overclocks or if sound isn't very important to you. The Gene has pretty killer onboard audio.

2. You're not really limited. The front HDD bay is removable and you can put any length of card in there, even a 6990/590.
 

ombz

Member
1. Maximus Gene or Gigabyte Sniper M3 if you aren't planning on heavy overclocks.

2. You're not really limited. The front HDD bay is removable and you can put any length of card in there, even a 6990/590.

Is there a big difference between the Sniper M3 and GA-Z77MX-D3H if you use a single card?
 
So I know this is going to be the kind of post everyone hates but I honestly know so little that it is hard to even start. I've read through the op, browsed that Falcon guide link, and glanced around Tom's Hardware but I think it is too much all at once.

I know I talked to some people who were playing Tera the other day (char: erinyes on dragonfall) who suggested to come to this thread.

Basically here is my history: Most of my life I used Macs, then got my first windows computer in highschool and it was just a value hp computer that I got dirt cheap due to my dad's work discount. For the last 8 years I've used only Laptops and my modifications were limited to sliding open the ram expansion port on the bottom and swapping out the memory stick there for a higher capacity one.

What I would like: I would like to build a desktop that will be suitable for many of the games on the market (for some examples let's say Witcher 2, Tera, possibly Diablo 3, Kingdoms of Amalur, etc) at high settings (not necessarily maxed out depending on how much a GPU that can do that would cost). I figure any computer that can do this is suitable for all my other needs, basic web use, watching HD video, etc.

What I have: Very little knowledge, a logitech g500 mouse, speakers. $2,000 USD in cash max, less would be better but I recognize I'm going to likely be 300-400 over the usual due to needing a monitor, OS, and keyboard.

From what I've seen the Mobo/cpu seems to be the core/start and with ivy bridge coming out soon I might have to wait on those for a few weeks until reviews start coming in but I'm wondering if perhaps I could get started on some of the other components in the meantime?

Thanks in advance for reading my long post and advice.
 

abasm

Member
So I know this is going to be the kind of post everyone hates but I honestly know so little that it is hard to even start. I've read through the op, browsed that Falcon guide link, and glanced around Tom's Hardware but I think it is too much all at once.

I know I talked to some people who were playing Tera the other day (char: erinyes on dragonfall) who suggested to come to this thread.

Basically here is my history: Most of my life I used Macs, then got my first windows computer in highschool and it was just a value hp computer that I got dirt cheap due to my dad's work discount. For the last 8 years I've used only Laptops and my modifications were limited to sliding open the ram expansion port on the bottom and swapping out the memory stick there for a higher capacity one.

What I would like: I would like to build a desktop that will be suitable for many of the games on the market (for some examples let's say Witcher 2, Tera, possibly Diablo 3, Kingdoms of Amalur, etc) at high settings (not necessarily maxed out depending on how much a GPU that can do that would cost). I figure any computer that can do this is suitable for all my other needs, basic web use, watching HD video, etc.

What I have: Very little knowledge, a logitech g500 mouse, speakers. $2,000 USD in cash max, less would be better but I recognize I'm going to likely be 300-400 over the usual due to needing a monitor, OS, and keyboard.

From what I've seen the Mobo/cpu seems to be the core/start and with ivy bridge coming out soon I might have to wait on those for a few weeks until reviews start coming in but I'm wondering if perhaps I could get started on some of the other components in the meantime?

Thanks in advance for reading my long post and advice.

I think the best thing you could do is watch one of the longer "build guide" videos in the OP. They go through the process of building a machine, but they also explain what each part does in fairly simple terms. Once you know what sort of purpose each component serves, you can determine where to best apply your cash.

And, to be honest, for $2000 you could get one hell of a machine--monitor, OS, and keyboard included.
 

zulfate

Member
so i just built my girlfriend a computer but now every once in a while the screen locks up showing a black background with purple squares everywhere. is this maybe a hardware issue or maybe a driver issue

edit: well it just goes straight to blue screen of death now...damn so it is hardware right? man this is the most annoying thing for someone who is learning how to build pcs lol. how the hell do i find the problem.

EDIT 2: ok even in safe mode it will bsod but i see that it says page fault in nonpage header
and once time i quickly said bad pool header.


if anyone cares, after alot of research and patience i found it it was a faulty ram stick.


So I know this is going to be the kind of post everyone hates but I honestly know so little that it is hard to even start. I've read through the op, browsed that Falcon guide link, and glanced around Tom's Hardware but I think it is too much all at once.

I know I talked to some people who were playing Tera the other day (char: erinyes on dragonfall) who suggested to come to this thread.

