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"I need a New PC!" 2012 Thread. Ivy, SSDs, and reading the OP. [Part 2]

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Z

Zeth

Member
Major revelation for me: There's a Micro Center ~20 min away that I never knew about. Just discovered it when I saw an outlier 3570k deal on PC Part Picker. I'll definitely get at least the CPU there, but now my impatience has me considering doing the whole damn thing brick and mortar style.

They have (in-stock) pretty much the exact build I'm looking at. Total price isn't too far off PC Part Picker, and nearly the same as straight newegg/amazon. Would basically just need to choose a 670 (halp!) They have a bunch of EVGAs (super clocked and FTW), Zotac, PNY, and MSI Power Edition OC. http://www.microcenter.com/search/search_results.aspx?Ntt=Gtx 670

Having a store like this nearby should be extremely helpful, especially when I'm inevitably missing a cable/bracket/etc when I try to put the thing together. As soon as I figure out what to do about the GPU I should be ready to go. Apologies for being super hyped, haven't had a modern gaming rig since 2005 and haven't used a PC in years either.
 
M

maven

Member
PC gaf

My core 2 duo / 8800 setup from 2008 is finally due for an upgrade.

I'm not in any particular rush, and will almost certainly wait for haswell / gtx 7xx, despite only modest performance gain predictions.

I'm not interested in multi-display setups, but definitely want to jump on the 120hz bandwagon. I'm also very interested in the oculus rift. Current speculation would suggest that 60 fps locked, 1080p, stereoscopic 3d with v-sync on will be the target.

Ignoring cost concerns for now, what sort of gpu setup should I be considering to maintain these sorts of settings? Is this realistically something I could manage with a single gpu? I expect this system to last me another 5 years, so I'm happy to pay a bit more now to avoid the upgrade bug 2-3 years down the track.

Advices?
 
T

The Bookerman

Member
Hey PC-GAF, I have a windows 7 problem . I bought a Samsung 840 PRO SSD, which I wanted to use as a primary drive. I already had windows 7 installed on my other Hard drive which I want to keep most of it's content, just ditch windows 7 out of it, How can I get rid of windows 7 on that Drive without formatting it?

Right now my pc sees two versions of Windows 7 and doesn't know which to use. Help me out.
 
M

Mr Swine

Banned
maven said:
PC gaf

My core 2 duo / 8800 setup from 2008 is finally due for an upgrade.

I'm not in any particular rush, and will almost certainly wait for haswell / gtx 7xx, despite only modest performance gain predictions.

I'm not interested in multi-display setups, but definitely want to jump on the 120hz bandwagon. I'm also very interested in the oculus rift. Current speculation would suggest that 60 fps locked, 1080p, stereoscopic 3d with v-sync on will be the target.

Ignoring cost concerns for now, what sort of gpu setup should I be considering to maintain these sorts of settings? Is this realistically something I could manage with a single gpu? I expect this system to last me another 5 years, so I'm happy to pay a bit more now to avoid the upgrade bug 2-3 years down the track.

Advices?
Click to expand...

I would wait for AMD and Nvidia for their new cards that come out in about 6 months (if there aren't any more delays)
 
Z

Zips

Member
Thanks a bunch! You guys are awesome.

I'm leaning towards the box right now, but I'll have to check some other things first. In the event I had to buy an OS - is Windows 7 currently regarded as better than 8? Probably doesn't matter that much for my purposes I guess.

Recommendations for a wireless keyboard/mouse, or wireless keyboard/trackpad (for potential use in the living room)?
 
M

mkenyon

Banned
maven said:
Ignoring cost concerns for now, what sort of gpu setup should I be considering to maintain these sorts of settings? Is this realistically something I could manage with a single gpu? I expect this system to last me another 5 years, so I'm happy to pay a bit more now to avoid the upgrade bug 2-3 years down the track.

Advices?
Click to expand...
Entirely depends on the game in question. Some games will never really be able to get there (you're talking about 120hz basically, as you'll want two frames delivered within that 16.7ms time frame, giving you a frame time of 8.3ms), some games can get there on mid-tier last gen cards.

If you're talking about games that are not out yet, we can't even speculate. Since you are also talking about a future GPU along with Haswell, we have no idea how any of them will perform either.
 