Basically here is my history: Most of my life I used Macs, then got my first windows computer in highschool and it was just a value hp computer that I got dirt cheap due to my dad's work discount. For the last 8 years I've used only Laptops and my modifications were limited to sliding open the ram expansion port on the bottom and swapping out the memory stick there for a higher capacity one.

What I would like: I would like to build a desktop that will be suitable for many of the games on the market (for some examples let's say Witcher 2, Tera, possibly Diablo 3, Kingdoms of Amalur, etc) at high settings (not necessarily maxed out depending on how much a GPU that can do that would cost). I figure any computer that can do this is suitable for all my other needs, basic web use, watching HD video, etc.

What I have: Very little knowledge, a logitech g500 mouse, speakers. $2,000 USD in cash max, less would be better but I recognize I'm going to likely be 300-400 over the usual due to needing a monitor, OS, and keyboard.

From what I've seen the Mobo/cpu seems to be the core/start and with ivy bridge coming out soon I might have to wait on those for a few weeks until reviews start coming in but I'm wondering if perhaps I could get started on some of the other components in the meantime?

Thanks in advance for reading my long post and advice.

dont stress i did it for the first time thanks to this thread and to everyone here, i recommend to follow the $1000 build and pick out a decent size case so that it will be easy to work with for your first time. i watched the tested 2 hour pc build in the OP and it helped alot during my first time. with atleast a $1000 you are looking at all the latest games with high graphics and 1080p gaming.....do it and you will never look at consoles the same again! love all of you guys hahaha!
 

OddSpoon

Banned
Built a cheap little rig over the weekend with some spare cash.
AMD Radeon HD 6800 Series
AMD Phenom(tm) II X4 955 Processor
3.2 GHz
w7
4gb ram
1tb hdd
250 hdd - c
fan 460w

Pleased with everything. System runs quite.
 

_woLf

Member
How important is it to have Intel Turbo Boost support on a board?

These are the two boards I'm looking at now. I see the two ASUS boards support it, but it doesn't look like the Gigabyte one does. Seems like a good feature to have, so I'm kinda disappointed the Gigabyte doesn't support it.

Forgive me if I'm stupid and missing out on something obvious here. I'm really, really torn between these two. I like how the Gigabyte has a better sound codec.
 

mkenyon

Banned
So I know this is going to be the kind of post everyone hates but I honestly know so little that it is hard to even start. I've read through the op, browsed that Falcon guide link, and glanced around Tom's Hardware but I think it is too much all at once.

I know I talked to some people who were playing Tera the other day (char: erinyes on dragonfall) who suggested to come to this thread.

Basically here is my history: Most of my life I used Macs, then got my first windows computer in highschool and it was just a value hp computer that I got dirt cheap due to my dad's work discount. For the last 8 years I've used only Laptops and my modifications were limited to sliding open the ram expansion port on the bottom and swapping out the memory stick there for a higher capacity one.

What I would like: I would like to build a desktop that will be suitable for many of the games on the market (for some examples let's say Witcher 2, Tera, possibly Diablo 3, Kingdoms of Amalur, etc) at high settings (not necessarily maxed out depending on how much a GPU that can do that would cost). I figure any computer that can do this is suitable for all my other needs, basic web use, watching HD video, etc.

What I have: Very little knowledge, a logitech g500 mouse, speakers. $2,000 USD in cash max, less would be better but I recognize I'm going to likely be 300-400 over the usual due to needing a monitor, OS, and keyboard.

From what I've seen the Mobo/cpu seems to be the core/start and with ivy bridge coming out soon I might have to wait on those for a few weeks until reviews start coming in but I'm wondering if perhaps I could get started on some of the other components in the meantime?

Thanks in advance for reading my long post and advice.
Go for the "excellent" build if you want it entirely for games, and opt for the better graphics card (560ti 448 core, GTX 680, 7970). Wait a week for Ivybridge to launch, might even be out tomorrow. Will be the same price as Sandybridge. I'd imagine Haz has a pending update to the spreadsheet.

If you really want to take advantage of all of that power, I'd suggest springing for a 120hz monitor. The Samsung S23A700D is a good choice if you dont mind a cheap stand/cabinet, otherwise the BenQ XL2420T is king.
 

sk3tch

Member
If you really want to take advantage of all of that power, I'd suggest springing for a 120hz monitor. The Samsung S23A700D is a good choice if you dont mind a cheap stand/cabinet, otherwise the BenQ XL2420T is king.