Koroviev

Koroviev

Member
The Bookerman said:
Hey PC-GAF, I have a windows 7 problem . I bought a Samsung 840 PRO SSD, which I wanted to use as a primary drive. I already had windows 7 installed on my other Hard drive which I want to keep most of it's content, just ditch windows 7 out of it, How can I get rid of windows 7 on that Drive without formatting it?

Right now my pc sees two versions of Windows 7 and doesn't know which to use. Help me out.
Click to expand...

You need to specify boot priority in the bios.
 
Z

Zips

Member
Hmmm...looks like I won't be able to use that copy of windows 7. So with all the additional stuff I'd have to buy, it seems like it might be easier just to get an all-in-one PC of some sort since that could include the monitor, basic speakers, the OS, and keyboard/mouse. Would there be a model of that that could do this media centre job? Still would like to use a wireless connection for that if possible, to avoid cables running along the floor and let us have the PC in a different room. They would only be about 10 feet away from each other (or less).

Sorry for all the questions guys.
 
Xdrive05

Xdrive05

Member
My 3570k don't like no 4.6 GHz. Prime stable at 4.5? No problem. But I can't get it to last even one minute at 4.6. Not worth messing with. Touchy little thing.
 
LiquidMetal14

LiquidMetal14

hide your water-based mammals
Shambles said:
Unless You're doing something wacky like tri-quad/SLI you're already past the point of spending money for the sake of spending money. It's time to draw a line in the sand for yourself. :p
Click to expand...

Ok so Gold it is. I am going to be doing a 3930k, 2 card SLI, with OC'ing on all the components so the best PSU I can get for a reasonable price is my goal. Will stick with my current choice in the 850w gold rated then.

Xdrive05 said:
My 3570k don't like no 4.6 GHz. Prime stable at 4.5? No problem. But I can't get it to last even one minute at 4.6. Not worth messing with. Touchy little thing.
Click to expand...

You try upping your max ampage and voltage? I had to do that to feed the CPU more power and then have an offset of about .010 on my 4.8ghz 2500k OC.
 
S

Scalemail Ted

Member
LiquidMetal14 said:
Ok so Gold it is. I am going to be doing a 3930k, 2 card SLI, with OC'ing on all the components so the best PSU I can get for a reasonable price is my goal. Will stick with my current choice in the 850w gold rated then.



You try upping your max ampage and voltage? I had to do that to feed the CPU more power and then have an offset of about .010 on my 4.8ghz 2500k OC.
Click to expand...

Just out of curiosity, what MOBO are you going with?
 
LiquidMetal14

LiquidMetal14

hide your water-based mammals
Scalemail Ted said:
But the 3930k is LGA 2011, isn't it?
Click to expand...

Yes. I'm trying to figure out what you want to know buddy :p

I currently have a 2500k and am upgrading to a 3930k.

The 3930k is my new build and I am almost sparing no expense as I have the luxury of having a buyer for the current PC I have with that very same 2500k clocked at 4.8ghz.
 
S

Scalemail Ted

Member
LiquidMetal14 said:
Yes. I'm trying to figure out what you want to know buddy :p

I currently have a 2500k and am upgrading to a 3930k.

The 3930k is my new build and I am almost sparing no expense as I have the luxury of having a buyer for the current PC I have with that very same 2500k clocked at 4.8ghz.
Click to expand...

I just wanted to know what MOBO you were going with for the 3930k. As I plan to build a similar system soon :p
 
LiquidMetal14

LiquidMetal14

hide your water-based mammals
Scalemail Ted said:
I just wanted to know what MOBO you were going with for the 3930k. As I plan to build a similar system soon :p
Click to expand...

This is the motherboard I'm currently looking at for my 2011 CPU - ASUS Sabertooth X79. There are slightly cheaper options as well.

I was initially debating on a 3820 since it actually doesn't specify but that CPU can actually overclock quite well. It's still a CPU with hyperthreading so you get 4c/8t. Most importantly, that CPU is around 300 as opposed to the 560USD 3930k. If you wanted to get your feet in the 2011 socket door, I would not hesitate on a 3820 but if there money is there, 3930k all the way. 6c/12t is a much better longer and viable solution.
 
S

scogoth

Member
LiquidMetal14 said:
This is the motherboard I'm currently looking at for my 2011 CPU - ASUS Sabertooth X79. There are slightly cheaper options as well.

I was initially debating on a 3820 since it actually doesn't specify but that CPU can actually overclock quite well. It's still a CPU with hyperthreading so you get 4c/8t. Most importantly, that CPU is around 300 as opposed to the 560USD 3930k. If you wanted to get your feet in the 2011 socket door, I would not hesitate on a 3820 but if there money is there, 3930k all the way. 6c/12t is a much better longer and viable solution.
Click to expand...
Plus real men BLCK overclock! None of this sissy multiplier ocing.
 
S

Scalemail Ted

Member
LiquidMetal14 said:
This is the motherboard I'm currently looking at for my 2011 CPU - ASUS Sabertooth X79. There are slightly cheaper options as well.

I was initially debating on a 3820 since it actually doesn't specify but that CPU can actually overclock quite well. It's still a CPU with hyperthreading so you get 4c/8t. Most importantly, that CPU is around 300 as opposed to the 560USD 3930k. If you wanted to get your feet in the 2011 socket door, I would not hesitate on a 3820 but if there money is there, 3930k all the way. 6c/12t is a much better longer and viable solution.
Click to expand...

Yeah between the sabertooth and rampage IV extreme... Must resist temptation to upsell myself when I won't use those 5 pci-e
 
LiquidMetal14

LiquidMetal14

hide your water-based mammals
Scalemail Ted said:
Yeah between the sabertooth and rampage IV extreme... Must resist temptation to upsell myself when I won't use those 5 pci-e
Click to expand...

More important for me is getting proper and full bandwidth 2 way SLI/XF support with SB-E. Sandy Bridge-E supports 40 PCIe lanes so that's a big plus.

Even a 3820 is worth investing in. Keep in mind, the 3820 is affordable and will get you into the 2011 socket "waters". It doesn't have a completely unlocked MP but you can very easily cap it at it's max MP of 43 for a 4.3ghz OC. A very respectable OC considering most with good air or moderate water solutions may go with 4.5-4.8ghz on an unlocked 3930k/3960x. Higher on enthusiast level water/nitrogen cooling.
 
A

Acosta

Member
Thinking on going with a i7 3770k and a Gtx 680 in a Prodigy, without OC but without extra cooling, do you think it will be safe?
 
T

Ty4on

Member
LiquidMetal14 said:
More important for me is getting proper and full bandwidth 2 way SLI/XF support with SB-E. Sandy Bridge-E supports 40 PCIe lanes so that's a big plus.

Even a 3820 is worth investing in. Keep in mind, the 3820 is affordable and will get you into the 2011 socket "waters". It doesn't have a completely unlocked MP but you can very easily cap it at it's max MP of 43 for a 4.3ghz OC. A very respectable OC considering most with good air or moderate water solutions may go with 4.5-4.8ghz on an unlocked 3930k/3960x. Higher on enthusiast level water/nitrogen cooling.
Click to expand...

Remember that you aren't limited to only overclocking with the multiplier on 2011, lot's of people reaching up to 5Ghz with it and probably more with better cooling and a good heart.
MysticX said:
is this GafProved?

650
http://www.pixmania.com/dk/dk/12821107/art/gigabyte/geforce-gtx-650-oc-2-gb-g.html

cheapest 2GB one

otherwise: 7850
http://www.pixmania.com/dk/dk/11984340/art/amd/radeon-hd-7850-2-gb-gddr5.html
Click to expand...

Not at all the 650, even the more powerful 650ti is still far weaker than the 7850. Below the 7850 and 660 GPUs are actually pretty bad value.
If that is what I ordered then you'll get a random 7850 (I got a VTX, saw someone got a MSI, but it was labeled as OEM). If you care about noise you should go for the Sapphire or HIS card, the HIS card did well in reviews and the Sapphire should be cool and quiet as well.
 
B

beje

Banned
Ty4on said:
Remember that you aren't limited to only overclocking with the multiplier on 2011, lot's of people reaching up to 5Ghz with it and probably more with better cooling and a good heart.


Not at all the 650, even the more powerful 650ti is still far weaker than the 7850. Below the 7850 and 660 GPUs are actually pretty bad value.
If that is what I ordered then you'll get a random 7850 (I got a VTX, saw someone got a MSI, but it was labeled as OEM). If you care about noise you should go for the Sapphire or HIS card, the HIS card did well in reviews and the Sapphire should be cool and quiet as well.
Click to expand...

My vote for the Sapphire 7850. It's actually THAT quiet, even under full load you barely notice the extra noise that comes from fan speed and the temps are awesome. Just so you know, my system is less noisy than a Wii U with the disc spinning when idle.
 