What's better after the BenQ XL2420T/TX? I am going to have to RMA a 2nd XL2420TX now...dead/stuck pixels. Also - do you ever get that where it looks like the screen is deinterlaced? It is fixed by switching from 120hz to 100hz and back to 120hz again (typically) but it happens on all three of my monitors (2x XL2420T, 1x XL2420TX) and it's maddening! Makes me want to go get 3 of the "last-gen" Acer GD235hz monitors. That guy has been flawless for me and it's still in my upstairs office...

Any other options on the horizon? Sucks...these BenQ's are great but man they have a lot of QC problems. A big pain for the cash they cost. Hopefully they give me a 2nd RMA with no guff.
 

Sethos

Banned
What's the latest in applying thermal paste? I remember the pea sized dot in the middle and then let the heatsink press it out was all the rave, but a few weeks ago I saw some tests on the various application methods, the pea sized tend to leave an oval shape and not get into the corners. Then someone suggested a cross instead as the best method.

It's a small thing but I was just curious, any decent articles on this?
 

Mr Swine

Banned
Looks like the new Intel CPU:s are going to be sold at the end of this week :| I'm sitting here with a new Motherboard and Ram waiting to be opened and now I have to wait another 6 days to purchase a CPU. Really intel? I wonder how many have done the same...
 

Hazaro

relies on auto-aim
How important is it to have Intel Turbo Boost support on a board?

Forgive me if I'm stupid and missing out on something obvious here. I'm really, really torn between these two. I like how the Gigabyte has a better sound codec.
I don't know of any boards that don't support the Intel Turbo boost, probably just left out? It could not support it, but I'd be really surprised.
So I know this is going to be the kind of post everyone hates but I honestly know so little that it is hard to even start. I've read through the op, browsed that Falcon guide link, and glanced around Tom's Hardware but I think it is too much all at once.

I know I talked to some people who were playing Tera the other day (char: erinyes on dragonfall) who suggested to come to this thread.

Basically here is my history: Most of my life I used Macs, then got my first windows computer in highschool and it was just a value hp computer that I got dirt cheap due to my dad's work discount. For the last 8 years I've used only Laptops and my modifications were limited to sliding open the ram expansion port on the bottom and swapping out the memory stick there for a higher capacity one.

What I would like: I would like to build a desktop that will be suitable for many of the games on the market (for some examples let's say Witcher 2, Tera, possibly Diablo 3, Kingdoms of Amalur, etc) at high settings (not necessarily maxed out depending on how much a GPU that can do that would cost). I figure any computer that can do this is suitable for all my other needs, basic web use, watching HD video, etc.

What I have: Very little knowledge, a logitech g500 mouse, speakers. $2,000 USD in cash max, less would be better but I recognize I'm going to likely be 300-400 over the usual due to needing a monitor, OS, and keyboard.

From what I've seen the Mobo/cpu seems to be the core/start and with ivy bridge coming out soon I might have to wait on those for a few weeks until reviews start coming in but I'm wondering if perhaps I could get started on some of the other components in the meantime?

Thanks in advance for reading my long post and advice.
Heeeeeeey. All you are going to need is the updated version of the 1k build in the OP. Ivy Bridge is coming in a week and there should be a new substitute GPU coming, or at least price drops in about the same time frame. I'll be updating as this stuff happens.
What's the latest in applying thermal paste? I remember the pea sized dot in the middle and then let the heatsink press it out was all the rave, but a few weeks ago I saw some tests on the various application methods, the pea sized tend to leave an oval shape and not get into the corners. Then someone suggested a cross instead as the best method.

It's a small thing but I was just curious, any decent articles on this?
Small pea (BB pellet) is fine and gives you a fine application. Paste does not need to cover the whole CPU. Pretty much anything will work fine, even if it does trap air.
Looks like the new Intel CPU:s are going to be sold at the end of this week :| I'm sitting here with a new Motherboard and Ram waiting to be opened and now I have to wait another 6 days to purchase a CPU. Really intel? I wonder how many have done the same...
Mobos were always going to be released in advance. All speculation was for end of April and still looks that way.
 

Sethos

Banned
Small pea (BB pellet) is fine and gives you a fine application. Paste does not need to cover the whole CPU. Pretty much anything will work fine, even if it does trap air.

Yes but exposed area most likely will increase temperatures, even by a little bit. I even recall someone saying the old manual application with a CC was still the best method. I'd just love to read up on it from someone credible.

Then again, it depends on CPU size, which paste used etc.

EDIT: Ohh nice http://www.arcticsilver.com/intel_application_method.html# Vertical line it is.
 

Ledsen

Member
How fast do my CPU fans need to be? I'm running a 2500K@4.5GHz and atm I have a Coolermaster 212 EVO with the stock fans in a Define R3 case. I believe the stock fan goes up to 2000rpm. Thinking about getting a Gentle Typhoon, but I don't know which speed to get. Noise is a huge issue for me, but I don't want to risk the CPU getting too hot during gaming.

Anyone?
 

Hazaro

relies on auto-aim
Whatever % keeps it under 65C load.
Yes but exposed area most likely will increase temperatures, even by a little bit. I even recall someone saying the old manual application with a CC was still the best method. I'd just love to read up on it from someone credible.
I've read a few thermal articles on the subject, basically what you want to avoid are air bubbles from the compound spreading and the easiest way to form those is by not having pressure evenly spread out the TIM. So the blob is the 'best' in that regard. Any other method between two surfaces should trap tiny air pockets.

All you are doing is filling the tiny tiny TINY space between the IHS and the HS.

Just a small amount is all you need. More if it's a thicker paste.

Quick sources I remember:
http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/What-is-the-Best-Way-to-Apply-Thermal-Grease-Part-1/1303/10
http://innovationcooling.com/applicationinstructions.htm
 

Sethos

Banned
Just updated my post, I've heard the vertical line a lot of times now and Arctic seem to also be on that train. Think that's my preferred method.

I see some tests favour the small dot, whilst others seem to paint a different picture. I've even seen tests do some shitty applications of the paste and call it a definitive test.
 

Hazaro

relies on auto-aim
Just updated my post, I've heard the vertical line a lot of times now and Arctic seem to also be on that train. Think that's my preferred method.

I see some tests favour the small dot, whilst others seem to paint a different picture. I've even seen tests do some shitty applications of the paste and call it a definitive test.
Arctic posted the line method because that's how the core 2 CPU was oriented. Whatever gets the paste on the chip is the same thing.

The only difference to the blob is direct heatpipe contact which usually isn't anywhere near a smooth surface so you can make a line per gap on those because you just need paste in there.
 

Sethos

Banned
Yeah, you may be right. Did some more reading with some more recent results and the small pea sized seem to work best. If not for the fact there's less of a chance it'll smear all over the place and get outside the edge of the CPU.
 

n0n44m

Member
What's better after the BenQ XL2420T/TX? I am going to have to RMA a 2nd XL2420TX now...dead/stuck pixels. Also - do you ever get that where it looks like the screen is deinterlaced? It is fixed by switching from 120hz to 100hz and back to 120hz again (typically) but it happens on all three of my monitors (2x XL2420T, 1x XL2420TX) and it's maddening! Makes me want to go get 3 of the "last-gen" Acer GD235hz monitors. That guy has been flawless for me and it's still in my upstairs office...

Any other options on the horizon? Sucks...these BenQ's are great but man they have a lot of QC problems. A big pain for the cash they cost. Hopefully they give me a 2nd RMA with no guff.

I've got no dead/stuck pixels luckily ... the deinterlaced effect, is that when you are in 3D Vision mode (green light on the monitor?) if so I have it, but only in 3D Vision when you're supposed to have the glasses on :p

the monitor did get stuck in 3D mode a couple of times after exiting applications, but that's 90% solved after the latest Nvidia drivers ...

never seen it when I have 3D Vision turned off
 

n0n44m

Member
Well... how do I know that before buying the fan? I don't know which RPM to buy, that's why I asked. Aren't there any guidelines, recommendations, experiences etc?

you have the default fan on it right now? It should be speed adjustable using your mainboard, just test out some speeds and see what RPM is the minimal acceptable with regards to temperatures under load

(when I had aircooling, the fan on the Mugen 2 would be maxed at 1300 RPM IIRC.... so anything above that will probably be overkill and just noisy :p )
 

lexi

Banned
er, Ivy Bridge isn't on the 2011 socket? Or will they have 1155 Ivy Bridge CPU's?

BTW Picked these up on the weekend (crappy photo):
pc.jpg


Really happy with the bang for buck, also super impressed with the 7870.
 

1-D_FTW

Member
Pulling the plug on a new PC. Mainly for gaming and video editing -

CPU - Intel 2550K
Cooler - Corsair H70
Case - Corsair Special Edition White Graphite Series™ 600T
PSU - Corsair TX750
SSD - OCZ 120GB
HDD - Seagate 1TB
GPU - Sapphire Radeon 6870
Blu-Ray Drive - LG Internal Blu-Ray
Mobo - Asus P8Z68
Memory - 16GB Corsair

Thoughts? That GPU is $184. Is that overkill with the rest of the system?