M

MysticX

Member
kharma45 said:
Not a 650, 7850 is so much better. Also get one with a good cooler on it like the MSI TF3, ASUS DCUII or Gigabyte Windforce.
Click to expand...

like this one? about $40 more expensive than the Sapphire one

My vote for the Sapphire 7850. It's actually THAT quiet, even under full load you barely notice the extra noise that comes from fan speed and the temps are awesome. Just so you know, my system is less noisy than a Wii U with the disc spinning when idle.
Click to expand...

I´m actually coming from Sapphire 5770 1GB which got returned and got a 6770 1GB instead, but I´m generally satisfied with it.
 
LiquidMetal14

LiquidMetal14

hide your water-based mammals
Ty4on said:
Remember that you aren't limited to only overclocking with the multiplier on 2011, lot's of people reaching up to 5Ghz with it and probably more with better cooling and a good heart.
Click to expand...

I won't be able to check this until later but how much can you adjust the BLCK in SB-E CPU's? My 2500k would only allow me to go as high as 101.1 or 110 (it's been a while and I'm drawing a blank plus I'm not on my main PC right now).

For my 4.8ghz OC, I upped my offset voltage to .010-.011 and allowed more power to be pushed to the CPU via other options. Been using that OC stable for about 5 months now. I have basically sold it to help me build my new PC though so it will be missed.
 
K

kharma45

Member
MysticX said:
like this one? about $40 more expensive than the Sapphire one.
Click to expand...

The Sapphire one you've linked to up above is still generally a pretty good one. Also make sure to find out what the different brands are like for RMA service in your country, Sapphire isn't the best over here in the UK but the likes of Gigabyte and MSI are pretty good, Gigabyte especially.
 
M

MysticX

Member
kharma45 said:
The Sapphire one you've linked to up above is still generally a pretty good one. Also make sure to find out what the different brands are like for RMA service in your country, Sapphire isn't the best over here in the UK but the likes of Gigabyte and MSI are pretty good, Gigabyte especially.
Click to expand...

well, my last one started acting funny just before the 2 years since purchase ran out, and I sent it to the store I bought it from and no problems, and the 5770 was long gone out of stock and got a 6770 instead, was a bit bummed when I found out that it was generally the same as 5770 performance wise.
 
T

Ty4on

Member
LiquidMetal14 said:
I won't be able to check this until later but how much can you adjust the BLCK in SB-E CPU's? My 2500k would only allow me to go as high as 101.1 or 110 (it's been a while and I'm drawing a blank plus I'm not on my main PC right now).

For my 4.8ghz OC, I upped my offset voltage to .010-.011 and allowed more power to be pushed to the CPU via other options. Been using that OC stable for about 5 months now. I have basically sold it to help me build my new PC though so it will be missed.
Click to expand...

I don't know everything, but Intel made the BLCK control lot's of important stuff in 1155 so changing it would quickly make the system unstable and could even corrupt files. 2011 does not have this problem and I think Haswell also shouldn't (which means overclocked i3/Pentiums :D).
MysticX said:
well, my last one started acting funny just before the 2 years since purchase ran out, and I sent it to the store I bought it from and no problems, and the 5770 was long gone out of stock and got a 6770 instead, was a bit bummed when I found out that it was generally the same as 5770 performance wise.
Click to expand...
It was actually a little worse. AMD changed the names when going to the 6000 series from 59XX being dual GPU, 58XX high end, 57XX mid end etc. to 69XX high end, 68XX mid end etc. The dual GPU card was of course the 6990.
 
K

kharma45

Member
Ty4on said:
I don't know everything, but Intel made the BLCK control lot's of important stuff in 1155 so changing it would quickly make the system unstable and could even corrupt files. 2011 does not have this problem and I think Haswell also shouldn't (which means overclocked i3/Pentiums :D).
Click to expand...

Fuck, maybe I should hold off buying a budget PC then if that's the case, if they were overclockable they'd be a phenomenal option.
 
S

scogoth

Member
IIRC ivy bridge BLCk over clocking is limited because the BLCK clock and PCI clock are based off the same clock generator with different multipliers. PCI buses don't respond we'll the clock differences so you can't adjust the BLCK clock because they are linked. Haswell will be the same so don't count on over locking non K CPUs. 2011 and 1366 both have a seperate clock generator for BLCK and the PCI bus so you can increase the BLCK clock without adversely affecting the PCI bus. For 2011 you could crank it to 200mhz and 25x multiplier.
 
T

Ty4on

Member
scogoth said:
IIRC ivy bridge BLCk over clocking is limited because the BLCK clock and PCI clock are based off the same clock generator with different multipliers. PCI buses don't respond we'll the clock differences so you can't adjust the BLCK clock because they are linked. Haswell will be the same so don't count on over locking non K CPUs. 2011 and 1366 both have a seperate clock generator for BLCK and the PCI bus so you can increase the BLCK clock without adversely affecting the PCI bus. For 2011 you could crank it to 200mhz and 25x multiplier.
Click to expand...

Ok, so it isn't totally confirmed, but it looks kinda promising.

Intel immediately discovered a design flaw in tying the L3 and CPU speeds together – if the GPU ever needed to access the L3 cache, the CPU speed would have to wake up as well. With Intel’s focus on power efficiency, this was a huge deal, which is why they will actually go back to individual clock speeds for the Uncore and CPU Core with Haswell.

This is pure speculation on my part, but it looks like the days of overclocking a locked CPU may be upon us again. By being able to manipulate the Uncore frequency separately from the CPU (and GPU) frequencies, there is a good chance that the lower end Haswell chips will become viable overclocking targets for enthusiasts once again. We may never see another 300a, but if we can have a $100 Haswell CPU running at similar frequencies to the $300 part, it will renew interest in overclocking for a lot of people.
Click to expand...

kharma45 said:
Fuck, maybe I should hold off buying a budget PC then if that's the case, if they were overclockable they'd be a phenomenal option.
Click to expand...
2011 looks pretty awesome with the overclocking and no socket coming this year to replace it, but the mobos are pretty expensive.
 
Koroviev

Koroviev

Member
kharma45 said:
Not a 650, 7850 is so much better. Also get one with a good cooler on it like the MSI TF3, ASUS DCUII or Gigabyte Windforce.
Click to expand...

beje said:
My vote for the Sapphire 7850. It's actually THAT quiet, even under full load you barely notice the extra noise that comes from fan speed and the temps are awesome. Just so you know, my system is less noisy than a Wii U with the disc spinning when idle.
Click to expand...

Yep, the 7850 really is a great card. I was skeptical, but I have the MSI TF3 and it's exceptionally cool and quiet. Currently idling at 18C (it's cold; typically 23C during the day).

On an unrelated note, I'm not getting proper temp readings from my HDD since installing the SSD. Doesn't really matter, but I did open up the computer last night to make sure that it wasn't frying. Definitely not running at 128C.

And cold boot with Windows 8 + SSD is just about 20 seconds.
 
M

mkenyon

Banned
scogoth said:
Plus real men BLCK overclock! None of this sissy multiplier ocing.
Click to expand...
After 1366, you're going to wonder how most people even call themselves enthusiasts. We're all pretty much pansies compared to you.

I'm pretty sad I missed out on Nehalem. I was still AMD all the way back then. I did have a PII 975 clocked to 4.3 on air though.
 
K

kharma45

Member
mkenyon said:
After 1366, you're going to wonder how most people even call themselves enthusiasts. We're all pretty much pansies compared to you.

I'm pretty sad I missed out on Nehalem. I was still AMD all the way back then. I did have a PII 975 clocked to 4.3 on air though.
Click to expand...

I'll swap you my i5-750 :p
 
DJ_Lae

DJ_Lae

Member
How common is it for higher end power supplies to have ridiculously short cables?

I was trying to get the 8 pin connector up to my CPU last night from a 750W Antec HCP and there's no way I can do it without leaving the thing dangling in the main part of my case. Any attempt to hide part of the cable results in it not being long enough - and not just by an inch or two, but by a huge amount.

Feels weird having to go out and buy an extension.
 
M

mkenyon

Banned
Antec is a little late to the game on a bunch of features. Needing excessively long EPS/CPU power cables is fairly recent in terms of necessity due to cable management cutouts.
 
DJ_Lae

DJ_Lae

Member
mkenyon said:
Antec is a little late to the game on a bunch of features. Needing excessively long EPS/CPU power cables is fairly recent in terms of necessity due to cable management cutouts.
Click to expand...

Ah, figured as much, I guess.

Still, only paid $65 for the power supply so I can't complain too much.
 
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