Pretty sure the GPU is underkill and will be the bottleneck (when you actually have one). I'm not saying it's not a good GPU that won't serve your purposes, just that it's the weakest link in the system.

Any reason you're going 2550k over 2500k? The 2550 is just a defective 2500k that's been sold with the IGP disabled.
 

sk3tch

Member
I've got no dead/stuck pixels luckily ... the deinterlaced effect, is that when you are in 3D Vision mode (green light on the monitor?) if so I have it, but only in 3D Vision when you're supposed to have the glasses on :p

the monitor did get stuck in 3D mode a couple of times after exiting applications, but that's 90% solved after the latest Nvidia drivers ...

never seen it when I have 3D Vision turned off

Ha...yeah 3D Vision is off and I've barely used it. It's really annoying. I emailed the dude I've been working over there with. Essentially it looks like it is in 120hz mode but only displaying 60hz of data. But when I do something that makes the screen re-orient itself (i.e. it goes black for a new resolution or application/game/etc. taking over full-screen mode) it will go away. But then sometimes another screen does it. Heh. Maybe it is a problem with the cables or the video cards or something. But they're on tight and re-connecting the cables does not help. Only the 120hz to 100hz and back to 120hz trick (or something similar such as launching a full screen game) works.

I've been using 120hz for PC gaming for about a year now (have an Acer GD235hz too) so I'm no noob. These BenQs are incredible but man so finicky.
 

dskillzhtown

keep your strippers out of my American football
Pretty sure the GPU is underkill and will be the bottleneck (when you actually have one). I'm not saying it's not a good GPU that won't serve your purposes, just that it's the weakest link in the system.

Any reason you're going 2550k over 2500k? The 2550 is just a defective 2500k that's been sold with the IGP disabled.

Thanks for the feedback. I wasn't thinking really when I picked the 2550k over the 2500k. If there is no advantages, I will go with the 2500. I would like to keep the GPU price around 175 for this build. I can always upgrade later, but don't want to get something that is going to be an issue until the upgrade.
 

1-D_FTW

Member
Thanks for the feedback. I wasn't thinking really when I picked the 2550k over the 2500k. If there is no advantages, I will go with the 2500. I would like to keep the GPU price around 175 for this build. I can always upgrade later, but don't want to get something that is going to be an issue until the upgrade.

Yeah. There's nothing wrong with that GPU. Just was pointing out that if you upgrade in the future, it's the thing that will benefit most from an upgrade.
 
I'm currently eBaying some unused gaming stuff with the hopes of getting enough to buy a 120 Hz monitor. I tend to feel "fuzzy-headed" after long periods of time at the computer, which I attribute to the 60 Hz display; am I correct in believing that a doubled refresh rate will alleviate brain-strain?

That may be the issue; I have no idea sorry. Have you googled it to see if you can answer it that way? Have you considered that you might have a sensitivity to electomagnetic fields? Some people claim that these can have an adverse affect on us and there is a whole industry of products that claim to protect and alleviate these adverse effects. Of course there are other people who say that these first people are tin foil hat wearers :). I only mention it as something to consider.

Hope you get it sorted soon.
 

Ledsen

Member
That may be the issue; I have no idea sorry. Have you googled it to see if you can answer it that way? Have you considered that you might have a sensitivity to electomagnetic fields? Some people claim that these can have an adverse affect on us and there is a whole industry of products that claim to protect and alleviate these adverse effects. Of course there are other people who say that these first people are tin foil hat wearers :). I only mention it as something to consider.

Hope you get it sorted soon.

Yeah, no, considering something that by all accounts doesn't exist is probably a bad idea. Considering alternatives that are known and proven first may be a better one.
 

scogoth

Member
Ha...yeah 3D Vision is off and I've barely used it. It's really annoying. I emailed the dude I've been working over there with. Essentially it looks like it is in 120hz mode but only displaying 60hz of data. But when I do something that makes the screen re-orient itself (i.e. it goes black for a new resolution or application/game/etc. taking over full-screen mode) it will go away. But then sometimes another screen does it. Heh. Maybe it is a problem with the cables or the video cards or something. But they're on tight and re-connecting the cables does not help. Only the 120hz to 100hz and back to 120hz trick (or something similar such as launching a full screen game) works.

I've been using 120hz for PC gaming for about a year now (have an Acer GD235hz too) so I'm no noob. These BenQs are incredible but man so finicky.

Well that convinces me. I guess I'm getting two more asus vg236h's. I don't need light boost anyway I hardly use 3D.
 
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